The Hawks D vs. the Top 8 D: Asset Expenditure

Palmegranite

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Russian dodgeball player...lol....that would explain some of the sieve-like characteristics of past lines.
 

Own The West

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On the other hand, we have a top 10 Offense and only Lockett, Jackson, Metcalf, and Fant making over $5M. That's pretty nice.

My expectation is that we shore up the defense next year. Adams is expensive and not producing, that's not going to help anyone. At least we didn't give him $250M...
 

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Here it is the thread you've all been waiting for!

I present to you the top 8 defenses in the NFL, and the assets they expended to build said top 8 defense through 13 games. While seeing how the Seahawks stack up. Why not Top 10? It got too muddy, there is a clear top 8, and after that 5+ plus teams could be argued for the final 2 spots. Top 8 also conveniently = Top 25%.

Rich Hill Valuation Model 2023 Draft Value Chart used to determine points for each pick. Factored in trade ups.

=================
49ERS
1ST (Yards), 1st (Points)
=================

$5M+ (APY) players:
-----------------------
$9.5M APY, Jimmie Ward (S)
$8.3M APY, Nick Bosa (Edge)
$17M APY, Arik Armstead (DL)
$6M APY, Samson Ebukan (Edge)
$19M APY, Fred Warner (LB)
$13.5M APY, Charvarious Ward (CB)
$8.2M APY, Dre Greenlaw (LB)
-------
Total Players: 7
Total APY in major investments = $81.5M APY

First 3 Rounds Defense the Last 5 years (Expected Starters.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
3rd'18, 70 pts. Fred Warner
3rd'18, 40 pts. Tarvarious Moore
1st '19, 717 pts. Nick Bosa
1st'20, 325 pts. Javon Kinlaw
3rd'21, 35 pts. Ambry Thomas
2nd'22, 86 pts. Drake Jackson
-----------------------------------------
Totals: 1st (2), 2nd (1), 3rd (3), 6 picks. 1273 pts of Draft Capitol spent.

# Notes: I was expecting a lot more investment with the #1 Defense. Bosa hasn't gotten paid yet, but they don't have a lot of picks invested. Only two 1sts, and one 2nd in the last 5 years.

=================
EAGLES
2nd (Yards), 7th (Points)
=================

$5M+ (APY) players:
-----------------------
$13M APY, Javon Hargrave (DL)
$16.7M APY, Darius Slay (CB)
$9.25M APY, Brandon Graham (Edge)
$14M APY, Fletcher Cox (DL)
$15M APY, Haasan Reddick (Edge)
$13.33M APY, Josh Sweat (Edge)
$7M APY, Derek Barnett (Edge)
$7.5M APY, Avonte Maddox (CB)
$7.25M APY, James Bradberry (CB)
-------
Total Players: 9
Total APY in major investments = $103.03M APY

First 3 Rounds Defense the Last 5 years (Expected Starters.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
3rd'18 - 39 pts. Ronald Darby (Trade: Spent #96.)
'19 - None (All Offense)
3rd'20, 35 pts. Davion Taylor
3rd'21, 65 pts. Milton Williams 139
1st'22, 355 pts. Jordan Davis (Traded up: #15 + #124 + #162 + #166)
3rd'22 52 pts. Nakobe Dean
-----------------------------------------
Totals: 1st (1), 2nd (0), 3rd (4), 5 picks. 546 pts of Draft Capitol spent.

# Notes: The Eagle have $64M in dead money on their cap, and by far the least amount of draft capitol invested into their defense. So how the hell are they doing this? Voidable years. Nearly all of their paid guys have voidable years attached to keep their cap numbers down. They are also smart and the complete opposite of the Seahawks when it comes to spending. Pash Rushers and guys who can cover. Those are the only guys getting paid on Philly's defense. Smart.

================
JETS
3rd (Yards), 6th (Points)
================

$5M+ (APY) players:
-----------------------
$15M APY, Carl Lawson (Edge)
$14.5M APY, John Franklin-Meyers (Edge)
$8.13M APY, Quinnen Williams (DL)
$5.5M APY, Sheldon Rankins (DL)
$8.3M APY, Sauce Gardner (CB)
$17M APY, C.J. Mosely (LB)
$11M APY, D.J. Reed (CB)
$7.25M APY, Jordan Whitehead (S)
-------
Total Players: 8
Total APY in major investments = $86.68M APY

First 3 Rounds Defense the Last 5 years (Expected Starters.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
3rd'18, 67 pts. Nathan Sheppard
1st'19, 514 pts. Quinnen Williams
3rd'19, 73 pts. Jachai Polite
3rd'20, 73 pts. Ashtyn Davis
3rd'20, 57 pts. Jabari Zuniga
'21 - None (All Offense)
1st'22, 491 pts. Sauce Gardner
2nd+3rd'22, 250 pts. Jermaine Johnson II (Traded up: #35 + #69 + #163)
-----------------------------------------
Totals: 1st (2), 2nd (1), 3rd (5), 8 picks. 1525 pts of Draft Capitol spent.

# Notes: The Jets are actually what a young defense is supposed to look like. Unlike the Seahawks who get stereotyped as young because they suck, so that must mean they are young. Their only old man regular is 30 year old C.J. Mosley, and he will likely be cut or a massive paycut at the very least, after the season. 2nd most draft capital spent which will happen when you draft defense in the top 5 twice. As they are the only ones in the top 8 to do so. 1k points between those 2 players alone.

================
COMMANDERS
4th (Yards), 10th (Points)
================

$5M+ (APY) players:
-----------------------
$10M APY, Kendal Fuller (CB)
$18M APY, Jonathan Allen (DL)
$8.6M APY, Chase Young (Edge)
$5M APY, Bobby McCain (S)
$8.5M APY, Da'Ron Payne (DL) (5th yr Option)
-------
Total Players: 4
Total APY in major investments = $50.1M APY

First 3 Rounds Defense the Last 5 years (Expected Starters.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
1st'18, 336 pts. Da'Ron Payne
2nd'19+2nd'20, 263 pts. Montez Sweat Trade Up (#46 + '20 2nd = #44)
1st'20, 717 pts. Chase Young
1st'21, 278 pts. Jamin Davis
3rd'21, 64 pts. Benjamin St-Juste
2nd'22 124 pts. Phidarian Mathis
-----------------------------------------
Totals: 1st (3), 2nd (3), 3rd (1), 7 picks. 1782 pts of Draft Capitol spent.

# Notes: The Commanders have the most draft capitol spent in the last 5 years despite only taking 6 players in that span. They are not spending a lot of money on defense, but they have a few 1st round D-Lineman due for new contracts soon. So that will change drastically in the next couple of years.

================
COWBOYS
5th (Yards), 3rd (Points)
================

$5M+ (APY) players:
-----------------------
$13.33M APY, Demarcus Lawrence (Edge)
$5M APY, Jayron Kearse (S)
$6M APY, Dorance Armstrong Jr. (DL)
$5.166M APY, Anthony Brown (CB)

-------
Total Players: 4
Total APY in major investments = $29.496M APY

First 3 Rounds Defense the Last 5 years (Expected Starters.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
1st'18, 278 pts. Leighton Vander Esch
2nd'19, 93 pts. Trysten Hill
2nd'20, 112 pts. Trevon Diggs
3rd'20, 54 pts. Neville Gallimore
1st'21, 347 pts. Micah Parsons (Dan Quinn '21, fix the Defense.)
2nd'21, 135 pts. Kelvin Joseph
3rd'21, 63 pts. Osa Odighizuwa
3rd'21, 51 pts. Chauncey Golsten
3rd'21, 37 pts. Nahshon Wright
2nd'22 98 pts. Sam Williams
-----------------------------------------
Totals: 1st (2), 2nd (4), 3rd (4), 10 picks. 1268 pts of Draft Capitol spent.

# Notes: Jerry is spending his money on offense, while he gave the great Dan Quinn the '21 draft to rebuild, which was at the time one of the worst defenses in the NFL. Dan Quinn turned it around immediately and now has them top 5 in the league with a bunch of 2nd and 3rd round picks, and Micah Parsons of course. Dallas has spent the 2nd most picks of the top 8 with a whopping 10 in 5 years with half of those coming in '21 alone.

================
PATRIOTS
6th (Yards), 5th (Points)
================

$5M+ (APY) players:
-----------------------
$13.625M APY, Matt Judon (Edge)
$10.4M APY, Davon Godcahaux (DL)
$7M APY, Jonathan Jones (CB)
$6M APY, Jalen Mills (CB)
$9M APY, Devin McCourty (S)
$5.5M APY, Deatrich Wise (Edge)
-------
Total Players: 6
Total APY in major investments = $51.525M APY

First 3 Rounds Defense the Last 5 years (Expected Starters.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
2nd'18, 109 pts. Duke Dawson (Traded up #63 + #117)
2nd+3rd'19, 134 pts. Joejuan Williams (Traded up #56 + #101)
3rd'19, 60 pts. Chase Winovich
2nd'20, 162 pts. Kyle Dugger
3rd+3rd'20, 85 pts. Josh Uche (Traded up #71 + #98 - #129)
3rd'20, 48 pts. Anfernee Jennings
2nd'21, 151 pts. Christian Barmore (Traded up #46 + #122 + #139)
3rd'21, 39 pts. Ronnie Perkins
3rd'22, 50 pts. Marcus Jones
-----------------------------------------
Totals: 1st (0), 2nd (4), 3rd (7), 11 picks. 838 pts of Draft Capitol spent.

# Notes: Nickel & Dime Bill. He shutters at having to pay big money to Free Agents and goes for the quantity over quality approach, similar to Pete. But unlike Pete, Bill can coach them up, turning them into a top 5 unit. Also taking the same approach in the draft with 11 selections, most amongst the top 8 defenses, but also 2nd least in draft capitol spent. Zero 1st rounders taken. That frugal SOB.


================
BRONCOS
7th (Yards), 4th (Points)
================

$5M+ (APY) players:
-----------------------
$15.2M APY, Justin Simmons (S)
$5.2M APY, Patrick Surtain II (CB)
$10M APY, D.J. Jones (DL)
$5.5M APY, Josey Jewell (LB)
$13.9M APY, Randy Gregory (Edge)
$10M APY, Ronald Darby (CB)
-------
Total Players: 6
Total APY in major investments = $59.8M APY

First 3 Rounds Defense the Last 5 years (Expected Starters.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
1st'18, 468 pts. Bradley Chubb
3rd'18, 37 pts. Isaac Yiadom
3rd'19, 68 pts. Dre'Mont Jones
3rd'20, 60 pts. Michael Ojemudia
1st'21, 387 pts. Patrick Surtain II
2nd'22 80 pts. Nik Bonitto
-----------------------------------------
Totals: 1st (2), 2nd (1), 3rd (3), 6 picks. 1100 pts of Draft Capitol spent.

# Notes: Denver is the most injured team in the NFL, yet it hasn't stopped their defense from playing amazing week in and week out. The offense not so much.
It is impressive to see how little they've invested draft wise into the defense. Chubb is gone so that just leaves Surtain II as the only significant draft invest in the last 5 years on defense.

================
BILLS
9th (Yards), 2nd (Points)
================

$5M+ (APY) players:
-----------------------
$20M APY, Von Miller (Edge)
$17.25M APY, Tra'Davious White (CB)
$12.66M APY, Tremaine Edmunds (LB) [5th yr. Option]
$9.75M APY, Jordan Poyer (S)
$9.625M APY, Micah Hyde (S)
$10.375M APY, Matt Milano (LB)
$8M APY, Taron Johnson (CB)
$7M APY, DaQuan Jones (DL)
$5M APY, Jordan Phillips (DL)
-------
Total Players: 9
Total APY in major investments = $99.66M APY

First 3 Rounds Defense the Last 5 years (Expected Starters.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
1st'18, 318 pts. Tremaine Edmunds (Traded up #22 + #65 - #154)
3rd'18, 39 pts. Harrison Phillips
1st'19, 387 pts. Ed Oliver
2nd'20, 104 pts. A.J. Epenesa
1st'21, 196 pts. Gregory Rousseau
2nd'21, 86 pts. Carlos Basham Jr.
1st'22, 251 pts. Kaiir Elam (Traded up: #25 + #130)
3rd'22, 46 pts. Terrel Bernard
-----------------------------------------
Totals: 1st (4), 2nd (2), 3rd (2), 8 picks. 1427 pts of Draft Capitol spent.

#Notes: You can't pay your QB, and the defense or so they say. Yet here the Bills are paying Josh Allen $43M APY, and handing out mega dollars to 9 players on defense.

==================
SEAHAWKS
28th (Yards), 30th (Points)
==================

$5M+ (APY) players:
-----------------------
$17.5M APY, Jamal Adams (S)
$6.172M APY, Poona Ford (DL)
$9.527M APY, Uchenna Nwosu (Edge)
$13M APY, Quandre Diggs (S)
$9M APY, Shelby Harris (DL)
$5.517M APY, Bryan Mone (DL)
-------
Total Players: 6
Total APY in major investments = $60.72M APY

First 3 Rounds Defense the Last 5 years (Expected Starters.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
3rd'18, 57 pts. Rasheem Green
1st'19, 203 pts. L.J. Collier
2nd'19, 124 pts. Marquise Blair
3rd'19, 51 pts. Cody Barton (Traded up #92 + #159 - #209)
1st'20, 216 pts. Jordyn Brooks
2nd+3rd'20, 127 pts. Darrell Taylor (Traded up #59 + #101)
1st+3rd'21+1st'22, 631 pts Jamal Adams (Trade: #23 + #86 + '22 #10 - '22 #109)
2nd'22, 149 pts. Boye Mafe
-----------------------------------------
Totals: 1st (4), 2nd (3), 3rd (4), 11 picks. 1558 pts of Draft Capitol spent.

Notes: Al Woods and Quinton Jefferson just came in under the threshold of $5M APY. Only 1 of the top 8 teams have expunged more draft capital than the Seahawks who have also spent more picks than any of these teams at 11. They spend their money foolishly on a bunch of runstuffers, but can't stop the run. Nwosu looks like the only one worth his money. Jamal Adams is a real albatross from his contract to the draft picks given up. A fireable offense.

If the Seahawks spend a top 5 pick on a defensive player, they will be ahead of all of these teams by a country mile on draft capitol spent. As they curently reside at 2nd out of these 9 teams. They could potentially spend 1500 points of draft capital in 2023 alone on defense in the first 3 rounds quite easily putting them at over 3,000 in the last 5 years! (Cycle out '18, add '23) Helluva job. The Seahawks have an asset expenditure with the purpose of building a top 5 defense, while falling so well short of the mark it makes you wonder…

Rankings in Major $$$ Defensive Player Investment:
------
1) EAGLES $103.03M APY
2) BILLS $99.66M APY
3) JETS $86.68M APY
4) 49ERS $81.5M APY

--> SEAHAWKS $60.72M APY <----- Are Here

5) BRONCOS$59.8M APY
6) PATRIOTS $51.525M APY
7) COMMANDERS $50.1M APY
8) COWBOYS $29.496M APY


Rankings in Major Draft Capitol Investment for Defensive Players Since 2018:
------
1) COMMANDERS 1782 pts.

--> SEAHAWKS 1558 pts. <----- Are Here

2) JETS 1525 pts.
3) BILLS 1427 pts
4) 49ERS 1273 pts
5) COWBOYS 1268 pts
6) BRONCOS 1100 pts
7) PATRIOTS 838 pts
8) EAGLES 546 pts

To say the Seahawks have drafted and invested poorly on defense since 2018 is the understatement of the century.
Thanks for ruining my life Fade.

That's hard to argue. There have been major mistakes made. Those drafts are
So freaking underwhelming. They're just dudes, while these other teams march out with playoff caliber defenses with half the capital invested....

Is it all drafting or coaching as well ?

Shit
 

cymatica

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Thanks for ruining my life Fade.

That's hard to argue. There have been major mistakes made. Those drafts are
So freaking underwhelming. They're just dudes, while these other teams march out with playoff caliber defenses with half the capital invested....

Is it all drafting or coaching as well ?

Shit
Probably a combination of coaching, overpaying, and drafting players too high
 

morgulon1

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Probably a combination of coaching, overpaying, and drafting players too high
Well , as Mr Fade said, they have close to 30 million tied up in a perennially hurt safety and the other one is a decent player. Nothing crazy

I have to put it on coaching as well.
What has Darrell Taylor accomplished that a cheap free agent couldn't?
 

Hockey Guy

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Imagine all the heads that are going to explode when we use all our draft capital to fix the defense.

It'll still be "fire/discredit everyone" even if they do fix the defense thru the draft & we have a great 2023 season because of the premise of this thread.

If they don't have another stellar draft & fix the defense next year then I believe it's time to move on from PC but not before.
 

SoulfishHawk

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Well, IF they have another great draft, Fade will make sure to downplay it and say that Pete and John had nothing to do with it and/or just got lucky.
 

94Smith

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You have to fire enough capital at it to make it work. For every draft success story like Bosa, there are the Solomon Thomas and Javon Kinlaw busts (so far). For every Dee Ford free agent that doesn't work there are the Samson Ebukam, Charles Omenihu, FS Gipson. You have to have success in lower rounds, second round and down
 
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Fade

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Thanks for ruining my life Fade.

That's hard to argue. There have been major mistakes made. Those drafts are
So freaking underwhelming. They're just dudes, while these other teams march out with playoff caliber defenses with half the capital invested....

Is it all drafting or coaching as well ?

Shit
When you are this bad on defense it is all of the above.

Scheme, Drafting, Development, Free Agents, position coaches, everything.

Without the Nwosu hit this year, you have to go back to 2013 to find the last great Free Agency signing (Avril & Bennett) on defense. Which was 10 off-seasons ago.

I believe it is the coaching, because too often I see players being setup to fail. And guys consistently not developing. Too often they have guys flash as rookies, and then they get worse.

Taylor flashed in year 1, then got worse. Brooks looked good in year 1, but has not developed. He is the same player. Ugo Amadi, and Marquise Blair flashed their rookie years and then proceeded to get worse. Mafe (though early) doesn't seem to be progressing.

Their is a consistent issue of players not developing, particularly in the front 7. I think Pete is still good with DBs, despite having some misses on the backend, which will happen. The front 7 looks apocalyptic. All of the investment and Nwosu looks like the only longterm building block. Buncha stopgaps and busts.

Poona Ford is a guy playing out of position in the new defense. Which begs the question, why pay a guy to do a certain job, and then make him do another?

Pete Carroll is on the record in 2021 after having Jamal Adams for over a year that "We're still trying to figure out how to use him." You traded all of that capitol, and payed him all of that money, and you don't know how to use him? No accountability. Pete's allowed to screw it up year after year on defense, but for him he's been bailed out by productive QB play to mask how bad it has actually been.

The average fan just looks at the record and think everything is fine, when it is actually not. People are waking up though, and if they spend all of this draft capitol in '23 on defense and still have one of the worst defenses, that will be impossible to live down.
 
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Fade

Fade

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You have to fire enough capital at it to make it work. For every draft success story like Bosa, there are the Solomon Thomas and Javon Kinlaw busts (so far). For every Dee Ford free agent that doesn't work there are the Samson Ebukam, Charles Omenihu, FS Gipson. You have to have success in lower rounds, second round and down
The Seahawks have. The problem is they rarely ever hit on defense since 2013. A decade of failure catches up eventually. I was being kind by only focusing on the last 5 drafts, and currently signed players.

They continue to throw assets at the defense, and get worse. We've hit the end of the line. If Pete flubs this draft being allocated an insane amount of total capitol dumped into his defense at that point, but they still suck. Welp, there will be nothing Pete can say to deflect it anymore. Everyone will see it, it will be undeniable.

Imagine if Bosa and Warner had been busts, Ward retired years ago due to injury, lost Armstead in a bad trade, and no late rounders took off for 8 seasons save for Hufanga. That is the Seahawks defense.
 
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Fade

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Imagine all the heads that are going to explode when we use all our draft capital to fix the defense.

It'll still be "fire/discredit everyone" even if they do fix the defense thru the draft & we have a great 2023 season because of the premise of this thread.

If they don't have another stellar draft & fix the defense next year then I believe it's time to move on from PC but not before.

This is the most critical draft in Seahawks history since 2012, or maybe ever to put it lightly. Flubbing this draft will lead to a long, long, road back to contention. They cannot fail, or heads will roll.
 

Hockey Guy

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This is the most critical draft in Seahawks history since 2012, or maybe ever to put it lightly. Flubbing this draft will lead to a long, long, road back to contention. They cannot fail, or heads will roll.

I agree.
 

morgulon1

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When you are this bad on defense it is all of the above.

Scheme, Drafting, Development, Free Agents, position coaches, everything.

Without the Nwosu hit this year, you have to go back to 2013 to find the last great Free Agency signing (Avril & Bennett) on defense. Which was 10 off-seasons ago.

I believe it is the coaching, because too often I see players being setup to fail. And guys consistently not developing. Too often they have guys flash as rookies, and then they get worse.

Taylor flashed in year 1, then got worse. Brooks looked good in year 1, but has not developed. He is the same player. Ugo Amadi, and Marquise Blair flashed their rookie years and then proceeded to get worse. Mafe (though early) doesn't seem to be progressing.

Their is a consistent issue of players not developing, particularly in the front 7. I think Pete is still good with DBs, despite having some misses on the backend, which will happen. The front 7 looks apocalyptic. All of the investment and Nwosu looks like the only longterm building block. Buncha stopgaps and busts.

Poona Ford is a guy playing out of position in the new defense. Which begs the question, why pay a guy to do a certain job, and then make him do another?

Pete Carroll is on the record in 2021 after having Jamal Adams for over a year that "We're still trying to figure out how to use him." You traded all of that capitol, and payed him all of that money, and you don't know how to use him? No accountability. Pete's allowed to screw it up year after year on defense, but for him he's been bailed out by productive QB play to mask how bad it has actually been.

The average fan just looks at the record and think everything is fine, when it is actually not. People are waking up though, and if they spend all of this draft capitol in '23 on defense and still have one of the worst defenses, that will be impossible to live down.
Darrell Taylor has shown just enough where a person is left wondering what if... But most the time he doesn't do a lot.
Seattle played a lot better for a short stretch but then something changed and they give up tons of rushing yards.
Pete Carroll is a defensive guy right? Belechik might not be the same without
TB12 but you know what he does have?

A top defense.

This team needs to start over on defense and get another D.C. one that
Can make these guys perform. Obviously Mr hurtt isn't able to motivate.
 

Sgt. Largent

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I'm not going to defend the Hawk's defensive drafts, they've been bad.

But what I will defend is number of top 15-20 picks these other franchises Fade's using as the elite defense barometer trying to compare our front office's failures too.

These are the number of top 15 picks these other teams have had to accumulate most of their elite defensive talent over the past decade.

Eagles: 6 picks
Broncos: 4 picks
Niners: 7 picks
Bills: 5 picks

Seahawks: 1 (Bruce Irivn in 2012)
 

Ozzy

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I'm not going to defend the Hawk's defensive drafts, they've been bad.

But what I will defend is number of top 15-20 picks these other franchises Fade's using as the elite defense barometer trying to compare our front office's failures too.

These are the number of top 15 picks these other teams have had to accumulate most of their elite defensive talent over the past decade.

Eagles: 6 picks
Broncos: 4 picks
Niners: 7 picks
Bills: 5 picks

Seahawks: 1 (Bruce Irivn in 2012)
Sure that's fair but any way you cut it they've been terrible with their high leverage (1-2nd round picks) over the years often making picks that have other gm's commenting off the record how baffled they were for taking those guys. The Athletic had an article that used a dozen different metrics that factors in all of the usual arguments and Seattle came out bad almost across the board. Even when factoring in how hard drafting can be they're still below average the past few years.

Now I'm still skeptical but hopeful after this most recent class. My theory is Pete was way too involved and caused a lot of the goofy picks after some scout leaks came to light. To give Pete credit I think he gave up some control over personnel and let John have a little more freedom which again Pete deserves credit for if he did. I could be way off base but that's how I see it. Every team is going to have multiple misses every year, even the best drafting teams but Seattle needs to continue their success from this previous draft and like Fade said this draft is critical.
 

hawkfan68

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You mean George Fant…
True. They also signed Mark Vital to PS last season. He was from Baylor.

Mo Allie-Cox who's a TE for the Colts was formerly a bball player and has been fairly good for the Colts. So I think it's more about who is chosen and how they are developed that is the key. Not if they have basketball roots, per se.
 

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Sure that's fair but any way you cut it they've been terrible with their high leverage (1-2nd round picks) over the years often making picks that have other gm's commenting off the record how baffled they were for taking those guys. The Athletic had an article that used a dozen different metrics that factors in all of the usual arguments and Seattle came out bad almost across the board. Even when factoring in how hard drafting can be they're still below average the past few years.

Now I'm still skeptical but hopeful after this most recent class. My theory is Pete was way too involved and caused a lot of the goofy picks after some scout leaks came to light. To give Pete credit I think he gave up some control over personnel and let John have a little more freedom which again Pete deserves credit for if he did. I could be way off base but that's how I see it. Every team is going to have multiple misses every year, even the best drafting teams but Seattle needs to continue their success from this previous draft and like Fade said this draft is critical.

This is why I prefaced my post with I'm not going to defend our defensive draft picks.

But how much better would our defense be if we had another 4-5 top 15 picks over the past decade like these other franchises have had?

My guess is quite a bit better. That's my point.
 
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