Danny Kelly: NFL has Bevell's number in passing game

[hawksfansinceday1]

If indeed the Hawks are trying to throw deep all the time I have to ask why? This team simply does not have the right WRs to go deep consistently. There's no true burner in the WR corps. As an occasional 'catch 'em by surprise' strategy, sure. But in order to go deep a lot, you need guys with speed that get open downfield a lot (all you old-timers think Raiders with Cliff Branch or Chargers with Lance Alworth). No wonder I've complained so much about our WRs not getting open.

I would actually argue that the deep ball is the strength of our WR's. They don't do it with speed though, they do it with their ability to go up and get the ball.

A very good point J but to be good downfield on a consistent basis, you need both IMO. And yes, Kearse in particular has really shown the ability to catch at the highest point. But if no one has the speed to get open, RW doesn't even bother to throw deep and give them the chance to go up and get it. And this thread is about, I don't think we're seeing enough open WRs, especially deep. I would like to see a lot more use of Baldwin 10-15 downfield considering he's usually running routes against LBs or SSs. And as was mentioned earlier in this thread, Miller helps in the intermediate game as well. If the deep stuff ain't working, Bevell needs to adjust and it would appear that's not the case. Take what the defense gives you and all.

 

[Tech Worlds]

In addition to back up o-line men who haven't mastered the play book and can not pass protect, TE is an obvious weakness. Zach Miller and Mccoy were basically our intermediate routes.

And yes, it's also scheme. There aren't many quick pass plays to get RW into any kind of rhythm. It's either a run, or the big, low percentage "gap" play. That style is going to lead to feast or famine.

Finally I wish we could get Doug Baldwin the ball more, and not only on 3rd down.

You mean backups that have been on the team all season didn't have access to the playbook and thus could not master it?

 

[HawkWow]

Deon and Marshall Fulk said the same things last week pretty much verbatim.

Yeah, but now it's coming from credible people. *rimshot*

I also think it's just too easy to assume that Harvin will fix things. I don't have the impression that he's ever been a separation guy down the field. He strikes me as Golden Tate plus.

I feel exactly the same. We saw a play today (Tate) that was Harvin personified. 1 yard pass, 10 yard gain. That's where Harvin makes his money. In fact, I could be mistaken, but if you were to go back and look at Ponder's completions to Harvin, you would see an avg of a 1 yd pass...with a 9 YAC.

That certainly fits well in any offense, but I'm not expecting to see Harvin on the outside running away from DBs creating separation. What he is is a slightly quicker, shiftier version of Tate. I don't know if that fixes our passing game in itself. But it sure's gonna' cost a lot. I think we need to (obviously) draft O-line then look for a field stretcher soon after. As of now, I see a bunch of DBs wallowing in security and cheating towards up field.

 

[Hawks46]

His concepts are painfully obvious and basic. Verts, boot, and now slants. That's about it. The play action game caught fire today in the 2nd half, but we still have no ability to pick apart underneath coverage. Another week, and nothing inside the hashes.

I noticed that when we started moving the ball in the air, it was all a lot of shorter stuff than we normally run. Passes to Baldwin and Kearse were definately what I'd call underneath.

One thing I noticed was on that last FG...we were down in the red zone, and we sent 4 WR out. From the overhead view, all the WRs were on a perfectly level plane halfway into the end zone. No staggered depths or anything.

SOMEONE has to be noticing this, don't they ? I mean, it makes sense. All of the sudden our WRs are ineffectual, and we're all blaming the players. But Wilson isn't always running for his life, and he'll have 4 seconds back there, then be forced to run. 4 seconds is more than enough time for Manning, Brady and Brees to murder you through the air.

I know Pete is a defensive guru, but is so offensively inept that he's forcing this on Bevell, or just plain not seeing it ? Like I said, someone has to be seeing this, don't they? And while we're asking these questions, why can't we complete a pass to a TE on the field like the rest of the NFL does to us ?

 

[dontbelikethat]

I actually really miss Anthony McCoy. He got a lot of hate for his drops, but every play that I remember of his, he was wide open.

 

[CANHawk]

I dunno... I saw Sidney and chop chop WIDE open at times today on deep ins and deep comebacks; russ just missed them (or didn't trust them).

 

[BlueThunder]

Anybody else miss the rainbow bombs we saw routinely from Russell last year? You do? Yeah, me too... What happened to those?

 

[FlyingGreg]

I actually really miss Anthony McCoy. He got a lot of hate for his drops, but every play that I remember of his, he was wide open.

Yep. So many on here dismissed what he did for us.

 

[FlyingGreg]

Anybody else miss the rainbow bombs we saw routinely from Russell last year? You do? Yeah, me too... What happened to those?

No time in the pocket.

 

[Blitzer88]

Can't disagree with a single thing he says. Bevell needs to step up his play calling too.

 

[SonicHawk]

Anybody else miss the rainbow bombs we saw routinely from Russell last year? You do? Yeah, me too... What happened to those?

No time in the pocket.

He's not pressured every single time right away. The O line is not good, it's not the worst ever.

 

[BlueThunder]

Anybody else miss the rainbow bombs we saw routinely from Russell last year? You do? Yeah, me too... What happened to those?

No time in the pocket.

yep. Well, that and no separation by our receivers...

 

[SeatownJay]

Anybody else miss the rainbow bombs we saw routinely from Russell last year? You do? Yeah, me too... What happened to those?

No time in the pocket.

There were several plays today where he had plenty of time to throw deep and he didn't pull the trigger for whatever reason.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

If indeed the Hawks are trying to throw deep all the time I have to ask why?

Pete. He believes strongly in the psychological side of football and wants the back-breaking, morale-crushing big play.

I remember a game late in 2010 in which Seattle opened with an effective dose of short passes and runs. We were moving the ball well. Then we started another drive; all that went out the window and it was deep incomplete, deep incomplete, deep incomplete. I think that's when I realized, "Oh, THAT'S what he wants." Everything our offense does is for the sake of the big deep play, without regard to the actual merit of the run or the shorter pass. After all, "run-heavy" is just a euphemism for play action. And this was with Jeremy Bates as our OC and Matt Hasselbeck as our QB.

This really isn't a secret. Pete's talked repeatedly about how high on his priority list the big play ranks, on both sides of the football. And it does have both enormous psychological and statistical value (something like one big passing play being worth more statistically than five first downs or something). But either Pete's not setting up the big play effectively, or defenses are just determined to prove his one-dimensional approach wrong. Either way, it's starting to leave our offense out in the cold more and more often.

I think Pete's going to have to start respecting the slow-burning station-to-station drive as a legitimate tool.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

Anybody else miss the rainbow bombs we saw routinely from Russell last year? You do? Yeah, me too... What happened to those?

No time in the pocket.

There were several plays today where he had plenty of time to throw deep and he didn't pull the trigger for whatever reason.

I agree. Sometimes he's flushed, sometimes he runs on his own without pressure, and sometimes he stands there for five seconds with nobody near him. Once he's stood for more than four, the O-line has done its job, and even on those plays Wilson has found nothing. The saying "Give even a QB enough time and he'll pick you apart?" Wilson doesn't.

 

[DHawk]

"He's got Rice down the middle and all he needs is a ball!"

Miss those beautiful throws/catches.

 

[Seaswab]

Many times today i saw Wr open and russell didnt see them, so its not true that our receivers are always covered

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

If indeed the Hawks are trying to throw deep all the time I have to ask why?

Pete. He believes strongly in the psychological side of football and wants the back-breaking, morale-crushing big play.

I remember a game late in 2010 in which Seattle opened with an effective dose of short passes and runs. We were moving the ball well. Then we started another drive; all that went out the window and it was deep incomplete, deep incomplete, deep incomplete. I think that's when I realized, "Oh, THAT'S what he wants." Everything our offense does is for the sake of the big deep play, without regard to the actual merit of the run or the shorter pass. After all, "run-heavy" is just a euphemism for play action. And this was with Jeremy Bates as our OC and Matt Hasselbeck as our QB.

This really isn't a secret. Pete's talked repeatedly about how high on his priority list the big play ranks, on both sides of the football. And it does have both enormous psychological and statistical value (something like one big passing play being worth more statistically than five first downs or something). But either Pete's not setting up the big play effectively, or defenses are just determined to prove his one-dimensional approach wrong. Either way, it's starting to leave our offense out in the cold more and more often.

I think Pete's going to have to start respecting the slow-burning station-to-station drive as a legitimate tool.

Your last sentence is my point, specially since Harvin's strengths play into that approach. And thanks for the breakdown. It certainly would appear you're spot on with Pete's philosophy.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

"He's got Rice down the middle and all he needs is a ball!"

Miss those beautiful throws/catches.

I miss the separation that made it possible. I haven't seen Wilson finish a half-rollout and pass authoritatively in a long time. Of course, Rice's TD came against a rookie Pats corner.

 

[BamKam]

How dare someone say something bad about our team. He must not be a real fan. Danny Kelly should be banned.