Sherman Rumours

[adeltaY]

So entertaining. Pete and John have nothing to do with the success of the Hawks? Now I've heard it all :snack:

Should we have kept Hasselbeck and promoted Scott McCloughan to team president?

 

[Crizilla]

A lot of fans are still emotionally invested in the 2013-2014 team. Can't let emotions get the best of you. Look at NE. Least emotional managed team in the league. It's like some fans don't want the team to get young and hungry again. This isn't baseball. As crazy as it is, the NFL is a different game than it was in 2013. Let John and Pete do their damn business. They had a borderline dynasty going. Build around Wilson, Earl, and Wagner. Enough said. I'd like to see Sherman stay if he's 100% but he's gonna have to take a damn pay cut. That's just the way it is.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

A lot of fans are still emotionally invested in the 2013-2014 team. Can't let emotions get the best of you. Look at NE. Least emotional managed team in the league. It's like some fans don't want the team to get young and hungry again. This isn't baseball. As crazy as it is, the NFL is a different game than it was in 2013. Let John and Pete do their damn business. They had a borderline dynasty going. Build around Wilson, Earl, and Wagner. Enough said. I'd like to see Sherman stay if he's 100% but he's gonna have to take a damn pay cut. That's just the way it is.

Wanting to keep and pay a championship player is not emotional investment and I'm quickly getting very sick of the implication.

 

[TwistedHusky]

Have they had any success picking players since Scott left? Consistently?

You think that is just weird coincidence?

The moment a player eval guy leaves, suddenly player eval starts being less effective? Weird.

My personal opinion is that Scott is better with JS and Pete too, but without Scott JS & Pete have pretty much shown to be average to below average at identifying solid players.

 

[adeltaY]

Personally, I don't even care if it's emotional investment. I'll admit to it. I'd rather win the Seahawk way than with the Patriot way. Shoot, the Patriot Way didn't even work this year.

 

[Seahawkfan80]

Has Seattle ever had a fan favorite like him? He should have played his whole career here.

If this is a cut instead of a trade, I'm done with this FO.

Must be a 2012 Twelve. :smilingalien: :2thumbs:

Steve Largent
Cortez Kennedy
Kenny Easley
Walter Jones *yeah a linemen but he was great
Shaun Alexander


I'd say at least two of those guys were as loved by Seahawks fans. You young whippersnappers just don't appreciate the olden days.

Can we bring all of them but Tez back with Zorn as the QB? :sarcasm_off:

 

[Crizilla]

A lot of fans are still emotionally invested in the 2013-2014 team. Can't let emotions get the best of you. Look at NE. Least emotional managed team in the league. It's like some fans don't want the team to get young and hungry again. This isn't baseball. As crazy as it is, the NFL is a different game than it was in 2013. Let John and Pete do their damn business. They had a borderline dynasty going. Build around Wilson, Earl, and Wagner. Enough said. I'd like to see Sherman stay if he's 100% but he's gonna have to take a damn pay cut. That's just the way it is.

Wanting to keep and pay a championship player is not emotional investment and I'm quickly getting very sick of the implication.

In the NFL it's very easy to over react. I thought we all agreed those extensions to Bennett and Chancellor were bad ideas?

 

[SoulfishHawk]

The John and Pete hate is strong in that one :2thumbs:

 

[adeltaY]

Have they had any success picking players since Scott left? Consistently?

You think that is just weird coincidence?

The moment a player eval guy leaves, suddenly player eval starts being less effective? Weird.

My personal opinion is that Scott is better with JS and Pete too, but without Scott JS & Pete have pretty much shown to be average to below average at identifying solid players.

Correlation = Causation? Did you control for any other factors when making this argument?

 

[jammerhawk]

Until there is something official on this situation, this all may be an emotional response by Sherman and his family to a discussion about renegotiation of his deal with the team.

He could be traded if he won't re-negotiate, or he could be released. I am unsure about his contract language as to contract guarantees which may be relevant. Time will tell. It is clear something is in the works or something is being discussed with him. Being your own agent is tough because the conversation of the realities of the situation often is more harsh and harder to accept when not done through an intermediary or agent.

Let's set aside emotional responses here we are dealing with business situation, and for this season RS may not be worht his whole contract as he recovers.

 

[Chapow]

Have they had any success picking players since Scott left? Consistently?

Can you give any examples of any FO ever that has consistently turned 3rd round picks into franchise QBs and mid round picks into perennial all pros? Consistently?

Because it seems like your whole schtick here* is based on the premise that doing that should be the norm and any thing less is just awful drafting.

* By here, I mean .net. You post a lot and many of your posts are lengthy and well written, but you are essentially saying the same thing over and over again. Pete and John suck super bad at player acquisition whether that be by drafting, trading, or signing free agents and they will never acquire another remotely decent player ever again unless by dumb luck or unless they rehire the man who is truly responsible for any success this current era has seen, Scott McCloughan.

 

[ducks41468]

Sherman is still a fantastic player. It's not emotional investment when you're giving up a productive player and aren't able to replace him, which our recent track record shows we won't do. What are we gonna do with all the extra cap space? Sign more Lacy's and Joeckel's?

 

[chris98251]

Remember how Okung outsmarted himself initially, but it worked out a year later in San Diego.

I see the same game being player now.

While Sherman is listed as injured it kind of holds him over a barrel, teams may offer him but it will be way under what a healthy Sherman would get to compete with JS and Pete.

 

[TwistedHusky]

Correlation does not mean causation BUT it can be an indicator of an underlying relationship. Not always but often.

In any event, the FO has shown itself to be fairly average to below average (if you include FA moves) without Scott there.

So expecting the team to get better because of the FO then looks a lot less likely.

And Chapow, that is the problem.

We are removing some of our key contributors. But we are freeing up cap space supposedly.

And the reason we should not be worried is because JS and Pete are just going to replace these guys. But with what?

Whether because of Scott left, evil witches' curses or magical fairies, their drafts haven't been good since Scott left. But now that we have more money that will suddenly change?

And sure, we wasted millions every year on guys that nobody else thought would be worth much and then turned out not to be worth much - but hey this time it will be different?

The successes attributed to this FO were, for the most part, during a narrow band of time that was close to 5 years ago. They are not repeating. Or likely are not.

And yes, JS made a great call with Wilson. Years and years ago. But we have seen that Wilson in his superman cape cannot get this team to the playoffs.

JS or someone also made great pickups of Lynch, Avril and a few others. Then he balanced it out by a stretch of Cary Williams, Harvin, Graham and a number of other wastes of the salary cap.

But hey, maybe things will change. Surely Lacy and Joekel were outliers and if not, no worries because we got Coleman. That shows all the FA pickups weren't disasters. A 3rd string CB makes all the difference. I'm sold. Let's cut our 1st string corner and decimate our pass rush on the same day. No worries, it will all work out because we will have a good excuse for why Wilson cannot get us into the playoffs later....

 

[adeltaY]

So does the correlation between employing PCJS and having the most successful era of seahawks football ever count? Having no faith in them and insisting McCloughan was the architect seems like a weird hill to die on IMO but to each his own.

 

[12forlife]

A lot of fans are still emotionally invested in the 2013-2014 team. Can't let emotions get the best of you. Look at NE. Least emotional managed team in the league. It's like some fans don't want the team to get young and hungry again. This isn't baseball. As crazy as it is, the NFL is a different game than it was in 2013. Let John and Pete do their damn business. They had a borderline dynasty going. Build around Wilson, Earl, and Wagner. Enough said. I'd like to see Sherman stay if he's 100% but he's gonna have to take a damn pay cut. That's just the way it is.

Preach brother preach!!! Agree 100%. As for Sherman he has become a liability, even before the injury last year, he was getting burnt on a more regular basis. I mean a rookie QB in Watson last year made him look a fool. That isn't going to improve with age. Don't get me wrong love me some Shem, but it is time to cut bait, and rebuild this D around Wagner & ET with some young hungry guys with chips on their shoulders, like uhm............. oh yeah Sherm & Chancellor were coming outta college.

 

[TwistedHusky]

Adelta,

I believe that Carroll's environment and development combined with JS & Scott led to that success.

Without all the pieces, no I don't believe there is much more success coming.

You believe there is going to be more success coming under the Carroll team and I believe that we are in for a slow slide until he bails right before the bottom drops out. I really hope to be wrong on this one.

So let's hope you are right.

But no, I don't expect much more success from Carroll & JS based on what I have seen the past few years. I am hopeful that is not true however days like this rub it into my face that my earlier assessment is probably more likely correct.

I really hope to be wrong and have this rubbed in my face in a year or two.

 

[jammerhawk]

To be traded perhaps?

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... d-sherman/

Time will tell.

 

[jammerhawk]

So the team has picked no good players since Scot Mc left? Really?

Lots of hyperbole around here today.

 

[ExBassGuide]

In Pete and John I trust! no one knows what they know about the aging Seahawk team. If they think it is best for the team and getting us back to the S.B. I'm all for moves. Do you want a team to make it to the playoffs year after year and maybe even a few shots at the Super Bowl, Sit down and hang on! Pete and John did it once and I believe they can do it again!

Do you want an older often injured team not making the playoffs or a shot at five or six years in the playoffs and maybe more? paying top dollar for players entering possible / probable decline. I think it is safe to say that no one know football and the Seahawks better then P. & J.
Roger