Fieldgulls: More to Seahawks’ pressure problem than just OL

[MontanaHawk05]

https://www.fieldgulls.com/2017/11/14/1 ... ell-wilson

Good X's and O's read. Makes the point that a lot of pressures on Wilson come from blitzes, which fall on the play design (in part) to help ameliorate. Washington blitzed all day without answer.

 

[mistaowen]

Good read, thanks.

Seems like teams show their hand early on and don't need to adjust.

 

[iigakusei]

It doesn't make sense because I heard Bevell and Cable are fabulous.
This is my favourite part:
"And that’s not even an exhaustive list. In short, many of the offensive formations the Hawks have used this season have been minimal protection alignments that place the maximum amount of pressure on the offensive line. While the line has had struggles at times, it has also shown substantial improvement from the start of the season until today. Further, a good portion of the stress placed on the offensive line has come as a direct result of the offensive playcalling and scheming the team has used. I’m not going to posit why the team would utilize a system that would place as much stress as possible on the unit of the team that most pundits feel is the team’s weak link, so you can formulate your own hypotheses on that."

 

[Sgt. Largent]

It doesn't make sense because I heard Bevell and Cable are fabulous.
This is my favourite part:
"And that’s not even an exhaustive list. In short, many of the offensive formations the Hawks have used this season have been minimal protection alignments that place the maximum amount of pressure on the offensive line. While the line has had struggles at times, it has also shown substantial improvement from the start of the season until today. Further, a good portion of the stress placed on the offensive line has come as a direct result of the offensive playcalling and scheming the team has used. I’m not going to posit why the team would utilize a system that would place as much stress as possible on the unit of the team that most pundits feel is the team’s weak link, so you can formulate your own hypotheses on that."

Your only other option is to go into max protect...........and then what? Run the ball? Woo, good one!

Any offensive formation is a trade off with protection. It's obvious that Pete and Bevell are calling plays in hopes that Russell's athleticism and elusiveness can make up for the crappy protection. Rather than cut the playbook in half and run max protect plays, which take all of your 3 and 4 WR sets out of the playbook.

Bottom line, there is no GOOD way to playcall when your line stinks. You're going to have issues no matter which way you go.

 

[Boycie]

This was a great read.

So in short, it sounds like the play calling has been a major part of what has been plaguing the o-line?

If this is the case, why haven't we adjusted to the way teams have been playing us?

 

[adeltaY]

Max protection is not the only answer to this issue. Running the ball would be one, but we know we straight up can't do that, so that's a no. Screens are another option, but we don't run those much or well. Quick routes for the WRs like slants, hitches, outs, spots, etc. would be great but we seem to want to hit big plays against blitzes we can't block. Also, hot routes from the TE or RB, but we either rarely use those ore they go for 2 yards or less.

How about shifting protections? Keep a TE in to block or chip/release based on whether the DE rushes or drops into coverage. This allows the OT to keep an eye on the LB to see if he blitzes and pick him up if he does or block the DE after the TE releases if the LB drops back into coverage. Maybe diversify offensive alignments? There are ways to combat this, if there weren't then we wouldn't have good pass protection in this league.

 

[mikeak]

https://www.fieldgulls.com/2017/11/14/16643654/seahawks-offensive-line-duane-brown-pocic-britt-aboushi-ifedi-rawls-lacy-clayborn-russell-wilson

Good X's and O's read. Makes the point that a lot of pressures on Wilson come from blitzes, which fall on the play design (in part) to help ameliorate. Washington blitzed all day without answer.

Great read but sometimes I wonder about over complicating things.

Haven't hundreds of people been befuddled on this very website by how we fail to do something about blitzes? Arizona has hit us with the blitzes over and over and over again yet every single game it is the same story. I mean we have not efficiently moved the ball on Arizona, in a game that means something, in a very long time.........

They blitz and we don't have hot routes, outlet passes, screen passes, quick passes nor do we move players around or audible out of it. Again and again

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Max protection is not the only answer to this issue. Running the ball would be one, but we know we straight up can't do that, so that's a no. Screens are another option, but we don't run those much or well. Quick routes for the WRs like slants, hitches, outs, spots, etc. would be great but we seem to want to hit big plays against blitzes we can't block. Also, hot routes from the TE or RB, but we either rarely use those ore they go for 2 yards or less.

How about shifting protections? Keep a TE in to block or chip/release based on whether the DE rushes or drops into coverage. This allows the OT to keep an eye on the LB to see if he blitzes and pick him up if he does or block the DE after the TE releases if the LB drops back into coverage. Maybe diversify offensive alignments? There are ways to combat this, if there weren't then we wouldn't have good pass protection in this league.

I definitely agree on the screens, but you have to have a back that knows how to run them and you're comfortable with. Prosise is our best screen back, and well, yeah.............

Rawls likes to fumble his screens, and maybe McKissic? Idk, not really an i-back RB.

But overall I agree with "mo screens."

 

[mrt144]

Max protection is not the only answer to this issue. Running the ball would be one, but we know we straight up can't do that, so that's a no. Screens are another option, but we don't run those much or well. Quick routes for the WRs like slants, hitches, outs, spots, etc. would be great but we seem to want to hit big plays against blitzes we can't block. Also, hot routes from the TE or RB, but we either rarely use those ore they go for 2 yards or less.

How about shifting protections? Keep a TE in to block or chip/release based on whether the DE rushes or drops into coverage. This allows the OT to keep an eye on the LB to see if he blitzes and pick him up if he does or block the DE after the TE releases if the LB drops back into coverage. Maybe diversify offensive alignments? There are ways to combat this, if there weren't then we wouldn't have good pass protection in this league.

I definitely agree on the screens, but you have to have a back that knows how to run them and you're comfortable with. Prosise is our best screen back, and well, yeah.............

Rawls likes to fumble his screens, and maybe McKissic? Idk, not really an i-back RB.

But overall I agree with "mo screens."

The irony here (and it dovetails with your max protect comment above) is that the offense is so much better operating out of shotgun instead of under center. Don't know if you have access to the stats on Football Outsiders but that's my source on that.

 

[Seymour]

Funny they chose to do that on pass blocking when that is not even our lines biggest weakness. That would be run blocking.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

Bottom line, there is no GOOD way to playcall when your line stinks. You're going to have issues no matter which way you go.

Unless you install alert routes and dumpoff options that let the QB make predetermined throws or quick decisions that negate the pressure. In the first half, it would seem, it's alllll four-verts and deep crossers.

At least that's my impression. I wish I could afford All-22.

Oh, and by the way...and I know nobody wants to hear this, but it's true anyway and relevant...

Bubble screens are screens. :stirthepot:

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Bottom line, there is no GOOD way to playcall when your line stinks. You're going to have issues no matter which way you go.

Unless you install alert routes and dumpoff options that let the QB make predetermined throws or quick decisions that negate the pressure. In the first half, it would seem, it's alllll four-verts and deep crossers.
:

True, but some of that is on Russell. He falls in love with his own arm and taking shots downfield............when he has checkdowns and shorter routes open. Which if you follow guys like Hsu on Twitter you'll see how often those are open, and instead Russell chucks it downfield for a jump ball.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

Bottom line, there is no GOOD way to playcall when your line stinks. You're going to have issues no matter which way you go.

Unless you install alert routes and dumpoff options that let the QB make predetermined throws or quick decisions that negate the pressure. In the first half, it would seem, it's alllll four-verts and deep crossers.
:

True, but some of that is on Russell. He falls in love with his own arm and taking shots downfield............when he has checkdowns and shorter routes open. Which if you follow guys like Hsu on Twitter you'll see how often those are open, and instead Russell chucks it downfield for a jump ball.

That's also happening, yep. So it's a lot of things going wrong.

 

[scutterhawk]

It doesn't make sense because I heard Bevell and Cable are fabulous.
This is my favourite part:
"And that’s not even an exhaustive list. In short, many of the offensive formations the Hawks have used this season have been minimal protection alignments that place the maximum amount of pressure on the offensive line. While the line has had struggles at times, it has also shown substantial improvement from the start of the season until today. Further, a good portion of the stress placed on the offensive line has come as a direct result of the offensive playcalling and scheming the team has used. I’m not going to posit why the team would utilize a system that would place as much stress as possible on the unit of the team that most pundits feel is the team’s weak link, so you can formulate your own hypotheses on that."

Your only other option is to go into max protect...........and then what? Run the ball? Woo, good one!

Any offensive formation is a trade off with protection. It's obvious that Pete and Bevell are calling plays in hopes that Russell's athleticism and elusiveness can make up for the crappy protection. Rather than cut the playbook in half and run max protect plays, which take all of your 3 and 4 WR sets out of the playbook.

Bottom line, there is no GOOD way to playcall when your line stinks. You're going to have issues no matter which way you go.

Yep, The Deadskins applied very little pressure on the O-Line's BEST BLOCKER, Center Justin Britt, reserving their attack for pounding on the weakness of the other four O-Linemen.
The inept & shitty Referees letting the Skins Secondary tee off on our Receivers was icing on the Redskins cake.

 

[cymatica]

Bottom line, there is no GOOD way to playcall when your line stinks. You're going to have issues no matter which way you go.

Unless you install alert routes and dumpoff options that let the QB make predetermined throws or quick decisions that negate the pressure. In the first half, it would seem, it's alllll four-verts and deep crossers.
:

True, but some of that is on Russell. He falls in love with his own arm and taking shots downfield............when he has checkdowns and shorter routes open. Which if you follow guys like Hsu on Twitter you'll see how often those are open, and instead Russell chucks it downfield for a jump ball.

I don't think Wilson is perfect by any measure, but the coaches need to be drilling in his head to take what the defense gives you. The eye test, from the tv broadcast, tells me we quit often don't have the hot rout options available or run way too fee 3-5 step plays.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Bottom line, there is no GOOD way to playcall when your line stinks. You're going to have issues no matter which way you go.

Unless you install alert routes and dumpoff options that let the QB make predetermined throws or quick decisions that negate the pressure. In the first half, it would seem, it's alllll four-verts and deep crossers.
:

True, but some of that is on Russell. He falls in love with his own arm and taking shots downfield............when he has checkdowns and shorter routes open. Which if you follow guys like Hsu on Twitter you'll see how often those are open, and instead Russell chucks it downfield for a jump ball.

I don't think Wilson is perfect by any measure, but the coaches need to be drilling in his head to take what the defense gives you. The eye test, from the tv broadcast, tells me we quit often don't have the hot rout options available or run way too fee 3-5 step plays.

The coaches are part of the problem here. In the last few games we have been using little in the way of outlet routes, and our offense has paid. With the plays that are being called, the only thing Wilson can do is make something happen with his improv skills. The thing that is disconcerting to me is the fact that Washington, and even Arizona didn't even bother hiding the fact that they were blitzing. You knew who was going to blitz, and roughly where they were going to go pre-snap. That kind of audacity is the biggest diss that you can give an offense. Arizona followed the same game plan as Washington. Have their corners play off of our receivers, have a LB spy Wilson, and send 5 or more people. We continued to run the same long, developing plays against a team that was blitzing on almost every play. Even if every member of our line were pro-bowlers they would still struggle with this kind of playcalling. Our offensive coaching and philosophy is a huge liability at the moment.

 

[getnasty]

I don't care what Bevell calls if the defense shows a blitz and Russell doesn't change the play or the protection then it's on Russell in my opinion. Should Bevell call every play anticipating a blitz? Not trying to give Bevell a pass but you always see Rodgers, Brady, Brees and any other elite QB come to the line access the defense and then get there team in the right play if needed. If anyone is capable of reading a defense and adjusting it's Russ yet we rarely see him do it. Why is that?

 

[Spin Doctor]

https://www.fieldgulls.com/2017/11/14/16643654/seahawks-offensive-line-duane-brown-pocic-britt-aboushi-ifedi-rawls-lacy-clayborn-russell-wilson

Good X's and O's read. Makes the point that a lot of pressures on Wilson come from blitzes, which fall on the play design (in part) to help ameliorate. Washington blitzed all day without answer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUQKiJUi_Tg - Run game analysis

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdRT2KwN2gY - Texans game analysis. (offense)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRyYHz78KHE - Titans game analysis (offense)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9o_H847NSYM - Seattles 2015 off analysis

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzhK99Mb21M

As you can see, what we are doing now, vs what we did back in 2015 offensively is much different. Everything here is all-22

 

[WmHBonney]

Yet another soul wondering why this team makes no offensive adjustments. There seems to be a pattern here. Clearly, opposing defenses see a pattern.

 

[Seafan]

Current Seahawks are easy to defensive gameplan against. Pressure up the middle. RW can't handle it. It disrupts everything, run game included. This is not a Cable OL. They've put together a decent pass blocking line that has no push in the running game. Protecting RW is commendable but they have destroyed the offense. If you are going to a college line then you need to run a college offense.