Carlos Dunlap said he spoke with Russell Wilson before re-si

[pittpnthrs]

3 OC's, one Super Bowl that was won by a defense that needed the offense not to lose it and kill time.

All Three OC's left, the offense has never carried this team really, without outstanding defensive play we crumble without a pounding running game to eat time of possession and rely on hero ball. They took Hero ball away last season with a two deep look. We don't have a Incredible Hulk at RB, we have a good RB but not Lynch.

What is the common denominator, Gibbs a passing OC, Bevell a Passing OC, Schotty know for a good Run guy but a good passing OC as well.

I would say Pete does put his finger prints over how the offense functions, he wants the OC's to work in that frame work. When they want to deviate due to a DC figuring stuff out he is reluctant, if something fails or needs tweaking he reverts back to his comfort zone rather then countering. Why we looked so flat that past part of the season.

Exactly. Thats why it doesnt matter who the OC is. Anybody thinking Waldron is going to make substantial changes to the offense are sadly mistaken.

This is asinine, considering the extreme change we saw in 2020 towards a heavy pass split.

If you're talking about pass/run ratio. I can agree with that. If you're talking about scheme, I cant jump on board with that. It was the same old predictable running game, snap the ball with 1 second on the clock, throw the home run ball all the time. Same thing every year.

 

[pittpnthrs]

Come on. Most OC's move on due to other job opportunities, not because they were fired. Every OC under Pete,,,,,fired.

That has literally no effect on the Seahawks. None. End result is losing a coach. Schotty was getting head coach mentions in the media before his offense fell apart.

Also, provide the data showing that more coordinators move up than down, please.

Oh what team is Schotty the head coach of now? What exactly did head coaching mentions have to do with him being fired?

OC's dont necessarily grab the elusive head coaching gigs, but they move to other teams for better contracts and so forth. Tell me how many teams have fired 3 of them in a 10 year period? I'm betting its a very small list.

No data. Got it.

Judging by the fact that the average offensive coordinator has a tenure of about 1.1 years in their role, you're almost certainly off-track here. Should probably hold off on making claims you can't back up.

Everytime I look for information about OC's I get articles about minorities. I did find this one that states the average tenure of OC's is 2.29 years and states reasons as departure is both lack of success and moving on, so whatever. It doesnt point out which reason is more prevalent. I still feel its odd that Pete fired all of his OC's. Doesnt seem normal to me.

https://www.the33rdteam.com/post/study- ... oordinator

 

[Maelstrom787]

That has literally no effect on the Seahawks. None. End result is losing a coach. Schotty was getting head coach mentions in the media before his offense fell apart.

Also, provide the data showing that more coordinators move up than down, please.

Oh what team is Schotty the head coach of now? What exactly did head coaching mentions have to do with him being fired?

OC's dont necessarily grab the elusive head coaching gigs, but they move to other teams for better contracts and so forth. Tell me how many teams have fired 3 of them in a 10 year period? I'm betting its a very small list.

No data. Got it.

Judging by the fact that the average offensive coordinator has a tenure of about 1.1 years in their role, you're almost certainly off-track here. Should probably hold off on making claims you can't back up.

Everytime I look for information about OC's I get articles about minorities. I did find this one that states the average tenure of OC's is 2.29 years and states reasons as departure is both lack of success and moving on, so whatever. It doesnt point out which reason is more prevalent. I still feel its odd that Pete fired all of his OC's. Doesnt seem normal to me.

https://www.the33rdteam.com/post/study- ... oordinator

The 1.1 year figure was taken from an analysis at the beginning of the 2019 season. That season saw 16 new offensive coordinators, and 8 new head coaches.

Jeremy Bates sucked on and off the field, cut him loose year 1.

Bevell got sacked after the wheels fell off in 2017.

Schottenheimer got sacked after a longer-than-average tenure last year because his pass-heavy offense led to an inordinate amount of turnovers and the implosion of the franchise quarterback, with no solution found.

Either way, this isn't abnormal. In fact, OC in Seattle is more stable than anywhere else, for the most part. Do I think these guys have always been the best coaches? Nah, not at all. But it isn't a revolving door, and the job itself isn't a pit of misery for a capable coach.

 

[Appyhawk]

Aren't OCs more often targeted for HC advancement than other coordinator coaches?

 

[Maelstrom787]

Aren't OCs more often targeted for HC advancement than other coordinator coaches?

Probably. That's a hell of a lot different than saying most of them get promoted to HC, though.

 

[misfit]

Oh what team is Schotty the head coach of now? What exactly did head coaching mentions have to do with him being fired?

OC's dont necessarily grab the elusive head coaching gigs, but they move to other teams for better contracts and so forth. Tell me how many teams have fired 3 of them in a 10 year period? I'm betting its a very small list.

No data. Got it.

Judging by the fact that the average offensive coordinator has a tenure of about 1.1 years in their role, you're almost certainly off-track here. Should probably hold off on making claims you can't back up.

Everytime I look for information about OC's I get articles about minorities. I did find this one that states the average tenure of OC's is 2.29 years and states reasons as departure is both lack of success and moving on, so whatever. It doesnt point out which reason is more prevalent. I still feel its odd that Pete fired all of his OC's. Doesnt seem normal to me.

https://www.the33rdteam.com/post/study- ... oordinator

The 1.1 year figure was taken from an analysis at the beginning of the 2019 season. That season saw 16 new offensive coordinators, and 8 new head coaches.

Jeremy Bates sucked on and off the field, cut him loose year 1.

Bevell got sacked after the wheels fell off in 2017.

Schottenheimer got sacked after a longer-than-average tenure last year because his pass-heavy offense led to an inordinate amount of turnovers and the implosion of the franchise quarterback, with no solution found.

Either way, this isn't abnormal. In fact, OC in Seattle is more stable than anywhere else, for the most part. Do I think these guys have always been the best coaches? Nah, not at all. But it isn't a revolving door, and the job itself isn't a pit of misery for a capable coach.

Schotty just broke all type of offensive records for this franchise and is fired. Actually every year that Russ has put up career highs in stats, especially passing the OC has been let go. But one of the worst defensive coaching perfomances ever? Still here, not a word. There is no justification behind when Pete lets OC's go, and when they go too far away from his boring ass system they are shown the door. Probably to delay the situation we are in now of Russ wanting more influence.

 

[Maelstrom787]

No data. Got it.

Judging by the fact that the average offensive coordinator has a tenure of about 1.1 years in their role, you're almost certainly off-track here. Should probably hold off on making claims you can't back up.

Everytime I look for information about OC's I get articles about minorities. I did find this one that states the average tenure of OC's is 2.29 years and states reasons as departure is both lack of success and moving on, so whatever. It doesnt point out which reason is more prevalent. I still feel its odd that Pete fired all of his OC's. Doesnt seem normal to me.

https://www.the33rdteam.com/post/study- ... oordinator

The 1.1 year figure was taken from an analysis at the beginning of the 2019 season. That season saw 16 new offensive coordinators, and 8 new head coaches.

Jeremy Bates sucked on and off the field, cut him loose year 1.

Bevell got sacked after the wheels fell off in 2017.

Schottenheimer got sacked after a longer-than-average tenure last year because his pass-heavy offense led to an inordinate amount of turnovers and the implosion of the franchise quarterback, with no solution found.

Either way, this isn't abnormal. In fact, OC in Seattle is more stable than anywhere else, for the most part. Do I think these guys have always been the best coaches? Nah, not at all. But it isn't a revolving door, and the job itself isn't a pit of misery for a capable coach.

Schotty just broke all type of offensive records for this franchise and is fired. Actually every year that Russ has put up career highs in stats, especially passing the OC has been let go. But one of the worst defensive coaching perfomances ever? Still here, not a word. There is no justification behind when Pete lets OC's go, and when they go too far away from his boring ass system they are shown the door. Probably to delay the situation we are in now of Russ wanting more influence.

Are you seriously endorsing the offense we saw down the stretch last season? It completely fell apart and Russ looked broken.

Bates was let go after 2010 because he kinda sucked and was an ass off the field, apparently.

Bevell was let go after 2017 when the offense was anemic and one of the worst rushing teams of literally all time.

Schotty was let go this year after his offense and quarterback imploded.

If you're trying to argue that these guys are being fired for success, then it's clear you're arguing in bad faith. That's beyond nonsense.

 

[misfit]

Everytime I look for information about OC's I get articles about minorities. I did find this one that states the average tenure of OC's is 2.29 years and states reasons as departure is both lack of success and moving on, so whatever. It doesnt point out which reason is more prevalent. I still feel its odd that Pete fired all of his OC's. Doesnt seem normal to me.

https://www.the33rdteam.com/post/study- ... oordinator

The 1.1 year figure was taken from an analysis at the beginning of the 2019 season. That season saw 16 new offensive coordinators, and 8 new head coaches.

Jeremy Bates sucked on and off the field, cut him loose year 1.

Bevell got sacked after the wheels fell off in 2017.

Schottenheimer got sacked after a longer-than-average tenure last year because his pass-heavy offense led to an inordinate amount of turnovers and the implosion of the franchise quarterback, with no solution found.

Either way, this isn't abnormal. In fact, OC in Seattle is more stable than anywhere else, for the most part. Do I think these guys have always been the best coaches? Nah, not at all. But it isn't a revolving door, and the job itself isn't a pit of misery for a capable coach.

Schotty just broke all type of offensive records for this franchise and is fired. Actually every year that Russ has put up career highs in stats, especially passing the OC has been let go. But one of the worst defensive coaching perfomances ever? Still here, not a word. There is no justification behind when Pete lets OC's go, and when they go too far away from his boring ass system they are shown the door. Probably to delay the situation we are in now of Russ wanting more influence.

Are you seriously endorsing the offense we saw down the stretch last season? It completely fell apart and Russ looked broken.

Bates was let go after 2010 because he kinda sucked and was an ass off the field, apparently.

Bevell was let go after 2017 when the offense was anemic and one of the worst rushing teams of literally all time.

Schotty was let go this year after his offense and quarterback imploded.

If you're trying to argue that these guys are being fired for success, then it's clear you're arguing in bad faith. That's beyond nonsense.

Im not saing the offense was acceptable, but if a coordinator should be let go, it should be Norton. The problem on offense I would put on way other issues than an OC. Russ was off, Pete meddled, some was scheme, there is a lot of issues. I think the firing was definitely a surprise.

I dont think its a coincidence that the OC gets fired every year Russ has a career year. We can have a trash year offensively and as long as were "pounding the rock" everything is just fine

 

[pittpnthrs]

Wonder when Waldron will get the axe? 23',,,,24'?

5 more years guys, just 5 more years.

 

[chris98251]

Aren't OCs more often targeted for HC advancement than other coordinator coaches?

It's cyclic, it seems to trend in waves by what's dominating the game.

 

[Maelstrom787]

The 1.1 year figure was taken from an analysis at the beginning of the 2019 season. That season saw 16 new offensive coordinators, and 8 new head coaches.

Jeremy Bates sucked on and off the field, cut him loose year 1.

Bevell got sacked after the wheels fell off in 2017.

Schottenheimer got sacked after a longer-than-average tenure last year because his pass-heavy offense led to an inordinate amount of turnovers and the implosion of the franchise quarterback, with no solution found.

Either way, this isn't abnormal. In fact, OC in Seattle is more stable than anywhere else, for the most part. Do I think these guys have always been the best coaches? Nah, not at all. But it isn't a revolving door, and the job itself isn't a pit of misery for a capable coach.

Schotty just broke all type of offensive records for this franchise and is fired. Actually every year that Russ has put up career highs in stats, especially passing the OC has been let go. But one of the worst defensive coaching perfomances ever? Still here, not a word. There is no justification behind when Pete lets OC's go, and when they go too far away from his boring ass system they are shown the door. Probably to delay the situation we are in now of Russ wanting more influence.

Are you seriously endorsing the offense we saw down the stretch last season? It completely fell apart and Russ looked broken.

Bates was let go after 2010 because he kinda sucked and was an ass off the field, apparently.

Bevell was let go after 2017 when the offense was anemic and one of the worst rushing teams of literally all time.

Schotty was let go this year after his offense and quarterback imploded.

If you're trying to argue that these guys are being fired for success, then it's clear you're arguing in bad faith. That's beyond nonsense.

Im not saing the offense was acceptable, but if a coordinator should be let go, it should be Norton. The problem on offense I would put on way other issues than an OC. Russ was off, Pete meddled, some was scheme, there is a lot of issues. I think the firing was definitely a surprise.

I dont think its a coincidence that the OC gets fired every year Russ has a career year. We can have a trash year offensively and as long as were "pounding the rock" everything is just fine

2017 wasn't a career year for Russell, and 2020 looked good overall on paper but saw him sink to his lowest professional lows in the second half of the year.

Again, the whole "Pete fires OC's when they're successful" argument is beyond bogus.

 

[misfit]

Schotty just broke all type of offensive records for this franchise and is fired. Actually every year that Russ has put up career highs in stats, especially passing the OC has been let go. But one of the worst defensive coaching perfomances ever? Still here, not a word. There is no justification behind when Pete lets OC's go, and when they go too far away from his boring ass system they are shown the door. Probably to delay the situation we are in now of Russ wanting more influence.

Are you seriously endorsing the offense we saw down the stretch last season? It completely fell apart and Russ looked broken.

Bates was let go after 2010 because he kinda sucked and was an ass off the field, apparently.

Bevell was let go after 2017 when the offense was anemic and one of the worst rushing teams of literally all time.

Schotty was let go this year after his offense and quarterback imploded.

If you're trying to argue that these guys are being fired for success, then it's clear you're arguing in bad faith. That's beyond nonsense.

Im not saing the offense was acceptable, but if a coordinator should be let go, it should be Norton. The problem on offense I would put on way other issues than an OC. Russ was off, Pete meddled, some was scheme, there is a lot of issues. I think the firing was definitely a surprise.

I dont think its a coincidence that the OC gets fired every year Russ has a career year. We can have a trash year offensively and as long as were "pounding the rock" everything is just fine

2017 wasn't a career year for Russell, and 2020 looked good overall on paper but saw him sink to his lowest professional lows in the second half of the year.

Again, the whole "Pete fires OC's when they're successful" argument is beyond bogus.

He tied a high in passing tds

 

[Maelstrom787]

Are you seriously endorsing the offense we saw down the stretch last season? It completely fell apart and Russ looked broken.

Bates was let go after 2010 because he kinda sucked and was an ass off the field, apparently.

Bevell was let go after 2017 when the offense was anemic and one of the worst rushing teams of literally all time.

Schotty was let go this year after his offense and quarterback imploded.

If you're trying to argue that these guys are being fired for success, then it's clear you're arguing in bad faith. That's beyond nonsense.

Im not saing the offense was acceptable, but if a coordinator should be let go, it should be Norton. The problem on offense I would put on way other issues than an OC. Russ was off, Pete meddled, some was scheme, there is a lot of issues. I think the firing was definitely a surprise.

I dont think its a coincidence that the OC gets fired every year Russ has a career year. We can have a trash year offensively and as long as were "pounding the rock" everything is just fine

2017 wasn't a career year for Russell, and 2020 looked good overall on paper but saw him sink to his lowest professional lows in the second half of the year.

Again, the whole "Pete fires OC's when they're successful" argument is beyond bogus.

He tied a high in passing tds

So now we're cherry picking single statistics, hmm? You think that helps your argument?

Lowest yards per attempt, adjusted yards per attempt, tied for most interceptions to that point, and one of his lowest passer ratings. Indisputably one of his worst years due to a horrible supporting cast. Led team to what has been its worst record since 2012, and remains so.

If that's your idea of success, then you'd really like the Bears or some other hilarious fringe team.

 

[hawkfan68]

Im not saing the offense was acceptable, but if a coordinator should be let go, it should be Norton. The problem on offense I would put on way other issues than an OC. Russ was off, Pete meddled, some was scheme, there is a lot of issues. I think the firing was definitely a surprise.

I dont think its a coincidence that the OC gets fired every year Russ has a career year. We can have a trash year offensively and as long as were "pounding the rock" everything is just fine

2017 wasn't a career year for Russell, and 2020 looked good overall on paper but saw him sink to his lowest professional lows in the second half of the year.

Again, the whole "Pete fires OC's when they're successful" argument is beyond bogus.

He tied a high in passing tds

So now we're cherry picking single statistics, hmm? You think that helps your argument?

Lowest yards per attempt, adjusted yards per attempt, tied for most interceptions to that point, and one of his lowest passer ratings. Indisputably one of his worst years due to a horrible supporting cast. Led team to what has been its worst record since 2012, and remains so.

If that's your idea of success, then you'd really like the Bears or some other hilarious fringe team.

Russell had a QB rating of 105.1 which was his highest rating except for 3 seasons where he was higher. As matter of fact his rating was higher than years 2012-2014, 2016-2017.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/14881/russell-wilson

 

[Maelstrom787]

2017 wasn't a career year for Russell, and 2020 looked good overall on paper but saw him sink to his lowest professional lows in the second half of the year.

Again, the whole "Pete fires OC's when they're successful" argument is beyond bogus.

He tied a high in passing tds

So now we're cherry picking single statistics, hmm? You think that helps your argument?

Lowest yards per attempt, adjusted yards per attempt, tied for most interceptions to that point, and one of his lowest passer ratings. Indisputably one of his worst years due to a horrible supporting cast. Led team to what has been its worst record since 2012, and remains so.

If that's your idea of success, then you'd really like the Bears or some other hilarious fringe team.

Russell had a QB rating of 105.1 which was his highest rating except for 3 seasons where he was higher. As matter of fact his rating was higher than years 2012-2014, 2016-2017.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/14881/russell-wilson

I was referring to 2017, as was Misfit, as 2017 saw him throw 34 touchdowns which was tied for his most in a season until he threw 35 in 2018... when Brian Schottenheimer was retained, further proving my point.

 

[misfit]

2017 wasn't a career year for Russell, and 2020 looked good overall on paper but saw him sink to his lowest professional lows in the second half of the year.

Again, the whole "Pete fires OC's when they're successful" argument is beyond bogus.

He tied a high in passing tds

So now we're cherry picking single statistics, hmm? You think that helps your argument?

Lowest yards per attempt, adjusted yards per attempt, tied for most interceptions to that point, and one of his lowest passer ratings. Indisputably one of his worst years due to a horrible supporting cast. Led team to what has been its worst record since 2012, and remains so.

If that's your idea of success, then you'd really like the Bears or some other hilarious fringe team.

Russell had a QB rating of 105.1 which was his highest rating except for 3 seasons where he was higher. As matter of fact his rating was higher than years 2012-2014, 2016-2017.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/14881/russell-wilson

I don't think there is a rhyme or reason to Pete firing ocs he just does it to scapegoat the offense and keep heat off himself. He will never ever ever fire a dc no matter what happens

 

[Maelstrom787]

He tied a high in passing tds

So now we're cherry picking single statistics, hmm? You think that helps your argument?

Lowest yards per attempt, adjusted yards per attempt, tied for most interceptions to that point, and one of his lowest passer ratings. Indisputably one of his worst years due to a horrible supporting cast. Led team to what has been its worst record since 2012, and remains so.

If that's your idea of success, then you'd really like the Bears or some other hilarious fringe team.

Russell had a QB rating of 105.1 which was his highest rating except for 3 seasons where he was higher. As matter of fact his rating was higher than years 2012-2014, 2016-2017.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/14881/russell-wilson

I don't think there is a rhyme or reason to Pete firing ocs he just does it to scapegoat the offense and keep heat off himself. He will never ever ever fire a dc no matter what happens

He fires them when the wheels fall off. 2017 was pure hell all season, and 2020 fell apart in spectacular fashion despite finishing with a great record.

I just can't understand why the OC firing is actually getting criticism. It's a GOOD thing, and something we have all asked for. Schotty wasn't workin' out, and Pete hired a Russ-approved guy from a contemporary scheme. This is good!

 

[hawkfan68]

He tied a high in passing tds

So now we're cherry picking single statistics, hmm? You think that helps your argument?

Lowest yards per attempt, adjusted yards per attempt, tied for most interceptions to that point, and one of his lowest passer ratings. Indisputably one of his worst years due to a horrible supporting cast. Led team to what has been its worst record since 2012, and remains so.

If that's your idea of success, then you'd really like the Bears or some other hilarious fringe team.

Russell had a QB rating of 105.1 which was his highest rating except for 3 seasons where he was higher. As matter of fact his rating was higher than years 2012-2014, 2016-2017.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/14881/russell-wilson

I don't think there is a rhyme or reason to Pete firing ocs he just does it to scapegoat the offense and keep heat off himself. He will never ever ever fire a dc no matter what happens

Because we all know why....Pete is really the DC in Seattle. Ken Norton takes the blame but it's Pete's defense, always has been. Pete isn't going to fire himself.

 

[misfit]

So now we're cherry picking single statistics, hmm? You think that helps your argument?

Lowest yards per attempt, adjusted yards per attempt, tied for most interceptions to that point, and one of his lowest passer ratings. Indisputably one of his worst years due to a horrible supporting cast. Led team to what has been its worst record since 2012, and remains so.

If that's your idea of success, then you'd really like the Bears or some other hilarious fringe team.

Russell had a QB rating of 105.1 which was his highest rating except for 3 seasons where he was higher. As matter of fact his rating was higher than years 2012-2014, 2016-2017.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/14881/russell-wilson

I don't think there is a rhyme or reason to Pete firing ocs he just does it to scapegoat the offense and keep heat off himself. He will never ever ever fire a dc no matter what happens

Because we all know why....Pete is really the DC in Seattle. Ken Norton takes the blame but it's Pete's defense, always has been. Pete isn't going to fire himself.

I agree w/ this, the ironic thing is that its Pete's offense as well. We'll see if it changes w/ Waldren. Schotty wasnt even allowed to bring his own playbook here originally. Im not a huge schotty fan, I just know that these OCs arent getting a fair shake when they come here

 

[TwistedHusky]

If Pete is the DC, that is a problem, because he sucks at it now.

I am hoping this is just Norton being below par. But it could be that Pete is just old and nowhere near the sharp defensive mind he used to be.

Let's hope the problem is Norton because at least Pete can fire Norton.

Not that it matters much because Pete struggles to hire effective coordinators, always has.