Anyone think Russ was trying to sabotage the O last year?

toffee

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I don't think Russ sabotage Hawk's season, Russ did put his personal interest ahead of the team's, that's for sure. What got me, and the former member of the LOB etc., was how he told John and Pete that he WILL NOT sign any contract extension with Hawks, yet go in front of press and said he wants to be Hawks for life.

LOB boys saw that type of stuff too often to have any respect for him. History often repeat itself, let's watch how the Bronco gig evolves.
 

keasley45

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toffee":3ihkl99f said:
What got me, and the former member of the LOB etc., was how he told John and Pete that he WILL NOT sign any contract extension with Hawks, yet go in front of press and said he wants to be Hawks for life.

LOB boys saw that type of stuff too often to have any respect for him. History often repeat itself, let's watch how the Bronco gig evolves.

Exactly. Who Russ is has been put out there for everyone to see for years. Teammates have called him out and the criticism was wrongly dismissed as misplaced 'hate' for not being 'black' enough.

No. They were pissed because it was ok for Russ to go out there and not execute, but also not get criticism because he'd 'fix' it in the end and then all Pete could talk about was how 'beautifully' he played. Russ wasn't any better at running the playbook in 2014 than he was in 2021. And his teammates were pissed that he wasn't called out for it and in the LOB days had to carry the team with the a stellar defense.

Russ has been playing the 'persona' game from jump and was even criticized for it by players at NCState.

Schneider confirming that Russ told them essentially that he'd never play for them again after his contract was up should be the smoking gun... if you wanna see it. He tells his FO, bye. He plays all last year like the offense is his own personal merc squad. And then all the while puts on the happy, good guy face to the media, to the degree he says he didn't even know he was being traded until he was told... because he thought he'd retire in Seattle???

Give me a ________ break.
 

toffee

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keasley45":31i0m1d3 said:
toffee":31i0m1d3 said:
What got me, and the former member of the LOB etc., was how he told John and Pete that he WILL NOT sign any contract extension with Hawks, yet go in front of press and said he wants to be Hawks for life.

LOB boys saw that type of stuff too often to have any respect for him. History often repeat itself, let's watch how the Bronco gig evolves.

Exactly. Who Russ is has been put out there for everyone to see for years. Teammates have called him out and the criticism was wrongly dismissed as misplaced 'hate' for not being 'black' enough.

No. They were pissed because it was ok for Russ to go out there and not execute, but also not get criticism because he'd 'fix' it in the end and then all Pete could talk about was how 'beautifully' he played. Russ wasn't any better at running the playbook in 2014 than he was in 2021. And his teammates were pissed that he wasn't called out for it and in the LOB days had to carry the team with the a stellar defense.

Russ has been playing the 'persona' game from jump and was even criticized for it by players at NCState.

Schneider confirming that Russ told them essentially that he'd never play for them again after his contract was up should be the smoking gun... if you wanna see it. He tells his FO, bye. He plays all last year like the offense is his own personal merc squad. And then all the while puts on the happy, good guy face to the media, to the degree he says he didn't even know he was being traded until he was told... because he thought he'd retire in Seattle???

Give me a ________ break.

Not wanting to play for the Hawks, one could accept, it's after all Russ's decision to make. But why go in front of media and tell 12s he is Hawks for life, wanted to stay after he told the team is will not sign any extension?
 

emurri

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pmedic920":350o797i said:
I don’t.

A bad season wasn’t going to help his trade value.
I agree. I don’t think he would suck on purpose but I could see him checking out a bit when it was clear there was going to be no playoffs.
 

keasley45

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emurri":2bvnulbp said:
pmedic920":2bvnulbp said:
I don’t.

A bad season wasn’t going to help his trade value.
I agree. I don’t think he would suck on purpose but I could see him checking out a bit when it was clear there was going to be no playoffs.

Agree. He wouldnt 'suck' and throw games, but
the thing thats curious is that Russ is smart enough to know that the perception of his fortunes and the teams weren't necessarily linked. His PR push for the last 2 years made it such that if he was still putting up the highlights and not committing unforgivable errors, that if the team struggled to a lackluster record, the media spin would see a team that had only one star, Russel Wilson. That's why when he woukd say things on his bounce back from injury like 'look out, we're gonna go on a run...' he meant it, but it was also going to be the Russel Wilson show. He cared to win, but win his way. It was smart. Why spend time potentially struggling to execute an entirely new scheme and putting that difficulty on tape when you can just ride it out doing what you've always done and get praise for it even when in reality, even if you struggle, the leess obvious, but more telling stats that point to flaws in you game are overlooked due to your generational talent?

What was ultimately come to be was touched on in the Athletic article last year. Positioning to control the narrative on his way out of town.
 

FrodosFinger

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No he just flat out stank ass. 3 years now in rapid decline. Less vision and mobility coupled with very poor accuracy and decision making with a "me against the world" attitude led to a very rapid decline. Now he bounced to Denver to a very gullible fan base lol
 

Boohman14

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I can't believe Russ tried to tank. I do think he should have sat longer but Pete probably thought that Russ needed to play out his rust. I think Geno would go into panic mode in certain parts of game and that may have scared Pete into inserting Russ a bit early.
 

scutterhawk

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Not wanting to play for the Hawks, one could accept, it's after all Russ's decision to make. But why go in front of media and tell 12s he is Hawks for life, wanted to stay after he told the team is will not sign any extension?
LOL, who started the "Let Russ Cook" narrative in '2020'? I doubt like hell it was the HC that got Seattle its FIRST Lombardi ->Pete Carroll.
Who mentioned 'in a presser' after a few games into several up & down games that "We Did Let Russ Cook"? When it became painfully obvious that Wilson wasn't following any of Schottenheimers' recipe's, Pete reined in Head-Chef Russ.
Also, in '2020', a disgruntled Russ let it be KNOWN that there were only a select few Teams that he'd consider waiving his "No Trade Clause" to play for, ->putting Pete Carroll on notice<-
'2021'->Wilson went in front of the doting fans Media & proclaimed his loyalty to being "a Hawk for Life", maybe in hopes that he could show that he had the hearts & minds of the Seahawks Fans & Media, that Jody Allen would just maybe choose him over Pete, and when she didn't buy into it, Russ knew that it was OVER in Seattle.
Now do I think that he purposely tanked his play last season? NO, (well not conscientiously anyway) as he still had his BRAND & reputation to think about.
I don't wish him any ill will, BUT, neither do I see that Pete Carroll should on the blame hook for a disgruntled Russell Wilson wanting to someday own a Professional ball club & trying to redirect how he believes the Seahawks Offense should be run either.
This Ruckus isn't just about what Wilson WANTED....Pete Carroll has 52 OTHER Players that he's responsible for.
Also, it's NOT the Russell Willson Seahawks, it's ALWAYS been the Seattle Seahawks that will ALWAYS own my fandom, & the FACT that it was HC Pete Carroll that COACHED us to that Lombardi, is why I believe that he's owed the benefit of doubt in this argument.
 

chrispy

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How do you define sabotage?

Part of what made RW successful was his preparation, both physically and mentally. Once he hit the field in 01, I believe he did everything he could to win each play. But in the last 3+/- years, I also believe his priorities changed so the Seahawks weren't his top/only focus 24/7 off the field. That's probably for a combination of a number of factors, but he wasn't unconditionally committed the same way he was previously. I'd guess he's re-doubling his focus for Denver and his former self will re-surface for a few years. ...until it fades again for the same reasons it did in Seattle.

...just my opinion and prediction. No judgement.
 

Lagartixa

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I don't think he intentionally tried to sabotage the team's offense. There would be no advantage for him in that.

However, I do think he believes he knows better than the coaching staff how to win (and some of the Russ fellators around here believe that too), and that ignoring open receivers at shorter but potentially chain-moving distances to go for long-yardage plays was part of that.
 

Hawkstorian

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He did say he might write a book some day, so will be interesting to hear his spin on things.
 

scutterhawk

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I don't think he intentionally tried to sabotage the team's offense. There would be no advantage for him in that.

However, I do think he believes he knows better than the coaching staff how to win (and some of the Russ fellators around here believe that too), and that ignoring open receivers at shorter but potentially chain-moving distances to go for long-yardage plays was part of that.
I also believe that Penny's success kind of irked him, as that was more of the "PETE BALL" and didn't really put the spotlight on his COOKING.
I fully believe that Wilson wanted Pete to focus more on producing better 'PASS PROTECTION' back away from featuring too much of Pete's 'Running Attack Show', as it was stealing attention the from his GLORIOUS PASS PADDING STATS.
Just imagine how the sales on his market items would soar if he'd won "Best Player of the YEAR"
That's why he's ecstatic about playing in front of an all-new Mega Market in Denver now.
 

CPHawk

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As Mike Salk was pointing out, RW rushed for 180 yards last year in 14 games.

anybody else going to be mad if he ups it to 500 next year?

Or is Russ just a potato with legs now?
Russ 40 time is probably around 4.8 now. Of course his rushing numbers have gone down, he can’t run like he used to.
 

Rainger

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RW after the first couple of years and after he "found" Hollywood and Cira was all about his brand.

Don't think he was "tanking" the club on purpose, but as others have so eloquently expressed it ,he definitely was doing what RW wanted to do regardless of the team , the play, the scheme or the play call.

RW has a way of playing to circumvent his weaknesses and accent his strengths. Unfortunately over the last few years his body has been making that much harder to achieve and we all watched the decline.

He wanted the team to build to him and cover up his weaknesses and initially they tried but as others have expressed, it didn't work.

This last year was soooo obvious that he had checked out and was already planning his move. Notwithstanding his words.

RW is the consummate politician. Says what he knows you want to hear.

As much as I used to love him I did lose respect and think RW is all about RW regardless of the rhetoric.

It is time to move on. This team WILL be better with him gone, even though that opinion may upset all the negative nellies and RW groupies.
 

IndyHawk

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It wasn't intentional but he did sabotage the season
by wanting the glory and showcasing himself.
You see this in everything he does it seems has to have
him in shining light.
As for himself the QB?I think he is in denial and that water
is not working.
He's fooled a lot but himself more.
 

Rainger

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From the Ringer article in another thread. says it so well.

But Russ is also an outlier in that he’s been able to consistently produce like a top quarterback while using an approach that we typically associate with mediocre passers. He regularly abandons clean pockets; he drops his eyes and looks to scramble at the first sign of pressure; and he is pretty much incapable of executing dropback passing concepts because of that discomfort with bodies around him. But Wilson is also supremely accurate: He has an arm that can make any throw, and he’s one of the best playmakers we’ve ever seen. He’s so talented he can get away with breaking the rules in ways that even the best quarterbacks in the NFL can’t. And while that style of play brought Seattle a lot of wins in the past decade, it’s easy to see how calling plays for such a quarterback could be frustrating for an offensive coordinator.

Wilson is the antithesis of the “system quarterback.” He is his own system, to the point that it didn’t matter who Carroll brought in as a play-caller. Eventually everything morphed into the Russell Wilson Offense.

Man this is a damn good article and has graphs to show RW's style. A must read on another thread.
 
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Maui12thman

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I think sabotage is the wrong word. I do think that he made every effort to shift blame of any failure away from him. For example, tell me if anyone felt this way- it seemed in the old days, to avoid sacks he would effortlessly fly the ball out of bounds and eat the down. Seemed he quit doing that and instead took the sacks, in doing so wouldn’t lower his completion percentage and instead would be able to give a visual of a poor offensive line.
In my eyes, Russell looks like a QB who is really difficult to pass-block for. Offensive lineman typically have subconscious clock in their head when pass blocking, which frankly is nullified when you have no idea where or when your QB is gonna break the pocket. Coaches and former lineman, what say you?
 

toffee

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I think sabotage is the wrong word. I do think that he made every effort to shift blame of any failure away from him. For example, tell me if anyone felt this way- it seemed in the old days, to avoid sacks he would effortlessly fly the ball out of bounds and eat the down. Seemed he quit doing that and instead took the sacks, in doing so wouldn’t lower his completion percentage and instead would be able to give a visual of a poor offensive line.
In my eyes, Russell looks like a QB who is really difficult to pass-block for. Offensive lineman typically have subconscious clock in their head when pass blocking, which frankly is nullified when you have no idea where or when your QB is gonna break the pocket. Coaches and former lineman, what say you?
I recalled Duane Brown said something along those lines right after he joined the hawks, can't remember exactly what he said though.
 

Smellyman

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I recalled Duane Brown said something along those lines right after he joined the hawks, can't remember exactly what he said though.
There were times this year when it looked like Brown wanted to pickup Wilson and slam him to the ground. He was getting quite frustrated with him.
 
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