Make No Mistake, Wilson Sucked, But He is NOT the Concern

[Fade]

Wilson had a bad game, his worst in a really long time. I saw a defeated player on the bench. Like they didn't have the answers. And they played like they didn't have any answers after the 1st possession.

The defense has been so bad, Wilson has been pressing and forcing throws he normally wouldn't.

The last 1.5 seasons I've been thoroughly impressed with how he has been able to carry such a flawed team and not even flinch. He's starting to flinch. He is actually human. But he will bounce back though, I am not concerned with Wilson.

I am concerned with the old man who built the worst defense in NFL history with multiple pro bowlers & all pros, $60M in in available cap space, Three 1st Rd picks, a 2nd Rd pick, and an additional 3rd Rd pick in this off-season. They expunged a gargantuan amount of assets to build… THIS!? And Pete has shown no signs of improving for 5+ seasons. They've literally gotten worse every single season for 7 seasons on defense, never improving once. They can't even go say, 27th to 22nd. They are going for the record this year, no pussyfooting around and falling to only 30th. NOPE! not only 32nd, but the worst 32nd of all-time.

The final score does not reflect how much the Rams totally eviscerated and entirely destroyed the Seahawks. The Rams took their foot off the gas because they didn't need to score anymore. Why risk a Goof turnover, that would've been the only way the Seahawks had a chance. It wasn't like the Seahawks were going to do anything offensively.

McVay is playing chess, Pete is playing checkers. That is what is concerning. The coaches in the division are all way younger and ahead of the curve. Pete's scheme was figured out years ago.

 

[Sports Hernia]

Wilson had a bad game, his worst in a really long time. I saw a defeated player on the bench. Like they didn't have the answers. And they played like they didn't have any answers after the 1st possession.

The defense has been so bad, Wilson has been pressing and forcing throws he normally wouldn't.

The last 1.5 seasons I've been thoroughly impressed with how he has been able to carry such a flawed team and not even flinch. He's starting to flinch. He is actually human. But he will bounce back though, I am not concerned with Wilson.

I am concerned with the old man who built the worst defense in NFL history with multiple pro bowlers & all pros, $60M in in available cap space, Three 1st Rd picks, a 2nd Rd pick, and an additional 3rd Rd pick in this off-season. They expunged a gargantuan amount of assets to build… THIS!? And Pete has shown no signs of improving for 5+ seasons. They've literally gotten worse every single season for 7 seasons on defense, never improving once. They can't even go say, 27th to 22nd. They are going for the record this year, no pussyfooting around and falling to only 30th. NOPE! not only 32nd, but the worst 32nd of all-time.

The final score does not reflect how much the Rams totally eviscerated and entirely destroyed the Seahawks. The Rams took their foot off the gas because they didn't need to score anymore. Why risk a Goof turnover, that would've been the only way the Seahawks had a chance. It wasn't like the Seahawks were going to do anything offensively.

McVay is playing chess, Pete is playing checkers. That is what is concerning. The coaches in the division are all way younger and ahead of the curve. Pete's scheme was figured out years ago.

Pete needs to adapt his coaching or his coaching career is going to go extinct.
He and his staff are extremely slow at making in game adjustments. I don’t think he realizes he doesn’t have the LOB defense anymore.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

McVay is playing chess, Pete is playing checkers. That is what is concerning. The coaches in the division are all way younger and ahead of the curve. Pete's scheme was figured out years ago.

Happened last week too, Pete got his coaching ass handed to him by McDermott.

But this is not a new thing, Pete has never outcoached anybody. He's won with superior talent through personnel acquisition and development.

That's really what's fallen short for Pete, he and John fell back to the rest of the pack in personnel, and if not for Russell would have been staring down the barrel of 4-5 straight years of 8-8 seasons with a different QB.

Did they draft and develop Russell into the HOF QB he is? Absolutely, but make no mistake Russell is now the reason we're an above average organization, just as much as Pete's responsible.

 

[John63]

Wilson had a bad game, his worst in a really long time. I saw a defeated player on the bench. Like they didn't have the answers. And they played like they didn't have any answers after the 1st possession.

The defense has been so bad, Wilson has been pressing and forcing throws he normally wouldn't.

The last 1.5 seasons I've been thoroughly impressed with how he has been able to carry such a flawed team and not even flinch. He's starting to flinch. He is actually human. But he will bounce back though, I am not concerned with Wilson.

I am concerned with the old man who built the worst defense in NFL history with multiple pro bowlers & all pros, $60M in in available cap space, Three 1st Rd picks, a 2nd Rd pick, and an additional 3rd Rd pick in this off-season. They expunged a gargantuan amount of assets to build… THIS!? And Pete has shown no signs of improving for 5+ seasons. They've literally gotten worse every single season for 7 seasons on defense, never improving once. They can't even go say, 27th to 22nd. They are going for the record this year, no pu$$y around and falling to only 30th. NOPE! not only 32nd, but the worst 32nd of all-time.

The final score does not reflect how much the Rams totally eviscerated and entirely destroyed the Seahawks. The Rams took their foot off the gas because they didn't need to score anymore. Why risk a Goof turnover, that would've been the only way the Seahawks had a chance. It wasn't like the Seahawks were going to do anything offensively.

McVay is playing chess, Pete is playing checkers. That is what is concerning. The coaches in the division are all way younger and ahead of the curve. Pete's scheme was figured out years ago.

Agreed on all counts, however I think some of the defeating you saw was Wilson frustrated that we went back to same old afte rgame 5.

Notice since game 5 little screens, little quick passing, little uptempo, little snapping at different times, lots of pocket movement, Wilson running early etc

Since game after game 5 we have seen lots of long developing routes, little movement of the pocket, lots of snapping with under 5 seconds, little Wilson running till 4th qtr.


I believe PC changed things to slow things down and take more time thinking it will help the defense. Remember he hates short passes anyway and its got Wilson frustrated. And then instead of just saying git he basically throws Wilson under the bus.

 

[AgentDib]

The larger concept behind this thread is the notion that something has changed recently, in this case that stress has finally caught up to Russ. That's always possible but you should immediately be wary of this line of reasoning because it is usually associated with flimsy arguments.

It's true that Carroll is older than McVay, and it's true that the Seahawks defense has struggled this season. We have a lot of history of those things being true and Russ playing well at the same time. The idea that we should throw out that information on the theory that maybe things are different now should require a lot of supporting evidence to be persuasive, as it is an appeal to look a small amount of recent information instead of the complete picture.

A much simpler explanation that includes historical information would be that Russ has struggled against those kind of defenses before, as well as that he is human and varies in how well he plays from week to week. One of his worst outings last season was against the Cardinals in December when he went 16/31 with 169 yards passing and the 11-4 Seahawks looked uncompetitive against the 4-9-1 Cardinals. It happens sometimes.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

A much simpler explanation that includes historical information would be that Russ has struggled against those kind of defenses before, as well as that he is human and varies in how well he plays from week to week. One of his worst outings last season was against the Cardinals in December when he went 16/31 with 169 yards passing and the 11-4 Seahawks looked uncompetitive against the 4-9-1 Cardinals. It happens sometimes.

I don't care how good the QB is, he will usually struggle against a good defense when the offense is one dimensional, of which we've been since Carson and Hyde got hurt.

That's really the issue here, not Russell. Teams no longer have to respect the run game and play action, and are just crowding the line, press covering and sending blitzes. So after the first quarter when Russell's been sacked, hit and harassed he's got happy feet, he's indecisive and he's making mistakes.

Schotty and Pete aren't helping him any by not changing the way they're gameplanning, they still think they have a run game, and they don't. So the end result is bad gameplanning + bad playcalling + predictable offense = Russ and offense getting their poop pushed in.

 

[AgentDib]

I don't care how good the QB is, he will usually struggle against a good defense when the offense is one dimensional, of which we've been since Carson and Hyde got hurt. That's really the issue here, not Russell.

I think we have plenty of evidence of Russ getting hit many times in a game and not getting happy feet, and I don't see the above as the takeaway from the Rams game at all. It's absolutely more difficult without Carson, and I think we probably needed a ~70th percentile performance from Russ in order to win as a result. We could have gotten it though, and there were many things that could have happened in that game that just didn't. The all-22 is up on GamePass now and I think it's pretty clear that Russ had more like a ~10th percentile performance (for Russ).

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I don't care how good the QB is, he will usually struggle against a good defense when the offense is one dimensional, of which we've been since Carson and Hyde got hurt. That's really the issue here, not Russell.

I think we have plenty of evidence of Russ getting hit many times in a game and not getting happy feet, and I don't see the above as the takeaway from the Rams game at all. It's absolutely more difficult without Carson, and I think we probably needed a ~70th percentile performance from Russ in order to win as a result. We could have gotten it though, and there were many things that could have happened in that game that just didn't. The all-22 is up on GamePass now and I think it's pretty clear that Russ had more like a ~10th percentile performance (for Russ).

If you can't see that the only thing that's changed the past three weeks for our offense is the absence of a run threat, then idk what to tell you.

It's not a coincidence that Russell was seeing a lot of zone until Carson went out in the Arizona game, now it's been 100% press man, stack the box and send blitzers to hit and harass Russ. Two high safeties and 8 men in and around the box cutting off all short and intermediate passing routes.

Why? Because there's no threat of play action to take the top off the defense........and why isn't there a threat of no play action? Because there's no threat of a run game.

You watch, as soon as Carson's back, Russell will magically be back to himself. Until then, expect more of what we've seen the past 2-3 weeks, not less.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

And tell me what QB's would be confident w/out a true running threat. It makes it too easy for the defense.
Shoot, Collins had some nice runs, but they didn't even attempt to stick to the run more.
Having Carson or Hyde in there (especially Carson) changes the entire offense, let alone how confident Russ plays. That's natural for any QB who is playing w/out a Running game.

 

[RCATES]

I would be all for the pressing part if the D hadn't actually stepped up in the 2nd half the last few weeks. Meanwhile the Offense failed to do jack shit only down one score during that time. So yeah Wilson has been and remains part of the problem at least for the last several weeks.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

He's absolutely struggling 3 of the last 4 weeks. No doubt about it.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I would be all for the pressing part if the D hadn't actually stepped up in the 2nd half the last few weeks. Meanwhile the Offense failed to do jack $h!t only down one score during that time. So yeah Wilson has been and remains part of the problem at least for the last several weeks.

Yep, when your bad defense only gives up 23 points to your division rival in their home stadium? That's on your offense, especially this offense. No excuses.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Final 7 drives for the Rams - 6 total points. Giving up only 23 to THAT team is pretty damn good, especially for a struggling Defense playing with a lot of backups.
They have been bad most of the year. But on Sunday? Early yes, but they played their hearts out in the 2nd half.
That game was flat out on the offense, Russ' decision making and the coaching.

 

[xray]

Wilson was allowed to cook early this season with success 5-0. Wilson has become a desperate QB that MUST compensate for a team that doesn't play likea team Just watch .

 

[bigskydoc]

The defense is developing as the season progresses. Russ is regressing.

His turnovers have been the difference maker, and the turnovers have put us into the deep holes, not just the defense being porous.

The difference between the first half of the season and now? Russ's turnovers. The defense is actually playing better now, than they did at the first of the season.

Of course, that is a very low bar, and there is no excuse for the way the defense has continued to get worse every year

 

[John63]

The defense is developing as the season progresses. Russ is regressing.

His turnovers have been the difference maker, and the turnovers have put us into the deep holes, not just the defense being porous.

The difference between the first half of the season and now? Russ's turnovers. The defense is actually playing better now, than they did at the first of the season.

Of course, that is a very low bar, and there is no excuse for the way the defense has continued to get worse every year

And I will say it againbthe biggest difference is the offense playing style and what was working they are no longer doing.

 

[Fade]

Besides Russell Wilson, what do the Seahawks do well?
https://twitter.com/TheHerd/status/1328394286010753024
Great point Colin. I'm still trying to figure that out.

Russell Wilson leads the NFL in TDs, and leads his team in rushing. Only other QB to do that?
Russell Wilson 2017. Pathetic, he has to carry so much of the load, just to barely win 9-10 games. They might win 11 this year due to the soft schedule, but the point still stands.

 

[Fade]

The defense is developing as the season progresses. Russ is regressing.

His turnovers have been the difference maker, and the turnovers have put us into the deep holes, not just the defense being porous.

The difference between the first half of the season and now? Russ's turnovers. The defense is actually playing better now, than they did at the first of the season.

Of course, that is a very low bar, and there is no excuse for the way the defense has continued to get worse every year

You're confusing the Rams taking their foot off the gas, with the Seahawks playing better. Though, they will get better statistically with the tomato cans lined up (NFC EAST). It will be a mirage, they will show their true colors in the playoffs, which pains me to say because this year was supposed to be different. It is a coaching, and development issue that will not be fixed until a restructure of how they do things changes.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/NFL_Memes/status/1328416609116053512[/tweet]

 

[Elemas]

The defense is developing as the season progresses. Russ is regressing.

His turnovers have been the difference maker, and the turnovers have put us into the deep holes, not just the defense being porous.

The difference between the first half of the season and now? Russ's turnovers. The defense is actually playing better now, than they did at the first of the season.

Of course, that is a very low bar, and there is no excuse for the way the defense has continued to get worse every year

You're confusing the Rams taking their foot off the gas, with the Seahawks playing better. Though, they will get better statistically with the tomato cans lined up (NFC EAST). It will be a mirage, they will show their true colors in the playoffs, which pains me to say because this year was supposed to be different. It is a coaching, and development issue that will not be fixed until a restructure of how they do things changes.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/NFL_Memes/status/1328416609116053512[/tweet]

100% agree. For verification, just look at the roster. You can definitely see a gap in pass rush but, look at the roster as a whole. Not many other teams can take highly rated players and turn them.into subpar performers like Seattle's defense can.
This isn't so much a personnel factor as it is coaching.

Things will be bright again as Fade mentioned. Maybe we even pull off a win vs AZ Thursday. Maybe...

Come playoff time, I expect an early exit.

 

[Fade]

Wilson had a bad game, his worst in a really long time. I saw a defeated player on the bench. Like they didn't have the answers. And they played like they didn't have any answers after the 1st possession.

The defense has been so bad, Wilson has been pressing and forcing throws he normally wouldn't.

The last 1.5 seasons I've been thoroughly impressed with how he has been able to carry such a flawed team and not even flinch. He's starting to flinch. He is actually human. But he will bounce back though, I am not concerned with Wilson.

I am concerned with the old man who built the worst defense in NFL history with multiple pro bowlers & all pros, $60M in in available cap space, Three 1st Rd picks, a 2nd Rd pick, and an additional 3rd Rd pick in this off-season. They expunged a gargantuan amount of assets to build… THIS!? And Pete has shown no signs of improving for 5+ seasons. They've literally gotten worse every single season for 7 seasons on defense, never improving once. They can't even go say, 27th to 22nd. They are going for the record this year, no pu$$y around and falling to only 30th. NOPE! not only 32nd, but the worst 32nd of all-time.

The final score does not reflect how much the Rams totally eviscerated and entirely destroyed the Seahawks. The Rams took their foot off the gas because they didn't need to score anymore. Why risk a Goof turnover, that would've been the only way the Seahawks had a chance. It wasn't like the Seahawks were going to do anything offensively.

McVay is playing chess, Pete is playing checkers. That is what is concerning. The coaches in the division are all way younger and ahead of the curve. Pete's scheme was figured out years ago.

Pete needs to adapt his coaching or his coaching career is going to go extinct.
He and his staff are extremely slow at making in game adjustments. I don’t think he realizes he doesn’t have the LOB defense anymore.

Agreed. The way I propose he adapts is hire a fired Head Coach that was an expert DC. Like a Vic Fangio if he gets fired. Someone like that. And Pete gets out of his way, and soley focuses on just being a Head Coach. He is an old dog, and has been running the same defense that he learned from Monty Kiffin in the 1970s. To expect him to learn new tricks, is asking too much. To just keep doing the same thing expecting a different result, well, that's why they suck now. It's clearly not working.

I would predict extremely dark days ahead for the Seahawks if Pete is allowed to run amuck and do whatever he wants with no one to put him in check for the next five years.

On the flipside I would predict that they would win a Superbowl if Pete had less on his plate, and a more focused role as a traditional head coach. This is the way forward.