Why '23 will be better than '22: Offensive weapons

[Hawkmode]

Would you guys be surprised by Charbonnet taking over as our lead back from say game 5 onwards?

Was this really a question for reaction? Ken Walker III had a very comparable rookie year to the one that introduced Jonathan Taylor to the NFL...and if you like "nerd hype" Walker III was THE most explosive RB in the NFL last year only Justin Fields (a RB hiding in a QB uniform) was a more explosive player/runner. Do you think the Colts would sit Taylor on the sidelines if they had drafted Char??

 

[Hawkmode]

Lol. Yeah going way back here. We can just look at last season. The chances of the defense being any good are slim to none, but I didnt want to hurt all the thin skinned peoples feelings by actually saying it.

No reason to feel thin skinned...you can actually boast a lot about the increased expectations of our 2023 Defense. Not only did we leave our secondary alone we went and boosted it big time with free agency (Julius Love) and the draft (Spoon)...Spoon still has to "prove it" on the field but one can imagine a blend of "sauce like" coverage skills with the "brick house" hits not seen since days of Earl and Kam. Woolen was deemed a "project" and our secondary coach Karl Scott unleashed Tariq's best. Scott's "students" are all standing in line...M-Jack/Tre Brown/Coby Bryant...eagerly saying "send me in coach!"

Enough of our Back Four (we can boast of safeties another time)...explosive running plays were a killer last year. Effort made? We kept Uchenna and Darryl Taylor and traded in all the rest. Concerns with DT setting edge? DT is well aware his defensive snaps are based on holding back the youngsters Mafe and Derick Hall who boast even better promise of punishing runners eager to test last years "RB playground"

Bobby Wagner is a known liability for deep drop coverage...but his weakness can be schemed around to allow him to still do what he does best "trigger" the shortest distance between him and and the runner. Devin Bush offers similar hunt and kill ability but those athletic 330 lb guards can sometimes "wash" him out...Jordyn Brooks eventual return will remedy this if it truly stunts Bush's effectiveness.

The D-Line got a makeover with more athletic interior nastiness. Darran Reed is older and wiser and still able to "swat" down RB bugs at the line of scrimmage. Joining our new RB "greeting" committee is Mario Edwards and our young 325 lb+ "pup" Cameron Young.

But those guys aren't a pass rush threat?? We're tapping the big shoulders of Dre'Mont Jones and perhaps a young protoje Mike Morris to collapse the pocket/wreck havok on the QB's comfort zone and perhaps penetrate and nail the would be runner behind the line of scrimmage (better known as TFL) as a tackle for loss.

But what about NT depth?? Our limited cap space should allow our scouts to watch pre-season games and "snag" a 53 man cut down NT. NT are less a "student" of the game...they need to have that "bully" attitude and can be snagged as plug and play since NT is less about technique and more about physicality...stop panicking!

 

[pittpnthrs]

No reason to feel thin skinned...you can actually boast a lot about the increased expectations of our 2023 Defense. Not only did we leave our secondary alone we went and boosted it big time with free agency (Julius Love) and the draft (Spoon)...Spoon still has to "prove it" on the field but one can imagine a blend of "sauce like" coverage skills with the "brick house" hits not seen since days of Earl and Kam. Woolen was deemed a "project" and our secondary coach Karl Scott unleashed Tariq's best. Scott's "students" are all standing in line...M-Jack/Tre Brown/Coby Bryant...eagerly saying "send me in coach!"

Enough of our Back Four (we can boast of safeties another time)...explosive running plays were a killer last year. Effort made? We kept Uchenna and Darryl Taylor and traded in all the rest. Concerns with DT setting edge? DT is well aware his defensive snaps are based on holding back the youngsters Mafe and Derick Hall who boast even better promise of punishing runners eager to test last years "RB playground"

Bobby Wagner is a known liability for deep drop coverage...but his weakness can be schemed around to allow him to still do what he does best "trigger" the shortest distance between him and and the runner. Devin Bush offers similar hunt and kill ability but those athletic 330 lb guards can sometimes "wash" him out...Jordyn Brooks eventual return will remedy this if it truly stunts Bush's effectiveness.

The D-Line got a makeover with more athletic interior nastiness. Darran Reed is older and wiser and still able to "swat" down RB bugs at the line of scrimmage. Joining our new RB "greeting" committee is Mario Edwards and our young 325 lb+ "pup" Cameron Young.

But those guys aren't a pass rush threat?? We're tapping the big shoulders of Dre'Mont Jones and perhaps a young protoje Mike Morris to collapse the pocket/wreck havok on the QB's comfort zone and perhaps penetrate and nail the would be runner behind the line of scrimmage (better known as TFL) as a tackle for loss.

But what about NT depth?? Our limited cap space should allow our scouts to watch pre-season games and "snag" a 53 man cut down NT. NT are less a "student" of the game...they need to have that "bully" attitude and can be snagged as plug and play since NT is less about technique and more about physicality...stop panicking!

I hope your right and love the optimism, but i've seen a lot of 'looks good on paper, but doesnt translate to the field'. I have no doubt the defense will be improved (how can it not), but to what degree? I cant help but to be skeptical because no matter the changes the defense just seems to get worse every year. Average would be great and thats sad that the bar is set so low.

 

[Sun Tzu]

Would you guys be surprised by Charbonnet taking over as our lead back from say game 5 onwards?

It would not surprise me. I won't be surprised if Charbonnet is the lead back to start the year, to finish the year, or at any point in the middle.

 

[Aircrew]

Based historically on how Pete Carroll teams play, the Hawks will be hit/miss until mid season when everyone gets on the same page, especially the rookies. We finish the second half of the year hot and squeak in with a WC berth and who knows from there. If, and this is a big if, the defense plays in the top half of the league out of the gate and the offense builds on what it did last year, we'd have at least a shot at the division. Tough to say with so many new players, especially on D. No matter what, I'm confident the 2023 season will be exciting to watch.

 

[toffee]

It would not surprise me. I won't be surprised if Charbonnet is the lead back to start the year, to finish the year, or at any point in the middle.

Lead back or not, the backs would enjoy similar snap counts. rotating the backs could confuse defense?

 

[Hawkmode]

I hope your right and love the optimism, but i've seen a lot of 'looks good on paper, but doesnt translate to the field'. I have no doubt the defense will be improved (how can it not), but to what degree? I cant help but to be skeptical because no matter the changes the defense just seems to get worse every year. Average would be great and thats sad that the bar is set so low.

I think teams ran the heck out of us last year for several reasons but perhaps the one "simple" reason is because our offense led by Geno was surprising to the point where some respect creeped in and the best way to keep a good offense on the sidelines while eating up time is the running game. Most NFL teams are ill equipped to handle the athletic 300-330LB maulers disguised as centers/guards using inside/outside zone blocking (welcome Anthony Bradford!)...so why us? The one area our improved offense struggled with was steady third down conversions...we had many more explosive first downs then short yardage or even check down first downs. Our biggest help to our run defense might be the additions of Jaxon Smith-Njigba/Zach Charbonnet and Kenny McIntosh on offense. NFL teams abandon their run if facing a quick early lead...especially if the threat of expanding a ten point lead. Pick your "poison" stay in your two high shell to deal with DK/Lockett/JSN scattering loose? ...or keep a stacked box to keep Walker III or even Char from running amok? Geno has to be smiling as much as Shane Waldron!

 

[chris98251]

I think teams ran the heck out of us last year for several reasons but perhaps the one "simple" reason is because our offense led by Geno was surprising to the point where some respect creeped in and the best way to keep a good offense on the sidelines while eating up time is the running game. Most NFL teams are ill equipped to handle the athletic 300-330LB maulers disguised as centers/guards using inside/outside zone blocking (welcome Anthony Bradford!)...so why us? The one area our improved offense struggled with was steady third down conversions...we had many more explosive first downs then short yardage or even check down first downs. Our biggest help to our run defense might be the additions of Jaxon Smith-Njigba/Zach Charbonnet and Kenny McIntosh on offense. NFL teams abandon their run if facing a quick early lead...especially if the threat of expanding a ten point lead. Pick your "poison" stay in your two high shell to deal with DK/Lockett/JSN scattering loose? ...or keep a stacked box to keep Walker III or even Char from running amok? Geno has to be smiling as much as Shane Waldron!

You didn't even mention our TE's, we should be able to exploit any team on some level based on what they try to take away.

 

[CallMeADawg]

I hope your right and love the optimism, but i've seen a lot of 'looks good on paper, but doesnt translate to the field'. I have no doubt the defense will be improved (how can it not), but to what degree? I cant help but to be skeptical because no matter the changes the defense just seems to get worse every year. Average would be great and thats sad that the bar is set so low.

Who says that average is the bar for the team? You?

More useless musings from the data allergic curmudgeon King.

 

[Hawkmode]

You didn't even mention our TE's, we should be able to exploit any team on some level based on what they try to take away.

How about our TE group? ...
In this modern NFL the TE traditional role as an in-line blocker for the running game or the "extra" help for the Right Tackle in Pass Pro sets has evolved more into that "sneaky" WR4 type able to light up the seam route.


Seattle is blessed with all 3 of our TE being a mix/blend of tradition and current times. Fant leans more to the sneaky seam buster type while Dissly leans heavily on blocking assignments. Colby Parkinson is emerging as a blend with a specialty as a Red Zone option to DK once our offense is in striking range.


Last year it was the "Uncle Will" show as he caught 3 TD in the first 4 games. His injury opened the door for Colby to emerge while putting Fant back as our TE TD maker down the stretch.


The good news is once again we have all 3 of them back to fully utilize our 12 personnel formations. Dissly didn't need surgery...just suffered through a long recovery. He has looked sharp and healthy in early camp...without the pads on.


Adding JSN to our WR corps might make it even easier for Noah Fant to roam free and wild in LB/Safety territory.
Colby Parkinson (like Noah Fant) is in a contract year and needs to fully bloom to keep the TE relevant in 12 personnel.

Most of our pre season banter has concerned every positional group...other than our TE's...so their role/impact on our 2023 offense is akin to a "sleeping giant" Go Hawks

 

[pittpnthrs]

Who says that average is the bar for the team? You?

More useless musings from the data allergic curmudgeon King.

Lol. I'm sure the team would like to be the greatest defense ever assembled, but they and I and even you know thats a pipe dream. The defense has been so bad for so long that average would be a monumental improvement. I'm sure your buddy Pete has it under control even though it seems to get worse every single season.

Data? Even when your presented with it you choose to ignore it because it doesnt fit your narrative.

 

[CallMeADawg]

Lol. I'm sure the team would like to be the greatest defense ever assembled, but they and I and even you know thats a pipe dream. The defense has been so bad for so long that average would be a monumental improvement. I'm sure your buddy Pete has it under control even though it seems to get worse every single season.

Data? Even when your presented with it you choose to ignore it because it doesnt fit your narrative.

You presented data? Where's that at?

 

[pittpnthrs]

You presented data? Where's that at?

Lol. There was actual data presented when talking about Pete Carroll coached QB's taking massive amount of sacks in the thread about the top rated coaches which is pretty black and wife. I'll help you out and give you the quotes and link to the thread so you cant hide and squirm.

Mina Kimes ranks Pete Carroll at #10 among coaches

It's common knowledge that Wilson's entire plan of forcing Jody to pick between him and Pete was hatched while watching Brady from the league suite in SB LV, which led to him pretty much forcing his way out of Seattle because of what you're saying here. So I guess give Russ credit, it worked...

www.seahawks.net

Quotes that back up the argument that you'll dispute since it doesnt show Pete in a bright light-

Tavaris Jackson - 2nd most sacked first year w/ Pete w/ (42). When he played for the Vikings never had more then 20sacks

Geno Smith - tied for 3rd most sacks last season (46).

Rcaldo even went further -

So it looks like the same thing happen in New England. Drew Bledsoe, sack total kept getting higher when Pete took over. He was the second most sacked QB in Pete last year with the Patriots w/ 50.


So Bledsoe 2nd in sack
Tavaris Jackson 2nd in sack
Geno - Tied for 3rd in sack

So that's 4 QBs in the top 3 most sacked QBs. Seem like a pattern to me.

Those arent opinions. Those are facts. More facts are that the Seahawks defense had almost half season stints of being historically bad during the past few years. Are you going to deny that also or do you need more quotes and numbers to look at?

 

[Hawkmode]

I'll take a stab at criticism of Pete for having the QB accumulate sacks. Its well documented the quickest way into Pete's "dog house" is turnovers. Turnovers are the quickest way for good teams to lose a game even when they're being favored to win...so if our QB can't fling it away without being called for grounding or is being faced with a "coverage" sack...bite the bullet and take the sack instead of forcing a throw into coverage. Not all sacks reflect a bad O-line...

 

[Hawkmode]

Lol. There was actual data presented when talking about Pete Carroll coached QB's taking massive amount of sacks in the thread about the top rated coaches which is pretty black and wife. I'll help you out and give you the quotes and link to the thread so you cant hide and squirm.

Mina Kimes ranks Pete Carroll at #10 among coaches

It's common knowledge that Wilson's entire plan of forcing Jody to pick between him and Pete was hatched while watching Brady from the league suite in SB LV, which led to him pretty much forcing his way out of Seattle because of what you're saying here. So I guess give Russ credit, it worked...

www.seahawks.net

Quotes that back up the argument that you'll dispute since it doesnt show Pete in a bright light-



Rcaldo even went further -



Those arent opinions. Those are facts. More facts are that the Seahawks defense had almost half season stints of being historically bad during the past few years. Are you going to deny that also or do you need more quotes and numbers to look at?

"had almost" lacks being decisive or convincing...you are right there have been recent times where our defense was really struggling...but a fan base pointing it out is for what gain? Pete as our Head Coach bears responsibility for the performance of our whole team...both offense and defense...and many can squawk knowing Pete is a defensive minded coach but third highest win total for past decade identifies he keeps our team competitive...thinking its easy to get deep into the playoffs might just be the result of not knowing NFL "induced forces' are built in to prevent "boring" dynasties that might seem great for the respective fan base...but are anathema to solid tv ratings. Remember there is a business "behind the curtains" and most owners don't want to compete fairly for television "share". Consistent winning is an uphill struggle...The Championship games leading into SB appearances are representing teams that had a lot of variables fall into place and are hard fought on a "playing field" seldom level in opportunity.

 

[CallMeADawg]

Lol. There was actual data presented when talking about Pete Carroll coached QB's taking massive amount of sacks in the thread about the top rated coaches which is pretty black and wife. I'll help you out and give you the quotes and link to the thread so you cant hide and squirm.

Mina Kimes ranks Pete Carroll at #10 among coaches

It's common knowledge that Wilson's entire plan of forcing Jody to pick between him and Pete was hatched while watching Brady from the league suite in SB LV, which led to him pretty much forcing his way out of Seattle because of what you're saying here. So I guess give Russ credit, it worked...

www.seahawks.net

Quotes that back up the argument that you'll dispute since it doesnt show Pete in a bright light-



Rcaldo even went further -



Those arent opinions. Those are facts. More facts are that the Seahawks defense had almost half season stints of being historically bad during the past few years. Are you going to deny that also or do you need more quotes and numbers to look at?

I don't see anywhere in that thread where YOU provided any actual data. Talk about completely missing the point.

Just more fairy tales from Pittsburghs finest curmudgeon.

 

[pittpnthrs]

"had almost" lacks being decisive or convincing...you are right there have been recent times where our defense was really struggling...but a fan base pointing it out is for what gain? Pete as our Head Coach bears responsibility for the performance of our whole team...both offense and defense...and many can squawk knowing Pete is a defensive minded coach but third highest win total for past decade identifies he keeps our team competitive...thinking its easy to get deep into the playoffs might just be the result of not knowing NFL "induced forces' are built in to prevent "boring" dynasties that might seem great for the respective fan base...but are anathema to solid tv ratings. Remember there is a business "behind the curtains" and most owners don't want to compete fairly for television "share". Consistent winning is an uphill struggle...The Championship games leading into SB appearances are representing teams that had a lot of variables fall into place and are hard fought on a "playing field" seldom level in opportunity.

'Had almost' was referring to leading and being on pace half way through seasons until they straightened up enough to claw their way out of the record books. It was pointed out because some fans and people on here can't talk or speak about the team and Pete in a rational manner because he walks on water in their eyes. The third highest win total for the past decade is great and all, but honestly its been nothing more than regular season wins. The post season record has been pathetic. I would gladly take a few losing seasons if it meant moving further in the post season every 4 or 5 years. And let's be true to ourselves, when Seattle did make the playoffs in that post 2015 time, there was very little faith and hope they would do anything once there. I don't put a lot of faith in that idea that the NFL halts one team or another for such a long period when the Patriots literally were in AFCCG's and Super Bowls for 20 years. Bottom line is i've watched Pete and this team long enough to recognize the patterns, trends, and habits and its going to take something really different to make me change my opinion.

 

[pittpnthrs]

I don't see anywhere in that thread where YOU provided any actual data. Talk about completely missing the point.

Just more fairy tales from Pittsburghs finest curmudgeon.

Who cares about who posted it. I stated my view and the stats your so hung up on backed them up. You just dont like it because it defeats your argument. To bad I guess. And like I said before, get ready for Geno to be one of the most sacked QB's in the league this coming season. Its just what happens when playing for Pete Carroll.

 

[NoGain]

The Sehawks offense has the potential to be pretty damn good next season if just a few things work out. We need better blocking out of the interior of our OL, and just some steady improvement from our rookie tackles. I'm pretty excited by our WR and RB units. I think our TE squad is good enough. And I feel okay about Geno if our game planning is solid and he doesn't try to do too much. Top 10 offense seems reasonable if these things pan out, maybe a little better than that.

The OL is the tentative/iffy thing to me, but there really is some potential for improvement there. We'll see...

 

[Hawkmode]

'Had almost' was referring to leading and being on pace half way through seasons until they straightened up enough to claw their way out of the record books. It was pointed out because some fans and people on here can't talk or speak about the team and Pete in a rational manner because he walks on water in their eyes. The third highest win total for the past decade is great and all, but honestly its been nothing more than regular season wins. The post season record has been pathetic. I would gladly take a few losing seasons if it meant moving further in the post season every 4 or 5 years. And let's be true to ourselves, when Seattle did make the playoffs in that post 2015 time, there was very little faith and hope they would do anything once there. I don't put a lot of faith in that idea that the NFL halts one team or another for such a long period when the Patriots literally were in AFCCG's and Super Bowls for 20 years. Bottom line is i've watched Pete and this team long enough to recognize the patterns, trends, and habits and its going to take something really different to make me change my opinion.