We're sorry, Tical. You were right, please forgive us, Tical

keasley45

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SoulfishHawk":34hm58y6 said:
So you're gonna' just ignore the FACT that Russ has saved Pete's a** for years by pulling out wins in the 4th quarter and OT? You think they actually went 12-4 last year because of Pete? No, they didn't at all.


This is the biggest myth in Seahawks history. It's taken that the offense was ineffective until Russ just took over in the 4th qtr. It's been pointed out here and by statistical gurus like SeahawksMaven that what happens when seattle is behind and gies hurry up is that defenses are forced to play off and in doing so, by default guve Russ the ability to see and complete the passes he didn't earlier in the game.

Defenses play off, Russ starts completing passes underneath. Defenses then play the underneath and Russ beats them over the top. And much of the underneath stuff he still only found because of his legs.

Now the legs aren't there. He's not stepping up. Defenses know it, and now just cover deep. And now they just rush the bejezuz out of him and he has not defense because the thing that would beat it woukd require that which he still can't do.

But what happened offensively between the opening kickoff and Russ 'saving Pete's ass' looked alot like the games in GB and Arizona and Washington where (in a scheme hatched by Russ and Waldron, not Pete) the offense was stagnant. Andnlikendays of old, Russ all of a sudden goes into hurry at the end of the game against WFT, the defense plays off, and he finds some success. But the only ass he was 'saving' was his own. But that wasn't Pete's game plan. It was a showcase of the good and bad that is Russel.
 

John63

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Palmegranite":1unbc74m said:
So which is it? Games where he carried the team to victory, or games where he excelled in the early part of the game?

Your argument keeps changing.

Some QBs put a towel on their head or play worse when the team is down early. Not Russell Wilson.

I'll give one more example. If not for poorly chosen footwear in a playoff game against Carolina, this QB was going to carry the team to a third Superbowl appearance, nearly overcoming a 30 point deficit.


When you know you are wrong you change the rules so you are right. It called the cowards way out.
 

chris98251

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keasley45":3q4mnhrg said:
SoulfishHawk":3q4mnhrg said:
So you're gonna' just ignore the FACT that Russ has saved Pete's a** for years by pulling out wins in the 4th quarter and OT? You think they actually went 12-4 last year because of Pete? No, they didn't at all.


This is the biggest myth in Seahawks history. It's taken that the offense was ineffective until Russ just took over in the 4th qtr. It's been pointed out here and by statistical gurus like SeahawksMaven that what happens when seattle is behind and gies hurry up is that defenses are forced to play off and in doing so, by default guve Russ the ability to see and complete the passes he didn't earlier in the game.

Defenses play off, Russ starts completing passes underneath. Defenses then play the underneath and Russ beats them over the top. And much of the underneath stuff he still only found because of his legs.

Now the legs aren't there. He's not stepping up. Defenses know it, and now just cover deep. And now they just rush the bejezuz out of him and he has not defense because the thing that would beat it woukd require that which he still can't do.

But what happened offensively between the opening kickoff and Russ 'saving Pete's ass' looked alot like the games in GB and Arizona and Washington where (in a scheme hatched by Russ and Waldron, not Pete) the offense was stagnant. Andnlikendays of old, Russ all of a sudden goes into hurry at the end of the game against WFT, the defense plays off, and he finds some success. But the only ass he was 'saving' was his own. But that wasn't Pete's game plan. It was a showcase of the good and bad that is Russel.


He has never thrown receivers open or rarely does before John63 puts up 10 videos of Doug Baldwin catching a pass, always waiting for clear separation before he commits to going there, that eats up his pocket time as well.
 

John63

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chris98251":3bnvz6zc said:
keasley45":3bnvz6zc said:
SoulfishHawk":3bnvz6zc said:
So you're gonna' just ignore the FACT that Russ has saved Pete's a** for years by pulling out wins in the 4th quarter and OT? You think they actually went 12-4 last year because of Pete? No, they didn't at all.


This is the biggest myth in Seahawks history. It's taken that the offense was ineffective until Russ just took over in the 4th qtr. It's been pointed out here and by statistical gurus like SeahawksMaven that what happens when seattle is behind and gies hurry up is that defenses are forced to play off and in doing so, by default guve Russ the ability to see and complete the passes he didn't earlier in the game.

Defenses play off, Russ starts completing passes underneath. Defenses then play the underneath and Russ beats them over the top. And much of the underneath stuff he still only found because of his legs.

Now the legs aren't there. He's not stepping up. Defenses know it, and now just cover deep. And now they just rush the bejezuz out of him and he has not defense because the thing that would beat it woukd require that which he still can't do.

But what happened offensively between the opening kickoff and Russ 'saving Pete's ass' looked alot like the games in GB and Arizona and Washington where (in a scheme hatched by Russ and Waldron, not Pete) the offense was stagnant. Andnlikendays of old, Russ all of a sudden goes into hurry at the end of the game against WFT, the defense plays off, and he finds some success. But the only ass he was 'saving' was his own. But that wasn't Pete's game plan. It was a showcase of the good and bad that is Russel.


He has never thrown receivers open or rarely does before John63 puts up 10 videos of Doug Baldwin catching a pass, always waiting for clear separation before he commits to going there, that eats up his pocket time as well.


lol did you watch the last game? I am guessing not he through numerous people open lockets TD was him throwing him open.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_l-kfx6e2Dw

nice try your wrong again and that's just the last game and only 3 of the plays. I can find some for almost every game he plays where he throws people open.
 

keasley45

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John63":3v35eyek said:
chris98251":3v35eyek said:
keasley45":3v35eyek said:
SoulfishHawk":3v35eyek said:
So you're gonna' just ignore the FACT that Russ has saved Pete's a** for years by pulling out wins in the 4th quarter and OT? You think they actually went 12-4 last year because of Pete? No, they didn't at all.


This is the biggest myth in Seahawks history. It's taken that the offense was ineffective until Russ just took over in the 4th qtr. It's been pointed out here and by statistical gurus like SeahawksMaven that what happens when seattle is behind and gies hurry up is that defenses are forced to play off and in doing so, by default guve Russ the ability to see and complete the passes he didn't earlier in the game.

Defenses play off, Russ starts completing passes underneath. Defenses then play the underneath and Russ beats them over the top. And much of the underneath stuff he still only found because of his legs.

Now the legs aren't there. He's not stepping up. Defenses know it, and now just cover deep. And now they just rush the bejezuz out of him and he has not defense because the thing that would beat it woukd require that which he still can't do.

But what happened offensively between the opening kickoff and Russ 'saving Pete's ass' looked alot like the games in GB and Arizona and Washington where (in a scheme hatched by Russ and Waldron, not Pete) the offense was stagnant. Andnlikendays of old, Russ all of a sudden goes into hurry at the end of the game against WFT, the defense plays off, and he finds some success. But the only ass he was 'saving' was his own. But that wasn't Pete's game plan. It was a showcase of the good and bad that is Russel.


He has never thrown receivers open or rarely does before John63 puts up 10 videos of Doug Baldwin catching a pass, always waiting for clear separation before he commits to going there, that eats up his pocket time as well.


lol did you watch the last game? I am guessing not he through numerous people open lockets TD was him throwing him open.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_l-kfx6e2Dw

nice try your wrong again and that's just the last game and only 3 of the plays. I can find some for almost every game he plays where he throws people open.

Just like he DOES throw short and to the middle of the field? And you've proven us wrong there too?

RW is statistically at the bottom or within three spots of the bottom of the league in doing that since 2015, and yet you still show charts with green dots 'proving' that he can.

If you call what you say he did against SF, 'throwing a player open', then there are obviously different definitions of the word or a wide range of examples.

Russel only likes to throw the ball into tighter than 3yard off coverage if he's tossing it 40 yards down field and over a wrs shoulder.

Throwing the ball in front of a crossing wr IS NOT throwing him open.
 

keasley45

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olyfan63":2ckwlalc said:
Tical21":2ckwlalc said:
Both. Russell was much better today. Especially with his accuracy. But you'll notice on the strip sack, the other really bad sack late, the 2 yard quick passes where Dissly got hit quickly, were all against 2-deep. The 49ers had success in 2-deep and Russ was noticeably uncomfortable against it, which you can even see in his presnap body language, but the 49ers major in single-high safety, so I knew going in that we were going to get quite a bit of it. And Russ was much more comfortable and feasted. I was wondering whether the niners were going to run a lot more 2-deep than usual because of Russ' troubles against it as of late, or whether they'd stick to their typical gameplan. In the end, they ran a little more 2-deep than usual, but not much.

Interesting. I was watching on a small mobile device so couldn't really pick up what the D was doing, but definitely something to look for, Russell's pre-snap body language. I suppose it's a good thing, that at least he's recognizing what he's seeing enough to be uncomfortable; maybe that discomfort is Russell trying to focus on trying to read what's there and flash through the routes in his mind and where to go with the ball. He's faked it for so long, used his own set of "rules" to sidestep the "official" way of reading the D, that trying a different way has to still be awkward and stressful for him.

So we know the Rams will throw a lot of 2-high at him, and so also will the Cardinals. It seemed to me that the OT game vs. the Cardinals last year is when Russell's struggles with 2-High looks were fully exposed for all the world, OK, the NFL world, to see.

You were too early, before the world was ready to see it. Besides, this limitation doesn't usually fully appear until playoff games, where we face more talented and better-prepared defenses. Also, it took Kurt Warner showing it in Xs and Os videos of Russell's playoff game, to start to accurately understand the issue, at least for me.

Also, there was another helpful breakdown video, from 2019, not showing Russell's "weakness" or "issues", but showing how he and Tyler Lockett "read" each other, and showing how Russell reads the coverage on the receiver, rather than the defense as a whole, and in turn Lockett also reads the coverage, and freelances--er, adjusts his route to the coverage, and Russell knows exactly how Tyler will improvise, and puts the ball with accuracy where he knows Tyler will be, based on their shared scramble drill rules. To me, this showed why the Wilson-to-Lockett combination has been so *incredibly good*. It also showed why Wilson often holds the ball for 5 seconds and more, looking deep downfield, and so often has to run out of the pocket to buy more time.

The flipside however, was the realization that that Russell has been using this "read the coverage on the receiver" as a shortcut, a *crutch* to avoid having to learn and master the detailed rules and reads that are required against 2-Deep safeties types of coverages, and preferring to look first for deep throws while often not even looking at shorter routes that require getting the ball out quickly .

These understandings also explain a lot of other things, from the relationship between Carroll and Wilson, to Waldron dialing up plays that create open receivers that Russell seemingly repeatedly turns his nose up at. It's like Russell is essentially having to learn a foreign language, as a near-beginner. It also shows the need for the Seahawks to have a strong run game to support Russell, and an O-Line that excels in run-blocking, but has to be at least average, not awful, in pass-pro. It explains how Russell, behind a crap O-Line in 2013 with rookies Michael Bowie and Alvin Bailey, but with Lynch as a run threat, and with his peak mobility, and supported by a historic defense, was able to lead the Seahawks to 2 Super Bowls in a row, winning one. It even explains many aspects of "the pick" in SB49, that Russell just had to "trust the play" since he couldn't really read the D the Patriots were lining up in--not 2-Deep, but 2-Many bodies in a small space for Russell to read to know where to go with the ball.

It even possibly explains Richard Sherman's seeming disdain for Russell's skills. Sherman, as an avid student of game film, saw other QBs making reads against the Hawks defense, e.g., Matt Ryan, Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, and knew Russell's skill set in reading defenses was so deficient as to be laughable in comparison to that level of QB skills. (Russell has other amazing superpowers) Sherman had long been annoyed, and probably loudly complained, that Russell wasn't expected/required to learn those reads. Thus, when Russell threw "the pick", Sherman could see it coming and was so disgusted, angered, and blamed Russell for not being able to read the defense and make a better decision with the ball. In Sherman's mind, he knew the D and the run game had carried Russell, erased his mistakes, and Russell and the coaching staff had let down him and the rest of the team through what Sherman viewed as a failure to prepare, and Russell being coddled. Sherman, being a bit of a narcissist, was beside-himself angry that Russell, and the coaching staff, had "thrown away" his, the team's, the defense's, the LOB's, rightful place in history as a defensive dynasty, all because Russell was allowed to be coddled. Hey, it's a theory, not saying it's right, just a theory to entertain.

So, what all this means, is that for the Seahawks to be a playoff threat again with Wilson, is that Russell needs to learn the reads needed to know where to go with the ball quickly, against a variety of defenses. His escapability alone is no longer sufficient. I'm pretty sure Russell knows this and is working his tail off on it.


Every single word of this^^^

This is the definition of Russel Wilson. It's how he play ball, picking out his go to based on coverage before the snap and then rarely deviating.

Reading a single coverage and not the defense.
 

keasley45

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SoulfishHawk":29ieg4bn said:
Fair enough. We all have our opinions.

It's funny how in this world we live in today, the conspiracy theorists and those without facts on their side try to label everything 'opinion'.

You can believe what you want to believe but there are still facts and truth. You can't change that.

And 'believing' that Russ was why we were 12-4 last year... well feel free to love in that belief all you want. I think we'd all prefer it was true.
 

keasley45

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John63":15djf0ok said:
For every so-called expert or former player or QB that says one thing, you can find another that says something else. I Can selectively pick games or plays from any QB Warner, Rodgers, Brady, Manning, and say look they are missing guys, they are not diagnosing the defense etc etc. I can grab periods of time when all of them had several bad games or seasons.

The thing they all have in coming along with Wilson is they could not have done what they have done in their careers without being great most of the time. Even the greatest of the greats the supposed GOAt had bad patches and seasons.

The reality is Wilson's career numbers are right up there with any of them and his wins are too.

I know some of you don't like it, but those are the facts.

Except you can't look at game after game after game of any of those players and find glaring examples of basic elements of QB play not being executed. And especially not in year 10, missing multiple open reads and wrs a game and obviously NOT making more complex diagnosis of a defense.

Proof is that every team plays the Hawks EXACTLY the same way and our QB still struggles to beat it. SAME THING EVERY WEEK. AN ENTIRE PLAYBOOK AT HIS DISPOSAL AND STILL HE STRUGGLES.

Did any of the players above ever get 'solved' by a basic defensive strategy or completely confused by it? Nope

All of the players you mentioned have bad games. Sure. But just because Russ's talents over the years and the teams strategy to cover his deficiencies lead to his shortcomings being less apparent, doesn't mean they weren't there and that he wasn't often as much often the cause for his offenses struggles as he was the savior when he played comeback against off coverages and defenses not substituting late in games.

If he's going to actually elevate his game now, great. All for it. Last game was a building block. But a step, does not a journey make. Nor is one good game a sign that all is good anymore an indication that one bad game is that all is lost.
 

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I have never in my life heard anyone question Matt Ryan, Stafford, Mayfield, Josh Allen, or Carr’s mental abilities when it comes to football. Suggesting that they don’t have the brain to play the position. I’m going to assume the people on here are old, out of touch, and don’t realize how ridiculous, biased, and gross it is to suggest Russ has never had the brain to play the position. And I’ll leave it at that.

I have little interest in arguing the other stuff, because a simple visit to NextGenStats and PFF would have some of these basic answers for you. In the last game, Wilson’s time to throw was 2.25. In the first 9 games, he was 2.6, which was 9th in the league. Since injury, ironically, tight ends and running backs got most of the catches.

There’s a certain lack of compassion, and grace that this fan base gives to Russ. Maybe it’s just the Seattle culture, which I’ve always described as a progressive small town culture with big city amenities. But Russ needs to get out of here. New York, Denver, New Orleans. All three will give him the coverage and respect he needs. And each of those fan bases will appreciate a QB that can give them 42 Touchdowns in a season and no less than 35 touchdowns. Time to move on.

For our team, Pete can rely on his healthy running backs and healthy defensive players when Russ is gone. Because of course, that is how you build sustainable success in the NFL. And of course, young free agents love Seattle.
 

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Tical21":2jdlpr6p said:
olyfan63":2jdlpr6p said:
Tical21":2jdlpr6p said:
Russ was damn good today. He's so great when he gets coverages he is comfortable with. Thank you Raheem!
I thought Russell and Shane Waldron were more on the same page today, and Russell was making the effort to take the open layups and move the chains. Am I wrong to give Russell (and Waldron) that credit for making adjustments, and it was really just that the 49ers ran defensive coverages and concepts that Russell knew how to read? Blame Raheem instead of credit Russ? Somewhere in between?
Both. Russell was much better today. Especially with his accuracy. But you'll notice on the strip sack, the other really bad sack late, the 2 yard quick passes where Dissly got hit quickly, were all against 2-deep. The 49ers had success in 2-deep and Russ was noticeably uncomfortable against it, which you can even see in his presnap body language, but the 49ers major in single-high safety, so I knew going in that we were going to get quite a bit of it. And Russ was much more comfortable and feasted. I was wondering whether the niners were going to run a lot more 2-deep than usual because of Russ' troubles against it as of late, or whether they'd stick to their typical gameplan. In the end, they ran a little more 2-deep than usual, but not much.

The Niners ran two high most of the game. Some of it was disguised coverage, where they’d show single high initially in hopes of fooling Wilson. You’re creating narratives, especially since most of Russ’ throws were short and intermediate.

The truth is, you, keasley45, and others here took a victory lap during Russ’ worst stretch of his career. That’s convenience. You weren’t able to do it before. You weren’t able to claim this early in the season. Because the facts didn’t support you. Since his finger surgery, where he was clearly having trouble gripping the ball and losing confidence, you saw that as an opportunity. Congrats but the actual facts and film don’t vindicate you.
 

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LTH":1ik6gi4f said:
SoulfishHawk":1ik6gi4f said:
So you're gonna' just ignore the FACT that Russ has saved Pete's a** for years by pulling out wins in the 4th quarter and OT? You think they actually went 12-4 last year because of Pete? No, they didn't at all.

I would argue that they went 12-4 because they were a good football team and both Russ and Carroll had something to do with that..

But If yeah want to get technical about it, yeah I would argue that Pete had a lot to do with it because he pulled Russ back when Russ was throwing into double coverage trying to make the Big play instead of taking the check down.. this was a consistent theme last year... Carroll went back to running the ball and that's when they started winning again.

Not sure how you got sucked into disliking Pete you used to like him... I'm telling ya Pete isn't perfect but he Is not as bad as some people make him out to be.. and it makes me sad that some of the fan base blames Carroll for EVERYTHING... It really just depends on what stance the media takes to what fans think. very few think for them selves and very few in the media have good in sight into what's really happening...

Not saying that I know everything cause I don't but i know enough to know this ^^^^


LTH


We went 12-4 because our QB prevented us from going 0-7 to start the season with Carroll’s terrible defense.

We won the remaining games of the season because Russ played well. We struggled against the Bills because Russ was forced into ANOTHER shootout, because Pete’s terrible defense couldn’t stop a nosebleed. There is not a QB in the league who has never turned the ball over in at least one shootout. The only way to hold Russ to a different standard in this case is if you have other biases.

After the Bills game, Russ then went on to have three games with a 100 Qb rating. Every game after had over 25 attempts and four of them had over 30 attempts. Meaning that the team still relied on his arm. So yes, Russ is absolutely the reason we finished 12-4. This fan base and its refusal to credit Wilson like other QBs are laughable. Pretty sure if Carr scored 42 TDs last year, you’d all praise him because he fits the mold and prototype many of you prefer.
 

John63

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keasley45":o0cd089v said:
John63":o0cd089v said:
chris98251":o0cd089v said:
keasley45":o0cd089v said:
This is the biggest myth in Seahawks history. It's taken that the offense was ineffective until Russ just took over in the 4th qtr. It's been pointed out here and by statistical gurus like SeahawksMaven that what happens when seattle is behind and gies hurry up is that defenses are forced to play off and in doing so, by default guve Russ the ability to see and complete the passes he didn't earlier in the game.

Defenses play off, Russ starts completing passes underneath. Defenses then play the underneath and Russ beats them over the top. And much of the underneath stuff he still only found because of his legs.

Now the legs aren't there. He's not stepping up. Defenses know it, and now just cover deep. And now they just rush the bejezuz out of him and he has not defense because the thing that would beat it woukd require that which he still can't do.

But what happened offensively between the opening kickoff and Russ 'saving Pete's ass' looked alot like the games in GB and Arizona and Washington where (in a scheme hatched by Russ and Waldron, not Pete) the offense was stagnant. Andnlikendays of old, Russ all of a sudden goes into hurry at the end of the game against WFT, the defense plays off, and he finds some success. But the only ass he was 'saving' was his own. But that wasn't Pete's game plan. It was a showcase of the good and bad that is Russel.


He has never thrown receivers open or rarely does before John63 puts up 10 videos of Doug Baldwin catching a pass, always waiting for clear separation before he commits to going there, that eats up his pocket time as well.


lol did you watch the last game? I am guessing not he through numerous people open lockets TD was him throwing him open.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_l-kfx6e2Dw

nice try your wrong again and that's just the last game and only 3 of the plays. I can find some for almost every game he plays where he throws people open.

Just like he DOES throw short and to the middle of the field? And you've proven us wrong there too?

RW is statistically at the bottom or within three spots of the bottom of the league in doing that since 2015, and yet you still show charts with green dots 'proving' that he can.

If you call what you say he did against SF, 'throwing a player open', then there are obviously different definitions of the word or a wide range of examples.

Russel only likes to throw the ball into tighter than 3yard off coverage if he's tossing it 40 yards down field and over a wrs shoulder.

Throwing the ball in front of a crossing wr IS NOT throwing him open.


Links to those supposed stats? IN the meantime you might want to understand the definition of throwing someone open.

throwing someone open-1-throwing to a specific location where the intended target will be. 2-throwing a to a target who is covered but throwing gin such a way as to allow the pass to be completed to them anyway.

So again sorry you are wrong he has done it a lot and even in the last game


AS to bottom 3 and all that again link, please? Also, the original narrative was he cant or doesn't now it change dot hardly does. Hmmm

"Russel only likes to throw the ball into tighter than 3yard off coverage if he's tossing it 40 yards downfield and over a wrs shoulder.' really hmm Lockett was only 12 yards. Dks was not over anyone's shoulder.

Also again changing the rules you were proven wrong about throwing open so now we change it to add the 40 yards and over the shoulder, unfortunately, your still wrong but keep changing eventually you will be right, Here I will help.,

Wilson cant throw a lineman open inside .1 yards of the down marker in the last second of the 3rd qtr. There see it is easy to eventually find what you want just keep changing the rules.
 

keasley45

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John63":1rud4elt said:
keasley45":1rud4elt said:
John63":1rud4elt said:
chris98251":1rud4elt said:
He has never thrown receivers open or rarely does before John63 puts up 10 videos of Doug Baldwin catching a pass, always waiting for clear separation before he commits to going there, that eats up his pocket time as well.


lol did you watch the last game? I am guessing not he through numerous people open lockets TD was him throwing him open.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_l-kfx6e2Dw

nice try your wrong again and that's just the last game and only 3 of the plays. I can find some for almost every game he plays where he throws people open.

Just like he DOES throw short and to the middle of the field? And you've proven us wrong there too?

RW is statistically at the bottom or within three spots of the bottom of the league in doing that since 2015, and yet you still show charts with green dots 'proving' that he can.

If you call what you say he did against SF, 'throwing a player open', then there are obviously different definitions of the word or a wide range of examples.

Russel only likes to throw the ball into tighter than 3yard off coverage if he's tossing it 40 yards down field and over a wrs shoulder.

Throwing the ball in front of a crossing wr IS NOT throwing him open.


Links to those supposed stats? IN the meantime you might want to understand the definition of throwing someone open.

throwing someone open-1-throwing to a specific location where the intended target will be. 2-throwing a to a target who is covered but throwing gin such a way as to allow the pass to be completed to them anyway.

So again sorry you are wrong he has done it a lot and even in the last game


AS to bottom 3 and all that again link, please? Also, the original narrative was he cant or doesn't now it change dot hardly does. Hmmm

"Russel only likes to throw the ball into tighter than 3yard off coverage if he's tossing it 40 yards downfield and over a wrs shoulder.' really hmm Lockett was only 12 yards. Dks was not over anyone's shoulder.

Also again changing the rules you were proven wrong about throwing open so now we change it to add the 40 yards and over the shoulder, unfortunately, your still wrong but keep changing eventually you will be right, Here I will help.,

Wilson cant throw a lineman open inside .1 yards of the down marker in the last second of the 3rd qtr. There see it is easy to eventually find what you want just keep changing the rules.


My lord. Ok john63. Russel Wilson does everything right. He gets the ball out wherever it needs to go. He throws receivers open. He throws tonthe middle of the field. He literally does everything a qb should do and werenit not for the idiot of a HC we'd have won several championships by now.

Better?

I'll embed the image later. But here's the link.
I'm sure it's been referenced before.

https://flic.kr/p/2mQ9bHz
 

John63

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keasley45":2c60sqpz said:
John63":2c60sqpz said:
keasley45":2c60sqpz said:
John63":2c60sqpz said:
lol did you watch the last game? I am guessing not he through numerous people open lockets TD was him throwing him open.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_l-kfx6e2Dw

nice try your wrong again and that's just the last game and only 3 of the plays. I can find some for almost every game he plays where he throws people open.

Just like he DOES throw short and to the middle of the field? And you've proven us wrong there too?

RW is statistically at the bottom or within three spots of the bottom of the league in doing that since 2015, and yet you still show charts with green dots 'proving' that he can.

If you call what you say he did against SF, 'throwing a player open', then there are obviously different definitions of the word or a wide range of examples.

Russel only likes to throw the ball into tighter than 3yard off coverage if he's tossing it 40 yards down field and over a wrs shoulder.

Throwing the ball in front of a crossing wr IS NOT throwing him open.


Links to those supposed stats? IN the meantime you might want to understand the definition of throwing someone open.

throwing someone open-1-throwing to a specific location where the intended target will be. 2-throwing a to a target who is covered but throwing gin such a way as to allow the pass to be completed to them anyway.

So again sorry you are wrong he has done it a lot and even in the last game


AS to bottom 3 and all that again link, please? Also, the original narrative was he cant or doesn't now it change dot hardly does. Hmmm

"Russel only likes to throw the ball into tighter than 3yard off coverage if he's tossing it 40 yards downfield and over a wrs shoulder.' really hmm Lockett was only 12 yards. Dks was not over anyone's shoulder.

Also again changing the rules you were proven wrong about throwing open so now we change it to add the 40 yards and over the shoulder, unfortunately, your still wrong but keep changing eventually you will be right, Here I will help.,

Wilson cant throw a lineman open inside .1 yards of the down marker in the last second of the 3rd qtr. There see it is easy to eventually find what you want just keep changing the rules.


My lord. Ok john63. Russel Wilson does everything right. He gets the ball out wherever it needs to go. He throws receivers open. He throws tonthe middle of the field. He literally does everything a qb should do and werenit not for the idiot of a HC we'd have won several championships by now.

Better?

I'll embed the image later. But here's the link.
I'm sure it's been referenced before.

https://flic.kr/p/2mQ9bHz


Lol let me.try it another for you

You and tical want us to believe a qb who according to you

Can't throw short
Can throw people open
Can't diagnose defenses
Can't work in an offense
Can only throw long that's all

Some how despite not being good at doing anything an NFL qb needs to do but throw long some how is amongst the best to play the game through his first 10 years. You do realize how absurd that is.

Now as to your attempt to placate me. Know one says he is great at everything no qb is. What we are saying is he is better than u and tical who think he can't do anything but throw long is. All these complaints u have about Wilson can de leveled at every qb in league at some level.
 

hawk45

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When Wilson looked decisive last week i puzzled over why, knowing it wasn’t finger or some crap like that. When I saw Matty Brown tweet his puzzlement over the niners running so much single high with man, it all made perfect sense.

Wilson will absolutely tear up that coverage, and even throw crossers on it from time to time because as the WR flashes through the window of Wilson’s compromised vision through the LOS, he knows the DB is *trailing*. When it’s zone, he knows a DB or LB might be lurking in his blind spot. This causes him to either not pull the trigger or to hesitate and throw late, too hard, and inaccurately.

Get ready for him to go right back to looking lost the next time he sees 2 high, and for this board to start wondering all over again why he’s broken. It’s Pete, it’s the finger, it’s the OL, it’s Tical’s fault.

I can guarantee this because in his entire career he has never consistently operated well vs zone for an entire season. He’s managed spurts, usually when there was some threat of either him running or a bell cow back, but he can’t make a so-so rushing attack work for him like Brady, Mannjng, Brees.

Brees made it work despite height because Brees could read coverages and anticipate. Wilson’s supposed commitment to film study makes me laugh because it’s the most wasted study ever. The guy is no better at reading zone or disguised coverages than he ever was. He can read man and beat a cover zero blitz when he sees it, which, so can I.

Wilson’s anticipation is really Kaepernick like. He’s better than Kaep, or at least he made it work much longer, but the anticipation is similar.
 

keasley45

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hawk45":3riv8qr3 said:
When Wilson looked decisive last week i puzzled over why, knowing it wasn’t finger or some crap like that. When I saw Matty Brown tweet his puzzlement over the niners running so much single high with man, it all made perfect sense.

Wilson will absolutely tear up that coverage, and even throw crossers on it from time to time because as the WR flashes through the window of Wilson’s compromised vision through the LOS, he knows the DB is *trailing*. When it’s zone, he knows a DB or LB might be lurking in his blind spot. This causes him to either not pull the trigger or to hesitate and throw late, too hard, and inaccurately.

Get ready for him to go right back to looking lost the next time he sees 2 high, and for this board to start wondering all over again why he’s broken. It’s Pete, it’s the finger, it’s the OL, it’s Tical’s fault.

I can guarantee this because in his entire career he has never consistently operated well vs zone for an entire season. He’s managed spurts, usually when there was some threat of either him running or a bell cow back, but he can’t make a so-so rushing attack work for him like Brady, Mannjng, Brees.

Brees made it work despite height because Brees could read coverages and anticipate. Wilson’s supposed commitment to film study makes me laugh because it’s the most wasted study ever. The guy is no better at reading zone or disguised coverages than he ever was. He can read man and beat a cover zero blitz when he sees it, which, so can I.

Wilson’s anticipation is really Kaepernick like. He’s better than Kaep, or at least he made it work much longer, but the anticipation is similar.

Stop talking sense, Hawk45.
 

keasley45

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John63":38o6z9d6 said:
keasley45":38o6z9d6 said:
John63":38o6z9d6 said:
keasley45":38o6z9d6 said:
Just like he DOES throw short and to the middle of the field? And you've proven us wrong there too?

RW is statistically at the bottom or within three spots of the bottom of the league in doing that since 2015, and yet you still show charts with green dots 'proving' that he can.

If you call what you say he did against SF, 'throwing a player open', then there are obviously different definitions of the word or a wide range of examples.

Russel only likes to throw the ball into tighter than 3yard off coverage if he's tossing it 40 yards down field and over a wrs shoulder.

Throwing the ball in front of a crossing wr IS NOT throwing him open.


Links to those supposed stats? IN the meantime you might want to understand the definition of throwing someone open.

throwing someone open-1-throwing to a specific location where the intended target will be. 2-throwing a to a target who is covered but throwing gin such a way as to allow the pass to be completed to them anyway.

So again sorry you are wrong he has done it a lot and even in the last game


AS to bottom 3 and all that again link, please? Also, the original narrative was he cant or doesn't now it change dot hardly does. Hmmm

"Russel only likes to throw the ball into tighter than 3yard off coverage if he's tossing it 40 yards downfield and over a wrs shoulder.' really hmm Lockett was only 12 yards. Dks was not over anyone's shoulder.

Also again changing the rules you were proven wrong about throwing open so now we change it to add the 40 yards and over the shoulder, unfortunately, your still wrong but keep changing eventually you will be right, Here I will help.,

Wilson cant throw a lineman open inside .1 yards of the down marker in the last second of the 3rd qtr. There see it is easy to eventually find what you want just keep changing the rules.


My lord. Ok john63. Russel Wilson does everything right. He gets the ball out wherever it needs to go. He throws receivers open. He throws tonthe middle of the field. He literally does everything a qb should do and werenit not for the idiot of a HC we'd have won several championships by now.

Better?

I'll embed the image later. But here's the link.
I'm sure it's been referenced before.

https://flic.kr/p/2mQ9bHz


Lol let me.try it another for you

You and tical want us to believe a qb who according to you

Can't throw short
Can throw people open
Can't diagnose defenses
Can't work in an offense
Can only throw long that's all

Some how despite not being good at doing anything an NFL qb needs to do but throw long some how is amongst the best to play the game through his first 10 years. You do realize how absurd that is.

Now as to your attempt to placate me. Know one says he is great at everything no qb is. What we are saying is he is better than u and tical who think he can't do anything but throw long is. All these complaints u have about Wilson can de leveled at every qb in league at some level.

Bro. A qb with a gifted arm and legs who doesn't throw the ball unless he sees his open by a pretty large margin is going to have a solid completion percentage. Especially if he functions in an offense that doesnt rely on him to do much through the air because it's build to win on the ground. Add in Russels natural gift and talents and you have a scenario where you have a qb with a cannon who rarely takes risks completing a high % of balls against defenses who have no idea where the ball is going because he's always off script. Doesn't mean he wasn't hall of fame good at it. Just that it doesn't explain away his obviously struggle at doing other basic things.

He's literally the definition of success despite his deficiencies which is remarkable and for that he deserves all the recognition he can get.

But talk about other aspects of his game... not so much. And that hasn't mattered until now.
 

hawk45

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Wilson has elite tools and can be very effective, it’s a shame really his ego won’t let him do what it takes like a Brady without ego would. Even Manning be like “hand the ball off, yo.”

Commit to handing it off even when it doesn’t work right away. Use his own legs. He doesn’t want to do either of those two things because it doesn’t fit his desire to be seen as Brees or the QBs that are volume passers. But you can’t be a volume passer if you can’t throw cover 2 beaters consistently. So go back to using RB and QB runs to threaten defenses out of cover 2, then carve them up with big clutch throws (Wilson is definitely able to be clutch in big moments even if he hasn’t been flinging it all day).

I would absolutely love that Wilson if I saw it.
 

hawk45

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He’s past the point in his career where he will put up with any coach sitting him down and saying “you’re in an HOF trajectory but we need to scheme around your deficiencies just like any QB needs to scheme around theirs.”

He will never accept that he is trash vs cover 2 and that’s why he looks so awful, scared, indecisive, and lost so much. I wish he’d see that playing with rookie level effectiveness against that coverage makes him look worse than if he just made the obvious adjustments to get defenses out of it. Hell, everyone would rally to his side and blame Pete for running it more, and go back to acting like Wilson bails out bad offense. And we’d win.
 
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