A Deconstruction and Chronicle of Pete's Defense

Maelstrom787

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Everyone is dumping on Fade but the coaches were forced to make changes schematically and it did take them 4 or 5 games to figure it out. Can't blame people for criticizing coaching when the defense was putrid

When the guy responsible for a multi-year long campaign against "meddling" suddenly advocates for the same type of "meddling," also known as "coaching," and then takes credit by saying the Seahawks defense is only good because they did the thing he said they should.... fair game to laugh at that.

Brazen lack of consistency.
 

LeveeBreak

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Everyone is dumping on Fade but the coaches were forced to make changes schematically and it did take them 4 or 5 games to figure it out. Can't blame people for criticizing coaching when the defense was putrid
If that was only it...but it wasn't. The criticism was fueled by the belief that the hawks would suck and that Pete was not capable of making the changes needed. It went from Geno, to the D, to it wont last, to seasons before 2002, to he did what I said and now we are where we are.

Most people can respect when someone admits they were wrong. The "dumping" is due to the extreme effort of long winded posts to avoid admitting that Pete/team have proved his views wrong, attempting to change the narrative as the season has gone along. It disrespects the collective intelligence of the forum. That is why you see the reactions to those posts.
 
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toffee

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We are on discussion forum to cheer, critique, and express our opinions, I think @Fade is doing what forums like this one is meant for. @Fade and I may not agree on much but I always appreciate his knowledge of the game, a lot more so than I do, and how he took hits from other members with polite rebuttal.

As far as strong opinions go, @Fade disagrees with Pete as much as how he disagrees with Shanahan. He seems to dislike these two coaches with equal passion. LOL, life sucks that way ?
 

cymatica

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When the guy responsible for a multi-year long campaign against "meddling" suddenly advocates for the same type of "meddling," also known as "coaching," and then takes credit by saying the Seahawks defense is only good because they did the thing he said they should.... fair game to laugh at that.

Brazen lack of consistency.
Well I don't pay attention to user post history that much so I'll take your word for it. I'm just going off the Op in this thread and at the time the criticism seemed fair. I was on board with the coaches making bad decisions and putting players out of position, which still seems like it was the case, or maybe they were aware and just wanted to give the new scheme a chance but nothing was improving. Hindsight is funny like that
 

Sgt. Largent

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Excluding 2022 because a change in process has clearly taken place, and this thread is taking a look at their window of where it went wrong.

So if Pete Carroll recognized your criticisms of poor drafts, obviously corrected it as we're seeing this year with how he and John approached free agent home runs like Nwosu, and the 2022 drafting of two starting corners, one who's up for rookie DPOY AND the insane in season turn around of scheme that's now propelled this defense into a top 3 defense over the past month?

Then what the hell is your problem with Pete still? Why are you still beating the Pete's terrible and has to go drum?

Damn dude, just take the L and move on like the rest of us.
 

Seahawker76

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I think its possible that Fade's mindset sits squarely in these three categories.

a) Fade hates Pete. :rolleyes:
b) Fade is a problem solver who isn't happy if he's not fixing something. :unsure:
c) Fade thinks he knows more about football than everyone, including Pete. 🤩

Fade is an interesting read WHEN RELEVANT but he has keypunched his way into being boorish :sleep: since his diagnosis no longer applies.
Maybe Mr. Fade should use his vast football knowledge to post some positivity and even try to enjoy this unexpected season as it takes us where ever it might lead. 😛🥳

Or... maybe Fade should just get a girlfriend? 😜
 

Sgt. Largent

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I think its possible that Fade's mindset sits squarely in these three categories.

a) Fade hates Pete. :rolleyes:
b) Fade is a problem solver who isn't happy if he's not fixing something. :unsure:
c) Fade thinks he knows more about football than everyone, including Pete. 🤩

Fade is an interesting read WHEN RELEVANT but he has keypunched his way into being boorish :sleep: since his diagnosis no longer applies.
Maybe Mr. Fade should use his vast football knowledge to post some positivity and even try to enjoy this unexpected season as it takes us where ever it might lead. 😛🥳

Or... maybe Fade should just get a girlfriend? 😜


Fade's a smart guy, he's just obviously stubborn and refuses to back down from what is now a very obviously wrong opinion about Pete.

Because if the Seahawk's trajectory continues this season and they end up somewhere around 11-6, make the playoffs and win the West? With a QB literally no one other than Pete in the entire league thought was worth anything, and trading away his franchise QB, AND turning around a team Vegas and everyone else on the planet who supposedly thinks they know NFL football thought would only win 4-5 games?

Pete will have accomplished one of the greatest coaching jobs in the history of the modern league.
 

BigBill1945

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We were never expected to get to the playoffs nor have a winning record. Now a few people are whining about PC. I am not joining that pity party. We have a very young team and are situated well to get some great players. We have such a bright future I am going to have wear dark glasses😎😜
 
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Fade

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When the guy responsible for a multi-year long campaign against "meddling" suddenly advocates for the same type of "meddling," also known as "coaching," and then takes credit by saying the Seahawks defense is only good because they did the thing he said they should.... fair game to laugh at that.

Brazen lack of consistency.
It was simply a band-aid solution, and a temporary short term fix to survive the season, to overcome the terrible hire in Hurtt.

To actually fix the defense it's going to require a restructure/change at the top.

Continuing to throw assets/capital at the defense will not fix it with the same coaches in place on defense.
 

seahawks08

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If we don’t get a Kam like persona in this draft, this defense will still be rebuilding. Pete’s scheme also involves hard hitting imposing our will system. Baltimore played that kind of football yesterday and nearly won. If you start imposing your will, no team will want to play us. Our team was led by Kam and Marshawn as our tone setting players. That’s essentially our framework to win.
 

hoxrox

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With regards to the Hurtt hire, it could have been worse. Donatell's name was in the mix at the time of the hire. His defense in Minnesota ranks 28-31st in key defensive stats. Minnesota fans are calling for his head.

Why didn't Sean Desai or Joe Whitt Jr get the DC job? Who knows. But I hope they axe/demote Hurtt and promote Desai or another experienced DC instead.
 

Polk738

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With regards to the Hurtt hire, it could have been worse. Donatell's name was in the mix at the time of the hire. His defense in Minnesota ranks 28-31st in key defensive stats. Minnesota fans are calling for his head.

Why didn't Sean Desai or Joe Whitt Jr get the DC job? Who knows. But I hope they axe/demote Hurtt and promote Desai or another experienced DC instead.

Fangio's so called "scheme" got heavily exposed this season especially in the wild card round, I'll seriously be surprised if any teams continue to run any kind of variations of it next season.

Fade is not wrong in that the front office/scouting department has whiffed VERY badly the last several years when it has come to drafting defensive players, every player that he listed I agree with. Scott Mcloughin was responsible for a lot of the Hawks generational talent that was drafted from 2010-2012, you could easily credit him for building the powerhouse that the Seahawks were back then, so it's no surprise that when he left, the teams drafts took a big nose dive

Call me optimistic but I have more faith in this team's future going forward because of how well they did in this last draft compared to several others in the past, I have no idea what specifically changed as far as their front office/scouting department etc etc, the only thing I can think of that was mentioned by someone else on this board was the trading away of Russell Wilson established a much needed different draft approach, whatever it was I hope they take the same approach for this upcoming draft.

The 2012 draft had Irvin, Bobby, Sweezey, and Russ which made huge contributions to the team that year
The 2022 draft had Cross, Lucas, Woolen, Bryant, Walker, Mafe all made big contributions to this team this season
 
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With regards to the Hurtt hire, it could have been worse. Donatell's name was in the mix at the time of the hire. His defense in Minnesota ranks 28-31st in key defensive stats. Minnesota fans are calling for his head.

Why didn't Sean Desai or Joe Whitt Jr get the DC job? Who knows. But I hope they axe/demote Hurtt and promote Desai or another experienced DC instead.
Pete sure knows how to pick 'em, doesn't he? :)

No high level DC will take the job. It's Pete's defense at the end of the day.

Guys on their last legs (literally have no other options), or underlings will be the DC.
 
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Fade

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Here are 3 questions that will crystalize how poorly contructed, coached, schemed, and implemented this defense is?

Name the last very good (not great-- we're setting the bar lower here.) defensive player the Seahawks have taken in the first 3 rounds of the NFL draft?

Answer: Frank Clark, 2015

Name the last very good coach on the defensive staff to get hired away and do something in the NFL?


Answer: Dan Quinn, FEB: 2015


Name the last very good Free Agent Signing on defense prior to Nwosu, who just ended the drought?

Answer: Avril & Bennett, 2013
 

Polk738

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Name the last very good (not great-- we're setting the bar lower here.) defensive player the Seahawks have taken in the first 3 rounds of the NFL draft?

Answer: Frank Clark, 2015

A player Chiefs fans definitely regret giving a contract to
 

BASF

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Polk738 is absolutely correct. A bunch of teams jumped on the Fangio bandwagon this season and the offensive coordinators had already figured it out. Combine that with lack of talent, chemistry and Hurtt's inability to adjust to the league's adjustments was a recipe for getting our butts handed to us.

The scheme and it's DC has to go. Carroll was slow to adjust the last time our D scheme was figured out. He has to be proactive this time.
 

BASF

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A player Chiefs fans definitely regret giving a contract to
It is weird that he made three pro bowls. He doesn't have the numbers to back those selections up. A lot of people here want to call Taylor a bust and want to move on from him, but he has more tackles, tackles for loss, forced fumbles, fumble recoveries than Clark in the past two years. Most telling, Taylor has more sacks in the past three years and he only played two of those years.
 

hoxrox

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The scheme and it's DC has to go. Carroll was slow to adjust the last time our D scheme was figured out. He has to be proactive this time.

Pete said in yesterday's presser, that they will change things up scheme wise to help stop the run.

“We will commit differently than we did,” Carroll said. “We are going to be committed a little bit different than we did this year, to make sure that we solidify that.

“That’s about as far as I’ll go” divulging that.



But sounds like Hurtt will stay...
 

Jville

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These outbursts of Pete Carroll condemnations are weak sauce.

All they really reveal is who continues to struggle at keeping up with the team's evolutionary process.
 

BASF

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Pete said in yesterday's presser, that they will change things up scheme wise to help stop the run.

“We will commit differently than we did,” Carroll said. “We are going to be committed a little bit different than we did this year, to make sure that we solidify that.

“That’s about as far as I’ll go” divulging that.



But sounds like Hurtt will stay...
Disappointing.
 
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