Three Biggest Issues Right Now?

[LTH]

I didn't say that you had. All I did was agree with your statement that some fans, which happens to include Yours Truly, think that Pete has gotten 'stale'.

I've all but given up on Pete. I was hoping that he'd get fired last year and when that didn't happen, I've been trying to bite my tongue until we're eliminated from contention.

A lot of people have given up and if the fan base was actually the team , the Hawks would be decimated because of the lack of belief...

I want it on record that I think this locker room stuff ,supposedly going on, is exaggerated. I believe there is some stuff going on in the locker room , I just think that Pete is not going to allow these issues to destroy his team. Whether he benches players or how ever he handles it, I believe he will handle it because that's what he does.

I fully expect the Hawks to come out swinging Monday night. I'm hoping the go on a run and get into the playoffs. Will it happen? We will see.

LTH

 

[hoxrox]

I understand that many people just think 14 years of Pete is too much. It's just gotten stale for some people.

I know that Pete is going to go soon even if the reason is because he is old..

I'm just wanted to see him go out on top. I was really hoping he would put one more killer year together. Doesnt look like it's going to happen.

I love Pete...for many different reasons for me its going to be hard when he goes... it was hard for me when Holmgren left.

I hope he finds a way to pull this season out...But most of all I hope people respect him when he does go... somehow I get the feeling the board is going to trash him...

LTH

The fairy tale ending is that he would go out on top, in his final chapter, and ride off into the sunset. For everything he's done for this franchise, he doesn't deserve some of the vitriol thrown his way.

But he had the opportunity for that fairy tale ending, and I believe he squandered it.

This third iteration of his team has no identity.

2012 to 2015 - Physical smashmouth Bullies, ultra competitors with chips on their shoulders, who held each other accountable.

2015 to 2021 - The RW era. To cook or not to cook.

2021 to Present - ???

When a team has no identity it either means 1) there is no vision at the top, or 2) the ability to express that vision and have it manifest through the team, and onto the football field has not been effective.

He needed coaches with proven experience - not first time play callers who still needed to be groomed and developed. That was his fatal flaw. He thought he could develop these coaches. The man is trying to do too much...

Side note:

If Mark Cuban offers me 500K to start a new ecommerce business, I'm hiring the BEST sales and marketing manager, and the BEST operations and logistics manager. I would build a team of people who are smarter than me. I'm not trying to hire and train people on the job, if I want this business to succeed.

 

[RiverDog]

A lot of people have given up and if the fan base was actually the team , the Hawks would be decimated because of the lack of belief...

I want it on record that I think this locker room stuff ,supposedly going on, is exaggerated. I believe there is some stuff going on in the locker room , I just think that Pete is not going to allow these issues to destroy his team. Whether he benches players or how ever he handles it, I believe he will handle it because that's what he does.

I fully expect the Hawks to come out swinging Monday night. I'm hoping the go on a run and get into the playoffs. Will it happen? We will see.

LTH

Think if it like this: The fan base is the customer, and the team is the producer. It's not the customer's job to 'not lose confidence' in the producer as he's not the one responsible for making the product. It's the producer's job to keep the customer happy by meeting their expectations so that they don't lose confidence in them and their ability to manufacture a quality product.

I don't know what the locker room status is like, but I can take a guess that it's probably not very good. Losing 4 in a row and 5 of the past 6 can make molehills into mountains just like winning cures a lot of evils.

I honestly don't know what to expect from the Hawks this coming Monday. If I had to guess, I'd say that they'll play a competitive game only to lose it in the end as they did with the Cowboys.

 

[JayhawkMike]

… I just am giving people the right to feel as they do even though it's different than I feel about it.

LTH

Thank you God. Biggest self reveal of a sentence that I have read in years.

 

[LTH]

Thank you God. Biggest self reveal of a sentence that I have read in years.

Look this is a football discussion board. It's not like people give me the same respect. I get hammered everyday for 5 years because I believe in Pete Carroll. Fine that's the way it is..give me a break man... I'm defending my position...that's all.

LTH

 

[GemCity]

What are 3 issues or persons and players personnel etc that need to be resolved or improvements next year. Was gonna do a poll but replies would probably be too varied. Don't be afraid to name names...

1. Coaching...I am still on the fence whether I want Pete out. I definitely do want the coordinators out but if it's like others have said about rinse and repeat I'd be concerned. If Pete is hiring continual failures at these positions how much longer can that be tolerated? There are so many bad coaches out there right now like the guy from last night's game that id be concerned about viable replacement at hc..if there were a change...who would do the search for new coaching staff?? I definitely want Hurtt and Waldron gone...will decide over next 4 games if Pete is added for an entirely new philosophical change.

2. QB succession plan...okay we all know Geno is never gonna be a guy to win a super bowl. He was an intermediate fill in and while I think he's better than expected there needs to be a plan at qb longterm. I'd like to see a qb drafted in either next year's draft or the one after. Obviously these 9-8 finishes get us nowhere in getting a top prospect. So is it just gonna be luck or is there someone legit we can get with a mid round pick??

3. Shedding the anchors...its time to say see ya to several players...Adams Diggs Wagner Dallas come to mind immediately. It's time to address the back end to support Witherspoon and rebuild the linebacker core with fresh young blood. I named Dallas as we get shit from him on returns. Most times I'm just happy he didn't turnover the ball. Wagner is an all time great and will always be a legend but it's time to move on as age has caught up to him.

Obviously massive coaching and perhaps front office changes are going to have a huge impact on all of this. I am concerned about just staying status quo under Pete but concerned we could end up worse...Having a vacant owner isn't helping.

Couldn’t have said it better

 

[GemCity]

Look this is a football discussion board. It's not like people give me the same respect. I get hammered everyday for 5 years because I believe in Pete Carroll. Fine that's the way it is..give me a break man... I'm defending my position...that's all.

LTH

Agree or disagree, appreciate your posts LTH!

 

[JayhawkMike]

Look this is a football discussion board. It's not like people give me the same respect. I get hammered everyday for 5 years because I believe in Pete Carroll. Fine that's the way it is..give me a break man... I'm defending my position...that's all.

LTH

I always think everyone should be able to speak their mind whether people agree or not. The only posters that annoy me are the ones who try to shut down discussion on .. checks notes … a discussion board. Don’t agree with you at all on Pete but have no issue with you.

 

[TheLegendOfBoom]

I rewatched the Lynch interview with Shannon Sharpe and it was made fairly obvious after the 49 debacle that the ride was over. I know the players are all but gone from that era but wonder if that just still lingers with Pete here.

Two of my unborn children still harbor resentment and anger for Carroll after Super Bowl 49.

Thank you very much!

 

[renofox]

1. Team Building Strategy, including Inability to Build Lines. Building outside-in doesn't work. Investing huge capital in skill positions, TEs, and safeties is not effective. We've ended up with too many receivers we can't use, highly drafted RBs with no holes to run through, and safeties (and LBs) who can't cover. The cost? An offensive line that can't block for run OR pass, and a DL that can't stop the run with a pass rush that disappears for long stretches.

2. Player Development. The progression to regression ratio is unfathomably horrible. For every player who gets progressively better, there's probably 5 or more who get progressively worse. Brown has regressed from mid-tier to #32 ranked, while Olu sits on the bench. Not only does Kmac have -0- snaps, we're still using DJ on returns when Kmac was a baller on those in college. What happened to Bryant? He was doing great last year with some mistakes, but not excessively so for a rookie. They had injured-should-be-healing Woolen completely change his technique, taking away his strengths and having him play to his weaknesses. I could go on, but you get the idea.

3. Coaching Staff Management. Is PC micromanaging his coaching staff, or is he giving them too much free rein? I've heard well supported arguments from both sides. I don't know. What I do know is, whichever argument is right, IT'S NOT WORKING! PC is causing/allowing dreadful schemes and horrific playcalling to go on week after week. Season after season. Blaming it on coordinators is a cop out. PC is the one responsible for hiring and training and guiding the coordinators. He's failing badly. Same with the position coaches. As noted above, the players aren't getting better - they're consistently getting worse, and it's been this way for years.

 

[ZagHawk]

I hope people respect him when he does go... somehow I get the feeling the board is going to trash him...

LTH

I don't think anyone here does NOT respect PC. You do not reach his level of success for the years he has by being garbage. He has achieved levels of success pretty much all of us have never and will never achieve. That being said the trashing him has to do with expectations as a fan for how he is doing his job. The game and other coaches has moved/adapted past him and his style of coaching and development where he is no longer successful at the highest level. No longer believing in him is not disrespect, it's just accepting the truth and not holding onto what isn't there. Like the idea of wanting him to finish out the year strong doesn't do anything for accepting the future, that's still holding onto hope that 2012-2013 can return, and it will not it's a different game with different rules and different opposing coaches.

I think when he is done the fanbase including myself will be thankful for all he did and his service, but at the same time the anger right now is we're stuck with a coach we all know cannot get it done anymore and we want to move on.

 

[LTH]

Think if it like this: The fan base is the customer, and the team is the producer. It's not the customer's job to 'not lose confidence' in the producer as he's not the one responsible for making the product. It's the producer's job to keep the customer happy by meeting their expectations so that they don't lose confidence in them and their ability to manufacture a quality product.

I don't know what the locker room status is like, but I can take a guess that it's probably not very good. Losing 4 in a row and 5 of the past 6 can make molehills into mountains just like winning cures a lot of evils.

I honestly don't know what to expect from the Hawks this coming Monday. If I had to guess, I'd say that they'll play a competitive game only to lose it in the end as they did with the Cowboys.

I think the NFC west is and has been the best division in football for years. Shanahan and McVay are two of the best coaches the NFL has produced in a very long time. There is no doubt that they will both be in the hall of fame. That's three coaches currently in the west that are going to be in the hall of fame, Shanahan. McVay and Carroll

That being said. Whom ever made the schedule this year brutalized the Hawks. I like that it was tough .the Rams, who I have more respect for than most people on this board, then 2 Thursday night games against the Niners who are the best team in football, the Cowboys on the road, who are one of the best team in football, the Niners again on the road, then the Eagles on Monday Day night. That's the toughest schedule in the league. All while key players decimated by injury, I just believe there are not many teams that could survive that.

As I think about it, I don't have any shame for the losses with the exception of the last Rams game they should have won that one. I don't believe that the Hawks fielded a better roster than almost all of those teams with the exception of the Rams.

Now that the Hawks are getting a little healthier, hoping that Geno is back and the experience of that schedule, that is actually a good thing. I've been patiently waiting for the Hawks to break out if they can find a way to beat the Eagles and go on a little run in the last few games they might be competitive if they make the playoffs.

The next 4 games are going to say a lot about this football team on how they work through adversity and how Pete Carroll keeps his team competitive.

If Carroll doesn't keep this team competitive then his job is on the line.

If he keeps his team in it and the make the playoffs then it's a fantastic coaching job... right now I'm probably the only one on this board that see's this As EVERYBODY has lost faith and that's fine.

When it gets tough like it is now, it's the GREAT COACHES who find a way to fight through the adversity and produce Greatness. With out the tough times you never find out how really good you are!

Let's see what happens this is set up to be EPIC! Who is Pete Carroll? We are about to find out!

LTH

 

[renofox]

I don't think anyone here does NOT respect PC. You do not reach his level of success for the years he has by being garbage. He has achieved levels of success pretty much all of us have never and will never achieve. That being said the trashing him has to do with expectations as a fan for how he is doing his job. The game and other coaches has moved/adapted past him and his style of coaching and development where he is no longer successful at the highest level. No longer believing in him is not disrespect, it's just accepting the truth and not holding onto what isn't there. Like the idea of wanting him to finish out the year strong doesn't do anything for accepting the future, that's still holding onto hope that 2012-2013 can return, and it will not it's a different game with different rules and different opposing coaches.

I think when he is done the fanbase including myself will be thankful for all he did and his service, but at the same time the anger right now is we're stuck with a coach we all know cannot get it done anymore and we want to move on.

Just to add. We're sick of PC the current coach. We'll always love and respect PC the person and PC the coach that he used to be. We just want the current coach to leave.

 

[Dandaman83]

I only see one issue right now, and it's been the same issue for years. Identity.

Pete and John have failed at re-establishing the physical bully identity that they created during the SB years. Oh they've tried desperately, but very little has worked.

The Adams trade, the Diggs trade, bringing Bobby back, drafting DK, spending two high picks on RB's to get back to a punishing run 1st offense setting up play action and explosive plays downfield.

You can't build a cohesive consistent winner in any sport without establishing what your identity is.........and IMO that's really where Pete's failed the most over the past 6-7 years. As hard as he's tried, he can't figure out how to get back to that, as he watches the other two successful teams in our division with smarter coaches do just that. Beat the ever loving piss out of him year after year with his own physical bully formula.

Time to hang up the Double Bubble and Nike Monarchs homie. It's time.

I only see one issue right now, and it's been the same issue for years. Identity.

Pete and John have failed at re-establishing the physical bully identity that they created during the SB years. Oh they've tried desperately, but very little has worked.

The Adams trade, the Diggs trade, bringing Bobby back, drafting DK, spending two high picks on RB's to get back to a punishing run 1st offense setting up play action and explosive plays downfield.

You can't build a cohesive consistent winner in any sport without establishing what your identity is.........and IMO that's really where Pete's failed the most over the past 6-7 years. As hard as he's tried, he can't figure out how to get back to that, as he watches the other two successful teams in our division with smarter coaches do just that. Beat the ever loving piss out of him year after year with his own physical bully formula.

Time to hang up the Double Bubble and Nike Monarchs homie. It's time.

I think it’s time for young college coaching staff to come in. Like Shanahan and company. This old school offense and defense is not the answer. If Pete doesn’t have the balls to fire coaches mid season then it’s time for him to go as well. Paul Allen’s sister doesn’t know what she is doing and needs to sell the team. To someone who can make moves. Draft Bo nix and build around him

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I think it’s time for young college coaching staff to come in. Like Shanahan and company. This old school offense and defense is not the answer. If Pete doesn’t have the balls to fire coaches mid season then it’s time for him to go as well. Paul Allen’s sister doesn’t know what she is doing and needs to sell the team. To someone who can make moves. Draft Bo nix and build around him

Chuck Arnold is a very smart President, and has been here for what, like 25 years?

If Jody Allen empowers him to fire Pete and/or John? I trust him to bring in the best available coach and GM. Who that is or who's available? I have no idea.

But that's where it starts. You don't just fire and draft everyone without a cohesive top down plan and hiring process to make sure you've hired the right people to take care of the rest of what you're talking about. Drafting, player acquisition, identity, etc.

If Allen doesn't want to do that and is just hanging around until she wants to sell the team? We get Pete and more mediocrity until his contract runs out in 2025.

 

[scutterhawk]

I think the NFC west is and has been the best division in football for years. Shanahan and McVay are two of the best coaches the NFL has produced in a very long time. There is no doubt that they will both be in the hall of fame. That's three coaches currently in the west that are going to be in the hall of fame, Shanahan. McVay and Carroll

That being said. Whom ever made the schedule this year brutalized the Hawks. I like that it was tough .the Rams, who I have more respect for than most people on this board, then 2 Thursday night games against the Niners who are the best team in football, the Cowboys on the road, who are one of the best team in football, the Niners again on the road, then the Eagles on Monday Day night. That's the toughest schedule in the league. All while key players decimated by injury, I just believe there are not many teams that could survive that.

As I think about it, I don't have any shame for the losses with the exception of the last Rams game they should have won that one. I don't believe that the Hawks fielded a better roster than almost all of those teams with the exception of the Rams.

Now that the Hawks are getting a little healthier, hoping that Geno is back and the experience of that schedule, that is actually a good thing. I've been patiently waiting for the Hawks to break out if they can find a way to beat the Eagles and go on a little run in the last few games they might be competitive if they make the playoffs.

The next 4 games are going to say a lot about this football team on how they work through adversity and how Pete Carroll keeps his team competitive.

If Carroll doesn't keep this team competitive then his job is on the line.

If he keeps his team in it and the make the playoffs then it's a fantastic coaching job... right now I'm probably the only one on this board that see's this As EVERYBODY has lost faith and that's fine.

When it gets tough like it is now, it's the GREAT COACHES who find a way to fight through the adversity and produce Greatness. With out the tough times you never find out how really good you are!

Let's see what happens this is set up to be EPIC! Who is Pete Carroll? We are about to find out!

LTH

You ain't alone.
Game 1 the two best O-Linemen go down.
A Schedule that beats the living shit out of regrouping and ...Continuity? yeah, that's been in the $#itter all season long.
The h8ers gonna hate, that's what they do best.
Pete Statue?, I like it.

 

[RiverDog]

I think the NFC west is and has been the best division in football for years. Shanahan and McVay are two of the best coaches the NFL has produced in a very long time. There is no doubt that they will both be in the hall of fame. That's three coaches currently in the west that are going to be in the hall of fame, Shanahan. McVay and Carroll.

I'm not sure of any of those three. There are only two active coaches who are slam dunk for the HOF, that being Belichick and Andy Reid. They're the only ones who have won multiple SB's, which I think is going to be one of the standards.

That being said. Whom ever made the schedule this year brutalized the Hawks. I like that it was tough .the Rams, who I have more respect for than most people on this board, then 2 Thursday night games against the Niners who are the best team in football, the Cowboys on the road, who are one of the best team in football, the Niners again on the road, then the Eagles on Monday Day night. That's the toughest schedule in the league. All while key players decimated by injury, I just believe there are not many teams that could survive that.

The "brutalized" schedule is just another excuse. We got a break by their moving the Eagles game back to a Monday. It gives us an extra day to prepare for them. Our opponent following the Eagles is a much weaker (on paper) Titans team.

Besides, we're not the only team that got "brutalized". Take a look at our next opponent, the Eagles. After their bad loss to the Jets, they have played the Dolphins, Cowboys x2, the Chiefs, and the Niners. That's at least equal to our Murderer's Row. And keep in mind that with the exception of two games, our schedule is just like that of our divisional opponents.

In fact, our schedule is currently ranked 17, just ahead of the Rams and Cards:

Ranking the easiest, hardest schedules for all 32 NFL teams: Saints, Falcons and Colts have favorable schedules in 2023 | NFL News, Rankings and Statistics | PFF

While every NFL team's path to victory will be unique, the strength of their schedule plays a pivotal role in shaping their future. Here, we use PFF ELO to delve into the 2023 NFL season and determine which teams have the easiest and hardest schedules.

www.pff.com

You're grasping for straws.

 

[AROS]

For anyone who has had posts deleted in this thread it is because it involves a highly-divisive political topic AND it is completely off the topic of this thread. Any further politically-charged posts and/or posts that are completely off topic from anyone will earn themselves a temporary ban. If you have any issues with moderation take it up with the moderators in private. No exceptions.

 

[RolandDeschain]

The three biggest issues are, in order:

1. Pete
2. Carroll
3. Pete Carroll

 

[LTH]

I'm not sure of any of those three. There are only two active coaches who are slam dunk for the HOF, that being Belichick and Andy Reid. They're the only ones who have won multiple SB's, which I think is going to be one of the standards.

The "brutalized" schedule is just another excuse. We got a break by their moving the Eagles game back to a Monday. It gives us an extra day to prepare for them. Our opponent following the Eagles is a much weaker (on paper) Titans team.

Besides, we're not the only team that got "brutalized". Take a look at our next opponent, the Eagles. After their bad loss to the Jets, they have played the Dolphins, Cowboys x2, the Chiefs, and the Niners. That's at least equal to our Murderer's Row. And keep in mind that with the exception of two games, our schedule is just like that of our divisional opponents.

In fact, our schedule is currently ranked 17, just ahead of the Rams and Cards:

Ranking the easiest, hardest schedules for all 32 NFL teams: Saints, Falcons and Colts have favorable schedules in 2023 | NFL News, Rankings and Statistics | PFF

While every NFL team's path to victory will be unique, the strength of their schedule plays a pivotal role in shaping their future. Here, we use PFF ELO to delve into the 2023 NFL season and determine which teams have the easiest and hardest schedules.

www.pff.com

You're grasping for straws.

No you just don't agree with me... that's fine... that link younposted was someones opinion besides i was really talking about that stretch of games along with playing 2 back to back on thursday night and then the monday night game all woth in 4 games... we will see what happens with the rest of the season. You kinda missed my point I was setting up the last 2 paragraphs about Carroll

LTH