Chicago. Big Mac/Defense, Geno, Grubb

TOPHawk

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Good news…the defense played as it should against a less disciplined and less guided offense. Do NOT fool yourself - Chicago has plenty of raw talent on offense…maybe more than Seattle. This could have been a game the Seahawks have lost in the past. (A certain Seattle/TB in TB game comes to mind.

As for the offensive struggles, I’m completely torn between Geno/Grubb/Offensive line.

By my count, Geno missed four easy throws to night that could have extended drives. He simply holds on to the ball longer than he should and missed open receivers. Adding to that, he has almost no concept of throwing the ball away. I appreciate the tenacity, but holy duck, understand the situation and throw that ball away if things don’t look right.

O-Line. Terrible. Chicago mostly had a four-man rush all night and was continually getting pressure. It makes the LBs job super easy if they have no reason to fear the play action. If Seattle showed an inkling of run, the Chicago LBs crashed lanes in the second half. If not, they dropped into zones and Geno had a hard time seeing the gaps. This, in particular, is super frustrating.

Grubb. I honestly don’t know if he’s trying to play chess with checkers pieces. I was super pumped after the Lions game earlier this season with the originality of plays, particularly in the second half. The team made a hard push against a premier NFC team. I just do not see it anymore. Is it Geno not seeing things or is it Grubb.
 
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cymatica

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It makes the LBs job super easy if they have no reason to fear the play action. If Seattle showed an inkling of run, the Chicago LBs crashed lanes in the second half. If not, they dropped into zones and Geno had a hard time seeing the gaps. This, in particular, is super frustrating.
They are tipping plays and Grubb's refusal to call play action amplifies the problem. When I can just glance and tell if they are running or passing it's sad
 

keasley45

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Good news…the defense played as it should against a less disciplined and less guided offense. Do NOT fool yourself - Chicago has plenty of raw talent on offense…maybe more than Seattle. This cold have been a game the Seahawks have lost in the past. (A certain Seattle/TB in TB game comes to mind.

As for the offensive struggles, I’m completely torn between Geno/Grubb/Offensive line.

By my count, Geno missed four easy throws to night that could have extended drives. He simply holds on to the ball longer than he should and missed open receivers. Adding to that, he has almost no concept of throwing the ball away. I appreciate the tenacity, but holy duck, understand the situation and throw that ball away if things don’t look right.

O-Line. Terrible. Chicago mostly had a four-man rush all night and was continually getting pressure. It makes the LBs job super easy if they have no reason to fear the play action. If Seattle showed an inkling of run, the Chicago LBs crashed lanes in the second half. If not, they dropped into zones and Geno had a hard time seeing the gaps. This, in particular, is super frustrating.

Grubb. I honestly don’t know if he’s trying to play chess with checkers pieces. I was super pumped after the Lions game earlier this season with the originality of plays, particularly in the second half. The team made a hard push against a premier NFC team. I just do not see it anymore. Is it Geno not seeing things or is it Grubb.

Grubb. You dont even have to look at just pass plays involving Geno. The plan is garbage. The plays are questionable. The balance is non-existent. The situational awareness is puzzling.

All of that BEFORE you consider the play of the QB.
 

JPatera76

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Grubb. You dont even have to look at just pass plays involving Geno. The plan is garbage. The plays are questionable. The balance is non-existent. The situational awareness is puzzling.

All of that BEFORE you consider the play of the QB.

So Grubbs the one choosing out of a couple plays to stare down field and wait for long developing plays? Or staring down his receivers or refusing to run for firsts and just taking sacks. It’s all on Geno and it has been for a while and it’s all mental. Yall wanna blame Grubb so quick but a good majority of you were whining and bitching the minute he was announced.
 

keasley45

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So Grubbs the one choosing out of a couple plays to stare down field and wait for long developing plays? Or staring down his receivers or refusing to run for firsts and just taking sacks. It’s all on Geno and it has been for a while and it’s all mental. Yall wanna blame Grubb so quick but a good majority of you were whining and bitching the minute he was announced.

The plays are the plays. Its been known. Been talked about on this forum. Been criticized by the HC, by analysts, broken down by film.

Geno is often 'staring down' receivers on plays where he hangs in waiting for a long developing route to come open. Dont take my word for it. Wyman just talked speciifcally about this after the Minny game - long developing plays on 3rd and short with often no outlet.

Thats poor playcalling.

But it wont ne a debate anymore when Grubb is sent packing.
 

cymatica

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So Grubbs the one choosing out of a couple plays to stare down field and wait for long developing plays? Or staring down his receivers or refusing to run for firsts and just taking sacks. It’s all on Geno and it has been for a while and it’s all mental. Yall wanna blame Grubb so quick but a good majority of you were whining and bitching the minute he was announced.
Grubb is the one who abandons the run and doesn't call play action. Seattle wasn't leading the league in opening drives without a TD under Geno the last couple years. Can't blame Geno for the huge disparity in runs vs passes and shotgun formations when we had a different OC with the same QB and Oline.
 

keasley45

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It's okay...there's nothing wrong with saying it's all THREE, because IT IS.

If you have a car that sucks and a mechanic that cant fix it, you cant expect the driver to win with it. In fact, you can likely expect him to make mistakes pretty often trying to extract more from it than it can offer.

That, in a nutshell, is 'all 3'. But what's the real problem in that scenario?
 

Fernie Hawks Fan

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If you have a car that sucks and a mechanic that cant fix it, you cant expect the driver to win with it. In fact, you can likely expect him to make mistakes pretty often trying to extract more from it than it can offer.

That, in a nutshell, is 'all 3'. But what's the real problem in that scenario?
Come on man, you said yourself in numerous posts, that there were times Geno made mistakes...Be a Geno fanboy all you want but let's be truthful here.
I never said it was ALL on Geno...but he does make some boneheaded plays.
 

keasley45

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Come on man, you said yourself in numerous posts, that there were times Geno made mistakes...Be a Geno fanboy all you want but let's be truthful here.
I never said it was ALL on Geno...but he does make some boneheaded plays.
Geno make mistakes. Dk makes mistakes, tyler makes mistakes. Lucas makes mistakes. Cross makes mistakes

And they all play in an offense thats one big mistake.
 

Ruminator

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A play on offense I remember in particular, I think it was late 3rd quarter, maybe early 4th, that underscores why our offense is so easily defended against: As soon as our guys lined up out of the huddle, a Bears cornerback near the LOS suddenly sprinted back 20+ yards, as if he had just received insider trading info to buy a certain stock guaranteed to reap millions. And sure enough, seconds later, Geno was looking for a receiver deep... and the play went totally pfffft.
 

bigskydoc

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Any NFL defense, even the worst in tbe league, will feast on a college offense. It doesn’t matter how good your offensive line and quarterback are.

We are basically running a college offense, a slower tempo version of the air raid. It reminds me of watching Mike Leach at TT or WSU. Nothing short, intermediate, or over the middle. Running game is focused on utilizing screen type passes, and true running plays are minimized.

Defense, and defensive coordinators, know pretty much exactly what we are going to throw at them now, and it’s easy to defend against. Pin your ears back and get to the QB who never rolls out, and never takes off downfield.

It’s to the point that I’m not sure you can reasonably evaluate the line or the QB. It makes sense why we had so much success early on. Defenses had no tape on us, and still had to respect the run. Now that they know exactly what we are going to do, they can pretty much shut us down. Our game plan hasn’t evolved like I hoped it would.

It’s Grubb
 

CalgaryFan05

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Grubb. You dont even have to look at just pass plays involving Geno. The plan is garbage. The plays are questionable. The balance is non-existent. The situational awareness is puzzling.

All of that BEFORE you consider the play of the QB.
Yup.

Grubb needs to go. Been saying that for 6 or 8 weeks now.

You should be able to scheme around a weak oline. He can't. And he refuses to do it.
 

Jac

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Yup.

Grubb needs to go. Been saying that for 6 or 8 weeks now.

You should be able to scheme around a weak oline. He can't. And he refuses to do it.

I trust Macdonald will address this in the offseason. He's done wonders with the defense in one season, and that side of the ball is only going to get better. He's too good of a coach to sit on his hands out of loyalty, stubbornness, etc.
 

keasley45

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So you're saying it could be all three?
The underlying root of the problem is the offense.

We all do realize Mac is asked about it every week, right?

Schlereth said it best when asked point blank what to do with Geno with respect to this offense and upcoming seasons:

“He's proven in the right system, with the right people around him, that he can be exceptional,” Schlereth said. “And I would lean more toward that than going out there and (acquiring) some guy that you think is going to all of a sudden have that Sam Darnold-type ascension.

To clarify, the system Mark is inferring 'isnt right' is the one we see every sunday. Fix the system and Geno and the whole thing is better.

Our offense as a whole is embarrassing. The line still isn't great and the running game is bottom of the league. To pretend as though some other qb will come in here and do all the remarkable things Geno does to actually make us competitive AND avoid the errors he's made that have hurt us is silly.

Its like Mac said himself just last week when asked about the INTs - yes, he threw the INTs , but he is the reason we are in the game to begin with. If not for his exceptional plays, how competitive are we.

Like Schlereth said, folks are quick to zero on on Geno becausr when things go wrong for the QB, its obvious. But the truth of the entire picture is not as cut and dry.

Do you hinestly think that a coach as smart as Mac has shown to be WOULDNT be more critical of Geno if the errors were as clear cut as the 'Geno must go' critics would like to make it seem and NOT a function of errors across the board in the offense? There's a reason he has coined terms like 'team errors' when asked to discuss some of Geno's INTs.

There's a reason he answers questions about plays like the last INT aganst Minny by saying hes not gonna talk about whether it was the route run or the play design or anything in between.

Its as obvious now with Grubb as it was with Waldron. - and i got flamed for calling him a hack too. But if you watch the film, its obvious. You dont have to feel any way about Geno. Its just obvious.

 

keasley45

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Any NFL defense, even the worst in tbe league, will feast on a college offense. It doesn’t matter how good your offensive line and quarterback are.

We are basically running a college offense, a slower tempo version of the air raid. It reminds me of watching Mike Leach at TT or WSU. Nothing short, intermediate, or over the middle. Running game is focused on utilizing screen type passes, and true running plays are minimized.

Defense, and defensive coordinators, know pretty much exactly what we are going to throw at them now, and it’s easy to defend against. Pin your ears back and get to the QB who never rolls out, and never takes off downfield.

It’s to the point that I’m not sure you can reasonably evaluate the line or the QB. It makes sense why we had so much success early on. Defenses had no tape on us, and still had to respect the run. Now that they know exactly what we are going to do, they can pretty much shut us down. Our game plan hasn’t evolved like I hoped it would.

It’s Grubb
1000 x this
 

keasley45

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All of us were hoping for the the Grubb offense we saw BEFORE the Championship Game and not the one that was embarrassed by a former NFL coach pushing NFL concepts.

What we got is what many were afraid we would. The championship game was the proverbial canary in a coal mine. A QB who looked really good prior to that game, looked entirely lost . An offense that looked unstoppable behind its 'genius' coordinator, looked amateurish - all because it was the first time it faced someone who could script a defense to stop it. Harbaugh embarrassed Grubb with college players. Why would anyone think that an NFL DC with even average NFL talent wouldnt do the same if Grubb didnt show the ability to step up his game?

Watching this team remain stuck in 2nd gear all year under Grubb has been frustrating. But its also not at all a surprise.
 
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