Listless in Seattle … was Matt Flynn a Malcontent Last Year?

[Hawkscanner]

Listless in Seattle … was Matt Flynn a Malcontent Last Year?

I don’t know how many of you have had a chance to read Brock Huard’s latest piece, “Why Trading Matt Flynn Made Sense” but for those who might have missed it, there were some extremely interesting and insightful comments he makes in that article. This one in particular really caught my eye and speaks to some of the dynamics that were going on behind the scenes in terms of Seattle’s quarterbacks last year …

Carroll said in no uncertain terms during the combine that Wilson's commitment and work ethic cannot be discounted or downplayed when it comes to player acquisition.
After spending two years in Indianapolis with an equally driven and demanding quarterback by the name of Peyton Manning, I can understand Carroll's sentiment. Watching Manning work, and just as importantly watching Marvin Harrison and Edgerrin James commit equally to their craft, elevated everyone in the building. As a backup, it meant trying to keep up with No. 18 with off-day meetings, early game-planning sessions and extra time with film study. Either buy in, commit and grab an oar or go elsewhere.
It was my understanding that last season it was Wilson who was in early and staying late. It was Wilson in the facility on Tuesdays getting a head start on the game plan. Wilson was grabbing the oars and had very little if any help from the backup. Josh Portis was actually more willing than Flynn to commit to the extra-credit time when no one was watching.

Source:
http://mynorthwest.com/422/2246184/Huard-Why-trading-Matt-Flynn-made-sense


So according to Brock, while everything seemed copacetic between Wilson and Flynn … and that the perception was that Flynn was there right along side Wilson, helping him out week in and week out; that wasn’t really the case. Huard basically says that things weren’t as sunny and rosy as they seemed … making Flynn out to be a malcontent, reluctant not only to put in the extra work … but also unwilling to lift a finger to help Wilson and the team.

Is this seriously the same Matt Flynn that the Seahawks inked for 3 Years/$19.5 Million back in March of 2012? Is this really the same guy we heard all the glowing reports about?

Just juxtapose Brock’s comments with the comments of John Schneider soon after he made the move to acquire Flynn …

John Schneider: “ … [he’s] highly competitive. You know, I talked to Aaron Rodgers last week and he basically just told me – said, ‘Look, John this is the first year that this guy just really, really came after me.’ He said, ‘I don’t know if it was because he was an unrestricted free agent or, you know, the fact that he was able to play in the New England game the year before and have some success, but I’m telling you (he said) everything we did he was challenging me in a big way. So that’s what you’ll find with this guy.”

Source:
950 KJR-am Interview with John Schneider – Ian Furness Show (3/19/12)


… And how about those of Kevin Harlan (who does Green Bay’s preseason games and knows the inner workings of that team well)? Two months before the Seahawks signed Matt Flynn, he had this to say to 950 KJR-am’s Softy Softerson …

Harlan: “He’s [Flynn’s] the best back-up quarterback to start the season … he’s the best back-up quarterback to end the season.

Harlan: “If you have a chance to get Matt Flynn – you cannot pay enough to get that guy. I don’t think there’s another QB, starters aside, that is any better than Matt Flynn right now. He could probably start for 25 other teams in the league right now.”

Softy: “You’ve seen Tavaris Jackson play. The beauty of that is Kevin that you don’t need to trade for him. You can keep your draft picks. He’s an unrestricted free agent. You tell me why a move like that would not make sense for the Seahawks.”

Harlan: “Well, I don’t know. I mean the only other guy I would have pause with would be Andrew Luck. I would take him over the kid at Baylor [Griffin], I’d take him over the kid (if he were coming out) at USC [Barkley] – there’s no question in my mind (and I do Green Bay’s Pre-season, so I’ve seen him now). He’s been part of a great program over at LSU – he was only a 1 year starter, but they were terrific that 1 year. He’s gone up there [to Green Bay], he’s experienced, he’s mature, he’s a leader. He probably doesn’t have a Rodgers arm, but few guys do. But the knock on him is that he’s not maybe as tall – he might be just a hair under 6’2” [goes on to talk about Drew Brees]

I think it’s a no brainer [the Seahawks picking him up]. And I’m not basing this just upon what he did a couple days ago with the 6 touchdowns and 1 pick against Detroit. It’s the body of work since he’s become a Pro and what he’s done – the system he has grown up in. I mean, that guy has been in an environment with as arguably as good an offense as is being run in the NFL right now. He has been privy to what the best quarterback – or at least what one of the top 2 quarterbacks in the NFL has done to get where he is. And Rodgers, while he’s a freak physically, has had to work incredibly hard to get where he is right now – and Flynn has absorbed – all of that. He has had a front row seat to the best offense in the NFL with arguably the best quarterback in the NFL.”

Source:
950-KJR Interview with Kevin Harlan – Softy’s Show (1/3/2011)
[Link no longer available]


Gary Crowton (Flynn’s former Offensive Coordinator at LSU) absolutely gushed about Matt Flynn. His report on him is completely and totally the OPPOSITE of the Flynn that Brock Huard described above …

Gas: “He seems to be a guy too who -- you talk about how he prepares and he’s ready. I mean, obviously those are skills that he been able to hone the last few years. And it’s got to be tough for him day, after day, after day to sit behind Aaron Rodgers. And yet, clearly he had to do some of that at LSU as well. And he was able to improve during that time when he wasn’t playing as much – he was still able to improve, in your mind?

Crowton: “Yeah, here’s what he does – is that. I had – I took him right after JaMarcus Russell had that real good year – and I was in the meeting room and I was asked a lot of questions about that. The thing that he [Matt Flynn] does is that – he pays so much attention to the game. And so when he’s in the meetings or even he’s on his own – he’s doing all the little things to understand the game and what it takes to win. And I think that he was one of the big reasons that JaMarcus Russell had such a good year his Junior year (right before he came out in that draft) was because that Matt was always there, kind of helping him in the meetings and talking with him. And when I got him, Matt knew what he was doing. It was his time to be the guy and he was just prepared when he went out there. And then what he does is – in his preparation he brings others around him. He helps them prepare because he’s always talking about the little things to them – and then they seem to get better. And it’s a great chemistry to have him there.”

Elise: “You think that he will be able to lead an NFL Franchise immediately?”

Crowton: “I think so. I think he definitely has the ability to do so. I’m not sure what all the chemistry is going to be about. I know that when he’ll get out there he will make the chemistry better whatever it is. And the thing that I admired in him is – he comes to work with a smile on his face, so the guys around him enjoy – but then again, he was such a competitor. And I think with those kind of attributes that he has -- I think that there is a very good possibility that good things are going to happen with him as the quarterback in the future – and I think that he can make a good run at it.

Source:
950 KJR-am Interview with Gary Crowton (Former LSU Offensive Coordinator) – Gas Man Show (3/19/12)


’Scanner’s Take:

If what Brock is saying is true, then contract alone wasn’t the only reason that Matt Flynn was sent packing. This move was about far more than just money – it was also about attitude.

The job of the back-up quarterback isn’t only to prepare themselves for possible game action in case the starter goes down … it’s also to help the starter prepare and be the best they can be on Sunday as well. And it appears clear that’s a role that Matt Flynn is willing to accept temporarily IF the brass ring of a starting job for himself is within his grasp.

Matt Flynn was willing to pour in the time and energy in to helping JaMarcus Russell be the best he could be because he knew that in a very short time, the job would be his.

He “came after” Aaron Rodgers, challenging him and giving forth that 100% mega-effort as “the best back-up in the league” because free agency and the prospect of a starting job elsewhere was looming on the horizon.

But when the dust of Seahawks training camp settled … and Flynn found out that he wasn’t going to be “the man” in Seattle … he chose to circle the wagons and shift it in to 1st gear. In essence, he stopped doing all of the extra credit hours, thought only of himself (and not the greater good of the team), and pouted because he wasn’t the starter. No extra hours to make himself the best he could possibly be … and certainly no helping of Russell Wilson.

Disappointment can be a powerful force in sports. For some, it can cause them to re-evaluate their game and redouble their efforts to make themselves to be the very best. For others though, it can cause them to become bitter and to shut down. And that’s apparently what happened in the case of Flynn. That kind of thing can perhaps fly on other teams … but not in Seattle. For Pete Carroll and the Seahawks, if you’re not “All in” … you’re all out. And that’s exactly where Matt Flynn has found himself now.

Some people have continued to ask the question, “Wouldn’t the Seahawks have been better off as a team keeping Matt Flynn as the back-up in case the unthinkable happened and Russell Wilson went down with an injury?”

The answer to that would be, “Yes … for someone who is willing to accept that role.”

Matt Flynn as a back-up in Seattle would never have worked because he clearly doesn’t see himself AS a back-up. He simply wasn’t willing to commit himself to that role and to doing the things that good back-up quarterbacks are supposed to do. Ergo, Flynn is now a Raider and Brady Quinn your new number two. Hopefully things work out for Flynn in Oakland. Can he grab on and hold on to the brass ring of the starting quarterback job there? It’ll definitely be interesting to see what happens to him and that locker room if he doesn’t.

 

[drdiags]

A slight nit. Seahawks didn't trade for Flynn back in March 2012.

It probably is true the Flynn was not able to get his mind fully into the backup mode and support the rookie. He did however keep his disappointment from getting leaked to the public. He kept his family and agent in a pretty tight circle. Maybe Hawkblogger and Softy, among others, knew his state of mind but for the most part the rest of us speculated.

He isn't the bad guy in my mind for taking a few moments to lick his wounds. Whether that was the main motivating factor for the Raiders trade? Only time will tell once Flynn moves down the road with the passage of time.

 

[gspin2k1]

I didn't read your whole post sorry. But I'll just assume what it was about and answer your title.

I would think that Flynn was malcontent last season. he came to Seattle with the expectation that he would start, Wilson beat him out, but honestly who saw that coming? Flynn sure as hell didn't, and when Wilson early on in the season was showing his rookie-ness. A lot of people were screaming for Flynn and I'm sure Flynn was just waiting to be put in to prove his worth.

I would love to keep Flynn as a back up, feels really comfortable, but let's face it, that's a luxury that pretty much no team has. Theoretically even the best back up, shouldn't even be good enough to start for the worst team in the NFL (theoretically). Anyway, I understand why things went down the way they did. I give praise to Flynn for being a good teammate last year, because he easily could have publicly stated things about him not being happy with his situation, but he kept his mouth shut and just supported the team. But yeah I think he was pretty damn sick of sitting on benches all these years lol.

 

[Hawkscanner]

A slight nit. Seahawks didn't trade for Flynn back in March 2012.

It probably is true the Flynn was not able to get his mind fully into the backup mode and support the rookie. He did however keep his disappointment from getting leaked to the public. He kept his family and agent in a pretty tight circle. Maybe Hawkblogger and Softy, among others, knew his state of mind but for the most part the rest of us speculated.

He isn't the bad guy in my mind for taking a few moments to lick his wounds. Whether that was the main motivating factor for the Raiders trade? Only time will tell once Flynn moves down the road with the passage of time.

You're right on the "trading for" part -- stupid error on my part (which I know) which has been corrected.

I agree also on what you're saying -- I hadn't heard any of this until Brock's article. It was good this was kept out of the press. It seems like most members of the local press DID basically know this, as it seems they have alluded to the NEED (almost necessity) to trade Flynn.

And as I said, there's a big part of me that understands. He isn't a bad guy whatsoever -- but apparently neither was he was viable member of this team. The back-up job simply wasn't one that he could accept, so the whole preparing the starter on a week-in/week out basis -- forget it. That attitude could have had long term consequences, so it was good in many ways that they traded him to a situation where he could legitimately compete for the starting job. And I seriously wish him best of luck.

 

[Basis4day]

Here is my problem with the idea.

We never heard from Flynn, ever. The closest we got to any insight into Flynn's feelings was people attempting to read Flynn's body language on the sidelines.
He didn't take to twitter, blast anyone of tv or have his agent wage a media campaign. Any feeling of disgruntlement Flynn had or didn't have was kept in house.
We're left to speculate on what Flynn did or didn't do. We're left to speculate the extent that Flynn "embraced" being a back-up.

Huard has mentioned that he heard rumblings from members of the organization, but nothing substantive or specific. I don't doubt that he has insider information, but can't think that Flynn was any kind of real detriment to the team without some specific instance leaking.

Different people have different ideas for what a backup should or shouldn't be. Whatever the Seahawks viewed in the role is their secret.

 

[Shadowhawk]

We'll probably never really know what Flynn did or didn't do during his time in Seattle. But if he was frustrated he didn't make it public. He didn't cause a distraction that a young team did not need. And for that I wish him well.

 

[Floridahawk79]

We'll probably never really know what Flynn did or didn't do during his time in Seattle. But if he was frustrated he didn't make it public. He didn't cause a distraction that a young team did not need. And for that I wish him well.

Plus he's not on the team anymore.

 

[jack_patera]

debatable for sure if he was a 'malcontent'...but disappointed, definitely...and who wouldn't have been...brought in to be 'the guy', played solid enough in pre-season to win job on most clubs but gets beat out by a rookie..after early games when things were a bit rocky, he had to see his chances looking up as far as maybe getting the nod, only to see this wunderkid take off...

i could see it when they were caught exchanging high-fives or after celebrating a touchdown...he wasn't 'all-in' in his exuberance...

i really felt it when he got in in the buffalo game...he was flinging the ball all around, without a care in the world, almost like he was letting out some frustration maybe?

regardless, i wish him well and hope he kicks ass in oakland..

 

[gspin2k1]

Here is my problem with the idea.

We never heard from Flynn, ever. The closest we got to any insight into Flynn's feelings was people attempting to read Flynn's body language on the sidelines.
He didn't take to twitter, blast anyone of tv or have his agent wage a media campaign. Any feeling of disgruntlement Flynn had or didn't have was kept in house.
We're left to speculate on what Flynn did or didn't do. We're left to speculate the extent that Flynn "embraced" being a back-up.

Huard has mentioned that he heard rumblings from members of the organization, but nothing substantive or specific. I don't doubt that he has insider information, but can't think that Flynn was any kind of real detriment to the team without some specific instance leaking.

Different people have different ideas for what a backup should or shouldn't be. Whatever the Seahawks viewed in the role is their secret.

I remember Pete Carroll in an interview saying that Flynn still thought he was the better QB, but it wasn't in a way that meant there was ill will in the team. But I think it more shifts the notion that Flynn believes he's a starting caliber QB, and wants to start. Can't blame him, he's been on the bench all this time, the few times he has played he's done well. But yeah he is a very expensive back up, Russell is our guy, we made huge trades/moves that took up salary cap because we want to win, and want to win now. I'm sure his salary off the cap for next year helps.

 

[Happypuppy]

Well done HawkScanner. A interesting take on the situation. My belief is he cam expecting to easily win the job. His body language on the sidelines seemed unhappy.

I think he asked to be traded or let go. fearing he would not be happy and "on board" they moved him.

I saw him play in the preseason and a practice and I agree with the one interviewee. He is better than most starters, at least in preseason. His arm is much better than many suspect. I think he will turn out to be a pretty good QB for Oakland, and I wish him the best.

 

[Hawks46]

Hawkblogger had a good article about this. I wish I had the link, but basically he was saying that none of the QBs started out very good, but at the beginning of TC, Jackson still looked like Jackson, Flynn was looking good and Wilson still looked overwhelmed.

Basically, Flynn won over the locker room, and the guys started pulling for Flynn, but going back to all Pete's pressers, he rarely mentioned Flynn, and gushed about Wilson when asked. Hawkblogger got the distinct impression that the team never really wanted Flynn to win the starting position, even though they brought him in for that job, after Wilson started to impress with his intangibles. This is an educated guess (more than any of us have) gained on insight Hawkblogger gained while watching all the practices, talking to the coaches after said practices, and the aforementioned cool attitude towards Flynn in pressers.

The one caveat is that nowhere in Hawkblogger's article was mentioned Flynn's tendinitis...which really brings us to two conclusions: there was never any tendinitis and Pete came up with that to save Flynn face, or that Hawkblogger's theory was hingeing on more speculation than he let on.

Either way, Flynn's luck has been pretty poor in his career: he gets stuck behind an inferior QB in Jamarcus Russell that Les Miles loved for physical intangibles but we all know he was a box of rocks upstairs....then he gets drafted and sits behind Aaron Rodgers, then he comes here and gets beat out by a once in a generation player (say what you want, but all the personnel guys are looking for the next RW in the draft, and all they are going to do is confirm that height issues negate most QB's chances unless you are truly special). I can't blame the guy for being a bit bitter, but Hawkblogger's account actually confirms the opposite.

 

[Hawks46]

One other point, several mentions in this thread of Flynn not "helping Wilson out" with game planning and getting in the film room.

From all accounts, Wilson was off the charts in that area. How do you help a guy out that A. doesn't need the help, and B. is light years ahead of anyone in his preparation and work ethic ?

Just curious what folks think Flynn could've done to help Wilson out. I also saw tempered excitement from Flynn on the sidelines, but you really can't blame the guy; this was going to be his big chance. Sure, he can go elsewhere, but this team is special and going places, and he had to know that.

 

[Hasselbeck]

I think Wilson's work ethic is so rare and unheard of that he would make a LOT of veteran QB's look bad, aside from probably the Manning's and Brady..

 

[Killa Kam]

Hawkblogger had a good article about this. I wish I had the link, but basically he was saying that none of the QBs started out very good, but at the beginning of TC, Jackson still looked like Jackson, Flynn was looking good and Wilson still looked overwhelmed.

Basically, Flynn won over the locker room, and the guys started pulling for Flynn, but going back to all Pete's pressers, he rarely mentioned Flynn, and gushed about Wilson when asked. Hawkblogger got the distinct impression that the team never really wanted Flynn to win the starting position, even though they brought him in for that job, after Wilson started to impress with his intangibles. This is an educated guess (more than any of us have) gained on insight Hawkblogger gained while watching all the practices, talking to the coaches after said practices, and the aforementioned cool attitude towards Flynn in pressers.

The one caveat is that nowhere in Hawkblogger's article was mentioned Flynn's tendinitis...which really brings us to two conclusions: there was never any tendinitis and Pete came up with that to save Flynn face, or that Hawkblogger's theory was hingeing on more speculation than he let on.

Either way, Flynn's luck has been pretty poor in his career: he gets stuck behind an inferior QB in Jamarcus Russell that Les Miles loved for physical intangibles but we all know he was a box of rocks upstairs....then he gets drafted and sits behind Aaron Rodgers, then he comes here and gets beat out by a once in a generation player (say what you want, but all the personnel guys are looking for the next RW in the draft, and all they are going to do is confirm that height issues negate most QB's chances unless you are truly special). I can't blame the guy for being a bit bitter, but Hawkblogger's account actually confirms the opposite.

Is Hawkblogger really that connected with the team, regarding his sources? How would he know who the team was rallying behind..

 

[General Manager]

I thought they should have retained him for 1 more season but he's gone he won't be back it's time to move on Flynn plays for the Raiders now.

 

[Scottemojo]

During the season last year, the insider for the Packers from the Milwaukee paper said that our staff was not impressed with Flynn's work ethic. I think it was in the days just before the Monday night Packer game.

HawkBlogger rode Flynns jock for a long time, and following the first Rams game published a piece using snapshots from that game to make Wilson look like he couldn't see open receivers. It was a bullshit piece with an agenda. I don't take a lot of what he says seriously now just because he rode that agenda in the face of real evidence.

 

[kearly]

Scanner: I think you are reading too much into this, but the truth is: I don't know. And you don't know. We can only speculate. This is more in the realm of opinion than fact.

You don't go from a 7th round pick to the NFL's best backup without busting some tail.

Now, lets say he really was slacking (in relative terms) this past year. Can you really blame him? He lost his chance at a starting job to arguably the most unprecedented rookie phenom in NFL history. By the end of the 3rd preseason game, he knew that he'd never be a starter in Seattle. You could see it on his face. He knew it. Where is the motivation to put in insane amounts of work when you know you're destined to be traded anyway. He could have spent every waking moment at the VMAC and it wouldn't have done anything to create an impression on his next employer.

I think the reason Seattle traded Flynn was because he was expensive, because they wanted a read-option backup, and because they felt Matt Flynn deserved better than to be a career backup. I don't think work habits factored. Not even a little. But that is only my opinion, and nothing more.

 

[kearly]

HawkBlogger rode Flynns jock for a long time, and following the first Rams game published a piece using snapshots from that game to make Wilson look like he couldn't see open receivers. It was a bullshit piece with an agenda. I don't take a lot of what he says seriously now just because he rode that agenda in the face of real evidence.

Wow, I'm glad I'm on your good side. Tell us how you really feel. :lol: :th2thumbs:

I actually liked that article, Wilson DID show signs of not seeing the field last season, especially early on, but obviously he was still a wonderful QB despite that flaw.

You are right though, his agenda pushing got way out of control for a few months there. You are dead on about his twisting logic and denying obvious inconvenient facts. If Matt Flynn was a Republican and Russell Wilson a Democrat, Hawkblogger would have been Sean Hannity. The whole episode really damaged his reputation and probably his traffic. Which is pretty strange, since he was one of the bigger Wilson supporters even before the NFL draft.

 

[scutterhawk]

We'll probably never really know what Flynn did or didn't do during his time in Seattle. But if he was frustrated he didn't make it public. He didn't cause a distraction that a young team did not need. And for that I wish him well.

You bet.
It had to be disappointing for Flynn to KNOW that he could come in (in case of injury), but that Russell Wilson would have been placed right back on the gridiron as soon as physically able.
Tough to be a die hard competitor, knowing that you'd only be considered as a stop gap.
Hard for a Quarterback that knows he's good enough to be a starter on most Teams in the NFL, and just stand aside and watch someone else live out your dreams.
I honestly do wish the guy luck as he sure as hell will need it in Raiderville.

 

[nbk35zw]

Let's please stop this. Flynn works for the Raiders now. Seattle was 30 seconds from the NFC Championship game last year. Please move on. Let's leave the speculation to the upcoming draft. All this negativity after a fantastic year is a downer.