If Seattle loses all games before BYE

[Spin Doctor]

If memory serves me,

Geno Smith did not beat out Drew Lock for the starting QB position.
Drew Lock acquired Covid, and was forbidden to compete for the position that season.

Lock played most of the preseason. He threw a stinker in the second game where he threw multiple picks. He caught Covid a few days after. He wasn’t out for too long in that competition.

 

[Dvl Dug]

Lock played most of the preseason. He threw a stinker in the second game where he threw multiple picks. He caught Covid a few days after. He wasn’t out for too long in that competition.

Spin Doctor,

Sorry, I was wrong & you were right. I just found the stats for those interested. Hope this comes across well.

 

[rcaido]

The thing is Geno didn't win the competition, Drew lost it. The first week Drew threw 2 TDs and Geno didn't even have a TD the whole preseason. Drew got Covid and missed week 2. Week 3 came along, he had a miserable game. Pete hates Tos and Drew threw 3int in that game. Drew probably tried to force more due to being the last game of the preseason, maybe not even recoverd from Covid. When i watched Drew play, he was more exciting and really slinged it but careless. Geno was pretty much ho hum but didn't make any mistakes.

 

[AgentDib]

Preseason stats should not be compared between individual players for two reasons.

First, the opposing player talent is all over the board; one guy could be playing against NFL starters and another could be playing against players who were out of the league completely within that month. Unless you go through and account for that the resulting information is going to be highly misleading.

Second, the vanilla schemes in the preseason are nothing like regular season football. Football IQ is one of the key attributes for success in the NFL, which is why preseason heroes don't necessarily translate to successful players on Sundays. There's a very long list of great athletes who couldn't handle the complexity of professional football.

The Hawks have an enormous amount of information about both Geno and Drew from working closely with them for multiple years now. A very, very, very tiny percentage of that total information is the few dozen attempts each player had in the 2022 preseason.

 

[RiverDog]

Keep in mind that performance in preseason games are just one of the measuring sticks used in a 'competition' for a starting job. As @AgentDib points out, there are too many irregularities in preseason games to use them as a fair yardstick. That doesn't mean that they completely ignore preseason performances, just that it's not used as a gold standard.

A good example is the preseason game vs. Pittsburgh last season. Lock missed an obvious blitz to his blind side then did not do a head check as he took a 5-step drop. No adjustments were made, and the linebacker blitzed unchecked and delivered a strip sack on the unsuspecting Lock, resulting in a turnover. Those are the types of things that coaches will use from a preseason game.

There are also performances in practices, informal scrimmages, their mastery of the playbook, etc., that we don't see that coaches will use to evaluate players. It's not only about what happens in a game situation.

 

[Dvl Dug]

Keep in mind that performance in preseason games are just one of the measuring sticks used in a 'competition' for a starting job. As @AgentDib points out, there are too many irregularities in preseason games to use them as a fair yardstick. That doesn't mean that they completely ignore preseason performances, just that it's not used as a gold standard.

A good example is the preseason game vs. Pittsburgh last season. Lock missed an obvious blitz to his blind side then did not do a head check as he took a 5-step drop. No adjustments were made, and the linebacker blitzed unchecked and delivered a strip sack on the unsuspecting Lock, resulting in a turnover. Those are the types of things that coaches will use from a preseason game.

There are also performances in practices, informal scrimmages, their mastery of the playbook, etc., that we don't see that coaches will use to evaluate players. It's not only about what happens in a game situation.

RiverDog,

Your points are good ones, but WR Bobo was clearly open for a large gain in the middle of the field in the second quarter, possibly for a TD, and Geno Smith elected not to throw. Geno ran out of bounds.

I'm just saying that Drew Lock passes have that straight trajectory that every rifleman loves. Geno Smith doesn't have that arm strength, so Geno wisely pulled out of it.

Quarterbacks need playing time to sharpen their minds. Sort of speed up the decision making process. My gut feeling is that Drew Lock would be the better quarterback given that playing time, with the number ones.

The only way to find out, is to prepare Drew Lock for about 2 weeks, and then put him out there on the field.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Last year PC was in the running for coach of the year, and Geno won comebak player of the year. One game later and everyone about getting rid of both of them. If we are 0-4 at the bye questions need ot be asked why that is the case. If it is down to drafting / trades there is nothing we can do about it until the offseason anyway. If it is down to coaching, we need to ask why the coaching is so much worse than last season can Pete learn from the losses or did he turn from a great coach to a has been in 8 months? If it is Geno, again why is he so much worse than last year?

I doubt we could get much of an improvement at QB mid season, we could try Lock (or even Ahlers) out but I think we have seen enough to know that is very unlikely to succeed. Who would we get in a trade? What would we need to give up to get someone like Brissett and would that be an upgrade on Geno?

I can't see Pete going before the end of the season or at least the effective end of the season when the playoffs are impossible. Most likely he would be allowed to "Retire" so he can save face after a brilliant tenure overall.

The NFL is pure show me what you have done lately league I and anyone with a braincell can give a **** about 5-10 years ago unless you're Belichichest and he's close to the curb himself trust that. Last year was a pure illusion that only delayed the truth and we are coming back to the mean thank you Jesus.

 

[Dvl Dug]

The NFL is pure show me what you have done lately league I and anyone with a braincell can give a **** about 5-10 years ago unless you're Belichichest and he's close to the curb himself trust that. Last year was a pure illusion that only delayed the truth and we are coming back to the mean thank you Jesus.

I'll answer that by re-posting my earlier comment:

Since the draft, my thought was that this team was going to have a hard beginning to the season. First reason being the all new defensive line that has never played together before. Second reason being the two undersized NT's right up the middle. That said, I'll go with...

No - On the mid season coaching change.
When Pete Carroll first came to Seattle from USC, my observation was that he seemed to have an advantage in bringing in good young talent, and mainly because he had a better understanding of who all the good players in the PAC-12 Conference were at the time. Pete had either coached them, or coached against them all, first hand. Fast forward to today, and I'd like to see the Hawks kind of replicate that formula again by bringing in a championship caliber coach from the SEC, but acquiring one of those coaches mid season is not going to happen.

Yes - On a possible quarterback change.
Geno Smith's game one 112 yard performance just about made me want to vomit. Granted we lost both starting offensive tackles to begin the second half, and everybody knew the Rams pass rush was FULL ON at that point, but no effective dump off passes to running backs? Maybe his TD to INT ratio is good, but people who site that statistic forget about all of Geno's fumbles last season. Drew Lock is at least worth taking a look if at some point it becomes obvious the Hawks just are not a post season caliber team; he's more mature now, and his pre-season performance was good.

Iffy - On a mid season DC change.
Clint Hurtt is a very likeable football personality & he's a really good speaker, but I don't like his frail 3-4 scheme, and the beginning to his career as a Defensive Coordinator has been painful to watch. Giving up 426 yards at home, to a Rams team without Cooper Kupp, and a bunch of no-name players on their roster was really bad. I know it's generally considered seasonal suicide to change schemes mid season, and I don't know who else might be available out there, but if you can't get the personnel for this scheme after two years then my feeling is you have to go another direction.

Yeah, I know DC wasn't one of the questions being asked. I just wanted to toss it in there anyways. That's my brain on !

 

[RiverDog]

RiverDog,

Your points are good ones, but WR Bobo was clearly open for a large gain in the middle of the field in the second quarter, possibly for a TD, and Geno Smith elected not to throw. Geno ran out of bounds.

I'm just saying that Drew Lock passes have that straight trajectory that every rifleman loves. Geno Smith doesn't have that arm strength, so he wisely pulled out of it.

Quarterbacks need playing time to sharpen their minds. Sort of speed up the decision making process. My gut feeling is that Drew Lock would be the better quarterback given that playing time, with the number ones.

The only way to find out, is to prepare Drew Lock for about 2 weeks, and then put him out there on the field.

Geno does not have a problem with arm strength. Last season, Geno led the league in efficiency on passes of 20+ yards. You don't do that with a sub-par arm.

Next Gen Stats' top 10 NFL deep passers of 2022: Geno Smith, Tua Tagovailoa excel at airing it out

Was anyone better at throwing downfield than the Seahawks' Geno Smith in 2022? Nick Shook uses Next Gen Stats to identify the top 10 deep passers from last season.

www.nfl.com

Besides, arm strength ranks down the list of desirable attributes for a quarterback. A quick release, good footwork, and decision making/reading defenses are all attributes that rank above arm strength. The fact that Lock has a little better, or even a lot better, arm strength is not a good reason to start him over Geno.

You may get your wish regarding Lock. I just saw where Cross has been ruled out of Sunday's game with the Lions, meaning that we'll be without our two starting offensive tackles. Geno played poorly in the 2nd half last weekend when both those guys were out, and if he continues to play poorly, we may be looking at a quarterback change down the road. But this is still Geno's team, and I have the feeling that Pete's going to ride with him come hell or high water.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

I'll answer that by re-posting my earlier comment:

Since the draft, my thought was that this team was going to have a hard beginning to the season. First reason being the all new defensive line that has never played together before. Second reason being the two undersized NT's right up the middle. That said, I'll go with...

No - On the mid season coaching change.
When Pete Carroll first came to Seattle from USC, my observation was that he seemed to have an advantage in bringing in good young talent, and mainly because he had a better understanding of who all the good players in the PAC-12 Conference were at the time. Pete had either coached them, or coached against them all, first hand. Fast forward to today, and I'd like to see the Hawks kind of replicate that formula again by bringing in a championship caliber coach from the SEC, but acquiring one of those coaches mid season is not going to happen.

Yes - On a possible quarterback change.
Geno Smith's game one 112 yard performance just about made me want to vomit. Granted we lost both starting offensive tackles to begin the second half, and everybody knew the Rams pass rush was FULL ON at that point, but no effective dump off passes to running backs? Maybe his TD to INT ratio is good, but people who site that statistic forget about all of Geno's fumbles last season. Drew Lock is at least worth taking a look if at some point it becomes obvious the Hawks just are not a post season caliber team; he's more mature now, and his pre-season performance was good.

Iffy - On a mid season DC change.
Clint Hurtt is a very likeable football personality & he's a really good speaker, but I don't like his frail 3-4 scheme, and the beginning to his career as a Defensive Coordinator has been painful to watch. Giving up 426 yards at home, to a Rams team without Cooper Kupp, and a bunch of no-name players on their roster was really bad. I know it's generally considered seasonal suicide to change schemes mid season, and I don't know who else might be available out there, but if you can't get the personnel for this scheme after two years then my feeling is you have to go another direction.

Yeah, I know DC wasn't one of the questions being asked. I just wanted to toss it in there anyways. That's my brain on !

TLTR. but I got your message problem is Pete h hasn't.

1. Pete has far too much power that needs to end immediately.
2. JS needs to stop just receiving checks and do his job immediately and start drafting actual quarterbacks.
3. Jody needs to stop living off her brothers money and do as he said.
4. Pete needs to die so I can not hate him in a murderous way.
5. We need to hire as coach sometime offensively minded and hopefully younger that understands the current NFL.
6. Please hire an actual DC.
7. Have an actual F0 without some 71 year old meglamanic running everything with nobody checking his senile ass.
8. A real GM would help.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

It's not about a talent deficiency it's all about the organization and the coaches and said philosophy and actual coaching.

 

[Dvl Dug]

TLTR. but I got your message problem is Pete h hasn't.

1. Pete has far too much power that needs to end immediately.
2. JS needs to stop just receiving checks and do his job immediately and start drafting actual quarterbacks.
3. Jody needs to stop living off her brothers money and do as he said.
4. Pete needs to die so I can not hate him in a murderous way.
5. We need to hire as coach sometime offensively minded and hopefully younger that understands the current NFL.
6. Please hire an actual DC.
7. Have an actual F0 without some 71 year old meglamanic running everything with nobody checking his senile ass.
8. A real GM would help.

Agree, but I'm sticking to my position of obtaining a winning SEC coach once this season is over.

By the way, have you taken a look at this front office lately?
Seahawks site, Management tab, up top in the black tabs area, not the green ones below.

They all speak Microsoft.
Tell me how many of those people speak winning football?

(I counted zero)

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Agree, but I'm sticking to my position of obtaining a winning SEC coach once this season is over.

By the way, have you taken a look at this front office lately?
Seahawks site, Management tab, up top in the black tabs area, not the green ones below.

They all speak Microsoft.
Tell me how many of those people speak winning football?

(I counted zero)

I don't have alot time to keep up on the Seahawks I really count on the people I trust here that really talk football and Rob Stanton given at this point I know far more about the AFC given I live in Chiefs Kingdom ground central.

 

[RiverDog]

Agree, but I'm sticking to my position of obtaining a winning SEC coach once this season is over.

There aren't very many college coaches who have found success in the NFL. Pete is one of the few. Just recently, Matt Rhule, Kliff Kingsbury, and Urban Meyer are former college HC's and all got fired within a short period of time. If we do make a coaching change, I'd rather go with a good OC, someone like Eric Bieniemy or Brian Callahan.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

But I follow riverDog and a few others for real information and analysis here.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

There aren't very many college coaches who have found success in the NFL. Pete is one of the few. Just recently, Matt Rhule, Kliff Kingsbury, and Urban Meyer are former college HC's and all got fired within a short period of time. If we do make a coaching change, I'd rather go with a good OC, someone like Eric Bieniemy or Brian Callahan.

Agreed. See why I listen to just a select few?

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Agreed. See why I listen to just a select few? River and myself rarely agree but I respect people that know their stuff.

 

[RiverDog]

But I follow riverDog and a few others for real information and analysis here.

Thanks, my friend! Flattery will get you everywhere!

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Just think of me as Gwen...I'm just a girl an ordinary American girl.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Thanks, my friend! Flattery will get you everywhere!

You are very infuriating sometimes but you and a few others keep me in the loop. I'm sure I'm the very same for many of you here also so it's even.