DT Malik McDowell expected to be released

[UK_Seahawk]

http://seahawksdraftblog.com/seahawks-meeting-with-malik-mcdowell-obi-melifonwu

Holy crap, if we got Obi that would be awesome and I know there are many here who would be just as excited. Bring him here please.

He's on ir at the raiders. Are you ok?

 

[original poster]

Nobody on this forum knows if we can go after part of the signing bonus or not. Unless I am wrong in my belief that someone here read the contract. We simply don’t know what was / wasn’t excluded and none of the articles that I have read confirms either that this was an allowed / non allowed activity

Yes we do

Here are 3 reasons within the CBA that grant a team permission to seek return of a signing bonus -

• The failure to report
  pass physical tests
  sustain good moral character

Malik is shit out of luck on the last two.

The Collective Bargaining Agreement is very clear about rookie contracts and really doesn't give either teams nor players much wiggle room or even loop holes. They have covered every possible eventuality.

 

[HawkGA]

I don’t get why there is all this negativity.

No team has a perfect drafting record and that is why teams at the bottom tend to stay near the bottom as they swing and miss on critical draft picks or can’t keep those they were right about. Imagine the differences that would be available for the Browns if they’d got just one of their gazillion first round QB picks right. They simply should have gone and traded for one that was proven and picked other positions instead of creating a culture of failure.

Calgary’s observation though is quite apt and the many early round picks traded away for players not here anymore (Harvin, Graham, and Richardson) that the team had to pay big money to is now showing as the draft record shows little in the way of consistent early round drafting. Schneider (read Pete) needs to stop swinging for the fence and to draft for the development of the team. The worst part of these three lousy deals is it also created cap problems and the players acquired aren’t around anymore whereas quality early picks may just still be as the team created cap space to keep them. Those missing draft picks could easily have been busts but each would have offered a cheaper smarter longer term solution to some positional needs. Maybe some would have been busts but they may not have cost the stupid money given to those three. All three of those picks and few other poor choices have created the cap mess they are trying to clear up by ridding the team of several expensive players who perhaps weren’t completely all in and had a a different agenda than that of the team. It’s time to get back to picking the best player rather than picking for need.

I frankly don’t fault the FO for the McDowell pick b/c he could have been and might still eventually become a high quality DLineman. The sad part is the team was high on him until he screwed up by taking a stupid youthful dangerous risk. Was this b/c of his character, or b/c he was young and dumb? Who are the other significant character risks besides Harvin who double whammied the FO and Clark who has proven to be complete success and worth far more than his draft position? Let’s identify all these character flawed players that have lead to the downfall of the team due to the negligence of the FO

Placing the blame for this injury to McDowell by blaming the FO for drafting him b/c he was character flawed and “they repeatedly ignore character issues” is genuine hypebole and in reality untrue. It also fails to recognize this young man was very young and still immature but was/is Uber talented as a DLineman with exceptional athletic ability. Perhaps he was a swing for the fence, but one many draft experts thought was a pick with good value. Shortly after of course he cracked his coconut and the front office was of course foolish, shortsighted, exemplifying their disregard for character. Clearly if this young man is cut and never plays a down that sucks and the pick was a mistake when the margin for error had been made very narrow by other more structural mistakes and the trifecta of dumb draft pick then overpaying for experienced players trades. The pick was a mistake but that is only presently clear in hindsight his character had little to do with him possibly fracturing his skull, his youthful I’m bullet proof stupidly certainly did. His nightclub arrogance displayed when he should have been invisible and recovering has done more to create a more negative impression on him than I feel anything to do with his accident other than he isn’t being transparent.

My comments here and above are not directed at any poster but rather at being correct and assigning blame where it is correctly due. McDowell caused the problem and may have thrown away a potentially successful career by being young and dumb and perhaps unlucky. That wasn’t Schneider’s fault, or Pete’s or anyone other than McDowell’s.

We here and perhaps even the team even now still don’t know the details of this ATV accident, how and what precisely happened. We don’t know what precisely the injury was, how it needed to be treated, what the timing of full recovery will be, or if full recovery is even possible. He suffered a very extreme concussion is all I know for sure. I suspect the bonus claw back potential is keeping McDowell’s side quiet, but the team is very close to being fed up and starting to think it’s time to move on. McDowell’s representation has misplayed this situation. Something for nothing doesn’t sell even with all the raw potential of this player.

I clearly am not blaming the FO but it does suck and is a darn shame.

I think this is definitely a case of the well being poisoned with bad decisions in the past. While this is unfortunate, have a second round pick flame out isn't the worst thing in the world and does happen occasionally. Him being the team's first pick of the year doesn't help either. But more importantly, coming on the heals of, what, 3 or 4 bad drafts and bad decisions in a row? This one stands out. The Harvin decision was still a much, much worse decision than this one. The Graham one wasn't a particularly good decision either (but that was more the offense's fault than the front office's).

I mean, this is the team that drafted somebody (not as high) who had a heart condition and never played. These things can happen but they should be fairly random and not happen all the time.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

This is what happens when you rePETEdly ignore red flags!

Good riddance to another loser IMO.

Yes cause his red flags also consisted of his propensity to ride atv's without a helmet.............

Red flags were there on poor judgement, immaturity, and lack of commitment. One NFL exec. claimed "it was worst interview he's ever done". That is exactly what happened with him....but defend away.

+1

There's nothing to defend. Asserting that an ATV accident is foreseeable from all that is just pure scapegoat mentality.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Yeah, the front office should have known he was going to jump on an ATV and get injured and basically ruin his career :roll:
Time to move on, it's over with this guy.

 

[Seymour]

Nobody on this forum knows if we can go after part of the signing bonus or not. Unless I am wrong in my belief that someone here read the contract. We simply don’t know what was / wasn’t excluded and none of the articles that I have read confirms either that this was an allowed / non allowed activity

Cap impact will be tied to that contract language

Although true that we don't know for sure what was in his contract, his injury was Not Football Related, so unless they had seriously poor contract writing, it's likely that they can get some of the cap room back. The issue though, is that we don't know if they will want to. This organization with this front office has been consistent about doing the players a solid on the way out the door, so even if they can (which is more than likely the case) they very well may not go after that Signing bonus. That type of good will goes a long ways in negotiations with other players you want to bring in.

Difference being he wasn't a player. He was a poser that never played an NFL down, and he has himself to blame for that.

 

[Popeyejones]

I don’t get why there is all this negativity.

I think there's two things that are causing all the negativity:

(1) PC/JS having what I think is really a historically impressive draft run from 2010-2012, which coincided with them taking over the franchise, and for (some? many?) fans set expectations way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way too high moving forward.

(2) PC/JS having what has been a comparatively incredibly poor draft run from 2013 through 2017, and even more so when you consider the picks they've given up in trade and what they've gotten from those trades.

#1 compounds the the disappointment about #2.

So, people are super-negative about McDowell not because of McDowell, but because he's symbolic of five years major draft misses that have only been punctuated by very occasional hits.

I think our evidence for this is another first round bust the Seahawks have had: James Carpenter. That was a wasted pick in 2011, but it was surrounded by so many homerun picks from 2010-2012 that nobody really thinks or cares about it.

Yet because McDowell was a wasted pick who is surrounded by a bunch of other wasted picks, he "stands in" for that general feeling.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

My gut on this tells me that he incurred some sort of brain damage and it may have affected one or more of his motor skills. He might not run as fast. He could have poor balance. His situational thought processing may have slowed down.

The whole thing about letting other team's doctors clear him to play, and allowing him to come back and play on another team, maybe as the next Aaron Donald, that just makes zero sense.

I'd bet my bottom dollar that he has some permanent damage and he is no longer anywhere close to being the athlete he was a year ago.

It doesn't have to be this serious.

This is football, it can be as simple as serious concussion + facial fractures = no doctor in his right mind would medically clear McDowell to smash his head into 300 lb men running at full speed for the next 10 years.

 

[RCATES]

I don’t get why there is all this negativity.

.

It's really quite simple. Hawks had 2 legit starting Offensive Tackles on the board for the taking when they got cute again and traded out. They then did what most teams won't and went after a player with a troubled back round and a semi head case. This pick now has pissed away 3x 2nd round picks and a 5th. 1 2nd for the Richardson trade, 1 2nd and a 5th for the Brown trade which wouldn't have happened if you stayed put in the 1st round and drafted a tackle. And obviously another 2nd for Malik being a dumbass which other teams clearly knew and stayed away from. All of these events were directly because of the Malik pick and injury. With how god awful JS and been in the last few drafts you simply can't afford to give away 3x 2nd rounders.

 

[Seymour]

I don’t get why there is all this negativity.

I think there's two things that are causing all the negativity:

(1) PC/JS having what I think is really a historically impressive draft run from 2010-2012, which coincided with them taking over the franchise, and for (some? many?) fans set expectations way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way too high moving forward.

(2) PC/JS having what has been a comparatively incredibly poor draft run from 2013 through 2017, and even more so when you consider the picks they've given up in trade and what they've gotten from those trades.

#1 compounds the the disappointment about #2.

So, people are super-negative about McDowell not because of McDowell, but because he's symbolic of five years major draft misses that have only been punctuated by very occasional hits.

I think our evidence for this is another first round bust the Seahawks have had: James Carpenter. That was a wasted pick in 2011, but it was surrounded by so many homerun picks from 2010-2012 that nobody really thinks or cares about it.

Yet because McDowell was a wasted pick who is surrounded by a bunch of other wasted picks, he "stands in" for that general feeling.

Bingo. In less words. The McDowell pick represents a very poor trend in our recent drafting process and the ultimate downfall of the team hanging on with too many aging overpaid vets IMO.

 

[RCATES]

I don’t get why there is all this negativity.

I think there's two things that are causing all the negativity:

(1) PC/JS having what I think is really a historically impressive draft run from 2010-2012, which coincided with them taking over the franchise, and for (some? many?) fans set expectations way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way too high moving forward.

(2) PC/JS having what has been a comparatively incredibly poor draft run from 2013 through 2017, and even more so when you consider the picks they've given up in trade and what they've gotten from those trades.

#1 compounds the the disappointment about #2.

So, people are super-negative about McDowell not because of McDowell, but because he's symbolic of five years major draft misses that have only been punctuated by very occasional hits.

I think our evidence for this is another first round bust the Seahawks have had: James Carpenter. That was a wasted pick in 2011, but it was surrounded by so many homerun picks from 2010-2012 that nobody really thinks or cares about it.

Yet because McDowell was a wasted pick who is surrounded by a bunch of other wasted picks, he "stands in" for that general feeling.

Bingo. In less words. The McDowell pick represents a very poor trend in our recent drafting process and the ultimate downfall of the team hanging on with too many aging overpaid vets IMO.

This is why I'm so angry. In just one year this team has fallen off the map. The injuries hurt but the FO has been even worse the last 3 years. Bad Drafts, Bad Contracts, Hanging onto coaches too long. Just like that the Seahawks window has been slammed shut.

 

[hawknation2018]

(2) PC/JS having what has been a comparatively incredibly poor draft run from 2013 through 2017, and even more so when you consider the picks they've given up in trade and what they've gotten from those trades.

That's incorrect. If you actually evaluate those drafts by expectation, as measured by Approximate Value, the 2015, 2016, and 2017 drafts were all ABOVE AVERAGE in comparison to the rest of the league.

Taken as a whole, the Carroll/Schneider Seahawks regime has been "the best talent evaluator of the past 21 years."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fan ... t-20-years

 

[TwistedHusky]

First, there is getting to be a pile of evidence that the 'homeruns' might have been hit by someone else. If Cleveland turns into a winning team in 2-3 years, we will know this to be true. Scott might just be a GM's best friend.

Second, please don't conflate Clark's issues with MM. Clark was red flagged because of a checkered past and some accusations of violence. We WANT our defensive players violent, just ideally on field not off. But guys with work ethic or commitment to the game issues rarely work out for anyone, and when they do they rarely become stars. So those are bigger risks and it was stupid to take that risk - especially for a freaking DT that we did not need when we desperately needed players at other positions.

It was a bad decision.

And considering our track record on drafting, not a one off. We have not drafted well in years. MM is just another indicator of this.

And bad drafting combined with bad FA decisions is what assured this team would never live up to its promise. We had a great team for 2 years, both SB runs. But every other year this team underperformed and was overrated at the start of every year. It was a wildcard team sliding into being a team that does not even make the playoffs.

One draft pick would not have changed that, but this new failure was as close to an indicator that they won't be able to turn the ship around as you can get.

If you cannot draft well and you cannot make good FA decisions then you better have coaches that fantastic tactically. We don't so all the MM failure points out is that this team isn't going to be better for a while. Because with our system, you cannot get better without better players.

 

[Chapow]

(2) PC/JS having what has been a comparatively incredibly poor draft run from 2013 through 2017, and even more so when you consider the picks they've given up in trade and what they've gotten from those trades.

That's incorrect. If you actually evaluate those drafts by expectation, as measured by Approximate Value, the 2015, 2016, and 2017 drafts were all ABOVE AVERAGE in comparison to the rest of the league.

Taken as a whole, the Carroll/Schneider Seahawks regime has been "the best talent evaluator of the past 21 years."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fan ... t-20-years

There's also this.

https://www.fieldgulls.com/2018/3/8/170 ... ade-rumors

And I do believe that for a lot of fans, there's a lot of truth to this.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

The "12s" are a bunch of spoiled whining babies. That's no secret.

 

[Popeyejones]

(2) PC/JS having what has been a comparatively incredibly poor draft run from 2013 through 2017, and even more so when you consider the picks they've given up in trade and what they've gotten from those trades.

That's incorrect. If you actually evaluate those drafts by expectation, as measured by Approximate Value, the 2015, 2016, and 2017 drafts were all ABOVE AVERAGE in comparison to the rest of the league.

Taken as a whole, the Carroll/Schneider Seahawks regime has been "the best talent evaluator of the past 21 years."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fan ... t-20-years

1) Nowhere in your link does it say that 2015-2017 are well above average in comparison to the rest of the league. In summarizing the Hawks' draft hits in that article there's not even mention of a single player who has been drafted since 2012.

2) Nobody disputes the insanity of the Hawks' 2010-2012 draft run -- in the post your responding to I even called it historic (I'd have to go back through to decide if I think it's the best draft run in the history of the NFL, but it's *easily* in the conversation for that).

I also don't dispute that the 2010-2012 run was so historically dominant that it even makes 2010-2017 look exceptional overall (the same thing is gonna happens with the Saints and their 2017 draft, which is gonna inflate their baseline average draft numbers across years for a loooong time). 2010-2012 was really that good dude.

If you wanna have a debate about draft success over the last five drafts though, you can't shove 2010-2012 into the data because not a single person in the world debates how much the Hawks crushed those drafts.

(FWIW I'm not interested in spending the time on a debate about if the Hawks haven't drafted very well from 2013-2016 (and maybe 17, we're still waiting) -- if you think I'm a jerk for thinking that, I'm cool with it).

 

[kobebryant]

I do hope for his sake that he gets his health back and can lead a normal(ish) life, and if he can play football again even better. I think we all did things in our early 20s that we regret and would like to have a do-over on. I really really hope he can get his life back on track, this is just sad all the way around.

 

[RCATES]

I do hope for his sake that he gets his health back and can lead a normal(ish) life, and if he can play football again even better. I think we all did things in our early 20s that we regret and would like to have a do-over on. I really really hope he can get his life back on track, this is just sad all the way around.

I find it difficult to be compassionate for this kid especially after his latest arrest. The day you were drafted and got that big payday your life changes as well as the activities surrounding it. NFL career's are short and you have to make the most of it and take care of your body and be smart with the choice's you make. No excuses this kid was a moron to jump on a quad with no helmet when he had a NFL career lined up for him with millions of dollars on the line.

 

[hawknation2018]

(2) PC/JS having what has been a comparatively incredibly poor draft run from 2013 through 2017, and even more so when you consider the picks they've given up in trade and what they've gotten from those trades.

That's incorrect. If you actually evaluate those drafts by expectation, as measured by Approximate Value, the 2015, 2016, and 2017 drafts were all ABOVE AVERAGE in comparison to the rest of the league.

Taken as a whole, the Carroll/Schneider Seahawks regime has been "the best talent evaluator of the past 21 years."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fan ... t-20-years

1) Nowhere in your link does it say that 2015-2017 are well above average in comparison to the rest of the league. In summarizing the Hawks' draft hits in that article there's not even mention of a single player who has been drafted since 2012.

2) Nobody disputes the insanity of the Hawks' 2010-2012 draft run -- in the post your responding to I even called it historic (I'd have to go back through to decide if I think it's the best draft run in the history of the NFL, but it's *easily* in the conversation for that).

I also don't dispute that the 2010-2012 run was so historically dominant that it even makes 2010-2017 look exceptional overall (the same thing is gonna happens with the Saints and their 2017 draft, which is gonna inflate their baseline average draft numbers across years for a loooong time). 2010-2012 was really that good dude.

If you wanna have a debate about draft success over the last five drafts though, you can't shove 2010-2012 into the data because not a single person in the world debates how much the Hawks crushed those drafts.

(FWIW I'm not interested in spending the time on a debate about if the Hawks haven't drafted very well from 2013-2016 (and maybe 17, we're still waiting) -- if you think I'm a jerk for thinking that, I'm cool with it).

No, I just think you're uninformed on the topic. If you use Approximate Value, the 2015, 2016, and 2017 Seahawks drafts have each exceeded expectations.

Follow the link:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics ... 550c11ea98

 

[kobebryant]

I do hope for his sake that he gets his health back and can lead a normal(ish) life, and if he can play football again even better. I think we all did things in our early 20s that we regret and would like to have a do-over on. I really really hope he can get his life back on track, this is just sad all the way around.

I find it difficult to be compassionate for this kid

And you're well within your rights not to feel any compassion for him.