Geno and the Super Bowl

[Rainger]

I don’t think Geno can or will win a Super Bowl., unless everything runs perfect, see Dilfer winning a SB.

I’d love for Geno to prove me wrong and cause me to shut my big fat yapper though.

I would love that too and it will happen this year!

 

[knownone]

Seattle could absolutely win a title with Geno.

We saw last season that he's capable of putting together a Joe Flacco-esque hot streak. Why couldn't he do that in the playoffs? Yeah. It's unlikely. But he has the talent in him and around him to succeed.

 

[Lagartixa]

Troy Aikman. Most overrated SB QB ever. Give him last years Seahawks, and they win 6 games. He was a game manager

I dislike Aikman and his broadcast partner Joe (Dum)B(f)uck, but as a player, Aikman was a top-five QB for five years (1991-1995, his age-25 through age-29 seasons) and top-ten for 1991-1996 plus 1998, and not far from it for 1997.
During his athletic-peak years, Aikman was one of the most efficient QBs in the NFL. In 1993, he was the most efficient QB in the league. I haven't looked into how strong Aikman's HoF case was (just glancing at his career numbers and stuff now, I'd say it was probably on the weak side), but he was actually a pretty effective QB. In 1997, when Aikman's efficiency was below where it was in 1991-95 and 1998, he was still an above-average NFL QB.

 

[Mick063]

I dislike Aikman and his broadcast partner Joe (Dum)B(f)uck, but as a player, Aikman was a top-five QB for five years (1991-1995, his age-25 through age-29 seasons) and top-ten for 1991-1996 plus 1998, and not far from it for 1997.
During his athletic-peak years, Aikman was one of the most efficient QBs in the NFL. In 1993, he was the most efficient QB in the league. I haven't looked into how strong Aikman's HoF case was (just glancing at his career numbers and stuff now, I'd say it was probably on the weak side), but he was actually a pretty effective QB. In 1997, when Aikman's efficiency was below where it was in 1991-95 and 1998, he was still an above-average NFL QB.

Aikman won Super Bowls. It is the measuring stick. If it were not, Brady would have some serious GOAT competition, no one would give a crap about "Terry Bradshaw's money", and Marino/Fouts would be regarded much, much higher. I don't necessarily agree with it as the definitive measure, but it is obviously the measure that NFL nation uses. Take away Aikman's rings and he would be an afterthought. Like Bert Jones. Now that was an exciting, damn good quarterback, with no rings. Give Aikman's rings to Bert Jones and we would be talking about him in the same breath as Joe Montana.

 

[WarHawks]

This is Geno's make or break year. Another one and done, and we will be drafting a qbotf.

 

[Mick063]

This is Geno's make or break year. Another one and done, and we will be drafting a qbotf.

It won't be one and done. But that doesn't matter. You will just move the goal posts.

 

[Shanegotyou11]

Silly how people hate on Russ now and act like he was not elite. The same people who wanted Pete fired and Russ to stay.

Russ helped win that chip. Simple as that. Until Geno wins a chip and does what Russ did for a decade, then you can not compare the two.

 

[BASF]

Silly how people hate on Russ now and act like he was not elite. The same people who wanted Pete fired and Russ to stay.

Russ helped win that chip. Simple as that. Until Geno wins a chip and does what Russ did for a decade, then you can not compare the two.

Please define elite. So much of the Wilson back and forth depends on the definition.

For me, elite is being in the top three of your position for at least the entire term of one of your contracts. The usual term is four years. So, in any four consecutive years, was Wilson top three? I don't know how anyone can answer that as a yes with a straight face. He may have out performed Brees or Rodgers or Brady in a year or two of the four consecutive, but no one can truly argue that he did. Then you have the younger generation that replaced the old guard. He is not better than Mahomes, Allen or Burrow.

Even if you want to go off of pure numbers, go to his pro football reference page:

Russell Wilson Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats for Russell Wilson. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

He has only ever led one season in three passing categories. Once in touchdowns. Once in QB rating. Once in fourth quarter comebacks/ game winning drives. On the last stat, one of those game winning drives/ fourth quarter comebacks we scored on the first play of the fourth quarter and never trailed again. Is that really a fourth quarter comeback? On one of the others the game winning drive was twelve plays in which Wilson completed only two passes. The one touchdown throw to Carson was with no one within seven yards of him. Not much high pressure game winning drive type stuff there.

 

[rcaido]

Please define elite. So much of the Wilson back and forth depends on the definition.

For me, elite is being in the top three of your position for at least the entire term of one of your contracts. The usual term is four years. So, in any four consecutive years, was Wilson top three? I don't know how anyone can answer that as a yes with a straight face. He may have out performed Brees or Rodgers or Brady in a year or two of the four consecutive, but no one can truly argue that he did. Then you have the younger generation that replaced the old guard. He is not better than Mahomes, Allen or Burrow.

Even if you want to go off of pure numbers, go to his pro football reference page:

Russell Wilson Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats for Russell Wilson. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

He has only ever led one season in three passing categories. Once in touchdowns. Once in QB rating. Once in fourth quarter comebacks/ game winning drives. On the last stat, one of those game winning drives/ fourth quarter comebacks we scored on the first play of the fourth quarter and never trailed again. Is that really a fourth quarter comeback? On one of the others the game winning drive was twelve plays in which Wilson completed only two passes. The one touchdown throw to Carson was with no one within seven yards of him. Not much high pressure game winning drive type stuff there.

Wilson was a top 5 throughout his career in Seattle. He was unlucky because Manning, Brady, Brees, & Erin. He was voted top 100 player every year he played for Seattle.

 

[Jazzhawk]

Geno on the 2013 roster could have won a SB. Geno on the 2023 roster is extremely unlikely to win a SB. He will not carry a team to a title and so he needs a great team around him to take the pressure off him. Just look at the playoff game vs SF. He was lights out for the first half. As soon as he wasn't up to that standard the game fell apart.

This team needs another great offseason or two to have the caliber of roster that I think Geno needs to win a SB. Geno skeptics like myself, think that he will maybe regress from last years numbers and/or be in his age 35 season when this team's championship window opens. It's a lot to bank on one season of production.

Brady, Mahomes, Allen, Burrow (hell, Montana, Elway, Young, Favre, Aikman) would not have won the Super Bowl with last year's or this year's roster. Tho I do think this year we'll see the defense improve.

Face it... he same people who went into last season saying "We have no QB" are the same one's who constantly drone on about Geno not being good enough to win the SB, a record breaking Seahawks QB season or not.

 

[keasley45]

What's funny about the obvious Russ Diehards is how staunch their support STILL is for a player who's flaws were quietly exposed even among analysts for years leading up to his trade and that have been entirely exposed now. Yet, all they can do now is toss whatever shade they can find at a qb who, in his first year off the pine ( actually the trash heap) ,according to his coaches and teammates did things with the offense that it was incapable of doing before. And he didn't need a self fabricated highlight real to do it.



Geno will get tge most of his wrs, his rb, his wrs, his o coordinator, and his offense. And the Hawks will go as far as that offense is built to go.



Russ only ever got as much as was available out of himself. The potential of the skill players around him was never fully realized because they were only ever in support of Russ's improvistaion. Didnt matter if they were masters of their craft... getting open on time... lineman blocking theit assignments accurately. What was drawn up didn't matter. It was just Russ playing elite Russ. Not Elite QB.



We managed to win a title with a qb who in year 11 is a deer in headlights when diagnosing plays. He wasn't better in year 2 and 3. He was worse. And still we won.



And we will win again, multiple times. And like last years success, it will only be a surprise to those who refuse to see it. And like last year, the chants from that tribe will be of 'no one could see this coming', or ' everything had to go perfectly ' , or ' Geno can't do it again', or ' If Russ had what Geno was given, he'd have done better '.


Save it. It's ok if you hitched your wagon to a dead horse, but don't expect every other wagon to slow down now because yours is busted.

Russ was the best there ever was at playing sandlot football. At that, he was elite. So much so that incoming wrs were made to learn the scramble drill. his HC permitted it and allowed multiple o coordinators to be left to look like idiots for never being able to scheme up a consistent, balanced and ultimatley successful playoff offense.

Russ played his game in the only town he would have been able to and in the early years, he had Lynch and the LOB help him through when his style of play didn't work or was figured out late in the season.

Do you want me to post articles from our SB season when the talk was abiut how we wouldn't go far if Russ continued to play as poorly as he did. How the hell is that elite? Hiw quickly we forget... or re-remember...

After they exited, he was left to carry the team on his own and could never manage more than a win in the playoffs because defenses knew what he was about, just as the whole league does now.

Literally the entire narrative through our championship runs was around whether we could win with a manager qb and pedestrian wrs.

Was that the talk when Allen and Mahomes were battling for AFC supremecy? Nope. Because they are obviously elite at their craft. Whether escability, anticipation, arm talent, processing... they ARE elite.

Russ, at our peak, never garnered that kind of respect. And it was only when any recognizable offensive strategy was abandoned for letting Russ create in his own, that the spotlight shined on him fully, because by default, every passing highlight was of a qb spinning around, twisting, turning and making an incredible play. Not because he always HAD to but because his non elite limitations forced him to.

And when he can't do that now, how elite is he at doing basic, non elite qb stuff? See the 2022 Donks offense.

And to think he will all of a sudden return to 'eliteness' under S Payton for any sustainable period? Good luck with that one.

2022 Geno on the 2013 and 2014 Hawks would have thrown the lights out. Period. That o line gave Russ more time than he ever had and opened up holes for Lynch that put him in position to win the NFL rushing title. Geno's o line last year got him sacked 4th most in the league and he STILL set all time franchise records.

Geno and the Seattle Seahawks will be fine.

 

[WarHawks]

It won't be one and done. But that doesn't matter. You will just move the goal posts.

Illogical. Why would I move the goal posts if Geno shows he can win in the playoffs? That's all any of us want. I don't care who the qb is as long as he wins in the playoffs and gives us a real chance at an owl. So far, however, Geno has not shown us he can do that, which is why I was hoping we would draft a qb, to hedge our bets. But we're all in on Geno now. Ok then. As I've said repeatedly, I hope he proves us doubters wrong. Especially since we have no other real options at this point, except for Lock.

 

[Shanegotyou11]

Please define elite. So much of the Wilson back and forth depends on the definition.

For me, elite is being in the top three of your position for at least the entire term of one of your contracts. The usual term is four years. So, in any four consecutive years, was Wilson top three? I don't know how anyone can answer that as a yes with a straight face. He may have out performed Brees or Rodgers or Brady in a year or two of the four consecutive, but no one can truly argue that he did. Then you have the younger generation that replaced the old guard. He is not better than Mahomes, Allen or Burrow.

Even if you want to go off of pure numbers, go to his pro football reference page:

Russell Wilson Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats for Russell Wilson. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

He has only ever led one season in three passing categories. Once in touchdowns. Once in QB rating. Once in fourth quarter comebacks/ game winning drives. On the last stat, one of those game winning drives/ fourth quarter comebacks we scored on the first play of the fourth quarter and never trailed again. Is that really a fourth quarter comeback? On one of the others the game winning drive was twelve plays in which Wilson completed only two passes. The one touchdown throw to Carson was with no one within seven yards of him. Not much high pressure game winning drive type stuff there.

Look I will say this. Mahomes is elite but looks way better with Andy Reid calling the shots. Mahomes 5 TDs and 4 picks in 3 Superbowl Appearances, yet is 2 and 1 in the title game. Look at Mncabb and Smith with Reid. They were all better under him. Mahomes highest TD season? 50. Yes that is better then Russ 40 touchdown passes. Now mahomes TD to INT ratio is awesome. 3.92 to 1. Awesome.

Josh Allen? 2td to 1int ratio. Allen is elite but highest TD season was 37. Russ? 40. Russ threw 3 more touchdowns. Russ TD to Int ratio is 3.14. That is 3rd best all time. It was even higher before the last couple of yrs.

It feels like you are trying to rip any credibility away from Russ because he is the villian now. He is the bad guy. Russ has 4tds and 1 pick in two superbowls. Russ was elite for a long time. Was he ever the best? No. Top 3 to 5? Yes. He also was that for 10 years.

 

[Rainger]

Illogical. Why would I move the goal posts if Geno shows he can win in the playoffs? That's all any of us want. I don't care who the qb is as long as he wins in the playoffs and gives us a real chance at an owl. So far, however, Geno has not shown us he can do that, which is why I was hoping we would draft a qb, to hedge our bets. But we're all in on Geno now. Ok then. As I've said repeatedly, I hope he proves us doubters wrong. Especially since we have no other real options at this point, except for Lock.

One guy doesn't win in the playoffs the whole team does. For instance will it be Genos fault if the Defense shits the bed, or the refs make a bunch of crap calls, or there are injuries, will as usual you all say seeee Geno cant win in the playoffs. Shit!

 

[CalgaryFan05]

Why is it that everyone thinks we can’t win a Super Bowl with Geno. He played very well last year. With all the additional offensive weapons he will have even less pressure to "do it all”. He is more than capable. People think you need a Brady or Mahomes in order to win. That is just BS. We won when Russ was still budding and not “elite”. Plenty of others have been won without an elite QB. Geno may be elite (time will tell) but many have already written his narrative for him. Lame. I am not saying he is the second coming of Brady or anything like that but he has proven he can play at a high level. Let’s root for him and at least not write him off. Jeez. Some fan base we are.

Just caught this thread -

I am not one of those people. I completely think that we can win an Owl with Geno.

Anyone who says that his 'high turnoverable ball throwing percentage' was high last year - is COMPLETELY right. Right after Pete broke the offense post-Munich. When the Tight End sets and scheme went away - all he had to throw at was fast closing, questionable targets.

Never wanted a brady, and neither does our cap. Don't want a Rodgers. Don't want any 60MM/year QB. I'd much rather have a 1-2 punch at QB - Saints 2022 style. What I wanted was a servicable quarterback. Build the pieces around him. That's what we're doing.

I couldn't be happier with Geno. He'll get right up to speed again this Sophomore year - and he's got some new toys to do it with.

Ain't nothing wrong with Geno. He's the man, and he'd have a few years to prove it on his contract if it was me making the decision.

 

[CalgaryFan05]

Aikman won Super Bowls. It is the measuring stick. If it were not, Brady would have some serious GOAT competition, no one would give a crap about "Terry Bradshaw's money", and Marino/Fouts would be regarded much, much higher. I don't necessarily agree with it as the definitive measure, but it is obviously the measure that NFL nation uses. Take away Aikman's rings and he would be an afterthought. Like Bert Jones. Now that was an exciting, damn good quarterback, with no rings. Give Aikman's rings to Bert Jones and we would be talking about him in the same breath as Joe Montana.

Let's take Brady out of the division. Seriously.

Take him out of the AFC east. Put him literally anywhere else EXCEPT for the NFC south - for 10 years - and see if he's the ******* GOAT then.

He's not. He's a cheater, in a soft as F division for a million years.

GOAT GOAT GOAT. If we can't have one, I suppose the league will 'make one'. Mahomes anyone? Bueller? Mahomes?

You know what? I wanna see Brady up against the 1970's Steelers Defense. Play that a bunch of times. THEN you can call yourself GOAT - well, once you get out of the hospital.

Brady et all (rodgers, mahomes/etc) are all GOAT worthy conversations in the soft as F modern league. I wanna see them hold up against teams that, as FADE is fond of mentioning weren't playing 'basketball on grass'.

<rant off>

 

[BASF]

Look I will say this. Mahomes is elite but looks way better with Andy Reid calling the shots. Mahomes 5 TDs and 4 picks in 3 Superbowl Appearances, yet is 2 and 1 in the title game. Look at Mncabb and Smith with Reid. They were all better under him. Mahomes highest TD season? 50. Yes that is better then Russ 40 touchdown passes. Now mahomes TD to INT ratio is awesome. 3.92 to 1. Awesome.

Josh Allen? 2td to 1int ratio. Allen is elite but highest TD season was 37. Russ? 40. Russ threw 3 more touchdowns. Russ TD to Int ratio is 3.14. That is 3rd best all time. It was even higher before the last couple of yrs.

It feels like you are trying to rip any credibility away from Russ because he is the villian now. He is the bad guy. Russ has 4tds and 1 pick in two superbowls. Russ was elite for a long time. Was he ever the best? No. Top 3 to 5? Yes. He also was that for 10 years.

So, your definition of elite is being either the third best to fifth best player in their position for a long time?

As far as ripping away credibility from Wilson because he is the villain now, it has nothing to do with him being the villain. I was one of the five or so people critiquing Wilson well before his Let Russ Cook campaign. So many people here were blinded by his sandlot style. So few of us could see how the receivers and linemen were reacting to him not getting the ball out on time. A lot of the comeback wins were due to him not running the offense as intended, but the Wilson marks always blamed the O-Line and Pete's offense, even though (and I have been pointing this out for most of the time that Wilson was here since I am an ACC fan and watched him at NC State) he always ran his passing offense from college (I even posted highlights from both NC State and Wisconsin illustrating this). I give a lot of credit to our offensive coordinators for getting him to do the read option so well as it wasn't really in his college playbooks. Other than that, he was pretty much a finished product coming into the NFL. His lack of evolution is the only thing that kept him from being elite by my definition.

 

[EverydayImRusselin]

Not sure why everyone is bringing Russ up now in this Geno thread, but I will just leave you with this.

Geno's 2022 season is nearly identical to Kirk Cousin's 5 year average in Minnesota. I don't think there are many Kirk Cousin's is going to win you a SB fans out there.

Geno - 69.8% comp %, 4,282 yds, 30/10 TD/INT, 7.8 YPA, 5.2 TD% 100.9 QB rating.

Cousins (5 year average in Min) - 67.8% comp %, 4,188 yds, 30.6/10 TD/INT, 7.6 YPA, 5.5 TD %, 100.9 QB rating.

 

[Spin Doctor]

I agree that if any of the guys below can win a SB, Geno can certainly win one:

Joe Flacco
Trent Dilfer
Nick Foles
Brad Johnson
Jeff Hostetler
Doug Williams
Russell Wilson

Only three of those guys are from the modern NFL era. It's also worth noting that Foles and Flacco put on historical postseason performances and absolutely carried their teams. Wilson also had a few moments where he was clutch.

The biggest issue that I have with Geno Smith, is he collapses in big moments, been that way ever since his collegiate days. It's the same reason why QB's such as Kirk Cousins aren't more highly regarded despite their gaudy statlines.

On his merits as a pure passer, he's about as good as anyone. The issue I have with Geno is when things around him go south, he tends to make really dumb decisions. He's easy to rattle and knock off his game. It is why i don't think that he's ever going to be a Super Bowl winning QB. Even with the best defense in the modern era, there were moments we needed to lean on Wilson during crucial moments.

Can Geno lead us to a Super Bowl? Sure, anything can happen, but some people just have a mental block in crucial moments and are unable to rise to the occasion. Geno Smith is firmly in the Kirk Cousins category of players. Not a bad place to be in, but also not the best player to stake your championship hopes on.

 

[Maelstrom787]

Not sure why everyone is bringing Russ up now in this Geno thread, but I will just leave you with this.

Geno's 2022 season is nearly identical to Kirk Cousin's 5 year average in Minnesota. I don't think there are many Kirk Cousin's is going to win you a SB fans out there.

Geno - 69.8% comp %, 4,282 yds, 30/10 TD/INT, 7.8 YPA, 5.2 TD% 100.9 QB rating.

Cousins (5 year average in Min) - 67.8% comp %, 4,188 yds, 30.6/10 TD/INT, 7.6 YPA, 5.5 TD %, 100.9 QB rating.

That statline... is not the reason people don't think Kirk is going to win a Super Bowl.