Clint Hurtt's Biggest Crime: 2023 at Dallas

[morgulon1]

All go as far as to suggest that it appeared some of the players flat out quit on the coaches.

Yeah, I said it.

That's certainly what it looked like.
I was on YouTube the other night and ran across random Seahawks games from the 2013 and 2014 seasons , and the difference was night and day regarding the intensity, communication, and most of all speed.

The Pittsburgh game was proof that Pete Carroll needed to go.

 

[AROS]

Yep I was watching some LOB era playoffs and it didn’t even look like the same type of sport was being played between the two.

 

[oldhawkfan]

Yep I was watching some LOB era playoffs and it didn’t even look like the same type of sport was being played between the two.

How much of that can be attributed to the difference in on field talent?

 

[Scout]

Hurtt tried to play dime defense nearly every down which doesn't work. The principal of stopping the run on early downs remain which is why top tier defenses are built to stop the run first and then rush the passer on third downs.

 

[morgulon1]

How much of that can be attributed to the difference in on field talent?

I know you directed your question to Aros please allow me to respond.

That's a great question. I wanted to think it was all talent yet last seasons defense had talent.

Those guys from THE defense had a different mental makeup.

 

[BASF]

What follows is complete supposition on my part:

I honestly think a couple of the leaders/veterans on the defense decided that they were done with Hurtt and wanted him gone. I believe they thought that Carroll's job was safe and that he would be forced to let Hurtt go. My reason for thinking this is when the veterans walked in for the goodbye Pete press conference, Diggs looks guilty for what happened. Maybe it was just that he knew he was going to be out of work very soon after his giving up so often during plays, but he had something going on when he walked into that room.

 

[olyfan63]

That's certainly what it looked like.
I was on YouTube the other night and ran across random Seahawks games from the 2013 and 2014 seasons , and the difference was night and day regarding the intensity, communication, and most of all speed.

The Pittsburgh game was proof that Pete Carroll needed to go.

I did that a while ago also, trying to "spot the differences" between LOB era and today (then 2023)

It looked different exactly as you said: intensity, communication, and speed.

I'm not a bigtime X's and O's guy on D, can recognize a few coverages, QB pressure schemes, key matchups, etc., but I really didn't need to pay much attention to the X's and O's stuff to see the differences.

 

[projectorfreak]

That Cleveland game not being able to get into the end zone and not taking field goals , i was just really really disappointed .
I felt the coaching was a problem for a long time but 3 games we should have and probably would have with most other coaches, last season i gave up and was positive if a change wasn't made we were screwed by our entire team from the top down
Thank you Mrs. Allen for having the guts to make the hardest decision of the last decade
Look at us now , optimism is huge for me and feeling like we could've wone possibly 11+ games last year I expect MM will be the tonic we've needed to revitalize us for the future
Go Hawks

 

[strohmin]

We should have won that Dallas game no doubt, but nothing spiked my blood pressure more than that Pittsburgh game last season. Such a garbage game on so many levels with so much on the line.

That game highlighted Pete's lack of discipline to the fullest. They couldnt tackle for shit after coming of a promising win. That was the game that had to have sealed Pete's fate. I rwally hope we dont see the same dumb mistakes again.

 

[OneLofaTatupu]

Yeah…. I mean that game was a travesty on another certain front with the zebras too… but the defense definitely did not do its job

Always with Dallas. Zebras screwed the lions too. I mean it’s all made up garbage and a spectacle but come on don’t make it so obvious

 

[hawkfan68]

I hate saying this because I like and respect Pete but he stopped coaching after he won the Superbowl. He got complacent. He thought he could just go through the motions and keep winning. You could tell he stopped because of the repeated mistakes, penalties, etc week in, week out. Nothing changed except it seemed Pete lost the passion. It could be a reason some of the players left or wanted to leave.

 

[AROS]

I hate saying this because I like and respect Pete but he stopped coaching after he won the Superbowl. He got complacent. He thought he could just go through the motions and keep winning. You could tell he stopped because of the repeated mistakes, penalties, etc week in, week out. Nothing changed except it seemed Pete lost the passion. It could be a reason some of the players left or wanted to leave.

I'm not sure he lost the passion. I think with Pete, it seemed to me that he was simply trying to rely on what had worked for him in the past, but the LOB Era had future Hall of Famers, perennial Pro Bowlers and serious depth. Neither of which he had much abundance of from 2016 on. Most fatalistically, it was his stubborn loyalty and refusal to move on quickly enough from coordinators who were simply terrible.

 

[jammerhawk]

Keeping Bevell after the SB 49 fiasco set a tone that was never able to be completely gotten past by the veterans still on the team after that catastrophe. His loyalty to some of his staff was difficult to understand when they continued to underperform.

It was steady down trending after that ill fated play.

I do think however that many here unfortunately relish jumping on Pete's grave when he did deliver the strongest period of team performance in the history of the team. His message and the coaching style just got outdated.

For us faithful there is the strong prospect of a new era of strong team play. I'm genuinely excited at watching that happen.

 

[morgulon1]

Keeping Bevell after the SB 49 fiasco set a tone that was never able to be completely gotten past by the veterans still on the team after that catastrophe. His loyalty to some of his staff was difficult to understand when they continued to underperform.

It was steady down trending after that ill fated play.

I do think however that many here unfortunately relish jumping on Pete's grave when he did deliver the strongest period of team performance in the history of the team. His message and the coaching style just got outdated.

For us faithful there is the strong prospect of a new era of strong team play. I'm genuinely excited at watching that happen.

Good points.

I do agree with you that there are some on .net that get a certain joy jumping on PC's
grave , but I think the majority are voicing their frustrations with what he allowed his program to morph into ,after all the great things he was able to accomplish.

It was aggravating but excusable when he would waste 2 timeouts in the first quarter
as long as Seattle was curb stomping the Rams and SF. It became much more of an issue as they came back to earth , then his hand picked lackeys (coordinators) started to be viewedvwith much more scrutiny and players who we as fans couldn't for the life us figure out why he wouldn't cut ties with.

Pete Carroll did this to Pete Carroll.

 

[James in PA]

Hurtt's 2nd biggest crime: Never eating a salad.

 

[warden]

I though his biggest crime was stealing a paycheck from the Seahawks

 

[Spin Doctor]

I'm not sure he lost the passion. I think with Pete, it seemed to me that he was simply trying to rely on what had worked for him in the past, but the LOB Era had future Hall of Famers, perennial Pro Bowlers and serious depth. Neither of which he had much abundance of from 2016 on. Most fatalistically, it was his stubborn loyalty and refusal to move on quickly enough from coordinators who were simply terrible.

One of the reasons why teams moved away from using the Pete style of defense is cost. His defense is a classic and it still works, but in order for it to work at a high level, teams found that the defense was expensive. What Pete's innovation was is the style of players he used. The undersized pass rushers and big CBs that would have been relegated to special teams or teams depth charts were readily available to run Pete's defense. In addition to this, rule changes were specifically aimed at the LOB. We could not run the defense the same way in 2024.

Carroll couldn't pivot and when he finally did, he hired internally rather than went with somebody with experience implementing the defense he wanted to run. The result was a mess. Carroll's biggest problem was the people he entrusted to man his defense. Hurtt didn't even have a great reputation as a DLine coach and his predecessor, Norton got fired for poor performance at Oakland.

Ever since 2017, the defense really seemed fragmented and listless. Almost like a ship running without a captain.

 

[RolandDeschain]

Yeah…. I mean that game was a travesty on another certain front with the zebras too… but the defense definitely did not do its job

Always with Dallas. Zebras screwed the lions too. I mean it’s all made up garbage and a spectacle but come on don’t make it so obvious

Gentlemen, this is why every head coach should approach every single game under the assumption that the officials will flat-out hand your opponent a full two touchdowns. Go for the throat, and never let up. Don't be satisfied with a two-score lead and six minutes left in the 4th quarter. This isn't peewee league where feelings should be spared. Run the score up as much as possible every time as if your life depends on it. Take a knee at the end only when victory is absolutely guaranteed, otherwise play aggressively throughout.

 

[AROS]

Gentlemen, this is why every head coach should approach every single game under the assumption that the officials will flat-out hand your opponent a full two touchdowns. Go for the throat, and never let up. Don't be satisfied with a two-score lead and six minutes left in the 4th quarter. This isn't peewee league where feelings should be spared. Run the score up as much as possible every time as if your life depends on it. Take a knee at the end only when victory is absolutely guaranteed, otherwise play aggressively throughout.

THIS.

 

[strohmin]

I hate saying this because I like and respect Pete but he stopped coaching after he won the Superbowl. He got complacent. He thought he could just go through the motions and keep winning. You could tell he stopped because of the repeated mistakes, penalties, etc week in, week out. Nothing changed except it seemed Pete lost the passion. It could be a reason some of the players left or wanted to leave.

I dont think he lost his passion or stopped coaching but I think that superbowl loss really messed with him. He can say he moved on and all that but I think it really affected him to the point where he lost his way. I think with each year of failure made Pete more desperate and stubborn to prove his way still worked and ended up just spiraling.