Refs ruined the game

keasley45

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If the Lions get a higher seed due to this game being the tiebreaker, and thus the game is in Detroit, will you use that as an excuse for a loss?

Edit - There is no scenario where both teams will have all 22 of their "starters" in a playoff game... that doesn't even happen in week 1. And further, every team has a handful of packages on each side of the ball to the point where there will be a core of 8 or 9 guys who are "true starters" and 3-4 "fringe starters", and it's not always clear what the actual 11 is on either side. Often the opponent may dictate that by matchups.

If the only issue is injuries and nothing else, or "22 vs 22 and no need for nuance"... I mean I cannot even comprehend that statement. The Super Bowl y'all lost in my Lions' stadium - was that because of injures, or because of the zebras? I didn't even care who won but it was clear the refs wanted the Steelers to win. This entire thread is about the refs for our MNF game. This is reality, not Madden. There is nuance.

Btw - someone over on my Lions thread pointed out that this year our opponents are getting blown out the next week. Rams lost 41-10 after playing us, then Tampa lost 26-7 after playing us, then Arizona lost 42-14 after playing us. Maybe it's coincidence. But our beat writers were at camp this year and they said the Lions were hitting unusually hard in practice, like hits that would normally start a fist fight but instead they just got up and ran another play. Repeatedly. Y'all got the Giants at home. We'll see how that streak goes.

Love the confidence, Iron Lion.

No need to talk about the past, whether our loss in the SB in your house or thr 9v2 edge we hold over you since 2000.

And no need to lecture about the realities of attrition in the league.

We will see you again.

Enjoy your win.
 

Hawk4lyfe

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Ok, then you agree the 2pt conversion was no good and the 3 blatant DPI no calls, 2 of which happened in the end zone, were inconsequential. You think calling OPI on Lockett when the defender ran into him was a good call on 4th down.

I'm so glad we have fans like you who can teach us the proper way to react to games so we don't embarrass you in the future. Every fan base has to have at least ONE fan Karen, and we all appreciate it so much.
Every single game in the NFL has calls that were missed, or shouldn't have been called or what have you. Humans are involved, so there's a certain amount of human error to be expected. You could likely sit here and complain about bad calls every single time we lose. We have benefitted from bad calls or no calls as well over the years. To sit here and whine about it and say "wah wah, we lost the game cuz the refs suck!" Seems incredibly childish and naive. Did u analyze all the no calls on the Hawks or missed calls that could/would/should have affected the game for Detroit? Just Seattle? Thought so. Over the course of a season it likely averages out. And as the saying goes, "don't leave the game up to the refs". If we excelled more in other areas, stopped them here or there, converted there or here, the no calls and bad calls don't often matter. In a highly contested playoff game, often it's a different matter.

Whine about the refs if u want to. But don't cry about it when u get called a whiner.
 

keasley45

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Every single game in the NFL has calls that were missed, or shouldn't have been called or what have you. Humans are involved, so there's a certain amount of human error to be expected. You could likely sit here and complain about bad calls every single time we lose. We have benefitted from bad calls or no calls as well over the years. To sit here and whine about it and say "wah wah, we lost the game cuz the refs suck!" Seems incredibly childish and naive. Did u analyze all the no calls on the Hawks or missed calls that could/would/should have affected the game for Detroit? Just Seattle? Thought so. Over the course of a season it likely averages out. And as the saying goes, "don't leave the game up to the refs". If we excelled more in other areas, stopped them here or there, converted there or here, the no calls and bad calls don't often matter. In a highly contested playoff game, often it's a different matter.

Whine about the refs if u want to. But don't cry about it when u get called a whiner.
I dont think anyone is arguing that bad calls go both ways. And the number of times bad calls actually materially affect the outcome of a game is something close to not often.

But..

There are those instances when a series of bad calls in critical moments does change things.

No doubt we played poorly.

There is also no doubt that the obvious and blatant wrong call on the 2 pt conversion sapped momentum, nevermind taking points off the board

And there is no doubt that if we get the blatant PI call on DK in the endzone, with the ball on the 1, we score a TD. What was the flipside of calling it wrong? We turn the ball over on downs.

And there is no doubt that if the rediculous offensive PI call on Tyler is just left to ride ( its obvious he wasnt blocking) we are in position again to score. Taking momentum, and putting doubt in the Detroit side that as well as they'd played, the team that beat them 9 of the previous 11 times was about to do it again. You cant just ignore hiw significant that is.

Theres a saying, that when great officiating is happening in a well played game, the refs are invisible. There's a reason they say that.

There are points and momentum that no doubt, materially affected the outcome of this game.

If you want to claim detroit got calls as well, fine, they were actually called for more penalties than we were, but which ones were SO obvious and contributed directly to taking points off the board? None

Which ones had NY hastily double check a 2 point conversion and prematurely determine it was incomplete?. A call THAT close is NEVER resolved THAT quickly. And thats not just fan talk. MM was onbiousky ticked about it as well. And Aikman and Buck were surprised by it as well.

So no. Just because we played poorly doesnt give the refs license to steer a game.

Thats the same nonsense that was spewed post SB in 05. 'If you'd played better, it wouldnt have mattered'. Sure if we had played a series or 2 better , we may have won that game Monday - it would have taken more than that to win that SB. The field was still tilted in the other team's favor.

And for a team to not have played well on defense and STILL have a very realistic chance to win, to have a referee affect that chance because of what smacks of at best, doing their job poorlyor at worst, negligence in what were poor calls that affected one team signifucantly more than the other...

Sometimes the lesser team on a given day still wins. When you officiate a one sided affair with respect to MAJOR calls, you all but nullify that opportunity. And who wants to watch a sport where you have a team overcome hurdle after hurdel after hurdel to position themselves to win, only to have the refs wrongfully say ' Nope. Sorry. Try again '

Its BS to normalize that kind of nonsense and just say play better, bad calls happen. You play 'better' to overcome the other team, not incompetent officiating, multiple times over the course of a game and in key situations. And i make that statement in full acknowlegement that offocials are human and that we needed to make fewer mistakes ourselves.

But if 'human error' means BS like we've seen in recent years and we saw Monday, then there needs to be less human intervention either in the form of more tech, or more play situations being reviewable. It is nonsensical that some plays, like spotting a ball can be reviewed on the spot, but a wr being knocked away from the ball before it gets to him cant?. Especially when that call is in the endzone. And in this game that wasnt even the only one.

Detroit was the better team Monday night. Doesnt mean they should have won. And just because they were flagged more, it doesnt nullify the magnitude of the calls that went the other way that werent just calls but BAD calls. Nobody is complaining about an illegal man downfield. Its calls that are blatantly errant.

Another great example - there was a facemask penalty called in a game the weekend before last on THE PLAYER THAT RECEIVED THE FACEMASK - forget which game and team byt im sure its on youtube. The call stood, game went on. Just 'human error'?

The Non PI that knocked the Saints out of the SB a few years ago. Just human error? There are judgement calls that could go either way. There are calls in the stream of play that a ref can likely make on either team every other play (like holding). And there are calls that are flat wrong and shoukd not be allowed to stand for the outcome they have on a game.

And shame on anyone to just claim 'human error' in today's legal gambling world where folks are making and losing money hand over fist.

You honestly think the refs who are 'only human' dont make moral errors and gamble on games? Games they can effect the outcome of? And no. I am NOT saying thats what happened. Just that its foolish to cast aside blatant, game altering errors as simply 'oopsies'. Forget them having their own private gripes or rooting interests. As was said... they are only human. Goes both ways.

Its naive. And the NFL needs to do something about it. Period. More replayabale calls. More tech. Less subjectivity. As little of it as possible.
 
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cymatica

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I dont think anyone is arguing that bad calls go both ways. And the number of times bad calls actually materially affect the outcome of a game is something close to not often.

But..

There are those instances when a series of bad calls in critical moments does change things.

No doubt we played poorly.

There is also no doubt that the obvious and blatant wrong call on the 2 pt conversion sapped momentum, nevermind taking points off the board

And there is no doubt that if we get the blatant PI call on DK in the endzone, with the ball on the 1, we score a TD. What was the flipside of calling it wrong? We turn the ball over on downs.

And there is no doubt that if the rediculous offensive PI call on Tyler is just left to ride ( its obvious he wasnt blocking) we are in position again to score. Taking momentum, and putting doubt in the Detroit side that as well as they'd played, the team that beat them 9 of the previous 11 times was about to do it again. You cant just ignore hiw significant that is.

Theres a saying, that when great officiating is happening in a well played game, the refs are invisible. There's a reason they say that.

There are points and momentum that no doubt, materially affected the outcome of this game.

If you want to claim detroit got calls as well, fine, they were actually called for more penalties than we were, but which ones were SO obvious and contributed directly to taking points off the board? None

Which ones had NY hastily double check a 2 point conversion and prematurely determine it was incomplete?. A call THAT close is NEVER resolved THAT quickly. And thats not just fan talk. MM was onbiousky ticked about it as well. And Aikman and Buck were surprised by it as well.

So no. Just because we played poorly doesnt give the refs license to steer a game.

Thats the same nonsense that was spewed post SB in 05. 'If you'd played better, it wouldnt have mattered'. Sure if we had played a series or 2 better , we may have won that game Monday - it would have taken more than that to win that SB. The field was still tilted in the other team's favor.

And for a team to not have played well on defense and STILL have a very realistic chance to win, to have a referee affect that chance because of what smacks of at best, doing their job poorlyor at worst, negligence in what were poor calls that affected one team signifucantly more than the other...

Sometimes the better team on a given day still wins. When you officiate a one sided affair with respect to MAJOR calls, you all but nullify that opportunity. And who wants to watch a sport where you have a team overcome hurdle after hurdel after hurdel to position themselves to win, only to have the refs wrongfully say ' Nope. Sorry. Try again '

Its BS to normalize that kind of nonsense and just say play better, bad calls happen. You play 'better' to overcome the other team, not incompetent officiating, multiple times over the course of a game and in key situations. And i make that statement in full acknowlegement that offocials are human and that we needed to make fewer mistakes ourselves.

But if 'human error' means BS like we've seen in recent years and we saw Monday, then there needs to be less human intervention either in the form of more tech, or more play situations being reviewable. It is nonsensical that some plays, like spotting a ball can be reviewed on the spot, but a wr being knocked away from the ball before it gets to him cant?. Especially when that call is in the endzone. And in this game that wasnt even the only one.

Detroit was the better team Monday night. Doesnt mean they should have won. And just because they were flagged more, it doesnt nullify the magnitude of the calls that went the other way that werent just calls but BAD calls. Nobody is complaining about an illegal man downfield. Its calls that are blatantly errant.

Another great example - there was a facemask penalty called in a game the weekend before last on THE PLAYER THAT RECEIVED THE FACEMASK - forget which game and team byt im sure its on youtube. The call stood, game went on. Just 'human error'?

The Non PI that knocked the Saints out of the SB a few years ago. Just human error? There are judgement calls that could go either way. There are calls in the stream of play that a ref can likely make on either team every other play (like holding). And there are calls that are flat wrong and shoukd not be allowed to stand for the outcome they have on a game.

And shame on anyone to just claim 'human error' in today's legal gambling world where folks are making and losing money hand over fist.

You honestly think the refs who are 'only human' dont make moral errors and gamble on games? Games they can effect the outcome of? And no. I am NOT saying thats what happened. Just that its foolish to cast aside blatant, game altering errors as simply 'oopsies'. Forget them having their own private gripes or rooting interests. As was said... they are only human. Goes both ways.

Its naive. And the NFL needs to do something about it. Period. More replayabale calls. More tech. Less subjectivity. As little of it as possible.
Exactly this
 
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cymatica

cymatica

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I get it, you took something personally that wasn't supposed to be personal, that's your issue, no one else's. We lost because our defense got destroyed on the back end and you want to believe it was flags. I can't help that you're wrong, take that up with your ego. Also your fucktarded fascination about me being a "Tough Guy" on the internet is really just your deflection, either way not my problem.
I didn't take it personally, you intentionally tried to make it personal and you're such a little bitch you can't own up to it. I was venting about refs making bad calls then you someone get offended and come at me. I never even said that's why we lost, I said the refs ruined what could have been a nailbiter. Learn to actually read and comprehend the words before you open your mouth and reveal how stupid you are

And yes, you are a fake tough guy behind a screen. I guarantee you don't talk like this to someone in public.
 

hawks85

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We will see you in the playoffs. After that game, come back and lets talk about moral victories and nuance.

A predictionand friendly challenge from fan to fan.

22 v 22, full strength, there will be no need for nuance.

You guys have a good team. Glad to see the Lions contending for best in the NFCN and was pulling for you against the 9ers in the championship gane last year.

But when we see eachother again, we wont need the moral victory to feel good (not that we need it now). A plain ol victory will do just fine. 9-2 in the head to head over the last 20 years. 2024 round 2 will make it 10-2.

Good luck to the Lions from here on out. Very much hoping we get that second game this year.
Yup, I want another crack at you guys full strength against full strength.
 

ZagHawk

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I didn't take it personally, you intentionally tried to make it personal and you're such a little bitch you can't own up to it.

And yes, you are a fake tough guy behind a screen. I guarantee you don't talk like this to someone in public.

Do you talk like that to someone in public? if so..oof.
 

ZagHawk

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NFL most rigged league in NA sports . Just the way it is.

If this is true, I wish they would just let everyone know. So I could start watching the NFL like the WWE. Oh man, I love how they made that ref miss that call. Who do you think is gonna win the SB this year? well I bet the Championship games they're gonna make us think it's these teams, but at last minute change to these teams. So the ultimate win will be this team passing the dynasty crown the undertaker once had to the Chiefs.
 

Iron Lion

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Love the confidence, Iron Lion.

No need to talk about the past, whether our loss in the SB in your house or thr 9v2 edge we hold over you since 2000.

And no need to lecture about the realities of attrition in the league.

We will see you again.

Enjoy your win.
So... if there's a playoff game in Detroit, you will say you shouldn't have been on the road in the first place. That's what this post looks like to me.
 

Flyingsquad23

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I didn't take it personally, you intentionally tried to make it personal and you're such a little bitch you can't own up to it. I was venting about refs making bad calls then you someone get offended and come at me. I never even said that's why we lost, I said the refs ruined what could have been a nailbiter. Learn to actually read and comprehend the words before you open your mouth and reveal how stupid you are

And yes, you are a fake tough guy behind a screen. I guarantee you don't talk like this to someone in public.
Imagine the hypocrisy it takes to call someone out as an internet tough guy and the play the internet tough guy card and call them stupid…lulz

It definitely tracks with you.
 
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cymatica

cymatica

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Do you talk like that to someone in public? if so..oof.
You mean when responding to someone who comes at me unprovoked? Yes, I give others the same respect they give me. Nice try at a gotcha but you failed
 
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cymatica

cymatica

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Imagine the hypocrisy it takes to call someone out as an internet tough guy and the play the internet tough guy card and call them stupid…lulz

It definitely tracks with you.
Imagine lacking the reading comprehension to understand how this isn't hypocrisy. I responded with the same respect that was given to me, just as I do face to face.

Another pathetic attempt at a gotcha
 

ZagHawk

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You mean when responding to someone who comes at me unprovoked? Yes, I give others the same respect they give me. Nice try at a gotcha but you failed


There's a Jordan Peterson quote I rather enjoy and I will share.

"You should learn to be an absolute monster...and then you should learn to control it"
 
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