This defense is unacceptable

[mistaowen]

As is giving up on a player they just traded a 2nd for.

Seeing Williams on that list is funny. Dude is the highest graded player every week since getting here and he’s only just learning the system. They should take the safety money and make sure he’s here for the next couple seasons. And then take the rest of it for another stud DL.

 

[renofox]

Q: Which players on Defense show year-to-year improvement?

A: None that I see. (edit: maybe Mafe?) All I ever seem to notice is regression.

The real A: our coaching staff sucks - they coach players down instead of up. They can't scheme to save their lives.

Too lazy to give detailed examples but if you think about individual players you'll see exactly what I mean.

 

[strohmin]

Q: Which players on Defense show year-to-year improvement?

A: None that I see. (edit: maybe Mafe?) All I ever seem to notice is regression.

The real A: our coaching staff sucks - they coach players down instead of up. They can't scheme to save their lives.

Too lazy to give detailed examples but if you think about individual players you'll see exactly what I mean.

Man I notice this too!

 

[cymatica]

Seeing Williams on that list is funny. Dude is the highest graded player every week since getting here and he’s only just learning the system. They should take the safety money and make sure he’s here for the next couple seasons. And then take the rest of it for another stud DL.

Watch Williams dramatically regress after an off-season of being coached up

 

[Optimus25]

Remember Taylor literally hugging Dak and not bringing him down?

Lol. What a joke.

I also like Dremont Jones playing end like he’s never seen a read option before. And he looks slow as my mother out there.

Plot twist. She’s dead.

 

[HawkFreak]

Bench his ass then till he can stop burning us with constant penalty play...

How about coach his ass instead? Oh wait...we need some effective coaches first...

 

[SeAhAwKeR4life]

How about coach his ass instead? Oh wait...we need some effective coaches first...

Yeah we just have ra ra guys who don;'t understand discipline. It's why we always lead the league in penalties. Pete doesn't believe in consequences...

 

[James in PA]

I cant stand Hurtt, but this terrible defense is 1000% on Pete. He has failed for YEARS now to field anything but below average defenses. Absolutely unacceptable for a defensive minded head coach.

 

[Fade]

Defensive coordinator replacement, sure...offensive, what's the point? Look at what Schottenheimer is doing for Dallas this year, their offense is putting up craploads of points everywhere. Replacing our OC is just putting a different puppet in place while Pete forces "Peteball".

When will folks learn? Like, how many times do we have to do this?

Scapegoating coordinators that run Pete's system will never work. If you want actual change, the head guy has to go.

 

[Maelstrom787]

Defensive coordinator replacement, sure...offensive, what's the point? Look at what Schottenheimer is doing for Dallas this year, their offense is putting up craploads of points everywhere. Replacing our OC is just putting a different puppet in place while Pete forces "Peteball".

But they're not playing Peteball, at least as we've come to know it. Peteball is generally defined (offensively) as complementary, balanced offense that balances explosives with rushing. We've seen anything but this year.

Schottenheimer is coordinating in Dallas, but he's doing so under an offensive-background head coach who controls the playsheet and offensive direction himself. Schottenheimer is presumably more of an implementation coordinator in Dallas. Probably not a coincidence that Dak is turning it around, Schotty is quite a good quarterback mentor. In fact, Schottenheimer is a good coach period these days. He also instantly turned around our offense into one that scored more and did so while maintaining a robust rushing attack.

As an aside, I'm impressed that we moved pretty well against a Quinn-led defense. Joe Whitt Jr. coaches their secondary as well, and he consistently churns out ballhawks outta nowhere. That's a positive, that we "got right" a little bit on O. DK really inspired confidence owning Bland like he did after the streak Bland's been on. Scoring 35 in that game after the tumultuous porta-potty ride the offense has been on was big.

I'm confused, though. If I buy into the idea of coordinator mattering less, I'd think it would matter less on the side of the ball that Pete obviously influences the direction of more - the defense.

 

[TwistedHusky]

When all the players suck...it's rarely the players.

The amount of cascading failures on defense is too large to put on the players. This is coaching. Tactics, scheme, and preparation are all failing. The job of coaches is to put players in a position to succeed, that isn't happening. The opposite might even be true. We are coaching players to lean into their weaknesses. Shockingly they struggle.

 

[Fade]

When all the players suck...it's rarely the players.

The amount of cascading failures on defense is too large to put on the players. This is coaching. Tactics, scheme, and preparation are all failing. The job of coaches is to put players in a position to succeed, that isn't happening. The opposite might even be true. We are coaching players to lean into their weaknesses. Shockingly they struggle.

Yup, but some folks on here always find a way to somehow scapegoat something else, other than the obvious. It's pretty incredible. The coaching staff is an epic fail on defense. Offense has issues, sure. But I'd say half of it falls on interior O-Line play, and the QB being mid-tier. The defensive coaching just flat-out sucks.


Opponents are attacking the Seahawks weaknesses and they are doing nothing to adjust.

-Like finding ways to isolate Woolen in the run game. What they should be doing on these plays is scrape a LBer or Safety and have Woolen play deep. Help him out, that's your job as a coach, mitigate his weakness, lean into his strength. He has a bum shoulder no less. They think he is Brandon Browner or something, and they can just run their base stuff and be fine. No. Scheme around your players.

-Going after Wagner with WRs in the passing game over the middle. (He has no chance.) This is a simple fix.

-Take him off the field in obvious pass situations.
-Blitz him more.
-Shade him towards the TE and buzz the flat.
Having him play the middle and pretending like he still has 4.4 speed that can matchup with WRs is absolutely on the coaches.

This in reality is kind of moot, as Seattle's scheme has been figured out anyway. They will just have 1 target enter a zone, the zone defender will carry him, and right in behind him they will send another receiver, wide open. This will continue until Pete is gone.

The Seahawks have the highest graded blitzing player in the NFL. Witherspoon, but never blitz him. Instead choosing to have him take a deep 3rd zone drop for most of the game. Apparently he has the skillset of Richard Sherman, because that is how they use him 95% of the time in recent games.

-They have kinda stopped blitzing at the league avg. rate, which is where they were at in the middle of the season. (When the defense was playing it's best, go figure.) And have returned to the Norton style defense. Drop into a softzone, rush 4, hope for the best. It is the most fire-able thing this coaching staff is doing. And they are doing a lot of stupid $H!t, lemme tell ya!

Run stacked fronts, blitz, mask your coverages, amoeba it up. Instead they are rolling out a 2013 LoB gameplan week after week, where they declare exactly what they are doing pre-snap, and then acting surprised when it didn't work once again.

 

[TwistedHusky]

Yep. At this point, the most interesting part of the sport is watching them gum up what could be an effective secondary - and then make adjustments that literally look like they are trying to lose.

I feel sorry for the players that have to play under Pete. He squanders so much talent forcing square pegs into round holes.


That said, at the start of the year - I pointed out the weakest part of the team were LB & S (I had no idea RB would be next). We did nothing to fix the LB issue and trotted out expecting Adams & Diggs wouldn't be the hot garbage everyone knew they would be.
Here we are near the end of the season, and LB & S are killing us (along w/ coaching). We did nothing to fix it.

 

[knownone]

The defense looked fine, except for a few crucial missed tackles and awful penalties. They clearly went into this game to take away the big play and make Dak earn everything. It worked for the most part. Sure, they gave up yards, but that will happen when you play this style against good offenses. Ultimately, the game plan gave them the opportunity to win the game, and they came up short.

The only major issue I saw is one we've known: without Nwosu, the Seahawks' defense can't create consistent pressure. Without that disruption, they're asking a lot out of secondary, particularly the safeties, in coverage. If I were to point blame, that's where I'd look. For the past five years, most analytics have shown that you need an elite defensive line to have an effective defense. And until recently, the Seahawks have built around their secondary. They don't have a top-20 player on the D-Line, and their best player is Williams—who they got during the season. That's what separates the Seahawks D from these other teams. Dallas, for example, had similar struggles as the Hawks, but their D-Line dominated when it mattered on those last three drives.

 

[Twilightendzone]

Yep. At this point, the most interesting part of the sport is watching them gum up what could be an effective secondary - and then make adjustments that literally look like they are trying to lose.

I feel sorry for the players that have to play under Pete. He squanders so much talent forcing square pegs into round holes.


That said, at the start of the year - I pointed out the weakest part of the team were LB & S (I had no idea RB would be next). We did nothing to fix the LB issue and trotted out expecting Adams & Diggs wouldn't be the hot garbage everyone knew they would be.
Here we are near the end of the season, and LB & S are killing us (along w/ coaching). We did nothing to fix it.

This has been it. Combined with the atrocious coaching/playcalling, since week one I have been blown away by the fact that we are putting out what looks like the two worst defensive units in the league and it appeared like nobody really noticed. I have been waiting for an article or even the radio to come right out and at least confirm what I thought I had been seeing all year.

Safety has been maddening and even if Love has been ok, he's had some seriously embarrassing moments and has still been the best S on the field by miles. $35-40 mil per year on the S position--especially this unit--sounds like an Onion headline. Diggs looks like he just happened to be on the same field as a football game and nobody
told him to go away. Even last year his pro bowl alternate selection was charity because I watched him and he was horrific minus a few takeaways. Diggs and Adams look like their salaries are dependent on how many tackles they attempt without arms or impeding a ballcarriers progress. Adams appears delusional at this point. Only he can completely misread a play, blow the tackle and then celebrate the fact that somebody eventually got the ballcarrier 25 yds downfield. He looks slower than Wagner at this point.

Brooks has always imo been overrated just because he got a lot of tackles and was a 1st round pick. He was absolutely awful last year taking over for Bobby and he's only ever been able to play with next to Bobby. Bobby can play the run exceptionally well still, but he's now maybe the worst coverage LB in the league at this point in his career--granted I do think much of that is PC/CH doing everything in their power to make sure he is on an island with the opponents best WR on what feels like 75% of passing downs at this point. I do think these guys could succeed under a new regime because there is no desire to dictate the game or play to strengths. Seattles real DC is usually on the wrong sideline.

A defensive coach hasn't fielded a respectable defense since 2015. Imagine where the Eagles might be if they had given Peterson this kind of leash for his one SB. I understand they haven't won it all again, but they've done things right. PC is a fun guy I'm sure, but he doesn't draft well, develop well or game plan well. There's a reason players don't get a second contract in Seattle. Pete wants "athletes" more than he wants football players. There are some bright spots and I hope the dead weight can be cut loose before big paydays are due for the young guys.

Apologies for the long-winded diatribe

 

[Optimus25]

How can a 3rd and 16 check down throw only have 1 guy to beat before he’s past the sticks?

 

[CPHawk]

When is the last time our D has even been good? It’s been years since Pete had a top 10 D?

It seems about time Pete hangs em up and goes golfing or fishing.

 

[Twilightendzone]

The defense looked fine, except for a few crucial missed tackles and awful penalties. They clearly went into this game to take away the big play and make Dak earn everything. It worked for the most part. Sure, they gave up yards, but that will happen when you play this style against good offenses. Ultimately, the game plan gave them the opportunity to win the game, and they came up short.

The only major issue I saw is one we've known: without Nwosu, the Seahawks' defense can't create consistent pressure. Without that disruption, they're asking a lot out of secondary, particularly the safeties, in coverage. If I were to point blame, that's where I'd look. For the past five years, most analytics have shown that you need an elite defensive line to have an effective defense. And until recently, the Seahawks have built around their secondary. They don't have a top-20 player on the D-Line, and their best player is Williams—who they got during the season. That's what separates the Seahawks D from these other teams. Dallas, for example, had similar struggles as the Hawks, but their D-Line dominated when it mattered on those last three drivo

This has been it. Combined with the atrocious coaching/playcalling, since week one I have been blown away by the fact that we are putting out what looks like the two worst defensive units in the league and it appeared like nobody really noticed. I have been waiting for an article or even the radio to come right out and at least confirm what I thought I had been seeing all year.

Safety has been maddening and even if Love has been ok, he's had some seriously embarrassing moments and has still been the best S on the field by miles. $35-40 mil per year on the S position--especially this unit--sounds like an Onion headline. Diggs looks like he just happened to be on the same field as a football game and nobody
told him to go away. Even last year his pro bowl alternate selection was charity because I watched him and he was horrific minus a few takeaways. Diggs and Adams look like their salaries are dependent on how many tackles they attempt without arms or impeding a ballcarriers progress. Adams appears delusional at this point. Only he can completely misread a play, blow the tackle and then celebrate the fact that somebody eventually got the ballcarrier 25 yds downfield. He looks slower than Wagner at this point.

Brooks has always imo been overrated just because he got a lot of tackles and was a 1st round pick. He was absolutely awful last year taking over for Bobby and he's only ever been able to play with next to Bobby. Bobby can play the run exceptionally well still, but he's now maybe the worst coverage LB in the league at this point in his career--granted I do think much of that is PC/CH doing everything in their power to make sure he is on an island with the opponents best WR on what feels like 75% of passing downs at this point. I do think these guys could succeed under a new regime because there is no desire to dictate the game or play to strengths. Seattles real DC is usually on the wrong sideline.

A defensive coach hasn't fielded a respectable defense since 2015. Imagine where the Eagles might be if they had given Peterson this kind of leash for his one SB. I understand they haven't won it all again, but they've done things right. PC is a fun guy I'm sure, but he doesn't draft well, develop well or game plan well. There's a reason players don't get a second contract in Seattle. Pete wants "athletes" more than he wants football players. There are some bright spots and I hope the dead weight can be cut loose before big paydays are due for the young guys.

Apologies for the long-winded diatribe

The defense looked fine, except for a few crucial missed tackles and awful penalties. They clearly went into this game to take away the big play and make Dak earn everything. It worked for the most part. Sure, they gave up yards, but that will happen when you play this style against good offenses. Ultimately, the game plan gave them the opportunity to win the game, and they came up short.

The only major issue I saw is one we've known: without Nwosu, the Seahawks' defense can't create consistent pressure. Without that disruption, they're asking a lot out of secondary, particularly the safeties, in coverage. If I were to point blame, that's where I'd look. For the past five years, most analytics have shown that you need an elite defensive line to have an effective defense. And until recently, the Seahawks have built around their secondary. They don't have a top-20 player on the D-Line, and their best player is Williams—who they got during the season. That's what separates the Seahawks D from these other teams. Dallas, for example, had similar struggles as the Hawks, but their D-Line dominated when it mattered on those last three drives.

Just the idea of building a defense from back to front just sounds idiotic. Pete would rather find 7 guys who can cover flawlessly for 5 seconds until Dline gets pressure than find a couple of linemen, or even one elite lineman, who can get to the qb in a couple of seconds. Aren't covering WRs and protecting the qb the most difficult non-qb jobs on the field?

 

[NJHawk]

I've been a major Adams supporter through the years but after tonight I don't think I can back that kind of play. He literally has the situational awareness of a defensive tackle while in coverage.

100% waste of money. Plays scared. Next man up please

 

[CPHawk]

Just the idea of building a defense from back to front just sounds idiotic. Pete would rather find 7 guys who can cover flawlessly for 5 seconds until Dline gets pressure than find a couple of linemen, or even one elite lineman, who can get to the qb in a couple of seconds. Aren't covering WRs and protecting the qb the most difficult non-qb jobs on the field?

He’s off to a great start. He found one guy that can cover, a 1 that is 50/50 he gets a flag, 1 who age has caught up, and the last guy we spent the most on can’t cover a chair.