Does anyone else think Seattle won the trade?

[toffee]

Pete get the credit for architecting one of the most dominant defenses in NFL history, and one of the most dominant NFL teams period.
He then gets the blame for pulling all the pieces out and stupidly thinking he could replace them.

Because Pete thought it was Pete. That was the core problem. Pete was good at finding great players and putting a system in place to let them be great. He wasn't just good, he was exceptional at it. (or more accurately, he was great at building teams of people that could do this).

He was a motivational and development God. And he also snapped up Scott from the 49ers after Scott filled that team full of ProBowlers.
But again, at some point Pete started thinking he was the reason for this, not the one who helped facilitate it.
The moment he believed he could replace players and be another Bill...we were screwed.

Bill is one of the greatest coaches ever. Pete is/was nowhere near that and thinking he was, was a big part of our problem.


It isn't a rant. Pete WAS great at many things if you could find a way to keep him from screwing himself up. He just isn't anymore.

Bill as Bill Parcell or Bill Walsh?

If it was Bill Walsh, then even Bill couldn't do it the second round when he was hired as GM, not HC. Check out his drafting record over that period, it wasn't pretty.

 

[TeamoftheCentury]

I going to say this. Compensation wise, Seahawks got the better deal. But we lost miserably. Russ gave us the best years of Seahawks football thus far and I wanted both Wilson and Wagner to play for no other team in their Hall-of-Fame careers.

That's football today. Thanks for everything, Russ.

 

[Rainger]

Pete get the credit for architecting one of the most dominant defenses in NFL history, and one of the most dominant NFL teams period.
He then gets the blame for pulling all the pieces out and stupidly thinking he could replace them.

Because Pete thought it was Pete. That was the core problem. Pete was good at finding great players and putting a system in place to let them be great. He wasn't just good, he was exceptional at it. (or more accurately, he was great at building teams of people that could do this).

He was a motivational and development God. And he also snapped up Scott from the 49ers after Scott filled that team full of ProBowlers.
But again, at some point Pete started thinking he was the reason for this, not the one who helped facilitate it.
The moment he believed he could replace players and be another Bill...we were screwed.

Bill is one of the greatest coaches ever. Pete is/was nowhere near that and thinking he was, was a big part of our problem.


It isn't a rant. Pete WAS great at many things if you could find a way to keep him from screwing himself up. He just isn't anymore.

 

[fullquartpress]

Bill as Bill Parcell or Bill Walsh?

If it was Bill Walsh, then even Bill couldn't do it the second round when he was hired as GM, not HC. Check out his drafting record over that period, it wasn't pretty.

My 1st Bill guess was Belichick

 

[pittpnthrs]

Man that is the pot calling the kettle black.

Had RW not been such a petulant ego and only play his sand lot football instead of executing the game plans, 2015 to 2020 would not have been sinking teams.

OMG. If Wilson wasnt the QB of those teams, Carroll and Seattle would have been below average.

Its unbelievable how many forget what a detriment Carroll has been for years now since Wilson bailed. The next few seasons will be a quick reminder. The team will never move forward until Carroll leaves.

 

[toffee]

My 1st Bill guess was Belichick

I think you ARE right.

 

[Rainger]

I think you ARE right.

Billicheat would never have been the supposed guru without Brady. Brady won most of the SB's. Seattle won their SB not because of RW but with him. How did the team fair after Brady left. My guess is Pete will have the hawks back much faster without RW.

 

[Rainger]

OMG. If Wilson wasnt the QB of those teams, Carroll and Seattle would have been below average.

Its unbelievable how many forget what a detriment Carroll has been for years now since Wilson bailed. The next few seasons will be a quick reminder. The team will never move forward until Carroll leaves.

So according to you RW was the reason that the hawks won the SB and not Pete and the team and the admin??? So without RW those 5 years of having the best D in all of football would not have happened?

In fact it is exactly because of RW that the team deteriorated. The D hated Pete's love of RW, the running game deteriorated as they kept trying to accommodate RW's ego (let Russ cook) {Puke face,} and only style of play.

 

[pittpnthrs]

So according to you RW was the reason that the hawks won the SB and not Pete and the team and the admin??? So without RW those 5 years of having the best D in all of football would not have happened?

In fact it is exactly because of RW that the team deteriorated. The D hated Pete's love of RW, the running game deteriorated as they kept trying to accommodate RW's ego (let Russ cook) {Puke face,} and only style of play.

No thats not according to me. Pete built a team on talent he was familiar with from the college ranks and through free agency pick ups like Lynch, Bennett, and Avril. Those teams were good enough to win even when Pete tried to pound square pegs through round holes. Pete lost the inside track on college talent and had weak to terrible drafts for years. He lost the locker room after the Super Bowl debacle and the LOB quickly disbanded shortly after. The teams from 2015 on were much weaker and they could no longer overcome Carrolls poor game day planning and outdated philosophy. It has only gotten worse from 2015 on except for the one saving grace - Russell Wilson. Wilson masked a lot of Carrolls deficiencies and hes no longer here.

Pete Carroll has always had to have optimum talent to win whether it was in the college ranks or the pros. He is incapable of replicating what Seattle had in the Super Bowl years and he's not a good enough coach to overcome the lack of talent. He's done. Seattle needs a change.

 

[BlueTalon]

He is incapable of replicating what Seattle had in the Super Bowl years and he's not a good enough coach to overcome the lack of talent.

Disagree. This offseason has a very 2010-2012 feel to it.

 

[Rainger]

No thats not according to me. Pete built a team on talent he was familiar with from the college ranks and through free agency pick ups like Lynch, Bennett, and Avril. Those teams were good enough to win even when Pete tried to pound square pegs through round holes. Pete lost the inside track on college talent and had weak to terrible drafts for years. He lost the locker room after the Super Bowl debacle and the LOB quickly disbanded shortly after. The teams from 2015 on were much weaker and they could no longer overcome Carrolls poor game day planning and outdated philosophy. It has only gotten worse from 2015 on except for the one saving grace - Russell Wilson. Wilson masked a lot of Carrolls deficiencies and hes no longer here.

Pete Carroll has always had to have optimum talent to win whether it was in the college ranks or the pros. He is incapable of replicating what Seattle had in the Super Bowl years and he's not a good enough coach to overcome the lack of talent. He's done. Seattle needs a change.

You really need to leave this forum and the Hawks and go become a Broncos fan and get on to their forums. There really is no place for you here!

Really why are you and John and a number of others and so many haters of the Hawks on this forum?

I don't get it, if all you and the others can do is hate and find fault and want the team to fail cause they are not doing it your way why are u even here.

Go find another team cause you are obviously not a FAN of the team. A fanatic is exactly that, they love their team regardless.

 

[flv2]

...Without the team PC built RW would have been another washed up 3rd rounder.

Unreal. SMH.

 

[Palmegranite]

Billicheat would never have been the supposed guru without Brady. Brady won most of the SB's.

You need to leave this forum and go sign up at the Tampa Bay forum immediately. There is no place for enemy team or player boosterism on Seahawks.net. Especially Brady.(unless Pete and John signed him)

This place is for fans, don't you know?

 

[sc85sis]

I did the research here and it shows the Packers ran 446 designed running plays and 626 designed passing plays. That's a 58.4% to 41.6% difference. I'm not sure where that falls in the league averages, but interesting nonetheless.

Compare that to the Seahawks last season, where they ran 413 designed running plays and 541 designed passing plays, broken down as 43.29% run vs 56.71% pass.

The Seahawks also ran 118 less offensive plays than the Packers last season.

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THe Seahawks had major 3rd down issues, which leads to fewer plays.

 

[sc85sis]

Anyone disagreeing that Russell isn't HIGHLY slow compared to old Russ is lying to themselves.

Russ ran a 4.55 at his fastest. Watch the Russell below and tell me it isn't possible that he's a half-second slower in the 40.

He's definitely faster here.

Interestingly, you can see him take the easier throws at times in this video - unlike in more recent seasons. But he also threw some passes that his receivers went up and got for him, even though the receiver sometimes had to put his body on the line to catch the ball. He gets bailed out at times.

 

[sc85sis]

Mike McCarthy says to hold his beer

They've done better since McCarthy was let go, but they still haven't been in the Super Bowl.

 

[scutterhawk]

So according to you RW was the reason that the hawks won the SB and not Pete and the team and the admin??? So without RW those 5 years of having the best D in all of football would not have happened?

In fact it is exactly because of RW that the team deteriorated. The D hated Pete's love of RW, the running game deteriorated as they kept trying to accommodate RW's ego (let Russ cook) {Puke face,} and only style of play.

I'm going to TRUTH to you Rainger, all Russ had to do is SHOW UP @ SB 48, as the Defense had de-balled Peyton Manning in that game, I mean hell, Pete could have substituted RW with his backup & STILL would have won that game.
NOW, SB 49, guess who shouldn't have thrown that PICK in the waning seconds?, guess who didn't/COULDN'T cover for his all beat to hell Defense, put the team on his back and carry them to a win?
To this day, Russ' Defensive teammates have ALL SAID that "all Wilson had to do is HAND THE DAMNED BALL OFF TO MARSHAWN LYNCH".
Again, here's how some of these PC haters reason it out->'Wilson is responsible for all of Pete's successes', BUT 'Wilson isn't responsible for Wilson's own shortcomings & failures'.

 

[sc85sis]

Unreal. SMH.

I think that's an exaggeration, as many of the comments have been on both sides.

It is true, however, that Pete is the one who gave Russ a chance to start. Pete is the one who saw what Washington was doing with RG3 and the read option and had RO plays added to the offense to take advantage of Russ' running ability. Pete was the one who stuck with Russ when he struggled early on, and people were saying Pete was an idiot for not going with Matt Flynn.

So no, Russell may not have been a "washed up third rounder," but there's no guarantee he'd ever have gotten the same opportunity to succeed with another team and coach.

(Read/zone option source: https://www.sbnation.com/longform/2012/12/27/3792740/pistol-offense-nfl-redskins-rg3, https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/11/08/pete-carroll-draws-inspiration-from-rg3-redskins/ and https://www.espn.com/blog/seattle-s...ue-to-use-option-football-with-russell-wilson)

 

[toffee]

Again, here's how some of these PC haters reason it out->'Wilson is responsible for all of Pete's successes', BUT 'Wilson isn't responsible for Wilson's own shortcomings & failures'.

I have been posting my opinion that Pete mishandled Russ, first by putting him above all teammates. Then after he help created a monster, he refused to trade away that monster. John got it right, he started personally scouting QB in 2016, first with Mahomes, then Allen, but all to be vetoed by ,,,,, guess who? Pete.

 

[keasley45]

No thats not according to me. Pete built a team on talent he was familiar with from the college ranks and through free agency pick ups like Lynch, Bennett, and Avril. Those teams were good enough to win even when Pete tried to pound square pegs through round holes. Pete lost the inside track on college talent and had weak to terrible drafts for years. He lost the locker room after the Super Bowl debacle and the LOB quickly disbanded shortly after. The teams from 2015 on were much weaker and they could no longer overcome Carrolls poor game day planning and outdated philosophy. It has only gotten worse from 2015 on except for the one saving grace - Russell Wilson. Wilson masked a lot of Carrolls deficiencies and hes no longer here.

Pete Carroll has always had to have optimum talent to win whether it was in the college ranks or the pros. He is incapable of replicating what Seattle had in the Super Bowl years and he's not a good enough coach to overcome the lack of talent. He's done. Seattle needs a change.

Explain that optimum talent that beat the superbowl favorite Saints in the playoffs...

The guy takes a team full of no names, has beens and young talent (but not yet playmakers) and literally orchestrates one of the biggest upsets in NFL playoff history, yet he's only capable of winning with superior talent?

The hate is strong.

And btw, that game was on NFL network the other day. Lots of passes going all over the field, including the middle. Timing, hot calls...

Makes you wonder what Hass could have done opposite the LOB and with Lynch established as Beastmode. That game was the birth of the Seahawks identity.