Has Cary Williams looked anything but average so far?

[Hasselbeck]

Exactly but he looks like the 3rd or 4th best corner when he is on the field with scrubs, even when playing against scrubs.

Yeah he misses his safeties he never played with (???) but he should still stand out as a key player instead of look like a guy that got cut by the Titans.

If you think Earl Thomas doesn't make a profound difference in the secondary, I don't know what to tell you.

Also.. Smith barely even tested him tonight.. so again.. not sure what you want from the guy? The Maclin TD drive appeared to have some sort of mix up on one throw. That's really the only time I remember him being thrown at tonight. He wasn't in the game long enough against Denver to even get noticed.

Oh and he played for the Eagles not the Titans.

 

[Hasselbeck]

Williams style really reminds me of Kelly jennings. He was giving receivers HUGE cushions at the LOS and his ball skills are really bad. He seems to be running with the receiver, but the receiver catches the ball anyways.

You've gathered all of this off of about 5 drives in the preseason?

:lol:

 

[SeaChase]

if he truly was elite he wouldnt have gone through 4 teams in 7 years

See Revis.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Williams style really reminds me of Kelly jennings. He was giving receivers HUGE cushions at the LOS and his ball skills are really bad. He seems to be running with the receiver, but the receiver catches the ball anyways.

You've gathered all of this off of about 5 drives in the preseason?

:lol:

I saw him quite a bit on the Eagles.

 

[Hasselbeck]

Williams style really reminds me of Kelly jennings. He was giving receivers HUGE cushions at the LOS and his ball skills are really bad. He seems to be running with the receiver, but the receiver catches the ball anyways.

You've gathered all of this off of about 5 drives in the preseason?

:lol:

I saw him quite a bit on the Eagles.

Good thing we're nothing like the Eagles defensively huh?

Let him play with the full starting unit in a game of importance .. then we can see if we got Cary Williams/Ravens version or Cary Williams/Eagles version.

 

[Hasselbeck]

Didn't we acquire another corner from the Lions? Did we acquire him, because Pete aren't fully satisfied with Williams?
I have the feeling, our corners aren't impression anyone.

He's been "injured" (code for about to be stashed on IR so he can get coached up for 2016)

 

[jake206]

He's going to be replaced by midseason. Maybe used as occasional slot corner. But he has too many bad habits already. Younger DBs don't have that problem, easier to correct incorrect technique. My candidate to replace him Ty Smith.

 

[TwistedHusky]

I am aware that he played for the Eagles...

But he still looks like a guy that could have been cut from the Titans, and that was more a dig against the Titans defense than the rest. Yes I know the Titans have a great young CB in Verner but that defense is still pretty crappy.

Not sure that it says much robbing the vaunted Eagles secondary either....but if the ball is in your area you should know how to contest the pass.

I guess I will stop calling the guy Cary Jennings once I see him play better than the rookies have played when they got a chance to play in a game. So far, a veteran has looked like a downgrade vs players like Simon - and those guys managed to standout against 1s even in games when Earl, Kam and Sherm were not in. So call me a cautious skeptic right now.

Given all the other issues in the game, this seems like nitpicking. But considering Kams concern that his contract #s might cause the team not to renew him next year, it makes sense to scrutinize a pretty hefty price tag for a pretty average looking corner given the amount that ever dollar matters now.

 

[DavidSeven]

Again, I'd like to see mention of actual plays. He got tested twice, I think. Maclin got him on an underneath route, which all of our corners except Sherman give up routinely as a matter of technique. And he also got him on a 6-yard dump off which looked like a miscommunication with the safety. The TD was on Irvin.

I also saw Smith look off Cary's side multiple times, and he even took coverage sack from Mebane while looking that direction. Not that any of this means anything. I just don't think the info is available yet.

 

[BigMeach]

Cut him? Lol, why would we cut him?

It's preseason and he is playing out there with guys who might have trouble seeing the field if it weren't for injuries(IN PRESEASON). The miscommunication happening right now in that secondary and the very generic play calling happening due to so many DB's out make it a little unfair to grade him off the team so early. They basically played only zone but they are doing it without a rangy safety like Earl or a lockdown corner on Sherman's side.

It's very hard to grade a CB without viewing the All-22, broadcast footage doesn't show much. For all we know he shut down guys all night but then once or twice gets beat from miscommunication (which is where we then see him in coverage on the broadcast)

I just don't understand why people are jumping the gun in preseason, would you rather we went 4-0 and decimated everyone like we did with Jim Mora? Boy we really were good then!

We should cut him :sarcasm_on:

 

[TwistedHusky]

We still have several games for him to pan out but the last thing we need to pee away the $11 million in the remaining years of his contract when we have so many guys we are going to be digging in the couch for nickels to keep.

If he doesn't produce by the final games of the preseaon?

Hell yes they should cut him.

He cost us 3.5 this season and it bumps up to 5, & 6 the years after.

But the question becomes cap hit. How much you save (because at this point I don't think you lose that much going with one of the guys like Simon or Lane or even keeping a raw guy like McNeil (spelling?) and hoping you can train him to be more.

On the field, Carry J hasn't flashed at all. Not once as a Seahawk but there are several games to be played.
(Then again sometimes when guys just don't live up to expectations they could be hurt, but I am pretty sure I have seen a few teams gut his coverage like a fish when he was an Eagle, so I am hopeful but not foolish enough to be optimistic here)

What does it cost if this is a mistake? What does it cost later if we wait?



To me the guy stinks of Jennings enough that I worry. If it was a rookie? maybe but a vet should have some ball instincts and he is not going to magically get them just because the uniform is a different color.

I don't like the sunk cost issue, because sunk costs just become larger costs over time when you go with a bad decision. Maybe you leave that time to pan out but sometimes you have to take a Harvin (ie cut a non-producer and take the cap hit in the near term), suck it up, and save cap room for paying guys like Kam.

We will see.

 

[BigMeach]

We still have several games for him to pan out but the last thing we need to pee away the $11 million in the remaining years of his contract when we have so many guys we are going to be digging in the couch for nickels to keep.

If he doesn't produce by the final games of the preseaon?

Hell yes they should cut him.

He cost us 3.5 this season and it bumps up to 5, & 6 the years after.

But the question becomes cap hit. How much you save (because at this point I don't think you lose that much going with one of the guys like Simon or Lane or even keeping a raw guy like McNeil (spelling?) and hoping you can train him to be more.

On the field, Carry J hasn't flashed at all. Not once as a Seahawk but there are several games to be played.
(Then again sometimes when guys just don't live up to expectations they could be hurt, but I am pretty sure I have seen a few teams gut his coverage like a fish when he was an Eagle, so I am hopeful but not foolish enough to be optimistic here)

What does it cost if this is a mistake? What does it cost later if we wait?



To me the guy stinks of Jennings enough that I worry. If it was a rookie? maybe but a vet should have some ball instincts and he is not going to magically get them just because the uniform is a different color.

I don't like the sunk cost issue, because sunk costs just become larger costs over time when you go with a bad decision. Maybe you leave that time to pan out but sometimes you have to take a Harvin (ie cut a non-producer and take the cap hit in the near term), suck it up, and save cap room for paying guys like Kam.

We will see.

Without watching the all-22 I just don't see how you can speak on a DB's proficiency in two games from preseason, there is just so little you get to see with the broadcast footage. I'm not saying I have watched it, but I'll give a guy the benefit of the doubt until I can see for myself or see a good breakdown of the all-22.

In re-watching the game what I have seen is the few times he was beat it was communication with other DB's on the field who are young and it wasn't really him getting beat. All the plays where the ball isn't going his way I can't see and don't know if it's because of good coverage or not. Unless he is thrown at you just don't see enough and the only way to really flash as a DB is to get thrown at. To say he needs to flash in preseason or be cut is ludicrous to me. I know that isn't specifically what you said but that is what it sounded like.

I feel like Pete and John don't go out and get this guy if they didn't see him fitting well with the rest of the legion and what we do and I trust those two when it comes to CB over anyone. Because of this, going by anything he did on previous teams doesn't really amount to much in my view.

We haven't been doing what we do in the preseason because of injuries and vanilla defense. We can't even really play man right now because of the amount of CB's out. Another reason I just don't see us cutting him in the preseason is the fact we have so many ailing/injured/recovering/holdout CB's in the first place.

As far as Kam goes, even if they did cut Williams and open enough cap to give Kam more money I would hope they wouldn't do it. I'm more worried about setting that precedent than having Kam back, as much as I love Kam and what he does for this team.

 

[BigMeach]

Again, I'd like to see mention of actual plays. He got tested twice, I think. Maclin got him on an underneath route, which all of our corners except Sherman give up routinely as a matter of technique. And he also got him on a 6-yard dump off which looked like a miscommunication with the safety. The TD was on Irvin.

I also saw Smith look off Cary's side multiple times, and he even took coverage sack from Mebane while looking that direction. Not that any of this means anything. I just don't think the info is available yet.

I believe you're referring to the pass right before the touchdown. I re-watched that a couple times and found it wasn't that Williams got beat so much as he thought that Bailey was going to switch with him when they motioned to stack. By the time Williams realized he wasn't doing this it was too late. This is an example of the inexperience of playing together and something that has naught to do with actual skill.

Also a perfect example of how little information we get from watching the broadcast coverage, really only get to gather information on a DB when he is thrown at. Considering he only was caught on twice and at least one of those times was due to communication I for one am not ruling out Williams whatsoever.

 

[BlueThunder]

Here, he's not expected to be the #1 or 2 guy like he's spent a good chunk of his career so far. Here, he's the fourth guy. Once the LOB is healthy, I think you'll all calm down a bit once he settles in and gets comfortable knowing that someone's got his back and he can concentrate on less of the field...

Jeez... some of you guys need to calm down. So spoiled we've become... Jeez...

Pre-season, game 2, with no LOB. Let's save out bitchin' for, say, week 2 of the regular season.

 

[Rob12]

Holy hell :lol:

Let him play with #29 over the top and #25 on the other side please

LOL. Yes, this.

 

[Bigbadhawk]

If he gets cut it will not be until next year.

Perhaps my thinking is off and someone can correct me if so but Cary would be $4,666,666 in dead money since its post June 1st 2015 if he is cut right now. A team is allowed to designate 2 people a year as post June 1st cuts which would allow the team to split up the dead money for those 2 players for the current season and the next season at a 1/3 & 2/3 ratio. So if Cary was cut and they were able to designate him as one of the 2 post June 1st cuts he would count 1,555,555$ in dead money for 2015 and 3,111,111$ in dead money for 2016. This would save us 3,111,111$ for 2015. If he isn't able to be designated that then all 4,666,666$ would count against 2015 cap which would mean he save 0$ this year.

I believed the Seahawk's plan with Cary is to cut him in 2016. This would buy the team a year to develop a younger, cheaper replacement.

I also believe PFF graded Cary slightly better then Maxwell for 2014 for what its worth.

 

[HawKnPeppa]

The guy seems to remind me more of the Seahawk corners we had before Carroll got here.

Seems like the big weak link on the LOB, even with 3/4 of the LOB sitting on the sideline.

He isn't as good as everyone says that he is. Lacks make up speed, and that is a big one for me. Quite frankly I think we can go without him. Let him go and maybe there would be some extra money under the cap to entice Kam to return and reward Michael Bennett for his loyalty and play. Hey I'll ride with the young rough riders of Simon, Smith, Burley and Blackmon and see where the chips may fall.

One last note, Shead lacks the foot speed to quickly change direction and stay with the receiver. Noticeable during the game tonight.

Ummm, yeah really 'noticeable' deficiency in 'foot speed,' considering the fact that he balled out. Glad that somebody has a keen enough eye to 'notice' that, despite excellent play at CB, he actually sucks. [emoji33] Thanks!

 

[HawKnPeppa]

Exactly but he looks like the 3rd or 4th best corner when he is on the field with scrubs, even when playing against scrubs.

Yeah he misses his safeties he never played with (???) but he should still stand out as a key player instead of look like a guy that got cut by the Titans.

If you think Earl Thomas doesn't make a profound difference in the secondary, I don't know what to tell you.

Also.. Smith barely even tested him tonight.. so again.. not sure what you want from the guy? The Maclin TD drive appeared to have some sort of mix up on one throw. That's really the only time I remember him being thrown at tonight. He wasn't in the game long enough against Denver to even get noticed.

Oh and he played for the Eagles not the Titans.

There was no mix up. The play was designed to get a Maclin - Irvin mismatch.

 

[HawKnPeppa]

Williams style really reminds me of Kelly jennings. He was giving receivers HUGE cushions at the LOS and his ball skills are really bad. He seems to be running with the receiver, but the receiver catches the ball anyways.

You've gathered all of this off of about 5 drives in the preseason?

[emoji38]

I saw him quite a bit on the Eagles.

Good thing we're nothing like the Eagles defensively huh?

Let him play with the full starting unit in a game of importance .. then we can see if we got Cary Williams/Ravens version or Cary Williams/Eagles version.

Kelly Jennings?! Look, fellas, Williams at Baltimore had Ed Reed. Philly has no Safeties of that caliber. With Earl, he will carry out his role just fine I expect.

 

[HawKnPeppa]

I am aware that he played for the Eagles...

But he still looks like a guy that could have been cut from the Titans, and that was more a dig against the Titans defense than the rest. Yes I know the Titans have a great young CB in Verner but that defense is still pretty crappy.

Not sure that it says much robbing the vaunted Eagles secondary either....but if the ball is in your area you should know how to contest the pass.

I guess I will stop calling the guy Cary Jennings once I see him play better than the rookies have played when they got a chance to play in a game. So far, a veteran has looked like a downgrade vs players like Simon - and those guys managed to standout against 1s even in games when Earl, Kam and Sherm were not in. So call me a cautious skeptic right now.

Given all the other issues in the game, this seems like nitpicking. But considering Kams concern that his contract #s might cause the team not to renew him next year, it makes sense to scrutinize a pretty hefty price tag for a pretty average looking corner given the amount that ever dollar matters now.

SMH.