Fieldgulls: There’s something wrong with Russell Wilson

[vin.couve12]

Outside of a couple of games he's looked like a journeyman QB for the rest.

I don't know why people can't be real about the QB position or RW in general. Look at his stats, his fantasy value, etc....he's been one of the worst out there through seven games. You may not like it, and obviously there are injuries that compound everything and some OL inconsistencies, but it's the truth. He's flat out been bad outside of a couple games.

This kind of take baffles me. I know you're not a Wilson fan from your previous posts but the dude is playing through injuries that possibly no other starter in the league would play through and behind what is possibly the worst line in the league. Of course something is wrong and he looks like a "journeyman". Every other QB in the league would look the same under these curcumstances. :shock:

"Not a Wilson fan" doesn't quite cover it. Normally, I think he's just a shade under elite as a QB. I just can't stand it when he talks. There's a difference...player vs other stuff.

Regardless, in both ESPN stats and nfl.com stats he is the 26th rated QB in the league and there are 32 teams total. As for the Fantasy value, which reallly doesn't matter, but shows the ineptitude, he's thrown 5 TDs all year.

The aforementioned statistics are facts and this is not all on the OL. He has been missing reads left and right and camping with the football when he does have time.

Obviously you're not going to play Boykin or some stupid crap, but the truth is the truth.

 

[Hawks46]

The problem with highlighting a couple of plays is that EVERY QB in the league misses multiple reads in a game. With all the cat and mouse games and going back and forth you're going to miss some. I would agree that he hasn't been as sharp as he normally is but thats to be expected. He's pressing a little, battling multiple injuries and wondering how the protection is going to be every time he drops back.

Oh, I'd totally agree with this, which is why I actually watch more than just "hey, look there was a wide open WR on that play" when I watch stuff. You watch the OL first to see what the QB sees. Then you look at the WRs. Then you look at the WRs, stop the film, then look at where the QB is and what he was able to see.

There's two problems with this: first, if you're cherry picking stuff, there's also stuff the QB missed that wasn't mentioned. Secondly, some of this stuff is OBVIOUS. And I mean easy. Wilson missed his 6'7" safety valve of a TE with hands like glue, while rolling out. Thing is, Graham is running WITH him on a drag route, right in front of him, WIDE open. We've seen Wilson make that play 100 times or more. Why he would think "nope !" and pull it down, duck back INTO pressure and the OL scrum, run through it, then throw a low percentage throw to Michael, who doesn't have the size or hands of Jimmy is quite frankly beyond me. I honestly can't think of a good reason for it. Seeing it from 3 different angles, and I still just don't get it.

And blaming this on a "terrible" OL is low hanging fruit and lazy analysis. Our OL has the 7th best sack rate in the NFL. That might be the high point of Wilson's career. That also accounts for sacks like last week where he rolls right into the guy. Wilson obviously knows the play...Ifedi is pulling from the right side. It's almost impossible for that guy to take an inside rush on that, the ONLY avenue he really has is going outside, yet Wilson rolls right into it. Last year, we were saying "our OL is so bad, the sack rate doesnt' account for all the guys Wilson makes miss" which was true. This year, the opposite is true. Wilson is throwing balls away instead of making guys miss, yet his completion % isn't that much worse than his career average.

Summary: IT'S NOT ALL ON THE OL. The only part I'd put on it is the lack of a running game. That would take more pressure off of Wilson than jus magically getting better in your pass protection techniques (that are some of the highest since Wilson has been here). He's getting time. He also might have the 3 best Interior OLmen since he's been here. He's getting a pocket. He's not using them.

 

[mikeak]

Outside of a couple of games he's looked like a journeyman QB for the rest.

I don't know why people can't be real about the QB position or RW in general. Look at his stats, his fantasy value, etc....he's been one of the worst out there through seven games. You may not like it, and obviously there are injuries that compound everything and some OL inconsistencies, but it's the truth. He's flat out been bad outside of a couple games.

The issue I have is that come desperation time / end of halfs we move the ball almost at will. I refuse to believe that every single team plays soft zone at that point.

So that tells me that it isn't RW holding RW back.......

 

[AgentDib]

Nobody is critiquing Russell's lack of rushing yards. The concern is that he's struggled this year with both accuracy and decision making. The million dollar question is whether that is completely due to trying to compensate for his injuries. The next couple of weeks will affect how people view that as he gets rid of the knee brace.

For now, I'm in the camp that injuries explain most of our outcomes this season.

 

[AgentDib]

The issue I have is that come desperation time / end of halfs we move the ball almost at will. I refuse to believe that every single team plays soft zone at that point. So that tells me that it isn't RW holding RW back.......

I think most fans around here understand that just fine after seven years of watching the PC/JS regime.

Pete knows that his defense is championship caliber and doesn't want the offense to take chances that could lead to opposing points. That philosophy has worked for us pretty well over the years in the W/L column. Heck, it should have worked last week even in the Saints dome at 10 am if Russ doesn't throw the INT, or we don't flub the FG, or we don't have those huge phantom defensive penalties, or Russ puts a tiny bit less on that final pass, etc.

From what I've seen it's a minority that still gets upset by a lack of offensive numbers but they're just very vocal about it. Most understand that our offense is intended to be efficient rather than voluminous and it's the lack of efficiency so far this season that has them concerned.

 

[LeftHandSmoke]

The issue I have is that come desperation time / end of halfs we move the ball almost at will. I refuse to believe that every single team plays soft zone at that point. So that tells me that it isn't RW holding RW back.......

I think most fans around here understand that just fine after seven years of watching the PC/JS regime.

Pete knows that his defense is championship caliber and doesn't want the offense to take chances that could lead to opposing points. That philosophy has worked for us pretty well over the years in the W/L column. Heck, it should have worked last week even in the Saints dome at 10 am if Russ doesn't throw the INT, or we don't flub the FG, or we don't have those huge phantom defensive penalties, or Russ puts a tiny bit less on that final pass, etc.

From what I've seen it's a minority that still gets upset by a lack of offensive numbers but they're just very vocal about it. Most understand that our offense is intended to be efficient rather than voluminous and it's the lack of efficiency so far this season that has them concerned.

:ditto:

Nailed it

 

[vin.couve12]

The issue I have is that come desperation time / end of halfs we move the ball almost at will. I refuse to believe that every single team plays soft zone at that point. So that tells me that it isn't RW holding RW back.......

I think most fans around here understand that just fine after seven years of watching the PC/JS regime.

Pete knows that his defense is championship caliber and doesn't want the offense to take chances that could lead to opposing points. That philosophy has worked for us pretty well over the years in the W/L column. Heck, it should have worked last week even in the Saints dome at 10 am if Russ doesn't throw the INT, or we don't flub the FG, or we don't have those huge phantom defensive penalties, or Russ puts a tiny bit less on that final pass, etc.

From what I've seen it's a minority that still gets upset by a lack of offensive numbers but they're just very vocal about it. Most understand that our offense is intended to be efficient rather than voluminous and it's the lack of efficiency so far this season that has them concerned.

That's actually a pretty good summary. Nice work.

 

[LeftHandSmoke]

--
RENTON The Seahawks have tried to discuss with Russell Wilson the merits of resting one or any of his three injuries. Yet he will play on Monday for the 81st consecutive time to begin his career when Seattle (4-2-1) hosts Buffalo (4-4).

“They tried to talk to me about the idea of not playing,” Wilson said Friday of the sprained ankle and knee he got in the first three games, in September. “There was no chance. I was playing. There was no chance I wasn’t playing.”

http://www.thenewstribune.com/sports/nf ... 28928.html

 

[HawKnPeppa]

Outside of a couple of games he's looked like a journeyman QB for the rest.

I don't know why people can't be real about the QB position or RW in general. Look at his stats, his fantasy value, etc....he's been one of the worst out there through seven games. You may not like it, and obviously there are injuries that compound everything and some OL inconsistencies, but it's the truth. He's flat out been bad outside of a couple games.

Dude. Back off on the hyperbole juice.

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[HawKnPeppa]

There is something wrong with Russell, he's hurt.

It's not rocket science to come to the conclusion that he's not as accurate and missing reads when he's dealing with three major injuries, has no RB and the worst O-line in franchise history giving him less than two seconds to throw the ball.

Thanks Fieldgulls for your amazing insight.

It's unfalsifiable to say that Wilson is missing reads because of his injuries. It's very possible that he's missing them because he's...just missing them.

I know that scares us because there's no easy way out of it except the long painful process of watching Wilson grow, but that doesn't change the fact you can't lay everything at the feet of his OL and his injuries. It also doesn't help that Wilson has long had a well-documented habit of running himself out of his blocks and into pressure (the final near-sack by Cameron Jordan being a fine example). And you're ignoring the fact that Wilson is getting the ball out faster than he ever has in his career (less than 2.4 seconds this season) yet having a career-poor stretch.

QB play is the primary driver of an offense. Has been for several years now. We need to hold Wilson accountable for his mistakes instead of scrambling to blame them on EVERYTHING else.

And then we need to shrug, smile, and sit back with a beer realizing that Wilson will learn, will improve, and will continue to be our franchise QB for a long time.

Yes, yes, you've said it before. Who needs an OL? You are being every bit as subjective by trying to shift all blame away for a horrendous OL. You somehow don't or won't realize how important having one is, largley because of stubborness to open your eyes, and face a false belief. Is the poor run blocking also Wilson's faul?. That DOES make what we do much more predictable, but, naw, must be the RB's fault. Can't be the OL because they really have no bearing on anyone's success.

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[HawKnPeppa]

He's injured, but it's more than just physical limitations that's hurting the offense.

Our deep passing game is gone. Typically, we're in the top 3 in the league in explosive plays. It's a big part of our offense, and enables us to pound away with 3 yard runs a lot more. A team can get 5-6 runs between 2-3 yards in a drive and not be hurt when they uncork a 25 yard pass. Not only is the production itself gone, but it also makes our offense more 1 dimensional and easier to defend. No deep drops. No deep routes. The safeties can sit at a certain level and know they won't be challenged deep and be able to keep everything in front of them. We're making teams' secondaries better by making their jobs easier.

Wilson doesn't have to run, we've seen that last year. But it's the threat of running that keeps teams honest. Some try to spy him. Some try to contain him in the pocket. But when he rolls out and moves around, it ends up holding LBers and that makes it easier to hit those scramble intermediate throws.

Our OL is actually better in pass protection than last year. Our run game sucks, but we're starting to see how much of that hinged on Wilson's mobility as well. A healthy Wilson can produce like last year with deep routes, quick passes and the run game. It's also worth mentioning he probably picks up 2-3 first downs per game with his legs; the little 4 and 5 yard stuff we're not converting now. 2-3 extended drives per game is a big deal.

As Greg Bell of the Trubune has written more than once, RW has masked deficiencies of the OL for quite some time now.
Normally with his legs, but can't do that now, so it shows. He's getting rid of the ball faster which makes the pass pro look better than it actually is. No deep-drop, explosives because 1. Teams don't respect our run game. 2. The coaches are blowing smoke up our butts regarding how well the OL pass protects.

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[HawKnPeppa]

Field Gulls has regressed since the mass exodous to HB's site.

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[HawKnPeppa]

Montana I think in a vacuum you're right but the pressure issue is something that effects every play even if he's being pressured on that particular play. It's always in the back of his mind and the breakdowns happen so often its hard not anticipating another one around the corner. He's been pressured an incredible amount of times this year, not sure what the number is but when I saw it on twitter it almost defied belief. But I do agree he didn't have a great game for sure. I think he gets back on track this week.

I can agree with that. The Saints game wasn't a good one for him. Also agree that you can't just look at sack numbers. Total pressures and QB hits are near the worst in the league.

I have never liked field gulls. Never click.

Yep, same here.

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[Lords of Scythia]

The title's just click-bait. There's something wrong with Russell Wilson, we all know this--his legs are screwed up. This is a situation that is getting better every game.

 

[bandiger]

He's injured, but it's more than just physical limitations that's hurting the offense.

Our deep passing game is gone. Typically, we're in the top 3 in the league in explosive plays. It's a big part of our offense, and enables us to pound away with 3 yard runs a lot more. A team can get 5-6 runs between 2-3 yards in a drive and not be hurt when they uncork a 25 yard pass. Not only is the production itself gone, but it also makes our offense more 1 dimensional and easier to defend. No deep drops. No deep routes. The safeties can sit at a certain level and know they won't be challenged deep and be able to keep everything in front of them. We're making teams' secondaries better by making their jobs easier.

Wilson doesn't have to run, we've seen that last year. But it's the threat of running that keeps teams honest. Some try to spy him. Some try to contain him in the pocket. But when he rolls out and moves around, it ends up holding LBers and that makes it easier to hit those scramble intermediate throws.

Our OL is actually better in pass protection than last year. Our run game sucks, but we're starting to see how much of that hinged on Wilson's mobility as well. A healthy Wilson can produce like last year with deep routes, quick passes and the run game. It's also worth mentioning he probably picks up 2-3 first downs per game with his legs; the little 4 and 5 yard stuff we're not converting now. 2-3 extended drives per game is a big deal.

As Greg Bell of the Trubune has written more than once, RW has masked deficiencies of the OL for quite some time now.
Normally with his legs, but can't do that now, so it shows. He's getting rid of the ball faster which makes the pass pro look better than it actually is. No deep-drop, explosives because 1. Teams don't respect our run game. 2. The coaches are blowing smoke up our butts regarding how well the OL pass protects.

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Exactly the team's run game is one of the worst in the league. Fix that first before harping about RW's performance. Prove that having a crappy o-line is actually fine to have with a defense that has a bend but don't break approach and rarely creates turnovers or scores

 

[CodeWarrior]

Exactly the team's run game is one of the worst in the league. Fix that first before harping about RW's performance. Prove that having a crappy o-line is actually fine to have with a defense that has a bend but don't break approach and rarely creates turnovers or scores

The primary reason the defense doesn't create turnovers is because our offense doesn't force opposing teams into a position where they are forced to take chances.

 

[Lords of Scythia]

He's injured, but it's more than just physical limitations that's hurting the offense.

Our deep passing game is gone. Typically, we're in the top 3 in the league in explosive plays. It's a big part of our offense, and enables us to pound away with 3 yard runs a lot more. A team can get 5-6 runs between 2-3 yards in a drive and not be hurt when they uncork a 25 yard pass. Not only is the production itself gone, but it also makes our offense more 1 dimensional and easier to defend. No deep drops. No deep routes. The safeties can sit at a certain level and know they won't be challenged deep and be able to keep everything in front of them. We're making teams' secondaries better by making their jobs easier.

Wilson doesn't have to run, we've seen that last year. But it's the threat of running that keeps teams honest. Some try to spy him. Some try to contain him in the pocket. But when he rolls out and moves around, it ends up holding LBers and that makes it easier to hit those scramble intermediate throws.

Our OL is actually better in pass protection than last year. Our run game sucks, but we're starting to see how much of that hinged on Wilson's mobility as well. A healthy Wilson can produce like last year with deep routes, quick passes and the run game. It's also worth mentioning he probably picks up 2-3 first downs per game with his legs; the little 4 and 5 yard stuff we're not converting now. 2-3 extended drives per game is a big deal.

As Greg Bell of the Trubune has written more than once, RW has masked deficiencies of the OL for quite some time now.
Normally with his legs, but can't do that now, so it shows. He's getting rid of the ball faster which makes the pass pro look better than it actually is. No deep-drop, explosives because 1. Teams don't respect our run game. 2. The coaches are blowing smoke up our butts regarding how well the OL pass protects.

Sent from my SC-02H using Tapatalk

Exactly the team's run game is one of the worst in the league. Fix that first before harping about RW's performance. Prove that having a crappy o-line is actually fine to have with a defense that has a bend but don't break approach and rarely creates turnovers or scores

Wilson's running opens up the regular running game. There are different defensive looks out there to defend against it, and they can get gashed up the middle.

 

[Bigpumpkin]

It is very obvious to everyone on this message board that the Seahawks are not playing "Seahawk football" the way we have been seeing the past few years. To me, the team does not look as "hungry" as I've seen in the past. We see an occasional "exceptional play" but the team cannot seem to do it consistently by "marching down the field and score". This weekend marks the mid season point. Historically....this is when the Hawks turn on the "afterburner" and mow down our opponents.

Should we lose to the Bills this Monday, this season is tilting the wrong direction and those in line for season tickets might well see a shorter line. If I am watching this message board correctly, the number of "hits" is down from last year. Watching the list of those "online" appears to be shorter this year. Sports shows keep talking about the loss of interest in the NFL. So perhaps that is the reason why fewer people are here and not necessarily our team's poor play.

 

[chris98251]

Wilson is hurt and we don't know what kind of limitations he is feeling that he is not disclosing, but having a Pec problem and then both legs banged up means he has delivery problems with velocity and probably being able to go into deeper patterns since he has limited leg drive into throws, those across the filed throws or bullets and or deep patterns are not there for him. not because the receiver isn't open but because he knows he can't get the ball there or doesn't trust that he can.

 

[Cyrus12]

probably on his way to David Carr 2.0 because of the horrendous o line and poor drafting...oh well he won us one title.