2 QBs, Goff and Geno.

toffee

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Geno was written off, but hey, so was Goff although not as much but Rams didn't want him and Detroit wasn't in love either. Last season, both 'wrote back' and both made pro bowl. I thought Geno had a better season than Goff? This season, Goff is having better stats and Lions are having better record. Any opinions on these two? Currently, Goff is the top ranked QB on PFF, with Geno at #9.

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SoulfishHawk

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There used to be a narrative that Goff sucks. Not all, he's a damn good QB. When he put his finger back in place and shredded our defense in the playoffs, I gained a lot of respect for that guy. Tough dude with some legit grit. And he's won big games. Goff can sling it and rarely throws picks these days.
 

renofox

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I am assuming PFF does not weight redzone plays differently than non-redzone plays. That's the only way those rankings even begin to make sense.

Geno has played well between the 20's, but that doesn't win games.

Rankings are.great. Helping win games is better.
 

hoxrox

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Tua and Goff should be high on this list. They have the most productive offenses in the NFL right now.

1697566317454

We could be top 5 if we can solve red zone issues.
 

Lagartixa

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The issue with Goff, which the Patriots used to embarrass the Rams in the Super Bowl, allowing them to score only three points, is that he didn't know how to read a defense, so he relied on McVay to look at the defense and tell Goff what to do via the in-helmet radio. The Patriots suspected this, so they'd line up one way, then change their alignment once the play clock got to 15 seconds and Goff could no longer hear McVay because the communication gets cut off at that point.

Goff has genuinely played like a top-five QB this season. I'm not sure if he's learned to read defenses (we're, uh, familiar with at least one QB who never did), but I'm guessing he has, because I can't imagine other NFL teams not using "the book" on him that Belichick wrote and showed everyone in the world on the most-watched TV broadcast of that year.

I've got nothing against the Lions except when the Seahawks are playing them, so I guess I could stop calling their QB JaGoff, a name that never caught on even though I started using it in his early days with the Rams and never really stopped. It's just I really enjoy that one.

Yes, Goff has clearly been better than Smith this season, but they were roughly equal in the game they played against each other this season (Smith was a little better in QBR, Goff was a little better in passer rating). Last season, Goff and Smith ended up having seasons of similar quality overall - both in the top ten in the league, with Goff ahead of Smith by some measures and Smith ahead of Goff by others.
 
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toffee

toffee

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The issue with Goff, which the Patriots used to embarrass the Rams in the Super Bowl, allowing them to score only three points, is that he didn't know how to read a defense, so he relied on McVay to look at the defense and tell Goff what to do via the in-helmet radio. The Patriots suspected this, so they'd line up one way, then change their alignment once the play clock got to 15 seconds and Goff could no longer hear McVay because the communication gets cut off at that point.

Goff has genuinely played like a top-five QB this season. I'm not sure if he's learned to read defenses (we're, uh, familiar with at least one QB who never did), but I'm guessing he has, because I can't imagine other NFL teams not using "the book" on him that Belichick wrote and showed everyone in the world on the most-watched TV broadcast of that year.

I've got nothing against the Lions except when the Seahawks are playing them, so I guess I could stop calling their QB JaGoff, a name that never caught on even though I started using it in his early days with the Rams and never really stopped. It's just I really enjoy that one.

Yes, Goff has clearly been better than Smith this season, but they were roughly equal in the game they played against each other this season (Smith was a little better in QBR, Goff was a little better in passer rating). Last season, Goff and Smith ended up having seasons of similar quality overall - both in the top ten in the league, with Goff ahead of Smith by some measures and Smith ahead of Goff by others.
The other possibility could be McVay likes to micromanage, just saying.
 

knownone

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Geno was written off, but hey, so was Goff although not as much but Rams didn't want him and Detroit wasn't in love either. Last season, both 'wrote back' and both made pro bowl. I thought Geno had a better season than Goff? This season, Goff is having better stats and Lions are having better record. Any opinions on these two? Currently, Goff is the top ranked QB on PFF, with Geno at #9.

View attachment 61281
Goff plays behind a top 3 O-Line. Geno does not. That's where it gets hard to compare the two statistically.

If you can access PFF, look at O-Line pressures, then QB Own Pressures Allowed.
 
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Ozzy

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What's a good metric for rating QBs?
Honestly I don't have a good answer to that. I think Passer rating is possibly the best even though its flawed. YPA and TD/INT ratios as well. Those would proably be my 3
 

knownone

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The traditional ones in my opinion. Qb rating, completion percentage, TD/int ratio, W/L . Not a system that puts Fields ahead of Brock Purdy
That is understandable; some advanced metrics paint Purdy as a system QB. In the sense that he's not creating much on his own, which is why Fields tends to rate better in some areas; however, Purdy destroys him in efficiency.

Traditional stats are limited. They give a suitable generalization of a player's current performance but lack the proper context for evaluation. And they have the same issues you've hinted at. For example, Justin Fields is right up there with Pat Mahomes in every category but W/L and CMP%, and suddenly Sam Howell is in the same territory as Lamar Jackson, Dak Prescott, Joe Burrow, and Matt Stafford. Fun Fact: Sam Howell is on pace for 96 sacks (this made me laugh, so I included it).
 

LTH

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I think Toffe's guy breaks it down. Do you guys agree with this? I think it shows the lack of pass protection. Not sure I agree with statements like Phil Haynes can't play left guard... I mean he is playing hurt. But for the most part it breaks it down.

 

Fade

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These are not rankings, just grades on what they've been asked to do so far.

Not every QB is asked to do the same thing, not every QB plays against the same level of defense, and not every QB has the same level of talent around them.

Then there is the scheme. Tua by far is in the best situation in the league. I still have him as a top 10 QB, but MM is going to push him up to MVP level.

To rank QBs properly you have to be able to understand all of these factors and watch the cutups of each one.

Goff in NE would be called washed.

Purdy on most other NFL rosters is just okay.

CMC and Deebo go out of the game and Purdy turned into a pumpkin.
 

Pandion Haliaetus

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Funny. I’m not sure how long Goff is under contract for and if the Lions see him as the future as they drafted Hooker but I thought the other day that in one or two years if Goff is available and Waldron is still here, they’d be good together.

I’m not saying Geno is bad but some of y’all want to push that narrative, just saying if Geno doesn’t have it and Lock doesn’t have it, and the Seahawks can’t draft their guy in the next 2 drafts, Goff is probably the QB at the top of my list.
 
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