This defense is unacceptable

[cymatica]

Okay. That's not how reality works. But at least now I understand where you are coming from.

How does it really work?

 

[knownone]

How does it really work?

Simple: How much you invest has little bearing on performance, particularly when a player suffers a significant injury post-investment. Therefore, the idea that the game shouldn't have been close against a top 5 team—simply because Seattle has poured resources into their defense—is absurd.

That doesn't exonerate the front office, by the way. Where they've invested resources is one of the most significant issues I've had with the team.

 

[Ozzy]

I'm baffled anyone can think the defense played good last night? A team scored 41 points and didn't punt. Even if a couple of drives were extended by penalties its still an ugly game for the defense. We have a defensive guru as a coach yet even with investing like 5 second round picks, multiple first round picks, multiple high level trades we still have one of the worst defenses in the league and its continued to get worse over an 8 year period.

Dallas had one of their best performances of the year last night. The defense has to play better than it did. This archaic scheme which Beinemy said is easy to game plan for continues to get killed by opposing teams. Thick picked on Bobby last night in the soft zone look over and over. It's hard to watch.

I'm not a hater either, I've been critical of Geno but I thought he played very well last night. A couple of mistakes but overall much better than he has been playing. The defense was really bad last night.

 

[knownone]

The lesson here is that people don't read. They infer. You make a benign comment that the defense was fine given the circumstances and gave the team a chance to win with timely stops while also being critical of the team's personnel decisions. And somehow, people morph that comment into the ludicrous statement that the defense was good. The defense was not good. As far as I can tell, no one is making that argument.

 

[TwistedHusky]

At some point, it's less about the players and more about the plan. We use players in ways that don't suit them. We run plays our players aren't well suited for. We use strategies don't fit our opponent.
There must be a reason. But it's baffling.

 

[MORGULON]

Woolen is going to likely get single digits coverage grade tonight. Lamb took his lunch money, back pack, girlfriend.

Then crapped in his toilet and didn't flush

 

[MORGULON]

This has been it. Combined with the atrocious coaching/playcalling, since week one I have been blown away by the fact that we are putting out what looks like the two worst defensive units in the league and it appeared like nobody really noticed. I have been waiting for an article or even the radio to come right out and at least confirm what I thought I had been seeing all year.

Safety has been maddening and even if Love has been ok, he's had some seriously embarrassing moments and has still been the best S on the field by miles. $35-40 mil per year on the S position--especially this unit--sounds like an Onion headline. Diggs looks like he just happened to be on the same field as a football game and nobody
told him to go away. Even last year his pro bowl alternate selection was charity because I watched him and he was horrific minus a few takeaways. Diggs and Adams look like their salaries are dependent on how many tackles they attempt without arms or impeding a ballcarriers progress. Adams appears delusional at this point. Only he can completely misread a play, blow the tackle and then celebrate the fact that somebody eventually got the ballcarrier 25 yds downfield. He looks slower than Wagner at this point.

Brooks has always imo been overrated just because he got a lot of tackles and was a 1st round pick. He was absolutely awful last year taking over for Bobby and he's only ever been able to play with next to Bobby. Bobby can play the run exceptionally well still, but he's now maybe the worst coverage LB in the league at this point in his career--granted I do think much of that is PC/CH doing everything in their power to make sure he is on an island with the opponents best WR on what feels like 75% of passing downs at this point. I do think these guys could succeed under a new regime because there is no desire to dictate the game or play to strengths. Seattles real DC is usually on the wrong sideline.

A defensive coach hasn't fielded a respectable defense since 2015. Imagine where the Eagles might be if they had given Peterson this kind of leash for his one SB. I understand they haven't won it all again, but they've done things right. PC is a fun guy I'm sure, but he doesn't draft well, develop well or game plan well. There's a reason players don't get a second contract in Seattle. Pete wants "athletes" more than he wants football players. There are some bright spots and I hope the dead weight can be cut loose before big paydays are due for the young guys.

Apologies for the long-winded diatribe

Then what comes next but a bunch of excuses from Grandpa with copious amounts of football-ese to sound cool.

Example:
"They loaded it up inside and we squeezed it,” Carroll said. “… The way we determined to protect it, which was not the way to do it, we should have opened up and we should have blocked out there with the tackle and we didn’t get that done … They fooled us a little bit with the look … I wish we would have blocked that with (right tackle Abraham Lucas) right there"

Hahaha !! Pathetic.

The sad thing is that Petey Pete isn't going anywhere. People fill the stands and buy lots of jerseys and hats. Then look at the TV revenue . There's no reason to change.

This team is NOT good . These players are average .

 

[Joshkihei]

We may have the worst Safety duo in the league while simultaneously paying them the most out of any team. This alone is a fireable offense considering the money that could have been spent on D-line instead.

I’ve been saying that for a long time
Adams proved it last night with Ferguson punking him and then beating him
What kind of coverage is that in the end zone even the announcer was like he’s gotta do a better job than that

 

[TwistedHusky]

Another issue with the defense is not just the ranking/effectiveness. It is the effectiveness vs investment. We have been pouring trade and draft capital, as well as salary cap dollars in this defense for years now. And even our good players struggle to be consistently effective. That's a sign of a larger problem. And an indicator that better players/a great draft pick/getting lucky to draft a Pro Bowl regular, etc...won't change things.

Someone else pointed out that two of the key things that Carroll stresses are Defense and Running the Ball. Both are things the Seahawks suck at now.

If the two things that are MOST IMPORTANT to your coach/program builder are things he cannot even deliver on, the other goals are probably out of reach too.

 

[James in PA]

Building from the outside in is the way to do it.

Thought no one ever, other than Pete Carroll.

 

[MORGULON]

I'm baffled anyone can think the defense played good last night? A team scored 41 points and didn't punt. Even if a couple of drives were extended by penalties its still an ugly game for the defense. We have a defensive guru as a coach yet even with investing like 5 second round picks, multiple first round picks, multiple high level trades we still have one of the worst defenses in the league and its continued to get worse over an 8 year period.

Dallas had one of their best performances of the year last night. The defense has to play better than it did. This archaic scheme which Beinemy said is easy to game plan for continues to get killed by opposing teams. Thick picked on Bobby last night in the soft zone look over and over. It's hard to watch.

I'm not a hater either, I've been critical of Geno but I thought he played very well last night. A couple of mistakes but overall much better than he has been playing. The defense was really bad last night.

I agree. This isn't on Geno Smith, he played well in spite of them not being able to run.
This is on defensive coordinator biggie smalls.

 

[mistaowen]

Building from the outside in is the way to do it.

Thought no one ever, other than Pete Carroll.

I hope JS sees what needs to be fixed and decides to throw more money at the safety position. Re-structure/extend Adams, Diggs, and Love so that they each make $20 mil a year until 2040 and then trade next years first and third to the Vikings for Harrison Smith

 

[flv2]

At some point, it's less about the players and more about the plan. We use players in ways that don't suit them. We run plays our players aren't well suited for. We use strategies don't fit our opponent.
There must be a reason. But it's baffling.

The defense can draw up plays and strategise as they wish. The bottom line is the opposing offense dictates where the ball goes. They pick the match-ups that suit them, and Seattle has too many defensive weak spots to hide.

 

[nanomoz]

I believe by DVOA, the Hawks have had a bottom-half-of-the-league defense in 5 of the last 6 years.

It's not good enough. There's isn't a lack of investment there.

 

[Wheetie]

What baffles me at this point, is there hasn't been a revolt from the players regarding this soft zone antiquated defense they run. Are guys actually OK having their names attached to a defense that gives up 400 yards per game and can't get off the field game in, game out, and rank near the bottom of the league when the talent says they should be so much better? This crap has been going on long enough and the fact they refuse to change scheme tells me the players are ok to just go along to get along. Are they all ok with this being part of their legacy? Where's the pride? You can't tell me BWagz, Reed, Williams, Jones, even Adams and Diggs don't have enough clout to try and talk some sense into Carroll to try and implement a more dynamic approach. Are they all ok with this sad excuse of a defense?

 

[pittpnthrs]

The defense looked fine, except for a few crucial missed tackles and awful penalties.

So defenses that give up 40+ points look fine to you?

 

[nanomoz]

So defenses that give up 40+ points look fine to you?

Seriously. Zero forced punts. And the Cowboys last drive looked so easy. It was like they didn't even have to try.

 

[pittpnthrs]

Our rebuilding effort is showing signs of being a great success.

It is? Seem's like a regression to me.

 

[pittpnthrs]

The lesson here is that people don't read. They infer. You make a benign comment that the defense was fine given the circumstances and gave the team a chance to win with timely stops while also being critical of the team's personnel decisions. And somehow, people morph that comment into the ludicrous statement that the defense was good. The defense was not good. As far as I can tell, no one is making that argument.

Even a defense that played fine should cause a couple 3 and outs during the game. Dallas had zero.

 

[Ozzy]

What baffles me at this point, is there hasn't been a revolt from the players regarding this soft zone antiquated defense they run. Are guys actually OK having their names attached to a defense that gives up 400 yards per game and can't get off the field game in, game out, and rank near the bottom of the league when the talent says they should be so much better? This crap has been going on long enough and the fact they refuse to change scheme tells me the players are ok to just go along to get along. Are they all ok with this being part of their legacy? Where's the pride? You can't tell me BWagz, Reed, Williams, Jones, even Adams and Diggs don't have enough clout to try and talk some sense into Carroll to try and implement a more dynamic approach. Are they all ok with this sad excuse of a defense?

d why even bring in Wagner if you weren’t going help him? At this stage of his career he’s in the worst type of defense possible to match his skillset. It feels like one of those Pete “this is my guy and he’s a legend!” Type of situations and they could’ve just a bunch of guys who fit this exposed in the middle scheme better and Wagner could go back to a team like the Rams where they will put him in better situations and not on an island