Six Things I Think I Think About the Hawks at Season's Half

[Uncle Si]

Bonus points for A-a-ron

[youtube]Dd7FixvoKBw[/youtube]

Do you want to go to war Be-Lock-ee Bortles?

 

[OkieHawk]

Pack it in, both of you...

Was that a sexual innuendo? :twisted:

 

[bmorepunk]

Bonus points for A-a-ron

[youtube]Dd7FixvoKBw[/youtube]

Do you want to go to war Be-Lock-ee Bortles?

Until recently I worked with a dude named "Aaron" yet he pronounced it "A-Ron". When this sketch came out it was like it was custom tailored.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Waffles or Pancakes? GO......

 

[Uncle Si]

 

[hawkfan68]

What bugs me is that I bet if you flopped the schedule and took the first 8 games (STL, GB, CHI, DET, CIN, CAR, SF, DAL) and replaced them in order with the next 8 games coming up (AZ, SF, PIT, MIN, BAL, CLE, STL, AZ) we would be looking at a 13-3, 14-2 record. We just ran into an unlucky situation playing GB, CIN and CAR without our D clicking and still feeling the effects of the Kam holdout.

Had we gotten to ease into the season against Palmer, Kaep, Rothlis/Vick/Landry?, Bridgewater, Flacco instead of Foles, A-a-ron, Clausen (which we steam-rolled), Stafford, Dalton, and Newton — I don't think we would have seen the epic fails (especially the Dalton, Newton games) that we saw.

The guys we played against (except A-a-ron) are early season champs who don't play worth a $#!t when the games truly matter. That's why I think we'd have been so much better off this year had we faced Dalton, Cam, Foles, and even Stafford late season... our D would be clicking and they would be sucking.

Great point. I'll take it one step further, given the current schedule, if they were able to convert one more touchdown in the red zone in 3 of their losses, instead of settling for FG, they would be 7-1. They would have won against the Bengals, Rams, and Panthers.

 

[Uncle Si]

What bugs me is that I bet if you flopped the schedule and took the first 8 games (STL, GB, CHI, DET, CIN, CAR, SF, DAL) and replaced them in order with the next 8 games coming up (AZ, SF, PIT, MIN, BAL, CLE, STL, AZ) we would be looking at a 13-3, 14-2 record. We just ran into an unlucky situation playing GB, CIN and CAR without our D clicking and still feeling the effects of the Kam holdout.

Had we gotten to ease into the season against Palmer, Kaep, Rothlis/Vick/Landry?, Bridgewater, Flacco instead of Foles, A-a-ron, Clausen (which we steam-rolled), Stafford, Dalton, and Newton — I don't think we would have seen the epic fails (especially the Dalton, Newton games) that we saw.

The guys we played against (except A-a-ron) are early season champs who don't play worth a $#!t when the games truly matter. That's why I think we'd have been so much better off this year had we faced Dalton, Cam, Foles, and even Stafford late season... our D would be clicking and they would be sucking.

Great point. I'll take it one step further, given the current schedule, if they were able to convert one more touchdown in the red zone in 3 of their losses, instead of settling for FG, they would be 7-1. They would have won against the Bengals, Rams, and Panthers.

We certainly have had a tougher stretch of games to start the season. And perhaps a more settled team either offensively or defensively would have given us a win or two more.

But the issues still exist, and its hard to suggest that we would have managed a 5-3 or 6-2 record against the 2nd half schedule if it was reversed given the issues we've been having.

I think that's what's got everyone so frustrated. We clearly are not playing "good" football, or atleast to the level we are used to. And yet, we've been up in every game late and seem to be just a couple plays from sitting near the top of the league.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

What bugs me is that I bet if you flopped the schedule and took the first 8 games (STL, GB, CHI, DET, CIN, CAR, SF, DAL) and replaced them in order with the next 8 games coming up (AZ, SF, PIT, MIN, BAL, CLE, STL, AZ) we would be looking at a 13-3, 14-2 record. We just ran into an unlucky situation playing GB, CIN and CAR without our D clicking and still feeling the effects of the Kam holdout.

Had we gotten to ease into the season against Palmer, Kaep, Rothlis/Vick/Landry?, Bridgewater, Flacco instead of Foles, A-a-ron, Clausen (which we steam-rolled), Stafford, Dalton, and Newton — I don't think we would have seen the epic fails (especially the Dalton, Newton games) that we saw.

The guys we played against (except A-a-ron) are early season champs who don't play worth a $#!t when the games truly matter. That's why I think we'd have been so much better off this year had we faced Dalton, Cam, Foles, and even Stafford late season... our D would be clicking and they would be sucking.

Great point. I'll take it one step further, given the current schedule, if they were able to convert one more touchdown in the red zone in 3 of their losses, instead of settling for FG, they would be 7-1. They would have won against the Bengals, Rams, and Panthers.

We certainly have had a tougher stretch of games to start the season. And perhaps a more settled team either offensively or defensively would have given us a win or two more.

But the issues still exist, and its hard to suggest that we would have managed a 5-3 or 6-2 record against the 2nd half schedule if it was reversed given the issues we've been having.

I think that's what's got everyone so frustrated. We clearly are not playing "good" football, or atleast to the level we are used to. And yet, we've been up in every game late and seem to be just a couple plays from sitting near the top of the league.

Good teams hang, great teams finish. That's how we've won both NFC championships under Pete. Now we're on the other side of the finishing and our record is indeed going to punish us for it. But hopefully, it does not need to be a death sentence. Still a lot of football to play.

 

[Uncle Si]

Good teams hang, great teams finish. That's how we've won both NFC championships under Pete. Now we're on the other side of the finishing and our record is indeed going to punish us for it. But hopefully, it does not need to be a death sentence. Still a lot of football to play.

Well, we were 4-4 in 2012 and 3-3 in 2014..

 

[Hawkpower]

What bugs me is that I bet if you flopped the schedule and took the first 8 games (STL, GB, CHI, DET, CIN, CAR, SF, DAL) and replaced them in order with the next 8 games coming up (AZ, SF, PIT, MIN, BAL, CLE, STL, AZ) we would be looking at a 13-3, 14-2 record. We just ran into an unlucky situation playing GB, CIN and CAR without our D clicking and still feeling the effects of the Kam holdout.

Had we gotten to ease into the season against Palmer, Kaep, Rothlis/Vick/Landry?, Bridgewater, Flacco instead of Foles, A-a-ron, Clausen (which we steam-rolled), Stafford, Dalton, and Newton — I don't think we would have seen the epic fails (especially the Dalton, Newton games) that we saw.

The guys we played against (except A-a-ron) are early season champs who don't play worth a $#!t when the games truly matter. That's why I think we'd have been so much better off this year had we faced Dalton, Cam, Foles, and even Stafford late season... our D would be clicking and they would be sucking.

Great point. I'll take it one step further, given the current schedule, if they were able to convert one more touchdown in the red zone in 3 of their losses, instead of settling for FG, they would be 7-1. They would have won against the Bengals, Rams, and Panthers.

We certainly have had a tougher stretch of games to start the season. And perhaps a more settled team either offensively or defensively would have given us a win or two more.

But the issues still exist, and its hard to suggest that we would have managed a 5-3 or 6-2 record against the 2nd half schedule if it was reversed given the issues we've been having.

I think that's what's got everyone so frustrated. We clearly are not playing "good" football, or atleast to the level we are used to. And yet, we've been up in every game late and seem to be just a couple plays from sitting near the top of the league.

Good teams hang, great teams finish. That's how we've won both NFC championships under Pete. Now we're on the other side of the finishing and our record is indeed going to punish us for it. But hopefully, it does not need to be a death sentence. Still a lot of football to play.

The team isnt any different than it ever has been. Some fans are making way more out of this season than they should. The team is the same.

The margin between winning and losing, the difference between Super Bowl victories and first round exits, can be razor, razor thin.

That's what we are seeing.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

The team isnt any different than it ever has been. Some fans are making way more out of this season than they should. The team is the same.

The margin between winning and losing, the difference between Super Bowl victories and first round exits, can be razor, razor thin.

That's what we are seeing.

Personnel may not be different for the most part, but the play of the defense certainly has been different.........at least up until the past two games.

No way in hell with the amount of talent on our D that they should have given up as many 4th quarter leads as we have this year. So sorry, that IS different.

Have they righted the ship? Maybe, we'll see going forward against better offenses. But as of now I'm not completely sold that this is just the same ol's struggle in the first half of the season and then turn it on the 2nd half to push towards the playoffs team.

 

[Hawkpower]

The team isnt any different than it ever has been. Some fans are making way more out of this season than they should. The team is the same.

The margin between winning and losing, the difference between Super Bowl victories and first round exits, can be razor, razor thin.

That's what we are seeing.

Personnel may not be different for the most part, but the play of the defense certainly has been different.........at least up until the past two games.

No way in hell with the amount of talent on our D that they should have given up as many 4th quarter leads as we have this year. So sorry, that IS different.

Have they righted the ship? Maybe, we'll see going forward against better offenses. But as of now I'm not completely sold that this is just the same ol's struggle in the first half of the season and then turn it on the 2nd half to push towards the playoffs team.

Well of course the results have been somewhat different....but again we have given up 4th quarter leads in the past with the same personnel... some games we recovered from it and won anyway, others we didnt. Clearly you remember these.

My reference was more to the group of fans who don't understand that our last two teams, as talented as they were, could just as easily fallen into the same predicament that this team has. All it takes is a game or two, here and there. You know this. The difference between winning and losing is so thin, in every single ball game. As talented as any team can be in this league, some years it just doesnt go your way.

That doesnt mean that the team is in anyway different, just experiencing different results in some games, thus far.

 

[marko358]

Personnel may not be different for the most part, but the play of the defense certainly has been different.........at least up until the past two games.

No way in hell with the amount of talent on our D that they should have given up as many 4th quarter leads as we have this year. So sorry, that IS different.

Have they righted the ship? Maybe, we'll see going forward against better offenses. But as of now I'm not completely sold that this is just the same ol's struggle in the first half of the season and then turn it on the 2nd half to push towards the playoffs team.

Not sure why you focus so much on the defense which statistically is top 5 for yards and points allowed.

The offense however is 32nd in red zone TD % and near the very bottom in points per game. You can try to point to the last couple of years and say they've been similar but it's simply not true. We have ZERO games with 3 TDs or more on offense after 8 games. In the last couple of years we've averaged about one every other game. That is a massive dropoff.

 

[TwistedHusky]

One thing to remember,

The year this team walked to the SB, there were a lot of posts about margins of victory.

Specifically posts that showed how successful teams over time, tend to be the teams that have significant margins of victory. Win by a lot, when you have to lose, lose by a little. I believe that was the general assessment of a great team.

And they were right. Those wins were indicators the team was going to the SB, even with the few close wins or come from behind wins sprinkled in.

My point is, you cannot have it both ways. If that is the measuring stick, this team does not measure up.

Then again, last year we had some big issue too (after the KC game specifically being a bit of a turning point). But there were some fundamental differences:

1 - Harvin being removed took some time to shake off, and it affected the team until they could adapt.

2 - We faced team after team that for some reason was missing or had injured QBs.

And even that only worked because we got homefield in the playoffs and still required an epic collapse by the Packers.

This team, as of up to today, is not playing good football. By any measure. Yes they have talent (uneven or inconsistent but certainly some great players in there), but as a team they are not playing tremendously well. And this is part of the reason for the collapses, the inconsistency as well as the ineffective use of the resources by some of the coordinators.

This whole thread feels like that Doctor Pepper commercial where the fan is in the stands trying to convince himself that the team is still going to win it all and the soft drink sales guy is just trying to talk him down but confused as to why he even believes what was on the field points at all to championship football.

So to paraphrase him, Yes, mathematically they are still in it.

And yes, they are going to get some easier runs on the schedule (though they almost lost to the freaking Lions ......) but no, they aren't playing like champions right now because they don't score *(&@##$@#(* touchdowns. Until they can start scoring points, even getting far in the playoffs is probably a ridiculous assessment.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

We'll make the playoffs. We have the players and resourceful coaching staff to do it.

you like Bevell.

Not Bevell............I believe it's either his mom or brother.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

.......No way in hell with the amount of talent on our D that they should have given up as many 4th quarter leads as we have this year. So sorry, that IS different.

Have they righted the ship? Maybe, we'll see going forward against better offenses. But as of now I'm not completely sold that this is just the same ol's struggle in the first half of the season and then turn it on the 2nd half to push towards the playoffs team.

Agree with this wholeheartedly. Also think the red zone offense must improve to get to the playoffs.

Thanks for the well thought out post Montana. Pretty much agree with all you said.

 

[Uncle Si]

This team, as of up to today, is not playing good football. By any measure. Yes they have talent (uneven or inconsistent but certainly some great players in there), but as a team they are not playing tremendously well. And this is part of the reason for the collapses, the inconsistency as well as the ineffective use of the resources by some of the coordinators.

#2 in defense..

pretty good measure.

The whole team has not played a good football game at the same time.. thus 4-4.

 

[Basis4day]

One thing to remember,

The year this team walked to the SB, there were a lot of posts about margins of victory.

Specifically posts that showed how successful teams over time, tend to be the teams that have significant margins of victory. Win by a lot, when you have to lose, lose by a little. I believe that was the general assessment of a great team.

And they were right. Those wins were indicators the team was going to the SB, even with the few close wins or come from behind wins sprinkled in.

When did we walk to the Superbowl? 2013 was no cake walk.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

Good teams hang, great teams finish. That's how we've won both NFC championships under Pete. Now we're on the other side of the finishing and our record is indeed going to punish us for it. But hopefully, it does not need to be a death sentence. Still a lot of football to play.

Well, we were 4-4 in 2012 and 3-3 in 2014..

But in 2014, our four losses came against two AFC teams (less damaging for tiebreakers) and one NFC powerhouse (the Cowboys). This year it's against only one, and two of our losses have come against teams who will be hanging around for tiebreakers in January.

 

[IndyHawk]

One thing to remember,

The year this team walked to the SB, there were a lot of posts about margins of victory.

Specifically posts that showed how successful teams over time, tend to be the teams that have significant margins of victory. Win by a lot, when you have to lose, lose by a little. I believe that was the general assessment of a great team.

And they were right. Those wins were indicators the team was going to the SB, even with the few close wins or come from behind wins sprinkled in.

My point is, you cannot have it both ways. If that is the measuring stick, this team does not measure up.

Then again, last year we had some big issue too (after the KC game specifically being a bit of a turning point). But there were some fundamental differences:

1 - Harvin being removed took some time to shake off, and it affected the team until they could adapt.

2 - We faced team after team that for some reason was missing or had injured QBs.

And even that only worked because we got homefield in the playoffs and still required an epic collapse by the Packers.

This team, as of up to today, is not playing good football. By any measure. Yes they have talent (uneven or inconsistent but certainly some great players in there), but as a team they are not playing tremendously well. And this is part of the reason for the collapses, the inconsistency as well as the ineffective use of the resources by some of the coordinators.

This whole thread feels like that Doctor Pepper commercial where the fan is in the stands trying to convince himself that the team is still going to win it all and the soft drink sales guy is just trying to talk him down but confused as to why he even believes what was on the field points at all to championship football.

So to paraphrase him, Yes, mathematically they are still in it.

And yes, they are going to get some easier runs on the schedule (though they almost lost to the freaking Lions ......) but no, they aren't playing like champions right now because they don't score *(&@##$@#(* touchdowns. Until they can start scoring points, even getting far in the playoffs is probably a ridiculous assessment.

With our defense as it stands when we get to the playoffs all we have to do is score more than we give up.It may be some ugly score(s) but defense wins championships and if healthy I like our chances.