SAM HOWELL

[Fresno Hawk]

Howell playing off script is the way of the league now. All the top QB'S in our league make great plays improvising. Mahomes, Allen, Jackson, Purdy even the rookies this year. This is what makes them great because it's so hard to defend. Even Geno when he is forced to improvise scrambling around he makes big time plays. For what ever reason he doesn't run as much when he has the chance.

 

[GeekHawk]

Howell playing off script is the way of the league now. All the top QB'S in our league make great plays improvising. Mahomes, Allen, Jackson, Purdy even the rookies this year. This is what makes them great because it's so hard to defend. Even Geno when he is forced to improvise scrambling around he makes big time plays. For what ever reason he doesn't run as much when he has the the chance.

You realize that you're describing Russball, right?

 

[toffee]

Howell playing off script is the way of the league now. All the top QB'S in our league make great plays improvising. Mahomes, Allen, Jackson, Purdy even the rookies this year. This is what makes them great because it's so hard to defend. Even Geno when he is forced to improvise scrambling around he makes big time plays. For what ever reason he doesn't run as much when he has the the chance.

Every QB in the league improvised when the situation called for it, even the most lead-footed QBs like Goff, Brady, and Matt Ryan, etc ran for yardage. I am sure @keasley45 and @Maelstrom787 know a lot more than I do, but I think to the Ryans of the world, improvising was icing on the cake, Russell Wilson made that into his main staple.

 

[Fresno Hawk]

You realize that you're describing Russball, right?

If thats the way you see it. Howell is no Russell Wilson in my eyes, although I do think Howell is better than Russ from the pocket. Take it with a grain of salt.

 

[Fresno Hawk]

Every QB in the league improvised when the situation called for it, even the most led-footed QBs like Goff, Brady, and Matt Ryan, etc ran for yardage. I am sure @keasley45 and @Maelstrom787 know a lot more than I do, but I think to Ryans of the world, improvising was icing on the cake, Russell Wilson made that into his main staple.

That's the thing, Howell doesn't make it improvising alone. Russ did, while Howell can do it he did alot from the pocket more than Russ in his early years. To me there is no comparison for the 2.

 

[GeekHawk]

My point isn't that one or the other is a better QB. My point is that what was described is what we around here derisively call "Russball" or "RussellBall" or whatever, as an example of what good QBs don't do. Now all of a sudden it's 'The Way of the Modern NFL' and all the best QBs are doing it? WTF???

 

[Fresno Hawk]

My point isn't that one or the other is a better QB. My point is that what was described is what we around here derisively call "Russball" or "RussellBall" or whatever, as an example of what good QBs don't do. Now all of a sudden it's 'The Way of the Modern NFL' and all the best QBs are doing it? WTF???

I didn't say anything about Russ ball. I didn't even mention him. All I said is all the top QBs in the league RIGHT NOW, are great at improvising. And its been an asset to all of there game and there's nothing wrong with that. How is that Russball! WTF!

 

[Spin Doctor]

That's the thing, Howell doesn't make it improvising alone. Russ did, while Howell can do it he did alot from the pocket more than Russ in his early years. To me there is no comparison for the 2.

Howell was mostly improv at Washington. He played like a hybrid between Ben Roethlisberger and Russell Wilson.

He held the ball longer than any other QB too and tended to avoid the middle of the field just like Wilson.

He was not great as a pure pocket passer, very clunky there.

Also, if you notice the current NFL trends it is shifting away from the trends of the 2010s.

In this era we saw guys with mediocre passing fundamentals and elite athleticism shine. With modern day defenses those guys aren’t as successful.

Gone are the days when you could run simple deep crossing routes to beat the cover 3 everyone was rolling out. Players are having to be very savvy presnap and post snap, they have to go through their progressions and play fundamentally sound football.

Howell is not that guy yet, which is why he’s not starting. He’s unrefined and very sloppy as a pure passer. His deep ball also has a huge wind up to it. His footwork is sloppy as well.

As a backup he’s great, but if he’s in a starting position I guarantee we would have 1-2 less wins at the moment.

 

[Fresno Hawk]

Howell was mostly improv at Washington. He played like a hybrid between Ben Roethlisberger and Russell Wilson.

He held the ball longer than any other QB too and tended to avoid the middle of the field just like Wilson.

He was not great as a pure pocket passer, very clunky there.

Also, if you notice the current NFL trends it is shifting away from the trends of the 2010s.

In this era we saw guys with mediocre passing fundamentals and elite athleticism shine. With modern day defenses those guys aren’t as successful.

Gone are the days when you could run simple deep crossing routes to beat the cover 3 everyone was rolling out. Players are having to be very savvy presnap and post snap, they have to go through their progressions and play fundamentally sound football.

Howell is not that guy yet, which is why he’s not starting. He’s unrefined and very sloppy as a pure passer. His deep ball also has a huge wind up to it. His footwork is sloppy as well.

As a backup he’s great, but if he’s in a starting position I guarantee we would have 1-2 less wins at the moment.

I do agree with some of this. Howell is not ready to start, he simply hasn't played enough. When he played in Washington, that offense ran long developing plays alot causing him to hold the ball, this could be a large part of him showing that. We just dont know.

I also think his fundamentals have gotten better, in the preseason he played well. And I know it's the preseason but there was improvement. However he does need to work on his accuracy.

We don't need him to be a pocket passer. The league right now is getting harder for guys to go through their 3rd progression, as you stated the defenses are to aggressive.

 

[gmor]

What is it that they saw in this guy? You all make it sound like he's a bust before he gets a shot with us.

 

[Fresno Hawk]

Found this break down of Sam Howell take what you want from it, but it's pretty good.

 

[Appyhawk]

Maybe I didn't get my point across clearly. I was only trying to use those circumstances to argue against the premise that JS has never had an opportunity to draft a QB. I included the details of the pre-draft discussions on this very board to refute that point with a relevant example. If board members could see a prime possibility, JS also saw it and refused it.

It all really just goes back to my belief that JS ain't all that, imo. He hit the jackpot with RW - twice. All that extra draft capital and he didn't take a shot at a QB. Any QB. Unforgivable, imo. I also believe that the extra draft capital was squandered. The roster should be so much better than this.

Add in all the horrible trades and huge overpays, and I'm just not enamored with JS. If he can't take a risk on a QB, can't build an OL, can't find elite players, and can't build a strong roster, I don't give MM much of a chance of achieving greatness in the next few years.

p.s. 5, 20, and DK was more value than CAR offered and CHI took. It also would have saved us DK's excessive salary.

I recall JS admitting they would have taken Penix at 9 had Atlanta not taken him, in which case we would have missed out on Murphy. It might have been worth it though. Maybe. I still think Murphy will become a game changing beast on the DL. As for Howell I think he has his position spot nailed down right now.

 

[Bear-Hawk]

If the coaches believed he’d win more games than Geno, he’d be starting. Coaches in the NFL keep their jobs by winning games.

 

[GeekHawk]

I didn't say anything about Russ ball. I didn't even mention him. All I said is all the top QBs in the league RIGHT NOW, are great at improvising. And its been an asset to all of there game and there's nothing wrong with that. How is that Russball! WTF!

Because improvising (and not really following the play as drawn up) was and is at the very heart of Russell Wilson's game. How is improvising NOT Russball? We gave him so much shit for improvising and not standing tall in the pocket like Tom Brady.

And, I realize you didn't mention RW3. Which was why I pointed out that you were describing that which we came to know so well around here.

 

[Fresno Hawk]

Because improvising (and not really following the play as drawn up) was and is at the very heart of Russell Wilson's game. How is improvising NOT Russball? We gave him so much shit for improvising and not standing tall in the pocket like Tom Brady.

And, I realize you didn't mention RW3. Which was why I pointed out that you were describing that which we came to know so well around here.

What your doing is assuming that me saying improvising, is to do what Russ did. Russ over did it. When I said it I never mentioned Russ, I mentioned other QBs as examples of improvising isn't all that bad. The improvising they use in games is the standard of how it is successful. Not the way Russ was. Not every QB can stand tall in the pocket, AGAIN wich isn't always bad thing. So next time maybe I will spell it out for you a little clearer so you won't assume s#!t.