Rapoport: Wilson's agent likely to end contract talks soon

[Tical21]

I seriously doubt Wilson or his agent care about getting a fully guaranteed deal. Elite QBs always get their money.

I have no idea what is going on, but my best guess is that the FO is lowballing Wilson with Newton type offers, and on the flip side Wilson's agent realizes that Seattle has basically zero leverage and is exploiting that to the max effect. Wilson's agent is going to win, it's inevitable. The sooner the Hawks FO realizes this, the less painful it will be for their bottom line. Giving Rodgers what he wants today is going to cost less than giving him what he wants a year from now.

Unfortunately, I think JS has dug his heels in here and will end up learning a tough lesson.

I think Russell's camp is just huffing and puffing while there is no pressure on either side and he will sign before the season starts because it makes the most sense.

This makes a lot of sense. Right now our guys aren't even around the building. Russell isn't risking being injured without a deal in place. We'll see what happens when the preseason rolls around and real pressure starts to build around the negotiations.

 

[Hawkpower]

I find it hard to believe they have low balled him, they paid Sherman, they paid Kam, they paid Thomas, they paid Baldwin, all at maximum contracts and or higher then people thought. Your going to tell me that the Franchise QB is going to get a low ball offer when everyone else has been paid well?

I really don't think it's money as much as structure and the Guaranteed amount.

EXACTLY.

There are very intelligent fans on this board assuming the FO is "lowballing" Wilson and I can't for the life of me fathom why they think that.

The FO has a history of taking care of their stars, why would they jack around with their QB out of nowhere?

 

[ivotuk]

They make this sound urgent, final.

It's not. Fear not.

Wilson is basically in year one of a 4-year, 70ish million contract due to the franchise tag.

I am not as sure about that 3rd year of the franchise tag. Although the totals look good, when you can't spread it around, that 3rd year franchise tag (which would be around $35 million) is a tough number to swallow in one go. I think the numbers are workable for this season + 2 franchise tags. IMO that is more than enough time to work out a deal. I just hope they realize that waiting only increases his payday. Locking him up now gives us more flexibility and a lower number. As time passes and more deals are signed and the cap keeps going up, his contract will continue to rise with it.

I'm still of the belief that they get a deal done before he ever has to be franchised, but it's still a game of cat and mouse right now.

I thought players can only be franchised twice...in a row, at least.

Franchise players can be tagged more but their raise is significant. The first year they get the franchise number. Year 2 they get a minimum of a 20% raise. Year 3 they get a minimum of a 44% raise. For quarterbacks that gets ugly quick.

Assume Wilson gets franchised next year and they set it at $21 million this is how it plays out

2015 - $1.5 million last year of rookie deal

2016 - $21 million franchise designation 1st year

2017 - $25.2 million franchise designation 2nd year 20% raise

2018 - $36.288 million franchise designation 3rd year 44% raise.

That averages out to 21 million over 4 years. Hell of a deal for Seattle.

I believe John Clayton has good information on this negotation and he says that Seattle is offering to make Russell a Top 5 paid QB, but that Russell wants to be the highest paid player in the NFL and he wants this year to be renegotiated from 1.5 million to 23 ish million.

NOBODY does that in the NFL. Earl Thomas, Richard Sherman, everybody has had their last year "blended" in to the new contract.

John Schneider doesn't want to set a new precedent in the NFL.

Neither to the Titans who are arguing with Mariota over something different.

 

[seahawk Dan]

SERIOUSLY, I say screw 'em and let him play for peanuts again this year, put the tag on him net year then let him go for two 1st round picks, he isn't worth the money they are asking

hoppe he gets past this season without serious injury LOL

M.M.

Sick of it

I know it is very stupid of the hawks to do it this way the longer they Waite the more the price tag goes up

if we Lose Wilson will be the biggest mistake the hawks will ever make.

 

[Hawkpower]

Once again, no one tags quarterbacks. Quit pretending it happens. Who can plan a season around the offensive leader of the team with a player that can sign the contract at the last minute without penalty?

If a quarterback doesn't want to be tagged, it ain't gonna happen.

Brees was tagged, but signed before the deadline.

True. Brees has no right to complain about losing players, given the ridiculous structure to the deal he signed. Loomis is more so to blame, but Brees was complicit in it. That contract is Exhibit A for why franchise QBs should look out for the interests of their team when signing extensions or else grin and bear the aftermath. A Top 3 QB and HC with no chance to sniff a Super Bowl in the foreseeable future.

This concerns me as well.

With as much as RW reportedly admires Brees, you would think some warning bells would be going off inside his head. If, of course, being on a dynasty type of a team for years to come is important to him.........

But then again, I would imagine it would be hard for a young guy, with an agent whispering in one ear, superstars in the other, on top of the world- to maybe have that type of perspective.

Easy for us to see from here, from there, maybe not.

 

[kearly]

I think Russell's camp is just huffing and puffing while there is no pressure on either side and he will sign before the season starts because it makes the most sense.

Wilson doesn't care about the risk. He's already got some money, he's got the insurance policy, and he's got a sense of God watching over his life. I don't think there is any bluff in Wilson's willingness to play this year at $1.5 million. He knows that once this year is played out, the FO will basically have nothing left as leverage. The longer this goes on, the more leverage Wilson has. If this strings out a few years, the leverage on Wilson's side will be enormous because Seattle will have to pay $29-30 million to franchise him 3 years from now.

If Wilson didn't have leverage, he would have signed a deal months ago.

JS is also a patient man at the table, but in this case, it is unwise to be. The circumstances dictate a sense of urgency from the FO, otherwise the deal Wilson eventually does sign down the road will dwarf the rumored Newton offer when it's all said and done.

 

[kearly]

This makes a lot of sense. Right now our guys aren't even around the building. Russell isn't risking being injured without a deal in place. We'll see what happens when the preseason rolls around and real pressure starts to build around the negotiations.

That would be the last gasp. It's very rare for QBs to sign deals after mid-August. I don't think that's happening. And based on Rodgers past history with his clients, I think we're probably in for Walter Jones 2.0 here. I think our best chance to see a deal done is right before or right after Luck signs his next year. Otherwise this could easily go on for 3 more years as Rodgers and Wilson allow the ballooning franchise numbers to put increasing pressure on JS.

 

[kearly]

I seriously doubt Wilson or his agent care about getting a fully guaranteed deal. Elite QBs always get their money.

I have no idea what is going on, but my best guess is that the FO is lowballing Wilson with Newton type offers, and on the flip side Wilson's agent realizes that Seattle has basically zero leverage and is exploiting that to the max effect. Wilson's agent is going to win, it's inevitable. The sooner the Hawks FO realizes this, the less painful it will be for their bottom line. Giving Rodgers what he wants today is going to cost less than giving him what he wants a year from now.

Unfortunately, I think JS has dug his heels in here and will end up learning a tough lesson.

I'd assume they are slightly north of Newton, right? Not much, just a little bit. If so, I think we have quite a difference of opinion as far as what would qualify as "lowballing." Wilson doesn't deserve Aaron Rodgers money. Not even close. But he's going to get it, which it is utterly ridiculous.

What do you think Wilson's agent is asking for? Does Schneider have any choice besides digging in his heels? He has no choice but to call Russell's bluff. Russell isn't stupid. He's not leaving, he's not going anywhere. He doesn't want to sign with Cleveland. If Russell has leverage because he is a franchise QB for a franchise that is desperate for one, and that provides more leverage than having the best coaching staff, front office, and roster in the NFL, the model is officially broken. In your theory, what would stop Russell from holding out for 40 APY? We would have no choice but to pay it, right? 50?

You say Wilson's agent is going to win. To what extent do you see him "winning?" 28 APY? Scary stuff.

If you are the Seahawks, you come out and tell his agent right now that you're going to pay him 1.5 this year, you're going to franchise him for the next two years, and we'll talk to you three years from now. No guaranteed years, no long-term contract. How is that not leverage that can trump anything on Russell's side?

I don't feel the same way you do about Wilson's value. Which is good, because Wilson is probably going to end up with a deal much bigger than you are comfortable with. If he signs tomorrow, it will be for more than Rodgers was paid a few years ago. But if he signs in 2017... prepare yourself for the "scary stuff" scenario.

 

[Hawkpower]

I think Russell's camp is just huffing and puffing while there is no pressure on either side and he will sign before the season starts because it makes the most sense.

Wilson doesn't care about the risk. He's already got some money, he's got the insurance policy, and he's got a sense of God watching over his life. I don't think there is any bluff in Wilson's willingness to play this year at $1.5 million. He knows that once this year is played out, the FO will basically have nothing left as leverage. The longer this goes on, the more leverage Wilson has. If this strings out a few years, the leverage on Wilson's side will be enormous because Seattle will have to pay $29-30 million to franchise him 3 years from now.

If Wilson didn't have leverage, he would have signed a deal months ago.

JS is also a patient man at the table, but in this case, it is unwise to be. The circumstances dictate a sense of urgency from the FO, otherwise the deal Wilson eventually does sign down the road will dwarf the rumored Newton offer when it's all said and done.

Unless of course JS doesn't value RW in the way we think he should or might.

Wouldn't surprise me to find out that the FO has a line in the sand that they aren't willing to cross...now or ever.

Debating the intelligence of such a stance is worthy, but the FO beats to their own drum, they value defense and running games, they have A LOT of superstars on the roster....and RW has some question marks, valid ones.

Maybe RW has leverage in most cases....but here? I don't know.

 

[DavidSeven]

Brees's situation was a little different. New Orleans actually was low-balling him. That was one situation where the fanbase/media actually sided with the player. Brees's APY isn't that outrageous. His cap hits are just crazy now because the Saints' cap was horribly mismanaged and they had to backload his deal.

He was coming off breaking the single-season passing record, and his coach was going to be suspended the next year. Getting $20M APY under those circumstances wasn't that outrageous. That entire team was built on Brees's arm, and everyone knew it. Not apples to apples with Russ.

 

[DavidSeven]

I think Russell's camp is just huffing and puffing while there is no pressure on either side and he will sign before the season starts because it makes the most sense.

Wilson doesn't care about the risk. He's already got some money, he's got the insurance policy, and he's got a sense of God watching over his life. I don't think there is any bluff in Wilson's willingness to play this year at $1.5 million. He knows that once this year is played out, the FO will basically have nothing left as leverage. The longer this goes on, the more leverage Wilson has. If this strings out a few years, the leverage on Wilson's side will be enormous because Seattle will have to pay $29-30 million to franchise him 3 years from now.

If Wilson didn't have leverage, he would have signed a deal months ago.

JS is also a patient man at the table, but in this case, it is unwise to be. The circumstances dictate a sense of urgency from the FO, otherwise the deal Wilson eventually does sign down the road will dwarf the rumored Newton offer when it's all said and done.

I'm with you here. Ultimately, Russ can put Seattle in a bad spot eventually, and that's leverage. What does Russ have to lose? Only a bit of security. But long run, he makes more money by waiting, even if he gets tagged a couple times. People keep looking at the money in three year windows. That's not how Russell or his agent thinks.

My only wish is that this hadn't become so contentious and that a happy medium could be struck, but it is what it is.

 

[ctrcat]

I think Russell's camp is just huffing and puffing while there is no pressure on either side and he will sign before the season starts because it makes the most sense.

Wilson doesn't care about the risk. He's already got some money, he's got the insurance policy, and he's got a sense of God watching over his life. I don't think there is any bluff in Wilson's willingness to play this year at $1.5 million. He knows that once this year is played out, the FO will basically have nothing left as leverage. The longer this goes on, the more leverage Wilson has. If this strings out a few years, the leverage on Wilson's side will be enormous because Seattle will have to pay $29-30 million to franchise him 3 years from now.

If Wilson didn't have leverage, he would have signed a deal months ago.

JS is also a patient man at the table, but in this case, it is unwise to be. The circumstances dictate a sense of urgency from the FO, otherwise the deal Wilson eventually does sign down the road will dwarf the rumored Newton offer when it's all said and done.

Unless of course JS doesn't value RW in the way we think he should or might.

Wouldn't surprise me to find out that the FO has a line in the sand that they aren't willing to cross...now or ever.

Debating the intelligence of such a stance is worthy, but the FO beats to their own drum, they value defense and running games, they have A LOT of superstars on the roster....and RW has some question marks, valid ones.

Maybe RW has leverage in most cases....but here? I don't know.

To borrow a basketball analogy since RW himself mentioned wanting to win 6 rings like MJ (who didn't win it all until year 7)-many people think RW is more akin to Isiah Thomas, amazing player on some great teams, a HOFer even, but not Michael Jordan like RW and many others believe. Time will tell.

 

[rideaducati]

I think Russell's camp is just huffing and puffing while there is no pressure on either side and he will sign before the season starts because it makes the most sense.

Wilson doesn't care about the risk. He's already got some money, he's got the insurance policy, and he's got a sense of God watching over his life. I don't think there is any bluff in Wilson's willingness to play this year at $1.5 million. He knows that once this year is played out, the FO will basically have nothing left as leverage. The longer this goes on, the more leverage Wilson has. If this strings out a few years, the leverage on Wilson's side will be enormous because Seattle will have to pay $29-30 million to franchise him 3 years from now.

If Wilson didn't have leverage, he would have signed a deal months ago.

JS is also a patient man at the table, but in this case, it is unwise to be. The circumstances dictate a sense of urgency from the FO, otherwise the deal Wilson eventually does sign down the road will dwarf the rumored Newton offer when it's all said and done.

Willing or not, Russell is playing this season on his rookie deal. Russell "bluffing" and "threatening" to do so is silly because he IS playing for that amount THIS YEAR...It isn't HIS choice. His ONLY choice is to go into this season with a boatload of money in the bank from a signing bonus or to buy a silly insurance policy and pray that he doesn't have to use it. The money he will pay for that insurance policy and the lost amount of interest he could collect on a signing bonus is probably higher than the difference in money he will garner in a contract signed next year or two years from now.

I actually hope Russell waits to sign after Andrew Luck. Andrew Luck wants to win and from what I've heard about him is he knows he is worth every penny, but also pays attention to the NFL and how the highest paid QBs have had their teams gutted just to fit the QB under the cap and haven't won since. After his rookie year, he did an interview and was asked what his biggest purchase was and he said he splurged and bought a ping pong table. Luck is a country boy that already has enough money. I think he will follow in Brady's shoes and play for less than market value.

With a bunch of QBs cap hits next year being really high, I suspect that most of them will be redone to reduce their cap hits which will reduce the franchise tag amount for QBs. Russell playing on the franchise tag might even be lower than what has already been offered and definitely lower than the current franchise tag projection.

The Seahawks are in control of this negotiation and Russell will figure this out very soon. Cooler heads will prevail and Russell will sign a contract extension before the next regular season game.

 

[Taehwk]

I am just speculating here, but if the Hawks do use 2 franchise tags on Wilson. He would be what 29 or 30 years old entering free agency?

The only reason Russell Wilson is valuable and worth this kind of money now is the threat of his legs. Will he still be able to remain elusive and extend plays when he is approaching 30 when players start to lose a step? is he worth 25/year if he can't do this?

Is this something the Hawks might be looking at? How long can Russell sustain what he is doing? Once the athletic gifts break down, will he still be able to perform?

I think Wilson is capable but he still doesn't have the best pocket awareness. So maybe it's not a bad thing they wait and see how he progresses with a target like Jimmy Graham before they go all-in.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

I'm just looking forward to all the backpedaling after he signs. Gonna' be entertaining.

 

[Chawker]

I'm just looking forward to all the backpedaling after he signs. Gonna' be entertaining.

Agreed!

I'm thinking that Wilson has already agreed to a deal but, the Seahawks are tring to ink Wagner before they release the deal with Russ. Or maybe Wagner and (God forbid Irvin). Me personally, Irvin
would look good in a Atlanta uniform. Kick that chick to the shore! cheers!

 

[Hawkpower]

I'm just looking forward to all the backpedaling after he signs. Gonna' be entertaining.

Backpedaling in what regard?

You think he's going to sign for a reasonable amount soon and all the worrying about him wanting a crippling deal is untrue?

Hope you are right.

 

[Hawkpower]

I think Russell's camp is just huffing and puffing while there is no pressure on either side and he will sign before the season starts because it makes the most sense.

Wilson doesn't care about the risk. He's already got some money, he's got the insurance policy, and he's got a sense of God watching over his life. I don't think there is any bluff in Wilson's willingness to play this year at $1.5 million. He knows that once this year is played out, the FO will basically have nothing left as leverage. The longer this goes on, the more leverage Wilson has. If this strings out a few years, the leverage on Wilson's side will be enormous because Seattle will have to pay $29-30 million to franchise him 3 years from now.

If Wilson didn't have leverage, he would have signed a deal months ago.

JS is also a patient man at the table, but in this case, it is unwise to be. The circumstances dictate a sense of urgency from the FO, otherwise the deal Wilson eventually does sign down the road will dwarf the rumored Newton offer when it's all said and done.

Unless of course JS doesn't value RW in the way we think he should or might.

Wouldn't surprise me to find out that the FO has a line in the sand that they aren't willing to cross...now or ever.

Debating the intelligence of such a stance is worthy, but the FO beats to their own drum, they value defense and running games, they have A LOT of superstars on the roster....and RW has some question marks, valid ones.

Maybe RW has leverage in most cases....but here? I don't know.

To borrow a basketball analogy since RW himself mentioned wanting to win 6 rings like MJ (who didn't win it all until year 7)-many people think RW is more akin to Isiah Thomas, amazing player on some great teams, a HOFer even, but not Michael Jordan like RW and many others believe. Time will tell.

Hard to know for sure. Seattle's roster is SO good, and RW is rarely asked to play a MJ type role as a result, so we don't really know for sure.

I will say that most of the NFL and a few Seahawk fans probably would agree with you though. Not that there is anything wrong with being Isiah Thomas, not a slight at all!

People often forget (myself included) just how awful our QB (and the offense in general) play was in the NFC championship game. I remember having some real RW doubts for most of that game, and then of course we got some breaks, our defense kept us alive, RW woke up and the rest is history.

I often wonder if this offseason would have felt differently in regards to the outlook and negotiations if Green Bay would have run us out of the CLINK that day like they should have. Are we sitting around today wondering if RW is the guy to be the highest paid player in the NFL? Is that overreacting to one game considering his wonderful history otherwise?

Things I think about

 

[onanygivensunday]

Wouldn't surprise me to find out that the FO has a line in the sand that they aren't willing to cross...now or ever.

I firmly believe this... and I also believe that it is less that what Aaron Rodgers is pulling down. Rodgers contract set the top of the market for QBs and as much as I like Russell's game, he is not Aaron Rodgers... and likely never will be.

And while Seattle's top offer to Wilson in subsequent years (assuming he plays out this year for $15M) may escalate with inflation and also with increases in the salary cap... I believe that Schneider/Carroll/Allen will not bend and continue to peg it to Rodgers contract... until such time that Luck's contract will re-set the top of the market. It may not, but likely will.

Best guess... Wilson and his agent want Wilson's contract to re-set the market.

Seattle's position... "No way, Jose."

 

[Tical21]

I seriously doubt Wilson or his agent care about getting a fully guaranteed deal. Elite QBs always get their money.

I have no idea what is going on, but my best guess is that the FO is lowballing Wilson with Newton type offers, and on the flip side Wilson's agent realizes that Seattle has basically zero leverage and is exploiting that to the max effect. Wilson's agent is going to win, it's inevitable. The sooner the Hawks FO realizes this, the less painful it will be for their bottom line. Giving Rodgers what he wants today is going to cost less than giving him what he wants a year from now.

Unfortunately, I think JS has dug his heels in here and will end up learning a tough lesson.

I'd assume they are slightly north of Newton, right? Not much, just a little bit. If so, I think we have quite a difference of opinion as far as what would qualify as "lowballing." Wilson doesn't deserve Aaron Rodgers money. Not even close. But he's going to get it, which it is utterly ridiculous.

What do you think Wilson's agent is asking for? Does Schneider have any choice besides digging in his heels? He has no choice but to call Russell's bluff. Russell isn't stupid. He's not leaving, he's not going anywhere. He doesn't want to sign with Cleveland. If Russell has leverage because he is a franchise QB for a franchise that is desperate for one, and that provides more leverage than having the best coaching staff, front office, and roster in the NFL, the model is officially broken. In your theory, what would stop Russell from holding out for 40 APY? We would have no choice but to pay it, right? 50?

You say Wilson's agent is going to win. To what extent do you see him "winning?" 28 APY? Scary stuff.

If you are the Seahawks, you come out and tell his agent right now that you're going to pay him 1.5 this year, you're going to franchise him for the next two years, and we'll talk to you three years from now. No guaranteed years, no long-term contract. How is that not leverage that can trump anything on Russell's side?

I don't feel the same way you do about Wilson's value. Which is good, because Wilson is probably going to end up with a deal much bigger than you are comfortable with. If he signs tomorrow, it will be for more than Rodgers was paid a few years ago. But if he signs in 2017... prepare yourself for the "scary stuff" scenario.

I know he would, and that's why he's not getting signed tomorrow. That would be absolutely ridiculous. Schneider knows it. Pete knows it. Russell knows it. Everybody in that locker room knows it. Anybody that has studied the tape knows it. Think about it. Aaron Rodgers money. Come on. This is a pretty/real good player holding a team hostage because he thinks he can. This is not how QB's make a legacy. You make your legacy winning Super Bowls, and you make infinite money by becoming a legend with multiple rings, not by sucking a few extra mil out of your front office causing them to make cuts to their roster to accommodate your ego.