Pete, culture, and quarterbacks

Rosco

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Wilson has "Carr Syndrome" because the Oline has been so awful for so long.

The main reason the Rams beat the Seahawks so often is because McVay is a much better coach. Its as simple as that.
He ran a lot cause he’s short and needed to find passing lanes
 

IndyHawk

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You can't convince me that if a QB spends his entire career running for his life, that he doesn't have a clock in his head, just waiting to get blasted. He carried Pete for years, period.
Clean Pockets? Yeah, not really that much at all. And for the record, it absolutely drove me crazy when he wouldn't take the underneath stuff. He clearly had stuff in front of him, but just didn't take it. One of the things about his playing that I couldn't stand. But he also got results. There's nothing wrong with being checkdown charlie, it worked quite well for a guy like Montana.
Carried Pete?Pete covered for and coddled him for years!
Russ has always been limited in reading defenses and adjusting at the line.
He obviously has a slow processor in the pocket that the elites of the game
never did.
He had three things going for him and that is a great deep ball,legs and durable.
We all saw that Russ thrived in moving,shaking and baking,going off script and
creating something.
The sacks were going to happen for sure,there is no OL that can block for a QB
who takes off whenever and goes wherever.
Why would anyone pay for a great OL and top $ to a QB if they aren't going to be
cohesive?
Pete knew.."Let's ride" with hero ball..It works as long as he has legs.
 

scutterhawk

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Wilson has "Carr Syndrome" because the Oline has been so awful for so long.

The main reason the Rams beat the Seahawks so often is because McVay is a much better coach. Its as simple as that.
No, Russ has "Carr Syndrome" because he's slowed down a bunch, while Defenses have sped up, Mcvay has his Defense playing better than a slooooowed down Russell Wilson who refuses to take layup shots THAT WERE ALWAYS THERE for the taking, Simple as that.
 

scutterhawk

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You can't convince me that if a QB spends his entire career running for his life, that he doesn't have a clock in his head, just waiting to get blasted. He carried Pete for years, period.
Clean Pockets? Yeah, not really that much at all. And for the record, it absolutely drove me crazy when he wouldn't take the underneath stuff. He clearly had stuff in front of him, but just didn't take it. One of the things about his playing that I couldn't stand. But he also got results. There's nothing wrong with being checkdown charlie, it worked quite well for a guy like Montana.
Carried Pete until he slowed down LOLOL
Wilson had time over the years to grow his craft, but instead, hung on to the ball for too long, & ran himself into sacks instead of LEARNING to take the layups that were almost always there to keep the chains moving.
What Sherman said was the absolute truth, Brady has always had the patience to cut you up with short gains, while Wilson was all about the deep ball shots.
Even when Wilson had clean pockets to take those shorter shots, he'd OFTEN run himself out of protections...How do you build an O-Line to block for a phantom of the pocket?
 

TwistedHusky

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Bad habits are incredibly hard to unlearn.
(This is also why, you don't need to run at all for PA to work.)

Wilson never needed to learn certain parts of being a QB, both because what he did already worked and because it was probably near impossible to do so. We had a good line during the SB run. But Pete loves to put UPS guys, TEs, pizza deliverymen, etc in at the line instead and just have them dive at the defender's knees. (There used to be a hilarious video of this where a bunch of the Seahawk offensive linemen jumped on the ground and were rolling around in the grass while the defenders were just standing there.)

While Wilson left clean pockets regularly, his pockets were not consistent. Even when the blocking succeeded, it could not be relied upon. OF COURSE, he left clean pockets.

By now, he probably lost the opportunity to get better at the other stuff. And frankly it was only until recently that defenses have been able to solve the mobile QB problem. This is why Mahomes was struggling for a bit too. Defenses were changing.
Wilson was running a passing offense that asked him to make reads after the snap based on the type of leverage the CB applied. It worked.
Combined with the option for the QB to keep the ball, it was tremendously effective.
Can Wilson do the other stuff? Probably late to learn. We will see. He did the year he was injured (2017?)

But it made no sense for him to do so here.

To be fair, a less obstinate or intractable coach could have found a way to make what Wilson did well work for him. The same way the younger Pete did. But it stopped working once Pete started forcing what he wanted to do, regardless of roster, scenario, or even opponent strengths/weaknesses.

I suspect Wilson will struggle in Year 1 as he learns his new team, and everyone here will chortle & point, thinking it validates their conclusions. Then Year 2, Wilson will have a resurgence, and everyone will be scratching their heads - while Pete struggles to make whatever flaming pile of garbage we are then trying to call a roster, work for him here.
 

IndyHawk

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Bad habits are incredibly hard to unlearn.
(This is also why, you don't need to run at all for PA to work.)

Wilson never needed to learn certain parts of being a QB, both because what he did already worked and because it was probably near impossible to do so. We had a good line during the SB run. But Pete loves to put UPS guys, TEs, pizza deliverymen, etc in at the line instead and just have them dive at the defender's knees. (There used to be a hilarious video of this where a bunch of the Seahawk offensive linemen jumped on the ground and were rolling around in the grass while the defenders were just standing there.)

While Wilson left clean pockets regularly, his pockets were not consistent. Even when the blocking succeeded, it could not be relied upon. OF COURSE, he left clean pockets.

By now, he probably lost the opportunity to get better at the other stuff. And frankly it was only until recently that defenses have been able to solve the mobile QB problem. This is why Mahomes was struggling for a bit too. Defenses were changing.
Wilson was running a passing offense that asked him to make reads after the snap based on the type of leverage the CB applied. It worked.
Combined with the option for the QB to keep the ball, it was tremendously effective.
Can Wilson do the other stuff? Probably late to learn. We will see. He did the year he was injured (2017?)

But it made no sense for him to do so here.

To be fair, a less obstinate or intractable coach could have found a way to make what Wilson did well work for him. The same way the younger Pete did. But it stopped working once Pete started forcing what he wanted to do, regardless of roster, scenario, or even opponent strengths/weaknesses.

I suspect Wilson will struggle in Year 1 as he learns his new team, and everyone here will chortle & point, thinking it validates their conclusions. Then Year 2, Wilson will have a resurgence, and everyone will be scratching their heads - while Pete struggles to make whatever flaming pile of garbage we are then trying to call a roster, work for him here.
Year two Bronco Russ will be an old 36..Arm weaker and wearing cement boots.
I predicted he will be done as a starter in 3 years.
 

FrodosFinger

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First 12 seasons w/ team:

Sean Payton
118-74 (8-5)
7 playoffs, 5 divisions, 1 conf., 1 SB

John Harbaugh
118-74 (10-7)
9 playoffs, 4 divisions, 1 conf., 1 SB

Pete Carroll
119-73-1 (10-8)
9 playoffs, 5 divisions, 2 conf., 1 SB
 

toffee

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First 12 seasons w/ team:

Sean Payton
118-74 (8-5)
7 playoffs, 5 divisions, 1 conf., 1 SB

John Harbaugh
118-74 (10-7)
9 playoffs, 4 divisions, 1 conf., 1 SB

Pete Carroll
119-73-1 (10-8)
9 playoffs, 5 divisions, 2 conf., 1 SB
What about the grumpy dude in New England? Potentially, McVay and Shanahan might have better record if they keep up their winning ways?
 

FrodosFinger

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What about the grumpy dude in New England? Potentially, McVay and Shanahan might have better record if they keep up their winning ways?
This is to correct any fallacies aimed at Pete. Many in here wish we would’ve kept Russ and dumped Pete without considering Russ hasn’t had any success without a complete team backing his ass up buddy. We could’ve had Whoopi Goldberg in at quarterback and still thumped Denver in the SB
 

pittpnthrs

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No, Russ has "Carr Syndrome" because he's slowed down a bunch, while Defenses have sped up, Mcvay has his Defense playing better than a slooooowed down Russell Wilson who refuses to take layup shots THAT WERE ALWAYS THERE for the taking, Simple as that.

Wilson has "Carr Syndrome" because the Oline has stunk for years and he was getting killed out there (wish I could find that picture where 5 Cardinal lineman were in the backfield as soon as he took the snap).

The Rams defense is one of the best defenses in the league. They just won a Super Bowl for cripes sake. Taking layup shots against the Rams isnt the answer. If it was, Seattle has just the QBs this season to prove it, because thats about all they are capable of.
 

scutterhawk

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Bad habits are incredibly hard to unlearn.
(This is also why, you don't need to run at all for PA to work.)

Wilson never needed to learn certain parts of being a QB, both because what he did already worked and because it was probably near impossible to do so. We had a good line during the SB run. But Pete loves to put UPS guys, TEs, pizza deliverymen, etc in at the line instead and just have them dive at the defender's knees. (There used to be a hilarious video of this where a bunch of the Seahawk offensive linemen jumped on the ground and were rolling around in the grass while the defenders were just standing there.)

While Wilson left clean pockets regularly, his pockets were not consistent. Even when the blocking succeeded, it could not be relied upon. OF COURSE, he left clean pockets.

By now, he probably lost the opportunity to get better at the other stuff. And frankly it was only until recently that defenses have been able to solve the mobile QB problem. This is why Mahomes was struggling for a bit too. Defenses were changing.
Wilson was running a passing offense that asked him to make reads after the snap based on the type of leverage the CB applied. It worked.
Combined with the option for the QB to keep the ball, it was tremendously effective.
Can Wilson do the other stuff? Probably late to learn. We will see. He did the year he was injured (2017?)

But it made no sense for him to do so here.

To be fair, a less obstinate or intractable coach could have found a way to make what Wilson did well work for him. The same way the younger Pete did. But it stopped working once Pete started forcing what he wanted to do, regardless of roster, scenario, or even opponent strengths/weaknesses.

I suspect Wilson will struggle in Year 1 as he learns his new team, and everyone here will chortle & point, thinking it validates their conclusions. Then Year 2, Wilson will have a resurgence, and everyone will be scratching their heads - while Pete struggles to make whatever flaming pile of garbage we are then trying to call a roster, work for him here.
Absolutely not true ^ Pete started "Forcing What he Wanted" BECAUSE RUSS SLOWED DOWN---See the last 4 games of 2021, and how Penny's Slamming Runs opened up Russ' Passing Attack.
It's simple really->One hand washes the other.
 

FrodosFinger

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Wilson has "Carr Syndrome" because the Oline has stunk for years and he was getting killed out there (wish I could find that picture where 5 Cardinal lineman were in the backfield as soon as he took the snap).

The Rams defense is one of the best defenses in the league. They just won a Super Bowl for cripes sake. Taking layup shots against the Rams isnt the answer. If it was, Seattle has just the QBs this season to prove it, because thats about all they are capable of.
Absolutely clueless wow 🤩
 

scutterhawk

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Wilson has "Carr Syndrome" because the Oline has stunk for years and he was getting killed out there (wish I could find that picture where 5 Cardinal lineman were in the backfield as soon as he took the snap).

The Rams defense is one of the best defenses in the league. They just won a Super Bowl for cripes sake. Taking layup shots against the Rams isnt the answer. If it was, Seattle has just the QBs this season to prove it, because thats about all they are capable of.
You keep telling yourself that.
'Wilson' >>'Pocket? What Pocket??, I don't need no damned "Pocket"...I run around and buy time for my guy to get open downfield, hey, it's always worked for me EVEN BEFORE I GOT DRAFTED & WENT TO SEATTLE.
 

pittpnthrs

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You keep telling yourself that.
'Wilson' >>'Pocket? What Pocket??, I don't need no damned "Pocket"...I run around and buy time for my guy to get open downfield, hey, it's always worked for me EVEN BEFORE I GOT DRAFTED & WENT TO SEATTLE.

You keep thinking that a dink and dunker, game manager is the answer. We'll see.
 

JayhawkMike

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This is to correct any fallacies aimed at Pete. Many in here wish we would’ve kept Russ and dumped Pete without considering Russ hasn’t had any success without a complete team backing his ass up buddy. We could’ve had Whoopi Goldberg in at quarterback and still thumped Denver in the SB
The same team that has failed in the post season the last 7 years with RW as QB has also failed with PC as the head coach. Now you may ascertain responsibility for those failure different than me but I go with 80/20 ish PC/RW. I am sure everybody has their own different numbers.

I am not sad to see RW go with his limitations and salary cap hit but I think a different coach/RW this year would do far better than PC/HIS choice of QBs. IF PC wanted a better QB he had plenty of opportunities and did not take any of them so the QB SUCCESS or FAILURE this year is on squarely on PC.
 

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