Earl Thomas

[RiverDog]

Earl Thomas is a top safety - thats why it's ridiculous. Here you say he can't be one, but obviously (and I'm no expert, keep in mind) he is one.

The body of work ET has put togather thus far is not symbolic in just one play from yesterday. That wasn't a Bill Buckner-eque career defining play. Unless superb owls (we call them that right?) are played in December.

It is not ridiculous to point out that he got burned on that play. It is ridiculous to say that he can't be an all pro because of that one play.

Good analogy with Bill Buckner. Jackie Smith is a football equivalent of Bill Buckner.

 

[ClumsyLurk]

Earl Thomas is a top safety - thats why it's ridiculous. Here you say he can't be one, but obviously (and I'm no expert, keep in mind) he is one.

The body of work ET has put togather thus far is not symbolic in just one play from yesterday. That wasn't a Bill Buckner-eque career defining play. Unless superb owls (we call them that right?) are played in December.

It is not ridiculous to point out that he got burned on that play. It is ridiculous to say that he can't be an all pro because of that one play.

Good analogy with Bill Buckner. Jackie Smith is a football equivalent of Bill Buckner.

Totally - it's one thing to point out that somebody got burned (Wags.... hello?) but in the context of the OP - thats too much and therefore I'd call it ridiculous.

 

[TJH]

The body of work ET has put togather thus far is not symbolic in just one play from yesterday.

Well, this is my biggest complaint against the majority of the posters in here. Unfortunately, missing tackles IS symbolic, at least partially, of his body of work until he gets it fixed. That play wasn't necessarily out of charachter. Great at coverage, but he isn't as well-rounded as everyone here wants it to seem like.

 

[plyka]

Cant be an all pro safety and totally get burned on that run. Inexcusable

He got burned on that run, and it has almost ZERO bearing on whether he is the best safety in the league or not....what you can't do, is attempt to use 1 play as some sort all encompassing deciding factor, especially when taking into consideration there may be more than 1000 plays in a regular season (just plucked that number out of thin air, but you get the point). Fan exaggeration at its finest.

Uh, sorry, it wasn't earl thomas he did nothing wrong

LOL, i can't believe what I'm reading. You went from saying this 1 play discounts him as being the best pro-safety in the league to he did nothing wrong, lol...can you truly not see any middle ground between those two polar opposites? That one play decides everything in a season for you versus 1 play means absolutely NOTHING. The first post was fan exaggeration at its finest, the 2nd post is Seahawk fan passive aggressiveness at its finest.

 

[ClumsyLurk]

The body of work ET has put togather thus far is not symbolic in just one play from yesterday.

Well, this is my biggest complaint against the majority of the posters in here. Unfortunately, missing tackles IS symbolic, at least partially, of his body of work until he gets it fixed. That play wasn't necessarily out of charachter. Great at coverage, but he isn't as well-rounded as everyone here wants it to seem like.

What other games has he been getting burned on? And I'm not asking to be a dick lol. Just football talk.

 

[bellingerga]

Jerry Rice dropped passes. Peyton Manning throws interceptions. Brian Urlacher missed tackles.

It happens.

Thats what I always say too. Seahawk fans just lose their damn minds if their players aren't perfect all the time. NO PLAYER IS PERFECT> get the hell over it.

 

[plyka]

OP is ridiculous.

. Reed, Polomalu, and other all pros have missed on tackles before.

Sure have, but not at the rate of Thomas. Bottom 10 in safeties this year for missed tackles, 4th worst last year. Everyone wants to act like these are isolated slip ups, but those are some uncomfortable stats. There's no way around it, he needs to get better.

OP is ridiculous.

Why is it so "ridiculous" for someone to call out a player who has obvious issues making tackles for missing a game-losing tackle?

The body of work ET has put togather thus far is not symbolic in just one play from yesterday.

Well, this is my biggest complaint against the majority of the posters in here. Unfortunately, missing tackles IS symbolic, at least partially, of his body of work until he gets it fixed. That play wasn't necessarily out of charachter. Great at coverage, but he isn't as well-rounded as everyone here wants it to seem like.

You're making a lot of assertions here but without any facts and statistics. I'd like to see where you are getting your numbers and WHAT criteria you are using for your numbers.

 

[mistaowen]

Anyone discrediting Earl in this thread is ridiculous. Earl missed one play yesterday that resulted in a huge gain, but there were others involved in the play who did not make the play either. He has been incredible this season making tackles when/where our linebackers should. No complaints towards the entire left side of our defense when Kaep ran for 9 yards on 3rd and 7 after that play? That would have gotten us the ball back with a lot more time to get in FG range.

Our ENTIRE defensive identity comes from how talented he is playing over the top BY HIMSELF. When was the last time we saw a huge gain through the air against us? Teams don't even try to anymore because there is a good chance Earl will be in the exact area. Posts like this piss me off, these are humans not robots.

 

[TJH]

You're making a lot of assertions here but without any facts and statistics. I'd like to see where you are getting your numbers and WHAT criteria you are using for your numbers.

Straight from Profootballfocus.com

2012, 17 Missed tackles, 4th worst among all safeties.
2013, 12 Missed tackles so far, tied for 9th worst in the league.


Footballoutsiders had him 4th worst in 2012 with a broken tackle rate of 19%

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-a ... 12-defense


----

These aren't some kind of secret...

 

[Jville]

The body of work ET has put togather thus far is not symbolic in just one play from yesterday.

Well, this is my biggest complaint against the majority of the posters in here. Unfortunately, missing tackles IS symbolic, at least partially, of his body of work until he gets it fixed. That play wasn't necessarily out of charachter. Great at coverage, but he isn't as well-rounded as everyone here wants it to seem like.

Well he may not be as well-rounded as you would like. But Carroll and Scheider look for what players can excell at ...... rather than dwell on limitations. The defensive secondary is built around Earl Thomas. Thomas makes their style possible.

 

[ClumsyLurk]

You're making a lot of assertions here but without any facts and statistics. I'd like to see where you are getting your numbers and WHAT criteria you are using for your numbers.

Straight from Profootballfocus.com

2012, 17 Missed tackles, 4th worst among all safeties.
2013, 12 Missed tackles so far, tied for 9th worst in the league.


Footballoutsiders had him 4th worst in 2012 with a broken tackle rate of 19%

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-a ... 12-defense


----

These aren't some kind of secret...

I didn't catch this. Crazy. Still elite though, not a doubt in my small mind.

 

[Jville]

You're making a lot of assertions here but without any facts and statistics. I'd like to see where you are getting your numbers and WHAT criteria you are using for your numbers.

Straight from Profootballfocus.com

2012, 17 Missed tackles, 4th worst among all safeties.
2013, 12 Missed tackles so far, tied for 9th worst in the league.


Footballoutsiders had him 4th worst in 2012 with a broken tackle rate of 19%

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-a ... 12-defense


----

These aren't some kind of secret...

My take is that raw statistical offerings instill considerable confusion.

Those statistic exercises do not reflect style or type of player. The assignment priorities of a small center fielder style safety as the last line of defense contrasts sharply with those of a big enforcer that sets the tone. We see raw statistical differences produced because of differences in size, style and assignment priorities. But the raw statistical offerings presented to us are not refined enough to reflect or account for those differences and generate a meaningful ranking.

Edit: underlined words added

 

[253hawk]

Sure, Earl took a little bit of a bad angle, but if Sherman wasn't held Gore would have been forced right into his path.

Notice ref two yards away.

 

[Anonymous]

And that pretty much sums it up now, doesn't it?

Nice, 253, very nice.

 

[RiverDog]

You're making a lot of assertions here but without any facts and statistics. I'd like to see where you are getting your numbers and WHAT criteria you are using for your numbers.

Straight from Profootballfocus.com

2012, 17 Missed tackles, 4th worst among all safeties.
2013, 12 Missed tackles so far, tied for 9th worst in the league.


Footballoutsiders had him 4th worst in 2012 with a broken tackle rate of 19%

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-a ... 12-defense


----

These aren't some kind of secret...

Those stats don't take into consideration that for much of the time, we play a "triangle" defense with Earl being the roaming center fielder with the other 8 "in the box", and as such, he's going to have more opportunities than if he's in a more traditional, two deep zone with the safeties on top of the corners. I don't have any stats to back up my suspicion, but there's the possibility that Earl could be getting more opportunities than other safeties, meaning the total numbers of missed or broken tackles would not necessarily be reflective of his performance.

But I do agree that tackling is not a strong point of Earl's game.

 

[TJH]

I don't have any stats to back up my suspicion, but there's the possibility that Earl could be getting more opportunities than other safeties, meaning the total numbers of missed or broken tackles would not necessarily be reflective of his performance.

But I do agree that tackling is not a strong point of Earl's game.

That's why I included the percentages stat from FOO. Missing 19% of your attempted tackles is not good regardless of how you're playing or what scheme. I'm sure he recognises it and is working on it. My main point here is everyone shouldn't act like this is an isolated incident like has been portrayed ad naseum.

 

[JGfromtheNW]

What Earl Thomas contributes to this team goes beyond even his stats. He IS the best safety in football, whether he misses slightly more tackles than other safeties or not.

2012 - ET misses 17 tackles. I don't know if that stat includes preseason/postseason, but that's an average of 1.0625 tackles missed per game. That's not many mistakes per game as far as tackling goes.

2013 - ET has missed 12 tackles through 13 games? That average is .9231 tackles missed per game.

Does he make every tackle? No, but he almost does on any given day. Not to mention, how many of these missed tackles are in our backfield vs. him coming up to blow a play up and it not really effecting the outcome of the play?

If you think he "misses too many tackles," it's because you're obsessed with stats and take what ET does for our defense for granted.

BTW, Earl Thomas has the most tackles on our defense this year. 12 missed tackles is nothing.

 

[TJH]

If you think he "misses too many tackles," it's because you're obsessed with stats and take what ET does for our defense for granted.

No, I think he misses too many tackles because he does it more than nearly any other safety. This has nothing to do with his coverage, that's a separate issue entirely.

 

[JGfromtheNW]

If you think he "misses too many tackles," it's because you're obsessed with stats and take what ET does for our defense for granted.

No, I think he misses too many tackles because he does it more than nearly any other safety. This has nothing to do with his coverage, that's a separate issue entirely.

That's great, but I'm telling you it's irrelevant, so deal with it.

 

[TJH]

That's great, but I'm telling you it's irrelevant, so deal with it.

Obviously not irrelevant when a missed tackle just lost us a game.