Bill Barnwell reaches for low hanging fruit

scutterhawk

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One of the worst QB lineups is a fact. You're fooling yourself if you say otherwise, we're solidly in the bottom third of the NFL in this category. The only reason people can give me as to why we're not is based on speculation and wishful thinking. Look at what Lock and Smith have done previously in their careers, it isn't pretty and you are deluding yourself if you think they're suddenly going to be above average. More often than not situations like this end up exactly how they look on paper. They *might* end up above average, but more than likely the mean says they're going to be exactly who we think they are.

Pete Carroll build that team in 2010, 13 years ago. Things have changed since then, we've had rule changes and the NFL adopted to his defense. The drafts this team has had since 2013 have had some questionable results too. There have been many decisions that Carroll and JS have made that have lead this team to where they're at right now. In addition to this, Carroll's playoff record since our last Super Bowl run has been absolutely dismal. In that period of time we have one of the worst playoff records of any team.

It's time to let go of the past. Carroll was great for us once upon a time but that time has come and gone. Past result does not indicate future success. Yes, he built a Super Bowl team, but that exact thing is not going to happen again under Carroll, period. He came in with an innovative defensive concept that teams struggled to deal with. To run that scheme he looked for players that teams traditionally undervalued, large corners, a safety that was more of a linebacker/SS hybrid and smaller, quicker pass rushers.

That defense that he ran at the USC for the NFL in 2010 was perfect. What happened over the years? Teams figured it out, they cracked it. Even many of his understudies have decided to switch from that system over the years. Carroll has been playing catch up and on his back feet ever since. Carroll is an old hat in the NFL. We can acknowledge what he's done for us in the past while realizing that he never is going to do it again. Also, you need to read my post again, I acknowledge that this draft was good.
You're stating the Seahawks Quarterbacks situation as though it were an absolute fact, when the only "Fact" is, what you are touting is PURE CONJECTURE, YOU DON'T KNOW!!
Oh and SPECULATION? Yeah, that's the same horse that you & a few others are riding....I'll be the FIRST TO OPENLY ADMIT, that there are going to be some hills to climb for our Quarterbacks, but YOU CAN'T KNOW FOR A FACT that Smith or Lock for that matter, won't come through with flying colors for the Seahawks

I have "let go of the past", Wilson IS NOT the same Mobile Quarterback as he was back 10 years ago, hell, he's not even as elusive as he was even FIVE years ago, you can't deny the fact that he's produced waaay too many three & outs in the last THREE years alone, because he either don't see, or refuses to take the OBVIOUSE EASY layups.
The last FIVE years have PROVEN that WILSON WAS NOT the SEATTLE SEAHAWKS ANSWER to another Super Bowl run, and getting their butts saddled with a 50+ Million dollar 33-year-old, SLOWING DOWN Quarterback would NOT allow them to provide enough coin to fill all the other holes.
We win just enough to put us into the 20's or higher first round pick, & CONTRARY to the babble, the odds of finding blue ribbon players goes down pretty quick after the 20th pick.
The fact that Pete & John were lucky as hell when they took DK & a few others in the lower rounds PROVES that he STILL KNOWS how to pick em.
Pete IS reloading with Younger, Hungrier & Faster guys that feel like they've been under valued, and are looking to prove the rest of the League WRONG by passing them by.
Wilson has gone to a team that has been STACKED with a lot of decent players & needed only a top 10/20 Quarterback to complete their puzzle.
OH AND, You might have something with the "Teams figured it out, they Cracked it", ESPECIALLY the teams like the Rams DEFENSE, "Figuring Out" Russell Wilsons weaknesses.
 

scutterhawk

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Which is funny since Pete is 3-1 against Bellichick since both got a second chance at being head coaches.
LOL Yeah, only according to a few yokels around these parts, Bellichick is aging like a fine wine, & Carroll is like a batch of Home-Brew Beer that's gone flat.
 

Spin Doctor

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You're stating the Seahawks Quarterbacks situation as though it were an absolute fact, when the only "Fact" is, what you are touting is PURE CONJECTURE, YOU DON'T KNOW!!
Oh and SPECULATION? Yeah, that's the same horse that you & a few others are riding....I'll be the FIRST TO OPENLY ADMIT, that there are going to be some hills to climb for our Quarterbacks, but YOU CAN'T KNOW FOR A FACT that Smith or Lock for that matter, won't come through with flying colors for the Seahawks

I have "let go of the past", Wilson IS NOT the same Mobile Quarterback as he was back 10 years ago, hell, he's not even as elusive as he was even FIVE years ago, you can't deny the fact that he's produced waaay too many three & outs in the last THREE years alone, because he either don't see, or refuses to take the OBVIOUSE EASY layups.
The last FIVE years have PROVEN that WILSON WAS NOT the SEATTLE SEAHAWKS ANSWER to another Super Bowl run, and getting their butts saddled with a 50+ Million dollar 33-year-old, SLOWING DOWN Quarterback would NOT allow them to provide enough coin to fill all the other holes.
We win just enough to put us into the 20's or higher first round pick, & CONTRARY to the babble, the odds of finding blue ribbon players goes down pretty quick after the 20th pick.
The fact that Pete & John were lucky as hell when they took DK & a few others in the lower rounds PROVES that he STILL KNOWS how to pick em.
Pete IS reloading with Younger, Hungrier & Faster guys that feel like they've been under valued, and are looking to prove the rest of the League WRONG by passing them by.
Wilson has gone to a team that has been STACKED with a lot of decent players & needed only a top 10/20 Quarterback to complete their puzzle.
OH AND, You might have something with the "Teams figured it out, they Cracked it", ESPECIALLY the teams like the Rams DEFENSE, "Figuring Out" Russell Wilsons weaknesses.
Pure conjecture? I'd say your wishful thinking is more closer to conjecture. I'm looking at what these guys have done throughout the duration of their careers. To all of the sudden think they're going to take a quantum leap in their skills is unrealistic. It has happened before, but more often than not you get Sam Darnold like results with reclamation projects.

I've heard this draft nonsense so many times. Listen, Pete Carroll and JS have had the opportunity to draft high quality players in their draft positions. We passed up all-pro caliber players multiple times, some which are perennially top 2-3 in their respective position since 2013. The frustrating thing is these particular players weren't even overlooked, they were often times at positions of need and were the consensus pick. The most recent example of this is Creed Humphrey. Instead we drafted an undersized receiver with an injury history. TJ Watt is another egregious example of a player in a position of need that we passed up.

This isn't a reload, it is a full on rebuild. We're also not necessarily stacking the team with young talent either. Many of our FA acquisitions were older vets or just resigning guys we had. We also traded for a 30 year old defense end in Shelby Harris. Our draft class aren't exactly guys that were "overlooked" or "undervalued" either. Actually our draft class, oddly enough was very straight forward for a Seahawks draft. We didn't do anything cute, we went with picks that probably would be considered consensus picks on big boards. Honestly though, despite my many misgivings with JS and PC probably our best potential draft class in years.

As far as the team goes, it wasn't just Russell Wilson that they figured out. Our defense has been struggling for quite some time. Our defense has been struggling for quite some time, and right now we're currently switching away from Pete's philosophy that he was defined by to Vic Fangio's system.

Pete Carroll just ain't it anymore. He's not going to get us to another Super Bowl. Even if we go by 2010 timelines, he'll be the oldest coach to coach the game by the time we're ready to make another run if we do happen to build another LOB (which is unlikely to happen). It's time we looked forward instead of to the past. Carroll has done all he's going to do with the Seahawks.
 

scutterhawk

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Pure conjecture? I'd say your wishful thinking is more closer to conjecture. I'm looking at what these guys have done throughout the duration of their careers. To all of the sudden think they're going to take a quantum leap in their skills is unrealistic. It has happened before, but more often than not you get Sam Darnold like results with reclamation projects.

I've heard this draft nonsense so many times. Listen, Pete Carroll and JS have had the opportunity to draft high quality players in their draft positions. We passed up all-pro caliber players multiple times, some which are perennially top 2-3 in their respective position since 2013. The frustrating thing is these particular players weren't even overlooked, they were often times at positions of need and were the consensus pick. The most recent example of this is Creed Humphrey. Instead we drafted an undersized receiver with an injury history. TJ Watt is another egregious example of a player in a position of need that we passed up.

This isn't a reload, it is a full on rebuild. We're also not necessarily stacking the team with young talent either. Many of our FA acquisitions were older vets or just resigning guys we had. We also traded for a 30 year old defense end in Shelby Harris. Our draft class aren't exactly guys that were "overlooked" or "undervalued" either. Actually our draft class, oddly enough was very straight forward for a Seahawks draft. We didn't do anything cute, we went with picks that probably would be considered consensus picks on big boards. Honestly though, despite my many misgivings with JS and PC probably our best potential draft class in years.

As far as the team goes, it wasn't just Russell Wilson that they figured out. Our defense has been struggling for quite some time. Our defense has been struggling for quite some time, and right now we're currently switching away from Pete's philosophy that he was defined by to Vic Fangio's system.

Pete Carroll just ain't it anymore. He's not going to get us to another Super Bowl. Even if we go by 2010 timelines, he'll be the oldest coach to coach the game by the time we're ready to make another run if we do happen to build another LOB (which is unlikely to happen). It's time we looked forward instead of to the past. Carroll has done all he's going to do with the Seahawks.
I REPEAT, "YOU DON'T KNOW"
 

BigMeach

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Lets play it out the other way. We trade Russ. We don't win(which would be the odds) and now we are stuck with an old coach and have no QB. Now we get to play the hope we find a good QB game. Until we do we continue to lose.
You know the teams that are continually good? Teams led by Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, and oh yeah, the Seahawks when they had Russ.
Edit: by the way saying bringing in a new coach and assuming Russ would lose is pretty head scratching to me. Could it happen? Sure, but its certainly not the odds as you state.

The reason it's likely is because of the time left on the RW contract. And who is to say RW even stays in that scenario? He can still leave at the end of his contract no matter the wins and losses. Which it sure seems like he and his wife wanted to do.
 
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