Biggest difference between Harbaugh and Carroll

[Giedi]

What I will say about Pete is that he's very conservative.

Apparently you haven't heard of "Big Balls Pete" and how he can go hormonal at times.

Does that happen once a month? :mrgreen: Kidding!

 

[LawlessHawk]

Both coaches stalk the sidelines jumping up and down, flaling their arms, hollering and yelling.

Only one does it with complete joy, enthusiasm and positive support for his players, while the other is in a screaming hissy-fit rage, smashing clip boards and headsets over all the wrongs so unfarely dealt to him.

And didn't someone already push the red eject button on pillowbiter and his dual personality awhile back?

 

[NinerLifer]

There is a lot more to being a great coach than just building a team/roster. It's what you do with that team that matters most.

You can have the most talented team in the league, but if you don't win it doesn't matter.

If a coach builds a strong team from the bottom up but doesn't win with them...nobody will care.

 

[RolandDeschain]

There is a lot more to being a great coach than just building a team/roster. It's what you do with that team that matters most.

You can have the most talented team in the league, but if you don't win it doesn't matter.

If a coach builds a strong team from the bottom up but doesn't win with them...nobody will care.

A great coach that can't build inherits a team, wins for a few years, then goes into suckitude mode. A great coach can't be a great coach, period, if they also can't build a great team; or at least hire enough of the right people to build it for them, at a minimum.

 

[60niners]

The entire OL was there before Harbs showed up. Iupati and Davis were 2nd year players under Harbaugh. It's ridiculous to say it's entirely Harbs that made them better players, when it's common knowledge that players have a tendency to make big leaps in skill and production from year 1 to year 2.

Not true. Harbaugh traded for the now starting C in Goodwin from the Saints. He also let walk the starting RG in Snyder, and promoted a backup T to starting RG. The LT, LG, and RT were in place.

 

[look@dafilm]

harbaugh's 2011 team had 12 starters return from the 2010 simpletary team (I'm being gracious here and including Alex Smith, even though everyone thought he was as good as gone and only started 10 games in 2010). The rest were FA pick ups, draftees, or players promoted to the starting lineup previously riding the bench. at the same time, 2 years later only 6 starters remain going into this season. harbaugh is the #1 reason why the 49ers are so good and why they were in the SB last season. to debate that and discredit him is foolish and sounds a lot like sour grapes. 13-3 in a lockout year in your first year as HC in the NFL ever with a whole new staff and FO, not knowing what player will play where, etc. and a SB bound team the year following says a whole hell of a lot about how good a coach is if you ask me.

not only that, but please don't give any credit to that buffoon named singletary. if anyone gets credit for the players accumulated before baalke and harbs arrival its Nolan. he was coach and gm and drafted players like

gore
davis
haralson
willis
staley
goldson
brown
mcdonald
snyder
smith

Simpletary yelled at Vernon and all of a sudden every 49er fan is indebted to that fool forever? nope sorry. it takes a little bit more than an inevitable ego crushing for eternal thanks.

 

[dumbrabbit]

The entire OL was there before Harbs showed up. Iupati and Davis were 2nd year players under Harbaugh. It's ridiculous to say it's entirely Harbs that made them better players, when it's common knowledge that players have a tendency to make big leaps in skill and production from year 1 to year 2.

Not true. Harbaugh traded for the now starting C in Goodwin from the Saints. He also let walk the starting RG in Snyder, and promoted a backup T to starting RG. The LT, LG, and RT were in place.

Okay, but Did Harbaugh Draft a 5th round Starting Safety? Did he draft a 6th round Starting Cornerback? Did he sign playmaking WRs? Did he Draft a 3rd round starting QB? Did he trade for a top 5 nfl bruising running back that had off field issues in his previous team? Did he draft a DE that led the league in sacks last year?

I didn't think so.

 

[5_Golden_Rings]

With the top coaches list coming out and Harbaugh being rated much higher then Carroll, I think they forgot to mention one big difference

Harbaugh did not really build the 49ers roster. Singletary had more to do with building the roster. Yes Harbaugh made some good improvements with Aldon Smith and Kaepernick but in all reality he inherited a very good team. 20 of his 22 starters were all ready in place when he arrived.

Now Carroll completely built his team. Very few remain from the previous regime. Red, Unger and Mebane come to mind but after that you really have to think about it. Yes JS gets some credit, but that hire was also Pete Carroll's decision

The fact that Harbaugh took a roster that perennially LOST and turned it into a WINNER is EXACTLY WHY he is a great head coach. The roster didn't change much. A few players in the secondary, and a couple other changes. The only major change between a 6-10 team and a 13-3 team was the COACH. That shows the impact of Harbaugh.

The entire OL was there before Harbs showed up. Iupati and Davis were 2nd year players under Harbaugh. It's ridiculous to say it's entirely Harbs that made them better players, when it's common knowledge that players have a tendency to make big leaps in skill and production from year 1 to year 2.

Not true. Harbaugh traded for the now starting C in Goodwin from the Saints. He also let walk the starting RG in Snyder, and promoted a backup T to starting RG. The LT, LG, and RT were in place.

Okay, but Did Harbaugh Draft a 5th round Starting Safety? Did he draft a 6th round Starting Cornerback? Did he sign playmaking WRs? Did he Draft a 3rd round starting QB? Did he trade for a top 5 nfl bruising running back that had off field issues in his previous team? Did he draft a DE that led the league in sacks last year?

I didn't think so.

8 sacks > 19, 20 sacks. Right. (methinks you meant "led the rookies in the league," like Aldon Smith did last year, except Aldon had 14).


Of course, the irony here is that Scott McCloughan built the nucleus of BOTH of our rosters, if I'm not mistaken... lmao.

 

[mretrade]

I am a 49ers fan and I just refuse to read this thread. Seahawk fans for the most part are never going to think otherwise despite their opinion being drastically against conventional thinking across the NFL. They are rationalizing what they desire to be reality instead of looking at facts.

24-7-1 as a regular season head coach. I don't care if we had the best roster in the league (which we were far from it when he took over) that record makes him a top 5 coach in this league.

Bill Belichick
John Harbaugh
Tom Coughlin
Mike McCarthy
Sean Payton
are probably the only coaches in the NFL right now you could argue that are ahead of Jim Harbaugh because they have won a championship. And even then, I probably would take Jim over Mike McCarthy.

 

[pinksheets]

I love that 49ers fans who have nothing better to do than seek out a Seahawks forum can't bother themselves with reading the thoughts of Seahawks fans. Uh...leave?

Fact of the matter is Harbaugh has been out-shined by Carroll on a personnel front by a large margin, and it's likely because Carroll is simply a lot better in that department. That is what it is and nothing more.

 

[Tech Worlds]

I am a 49ers fan and I just refuse to read this thread. .

It would also be nice if you would refuse to read this board as well.

 

[mretrade]

I love that 49ers fans who have nothing better to do than seek out a Seahawks forum can't bother themselves with reading the thoughts of Seahawks fans. Uh...leave?

Fact of the matter is Harbaugh has been out-shined by Carroll on a personnel front by a large margin, and it's likely because Carroll is simply a lot better in that department. That is what it is and nothing more.

lol. Harbaugh does not have final say on personnel decisions. Trent Baalke has done very well on that front and I really couldn't be happier. You are not comparing apples to apples.

Do you think any 49er fan would prefer Carroll over Harbaugh? The 49ers offense sophistication is light years ahead of a lot of teams in the NFL. Personally, after watching our offensive coordinator leave year after year, I would never want a defensive coordinator to be my head coach. What happens if Bevell gets a head coaching job? Then you have Wilson learning a whole new system. But yeah basically, Harbaugh has exceeded expectations.

You can have 42 to 13. I will take 24-7-1 And no one is saying Carroll isn't doing a good job in Seattle. He is doing better than I expected. But this is Harbaugh vs Carroll and I don't see how anyone can make the case that Carroll has been the better coach. The only way is to make the circumstantial baseless argument that he has done more with less.

 

[pinksheets]

Why are you even here, then? This thread is about Carroll being better with personnel and building a team, it seems that argument is settled and you want to argue other qualities to make yourself feel better. Ok, keep talking off-topic to the wall, then, I won't stop you.

 

[mretrade]

Why are you here?

This thread is not about Carroll being better at building a team. It is Harbaugh vs Carroll. No one in there right mind would say that Baalke and Harbaugh hasn't done a great job on building this roster. Both Seattle/San Fran have. Its not like one guy has built either of these rosters. Schneider gets none of the recognition he deserves.

 

[pinksheets]

Please read the OP. Oh weird, this thread's topic is exactly what I said it was.

With the top coaches list coming out and Harbaugh being rated much higher then Carroll, I think they forgot to mention one big difference

Harbaugh did not really build the 49ers roster. Singletary had more to do with building the roster. Yes Harbaugh made some good improvements with Aldon Smith and Kaepernick but in all reality he inherited a very good team. 20 of his 22 starters were all ready in place when he arrived.

Now Carroll completely built his team. Very few remain from the previous regime. Red, Unger and Mebane come to mind but after that you really have to think about it. Yes JS gets some credit, but that hire was also Pete Carroll's decision

 

[Tical21]

Have fun with the semantics and name-calling boys, but if I was building a team from scratch, the first coach I would call is Belichick. The next two would be Carroll and Harbaugh. They're that close. They're both ridiculous. It has to come down to what happens on the field then, right? I have to give it up, so far Harbaugh has the edge. It is really, really hard to argue what he's done at SF. And to give the credit to Singletary? That is just poor form. The good news is that there will be a tangible answer to this debate and it is going to be a helluva good one to watch.

I have to disagree with Kearly slightly. I don't think the coaches most important job is to build the team. I agree it is high on the list. But the good teams are all really talented. To me the most important job is to get the most out of the talent that you have. As to the OP, I would also bet that Harbaugh has almost as much control over personnel as Carroll does. The type-A coaches are involved in just about every discussion pertaining to their football team, unless they have an overbearing GM.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Boy, the Niners "faithful" sure spend a lot of time worrying about our team. Pathetic

 

[Scottemojo]

Clearly, mretrade has not refused to read this thread.

 

[LawlessHawk]

I am a 49ers fan and I just refuse to read this thread.

That is #$%@^x* rich!! LMDAO

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Yeah, those Niners "fans" are so very intelligent.