At 87 Seattle selects Jordan Hill, DT, Penn St.

[JSeahawks]

Don't know much about him. But like the position.

[youtube]rWFZ2PKWJ8s[/youtube]

 

[Axx]

It's strange that they picked a Running Back before a DT. I think a OLB is next.

 

[NorthwestSportsFan]

Seems to get into the backfield well. I like the athleticism.

 

[Shock2k]

MikeRob just real double high fived himself.

 

[hawkfan68]

Don't agree with this choice. Especially with Kaseem Greene, Sean Porter, and Brandon Williams still available. I don't see Hill as the BPA available at that point (not even at his position - DT).

 

[dumbrabbit]

Don't agree with this choice. Especially with Kaseem Greene, Sean Porter, and Brandon Williams still available. I don't see Hill as the BPA available at that point (not even at his position - DT).

First, tell me what you don't like about this kid, then tell me who would do it better.

 

[JSeahawks]

Watching his tape looks a little Rocky Bernardish.

 

[RockHawk]

Don't agree with this choice. Especially with Kaseem Greene, Sean Porter, and Brandon Williams still available. I don't see Hill as the BPA available at that point (not even at his position - DT).

This has consistently been the case each year, where the FO picks someone that was lower on boards than anyone else, and they have a pretty good track record doing that.

 

[hawkfan68]

Don't agree with this choice. Especially with Kaseem Greene, Sean Porter, and Brandon Williams still available. I don't see Hill as the BPA available at that point (not even at his position - DT).

First, tell me what you don't like about this kid, then tell me who would do it better.

I just named 3 guys who would be better choices in my earlier post. Jordan Hill was given a 3rd day grade (rounds 4 or later) in about every mock draft online that I have seen. Not that it means much but IMO OLB is a greater need than a backup DT. Hill's not bad but he could have been picked in the later rounds.

 

[hawkfan68]

Don't agree with this choice. Especially with Kaseem Greene, Sean Porter, and Brandon Williams still available. I don't see Hill as the BPA available at that point (not even at his position - DT).

This has consistently been the case each year, where the FO picks someone that was lower on boards than anyone else, and they have a pretty good track record doing that.

Very true, RockHawk. Great point. I was looking at it from a depth side. I believe that the Seahawks are better off at DT depth wise than they are at LB. I saw Brandon Williams' name in most rankings as a top DT, Hill was much lower. Hopefully they continue their track record of finding gems and he pans out.

 

[Falcan Moore]

Opposing fan here, Falcons myself...as you might've guessed, I'm a gigantic fan of Hill's, so I thought I'd give you guys something to be happy about in regards to him. Actually compares pretty well to Mebane in a lot of ways, but he's quicker, and his skillset is really special for the position he's playing. As to getting him in the fourth or fifth - that was a pipe dream. Some teams gave him second round grades, according to Hill, and he doesn't strike me as someone who would lie about that.

[youtube]eyQcggW8Fqs[/youtube]

That first guy he beats is Chance Warmack. He beats several other top 10 OL prospects throughout the video, so you know he's faced NFL caliber talent - heck, his best games have come against bigger guys because he gets under their pads better than with an agile player.

Highlights don't tell the whole story, but more often than not they do with Hill. Penn State have fielded a great run defense ever since he's been there, and the way he continued to produce (even more) without Still shows he can do it by himself. Often double teamed, even at his size. Leverage is some of the best of any DT in the draft, as is his hand usage, and he's very quick and strong, all things considered. He isn't going to be the type of guy who collapses a pocket, but if you're looking for a great pass rushing one gap NT, he's perfect for that role.

An interesting quote that sums up just how good he is in terms of underused statistics:

While big names like Sharif Floyd and Star Lotulelei dominate the discussion about defensive tackles, Jordan Hill deserves to be discussed based on his stats alone. As a pass rushing DT, Hill grades out with a Snaps Per Pressure (SPP) of 13.3, which makes him the most efficient pass rusher of the DTs (slightly ahead of Sheldon Richardson) and more efficient than some pass rushing DEs like Datone Jones. Hill also had the most combined tackles in the backfield and 1-2 yards from the LOS (25 tackles), more than any defensive tackle. Based on these metrics alone, Hill should be considered solid all-around DT to be picked earlier than the 4th-5th round he’s projected in.

He'd visited Atlanta so I was hoping we could get him...congrats guys, you got a steal. You'll see a couple years from now, maybe even this year. Fantastic player.

Looking forward to meeting you again this year.

 

[NorthwestSportsFan]

Falcan Moore, thanks for the insight. I think most Hawks fans will be pumped and jacked about this pick soon enough.

 

[bigdaddydave]

Thanks, Falcon Moore. Made me feel better!

 

[NorthDallas40oz]

Hill isn't a "backup DT," he's the Hawks' 3-tech of the future, and could easily start as a rookie. He was one of the most complete DT's in this draft. In the last game that he played, vs. Wisconsin, he completely abused Travis Frederick (1st round; Cowboys) for 4 quarters, to the tune of 12 tackles and 2 sacks. Had Hill not played out of position at 1-tech (NT) for the Nittany Lions out of necessity last season, his stats (TFL's, sacks, etc.) likely would have been eye-popping, never mind the fact that he played with a slightly bum knee in 2012, which he had scoped after the season, and is now back to 100%. Highly underrated, scheme-versatile, 3-down player who could be a star in the Seahawks system with how they mix, match and rotate their DL's based on situations.

 

[HawkWow]

Hill isn't a "backup DT," he's the Hawks' 3-tech of the future, and could easily start as a rookie. He was one of the most complete DT's in this draft. In the last game that he played, vs. Wisconsin, he completely abused Travis Frederick (1st round; Cowboys) for 4 quarters, to the tune of 12 tackles and 2 sacks. Had Hill not played out of position at 1-tech (NT) for the Nittany Lions out of necessity last season, his stats (TFL's, sacks, etc.) likely would have been eye-popping, never mind the fact that he played with a slightly bum knee in 2012, which he had scoped after the season, and is now back to 100%. Highly underrated, scheme-versatile, 3-down player who could be a star in the Seahawks system with how they mix, match and rotate their DL's based on situations.

Very insightful post. Thanks.

 

[Seafan]

In Quinn I trust. Hill does two things I like very well, he's a very good interior pass rusher which we really missed in the playoffs. He is a very good lateral run support defender. This is a guy who can play three downs for you. Deep DL draft and we get one who fits the bill. Can't complain. We still have 10 picks tomorrow. Four of the next 64 picks. Go, Hawks!

 

[kearly]

Jordan Hill was a player I really liked a ton early in the process, but drifted away from once I noticed that he's more of an "effort" DT than a physically imposing one. Back in January I liked him more than most and for a brief time I thought he deserved to be in the conversation with the draft's top defensive tackles (Floyd, Sly Williams, Short, etc). In fact, when I wrote my DT article back in Late February I included Jordan Hill in my analysis of the top DTs even though most sites had him listed as a late rounder. I eventually cooled on Hill and stopped talking about him once I realized that he's essentially a poor man's Sharrif Floyd, and I was NOT a fan of Floyd's, essentially considering him the Aaron Curry of defensive tackles. (Or perhaps a more accurate comparison would be him as a Floyd/Short hybrid: He has Sharrif Floyd's two-gapping ability and lack of pass rush combined with Kawann Short's quickness and gap slipperiness but also Short's poor run anchor and lack of strength).

Here is what I wrote about Hill two months ago:

Jordan Hill:

Hill isn’t very big nor does he anchor well, but he is probably good enough against drive blocks to be a non-specialist defensive tackle. He partially makes up for this by being consistently very fast off the snap, and keeps a good pad level.

Hill’s uses his arms a lot like a 3-4 defensive end would, excelling at disengaging via extension, not unlike Greg Scruggs but with shorter, weaker arms. He has excellent backfield vision and tracks the ball well. If I had to highlight Hill for being the best at anything out of this group, I think he might have the best short area quickness. He can cover two yards side to side very fast, and despite being weak to interior drive blocks he’s actually an asset against slower developing stretch runs because he can disengage and cover short areas of grass very quickly. Not only is he very quick, but he’s exceptionally instinctive and knows where to move to keep a runner in front of him while keeping his shoulders square.

Unfortunately, Hill can’t seem to use his shed ability to actually swim past defenders, which I theorize is from a lack of functional upper body strength. If he had it, I think he’d be using it. He also lacks lower body strength and is impotent as a bull rusher.

Hill is a bit like Kawann-Short-lite as a 3-tech. He can sometimes slip through exploitable mistakes but he doesn’t force guards back. He could be a serviceable 3-tech, but not a star. I like him more as a 3-4 defensive end, where he can use his quickness around the edge more and will get more mileage out of his talent for two-gapping and reading the football. Then again, Hill stands just 6’1″ and doesn’t appear to have the longest arms, so he’d be a bit of a gamble in such a role. Those factors might explain why he’s expected to be drafted in the mid to late rounds despite having some talent.

Bottom line, I think Hill is a high floor, low ceilling option at defensive tackle that might make a nice option for the Red Bryant role in the future. He's good for a few nifty plays a game in the backfield, but he's not a dominant force. In terms of upside, there were many other DTs who are better that Seattle passed on for Hill. In fairness, Stefan Charles may have the highest upside of them all and he could last into the late rounds, and it's not inconceivable that Seattle could draft a second defensive lineman with a late pick.

I don't think John Schneider is immune to reach picks. I don't think Irvin was a reach, and I don't think Carpenter was a reach and I absolutely didn't think that Wagner was a reach. That said, I felt EJ Wilson was a big reach in 2010 as was Kris Durham in 2011. I wasn't wild on the value of the Jaye Howard pick either. Though I like Hill, I think I'd feel safe calling this pick a reach. I feel pretty good about Hill reaching the 5th or 6th round, and even if he didn't, there were better options available when Seattle picked him.

Not a horrible pick, but I think in four years time every Seahawks fan (if not every NFL fan) will know Christine Michael's name, but only the dedicated among the Seahawks faithful will know who Jordan Hill is, because I think he's pretty likely to be an NFL average player.

 

[RufusPorter]

We finally get the DT talent we've been hungry for as fans and we can't see the forest for the trees.

Great post Falcan Moore please don't be a stranger around here.

 

[Blitzer88]

Jordan Hill was a player I really liked a ton early in the process, but drifted away from once I noticed that he's more of an "effort" DT than a physically imposing one. Back in January I liked him more than most and for a brief time I thought he deserved to be in the conversation with the draft's top defensive tackles (Floyd, Sly Williams, Short, etc). In fact, when I wrote my DT article back in Late February I included Jordan Hill in my analysis of the top DTs even though most sites had him listed as a late rounder. I eventually cooled on Hill and stopped talking about him once I realized that he's essentially a poor man's Sharrif Floyd, and I was NOT a fan of Floyd's, essentially considering him the Aaron Curry of defensive tackles. (Or perhaps a more accurate comparison would be him as a Floyd/Short hybrid: He has Sharrif Floyd's two-gapping ability and lack of pass rush combined with Kawann Short's quickness and gap slipperiness but also Short's poor run anchor and lack of strength).

Here is what I wrote about Hill two months ago:

Jordan Hill:

Hill isn’t very big nor does he anchor well, but he is probably good enough against drive blocks to be a non-specialist defensive tackle. He partially makes up for this by being consistently very fast off the snap, and keeps a good pad level.

Hill’s uses his arms a lot like a 3-4 defensive end would, excelling at disengaging via extension, not unlike Greg Scruggs but with shorter, weaker arms. He has excellent backfield vision and tracks the ball well. If I had to highlight Hill for being the best at anything out of this group, I think he might have the best short area quickness. He can cover two yards side to side very fast, and despite being weak to interior drive blocks he’s actually an asset against slower developing stretch runs because he can disengage and cover short areas of grass very quickly. Not only is he very quick, but he’s exceptionally instinctive and knows where to move to keep a runner in front of him while keeping his shoulders square.

Unfortunately, Hill can’t seem to use his shed ability to actually swim past defenders, which I theorize is from a lack of functional upper body strength. If he had it, I think he’d be using it. He also lacks lower body strength and is impotent as a bull rusher.

Hill is a bit like Kawann-Short-lite as a 3-tech. He can sometimes slip through exploitable mistakes but he doesn’t force guards back. He could be a serviceable 3-tech, but not a star. I like him more as a 3-4 defensive end, where he can use his quickness around the edge more and will get more mileage out of his talent for two-gapping and reading the football. Then again, Hill stands just 6’1″ and doesn’t appear to have the longest arms, so he’d be a bit of a gamble in such a role. Those factors might explain why he’s expected to be drafted in the mid to late rounds despite having some talent.

Bottom line, I think Hill is a high floor, low ceilling option at defensive tackle that might make a nice option for the Red Bryant role in the future. He's good for a few nifty plays a game in the backfield, but he's not a dominant force. In terms of upside, there were many other DTs who are better that Seattle passed on for Hill. In fairness, Stefan Charles may have the highest upside of them all and he could last into the late rounds, and it's not inconceivable that Seattle could draft a second defensive lineman with a late pick.

I don't think John Schneider is immune to reach picks. I don't think Irvin was a reach, and I don't think Carpenter was a reach and I absolutely didn't think that Wagner was a reach. That said, I felt EJ Wilson was a big reach in 2010 as was Kris Durham in 2011. I wasn't wild on the value of the Jaye Howard pick either. Though I like Hill, I think I'd feel safe calling this pick a reach. I feel pretty good about Hill reaching the 5th or 6th round, and even if he didn't, there were better options available when Seattle picked him.

Not a horrible pick, but I think in four years time every Seahawks fan (if not every NFL fan) will know Christine Michael's name, but only the dedicated among the Seahawks faithful will know who Jordan Hill is, because I think he's pretty likely to be an NFL average player.

I agree with ya here kearly, really thought there were better options available when we took Hill. Hopefully I am wrong. I really want to love what the hawks have done so far, but unfortunately I am not really a fan of either pick.

 

[JSeahawks]

Jordan Hill conference call from .com

http://www.seahawks.com/videos-photos/v ... fb8b966995