An "outside the box" approach to the Wilson contract

[Hawknballs]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... -contract/

Interesting.

I've been saying for a while now that the smartest thing for Wilson (and the Seahawks) to do if he really wants to keep a good team around him is to give him a fully guaranteed contract with a good chunk up front, for overall less money than other contracts are worth.

Of course everyone said I was crazy and it would never happen but ....

Wilson is smart and knows he's going to be set for life regardless. If he takes less 'overall' money but gets more up front and more guaranteed, he can begin investing that money wisely now while he's too busy playing football to spend it anyways, and in doing so will probably end up with more money in the long run anyways.

 

[jblaze]

Don't break your arm patting yourself on the back there chief...

Moreover, this is two sentences from our GM. Let's wait for the contract details before we all bow down to you and ask for your forgiveness.

 

[Recon_Hawk]

One thing John mentioned in that interview was that they don't do things like other clubs, which I think he's referring to clubs like Dallas which has a history of reworking contracts to save cap space now but lose it later, or contracts like Kaepernick with weird clauses and escalators that allow teams to dump players who aren't working out. Seattle doesn't work like this. They sign their players to straight forward contracts that reward and commit to them the way they expect to be committed to in return.

An "outside the box" would suggest exactly what you are saying in that it goes against the league's idea of protecting itself from giving huge contracts, but fits exactly how Pete and John want to run this organization.

 

[BlueBlood]

10 years for 100 million guaranteed plus incentives and a signing bonus. The Hawks extend Lynch, re-sign Wilson and Maxwell. Have just enough to make another "outside the box" offer and sign Suh. *Sigh

A kid can dream cant he?

 

[dontbelikethat]

The secret is they're going to pay him entirely in food stamps.

 

[jblaze]

Or by out of the box they mean give him a vet min deal and pay him handsomely with Microsoft endorsements!

 

[Recon_Hawk]

Outside the box?

 

[Seahwkgal]

10 years for 100 million guaranteed plus incentives and a signing bonus. The Hawks extend Lynch, re-sign Wilson and Wags. Have just enough to make another "outside the box" offer and sign Suh. *Sigh

A kid can dream cant he?

FIFY. I think BMax is gone if we get Suh.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

10 years for 100 million guaranteed plus incentives and a signing bonus. The Hawks extend Lynch, re-sign Wilson and Wags. Have just enough to make another "outside the box" offer and sign Suh. *Sigh

A kid can dream cant he?

FIFY. I think BMax is gone if we get Suh.

I think Maxwell is gone regardless. I guarantee you some team is going to overpay for him, especially teams like the Jags with Bradley who have more cap space and a coach history with him.

We can certainly give him a fair number, but like with Tate I betcha at least one other team is willing to overpay.

 

[BlueBlood]

10 years for 100 million guaranteed plus incentives and a signing bonus. The Hawks extend Lynch, re-sign Wilson and Wags. Have just enough to make another "outside the box" offer and sign Suh. *Sigh

A kid can dream cant he?

FIFY. I think BMax is gone if we get Suh.

Id be just fine with that. lol

 

[jblaze]

I think he was being sarcastic. No way we get Suh and Maxie is a long shot.

Maxie will get his. All about the second contract in this CBA.

Suh would make it rough for 2015 but impossible in 2016 once other contracts start "blooming". It would cost us Irvin and others and I don't think anyone wants to lose our depth or mid level players for one big DT no matter how good he is.

 

[jake206]

I wonder if they'll structure his contract like Colin Kaepernick. Where its not guaranteed, but based on performance?

 

[BlueBlood]

I think he was being sarcastic. No way we get Suh and Maxie is a long shot.

Maxie will get his. All about the second contract in this CBA.

Suh would make it rough for 2015 but impossible in 2016 once other contracts start "blooming". It would cost us Irvin and others and I don't think anyone wants to lose our depth or mid level players for one big DT no matter how good he is.

I think its funny when people say that we wont get player a or b because the salary cap wont let us all the while assuming they know what kind of money we will pay Wilson and our other free agents. What if Wilsons contract doesnt live up to expectations and we have more money to spend? Why are people acting like 10 and 20 million are the exact same?

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I think its funny when people say that we wont get player a or b because the salary cap wont let us all the while assuming they know what kind of money we will pay Wilson and our other free agents. What if Wilsons contract doesnt live up to expectations and we have more money to spend? Why are people acting like 10 and 20 million are the exact same?

That's not it with me. I just know that Pete and John don't overspend, so if they can fit Maxwell into the appropriate salary slot that's in their budget for the DB spot opposite Sherman, then they'll pull the trigger.

But if they've slotted 8-10M for him, and someone else offers 12-15M? Then he's gone.

It's what happened with Tate, we COULD have afforded to match Detroit's offer, it was still under our cap. But it wasn't in the range Pete and John had for him. Same will go for Maxwell, just because you can afford to match, doesn't mean you do if you think it's overvalued.

 

[jblaze]

I think he was being sarcastic. No way we get Suh and Maxie is a long shot.

Maxie will get his. All about the second contract in this CBA.

Suh would make it rough for 2015 but impossible in 2016 once other contracts start "blooming". It would cost us Irvin and others and I don't think anyone wants to lose our depth or mid level players for one big DT no matter how good he is.

I think its funny when people say that we wont get player a or b because the salary cap wont let us all the while assuming they know what kind of money we will pay Wilson and our other free agents. What if Wilsons contract doesnt live up to expectations and we have more money to spend? Why are people acting like 10 and 20 million are the exact same?

If you think RW will sign for 10m/yr, you're out of your mind. He would have to accept 10m/yr for us to be able to afford Suh and even then, in 2016 it would likely mean we lose out of players like Irvin due to the ballooning of the contract and if you read between the lines with JS, you understand he's not interested in going outside to make a big splash, he'd rather pay his own.

If you pay attention to what the Seattle salary cap experts and pundits have been saying, these things are highly unlikely. Also the players union will not allow RW to take far less than previous precedents dictate because it affects everyone else as well.

RW may or may not take less, perhaps it's more guaranteed or more based on performance escalators or incentives. We don't know that.

The salary cap is a finite resource and a lot of the money is already spent and is untouchable based on IR, existing contracts, practice squad players, dead money, in season replacement player costs, etc. These things are not unknowns, John knows exactly how much he has to work with based on his 1-3 year projections.

There is an order to this and it's easy to understand if you pay attention. We've had JS/PC around for a while now and you can see the writing on the wall and what appetite they have for certain types of transactions or risk and which ones they don't. You can totally anticipate these moves based on previous deals and how they've written them.

I can tell you with a high degree of confidence RW will get somewhere between 18-22m. Wagner will get around 9m/yr. Maxie will get probably 6.5-7m a year somewhere else, likely Jacksonville or Atlanta. Lynch will probably get a 2 year new deal with 1 yr gteed with the second not gteed. First year will probably be like 10m with signing bonus prorated.

People take contracts based on contemporaries previous contracts. Also as our salary cap and revenue has increased, so will top end salaries. These things are quantifiable and they are the justifications for contract negotiations. They are known and can be used to accurately project players earnings.

 

[LTH]

They cant even consider doing anything in FA until RW and ML get solved...the longer they wait the more they lose in FA...

 

[jblaze]

Teams can't even start talking to FA's until March 7th so there is some time.

I wouldn't worry about RW or Wagner. Their money is already slotted in and there is plenty of squish there.

The one thing we need to figure out is Lynch. If he decides he wants to retire, we need to start looking at the early draft RB's. Gurley and Gordon are both really good backs who could carry an organization under the right circumstances and they may be around late in the 1st round. This RB class is really good this year, much like last year's WR's. There's a ton of talent slotted with first 3 round grades and that's very unusual. Even if Lynch returns, we may grab one anyways.

I think anything Seattle does in FA will be role players like Williams from last year. One thing to keep an eye on is TE. We have a big need for a playmaking TE and the draft is weak at TE. We could take a look at Cameron or Gresham and move on from Miller. The guy took forever to get back from injury and is getting old. He may not be worth the medical/IR risk.

 

[Hawkfan77]

They cant even consider doing anything in FA until RW and ML get solved...the longer they wait the more they lose in FA...

This FO doesn't have blinders on...they won't "wait it out" on those two. They have a plan and will follow it

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

I think he was being sarcastic. No way we get Suh and Maxie is a long shot.

Maxie will get his. All about the second contract in this CBA.

Suh would make it rough for 2015 but impossible in 2016 once other contracts start "blooming". It would cost us Irvin and others and I don't think anyone wants to lose our depth or mid level players for one big DT no matter how good he is.

I think its funny when people say that we wont get player a or b because the salary cap wont let us all the while assuming they know what kind of money we will pay Wilson and our other free agents. What if Wilsons contract doesnt live up to expectations and we have more money to spend? Why are people acting like 10 and 20 million are the exact same?

True that.... We also dont know what a player like Suh would take in hometown championship historic defense discount to come here. Seahawks easily give Suh a contract that pays him a higher apy than McCoy for appearances but still have it be team friendly to the core. Also, McCoys contract if the otc numbers are correct is weird because he has relatively no signing bonus.

So at least for me it would be very easy to make Suh a paper tiger but give him more guaranteed money to keep his actual cap hits low.

Suh has made 64+ million in 5 seasons. We dont know whats in his heart nor that he'll follow the money.

Like we dont know whats in Wilsons heart or that he'll want the money.

Like we dont know whats in Lynchs heart or if he'll come back for the money.

Lot of variables to be played just to pin-point a direct path.

As its been said in many threads of all the questionable playets that could be cut: Miller, Unger, McDaniel, Mebane

Thats 15.3 million is possible cap saved.

If Lynch retires that number becomes 22.3 million.

So yeah people cant really say that no one guy is out of thier reach because they have options to work it out if they really wanted to.

 

[scutterhawk]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/02/10/schneider-hints-at-outside-the-box-approach-to-wilson-contract/

Interesting.

I've been saying for a while now that the smartest thing for Wilson (and the Seahawks) to do if he really wants to keep a good team around him is to give him a fully guaranteed contract with a good chunk up front, for overall less money than other contracts are worth.

Of course everyone said I was crazy and it would never happen but ....

Wilson is smart and knows he's going to be set for life regardless. If he takes less 'overall' money but gets more up front and more guaranteed, he can begin investing that money wisely now while he's too busy playing football to spend it anyways, and in doing so will probably end up with more money in the long run anyways.

Not "Everyone" Poncho, to honest, I never speculated one way or another on what Wilson would, or wouldn't, should, or shouldn't do.
I expect that because of his intelligence, he is going to do whatever it takes to keep the team competitive, knowing full well that he's going to be paid really $ick money after all's said & done anyways.