Poll: If Russ retired today does he make the HOF?

[NoGain]

I think we can agree that these are dunks for the HOF who are retired or at least over 30...

--Brady
--Rodgers
--Brees

This one seems likely...

--Roethlisberger

The rest...

--Eli Manning
--Russell Wilson
--Phillip Rivers
--Matt Ryan
--Matthew Stafford

RW was overshadowed by the likes of Brady, Manning, Brees, and Rodgers earlier in his career, and is now overshadowed by the likes of Mahomes, Allen, Burrows and a few others now.

I will say this...RW at his best was one of the best off script/scrambling/elusive/backyard/big play making QB's I've ever seen. That aspect of his game just started to go with age and he's suffered from it and has yet to properly reinvent himself, and perhaps never will.

 

[Torc]

Bear in mind he isn't just competing with other QBs. There's 5 slots per year. He's going to be competing with some of the amazing WRs and TEs that will come from this era, and there's some great defensive talent as well. There's a window after Brady/Rodgers/Brees are shoo-ins and before Mahomes/Burrow/Allen are eligible (I'm projecting but they're the most likely out of the young crop IMO) where if he doesn't get voted in those younger guys will take precedence.

 

[knownone]

Russ certainly has the resume to make the HoF today, but I think he needs another good season (or two) in Denver to change the narrative arc of his career and guarantee he gets in. Unfortunately for him, if he doesn't turn it around, his post-LOB career will be Kirk Cousins-esque.

 

[SonicHawk]

Rapesburger is definitely going in. I think Eli does too with those two rings. Rivers is probably the last one unless... maybe Stafford.

 

[SantaClaraHawk]

I wonder if he will make the Ring of Honor given the widespread dislike of him.

 

[SonicHawk]

I wonder if he will make the Ring of Honor given the widespread dislike of him.

Give it 10 years.

 

[SantaClaraHawk]

Give it 10 years.

Mmm, maybe. But I admit, I have a dislike for the guy. Personality wise I almost feel like I got out of a cult.

 

[NoGain]

There's one thing about RW that I went from thinking one way about to not being sure about anymore the past couple of years. It had to do with the time and effort he puts into remaining at the top of his game, or being the best he can be. I either assumed or was led to believe that RW went above and beyond in this time and effort department. I'm not so sure now.

The first thing that made me doubt this was his weight, and reading that others had pointed this out. His elusiveness and scrambling ability was always going to wane due to age, but I can't believe that his weight gain hasn't exasperated it. He looks downright slow in the pocket now at times.

I also wondered if he really put in the time and study to become a better on-script, ball control, pocket passing QB, or a more limited but scripted roll-out passer? I know coaching has a lot to do with this, but it clearly wasn't all on coaching from my limited perspective. Or maybe he's just a stubborn guy, or not as high in the IQ department as a QB than I thought he was earlier in his career. I don't know.

He definitely hit a wall a few years ago, and my guess is that he refused to admit it to himself and do the necessary things to change or evolve himself and his game to overcome such obstacles.

He is a weird guy, a bit of a conundrum.

 

[RiverDog]

Before the trade, I thought that Russell was borderline HOF. He does have one ring, but it was early in his career, and his career stats in the most commonly used metric for quarterbacks, total passing yards, just isn't gaudy enough as he's ranked 21st behind several non-HOF QB's and a large number of his contemporaries. Plus, Russell doesn't have a SB MVP or a league MVP, not ever garnering so much as a single vote for the latter award. Nevertheless, there has been QB's that have been admitted with equal or less stature than Russ, with Kenny Stabler coming to mind.

But following the trade and his subsequent face plant this past season, he's basically tossed away that ring and will have to win another to get himself back into position. Great quarterbacks, like Tom Brady and Peyton Manning, make their new teams better, not worse. They don't finish seasons as the 27th ranked QB in passer rating.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Wilson was never an HOF caliber QB. No all-pro, no SB MVP, no MVP, his sole SuperBowl win was overshadowed by the LOB and the teams running back. When he had the opportunity to win the SB in 2014 he threw a game losing interception on the goalline.

He was never considered one of the top passers in the league. Wilson was always overshadowed by his contemporaries even at the height of Seahawk dominance. Even the Broncos saw Wilson as a consolation prize.

At this point, Wilson is the QB version of Shaun Alexander.

 

[IndyHawk]

There's one thing about RW that I went from thinking one way about to not being sure about anymore the past couple of years. It had to do with the time and effort he puts into remaining at the top of his game, or being the best he can be. I either assumed or was led to believe that RW went above and beyond in this time and effort department. I'm not so sure now.

The first thing that made me doubt this was his weight, and reading that others had pointed this out. His elusiveness and scrambling ability was always going to wane due to age, but I can't believe that his weight gain hasn't exasperated it. He looks downright slow in the pocket now at times.

I also wondered if he really put in the time and study to become a better on-script, ball control, pocket passing QB, or a more limited but scripted roll-out passer? I know coaching has a lot to do with this, but it clearly wasn't all on coaching from my limited perspective. Or maybe he's just a stubborn guy, or not as high in the IQ department as a QB than I thought he was earlier in his career. I don't know.

He definitely hit a wall a few years ago, and my guess is that he refused to admit it to himself and do the necessary things to change or evolve himself and his game to overcome such obstacles.

He is a weird guy, a bit of a conundrum.

He had a lot fooled and still does somehow.

 

[RiverDog]

Wilson was never an HOF caliber QB. No all-pro, no SB MVP, no MVP, his sole SuperBowl win was overshadowed by the LOB and the teams running back. When he had the opportunity to win the SB in 2014 he threw a game losing interception on the goalline.

He was never considered one of the top passers in the league. Wilson was always overshadowed by his contemporaries even at the height of Seahawk dominance. Even the Broncos saw Wilson as a consolation prize.

At this point, Wilson is the QB version of Shaun Alexander.

I don't necessarily disagree, which is why I said that he was going to need a league MVP or SB MVP to get in on the first ballot prior to the trade. However, there's been some very shaky players gain admittance. Kenny Stabler, for example, has some horrific career numbers, ranked 65th for passing yards, tied for 56th in TD passes, and has just the one ring. I also didn't think that Drew Pearson's resume rose to HOF level, but he's wearing a gold jacket.

This season was obviously a huge setback for him, but it's not the end of the world, either. If he gets it turned around, takes the Broncos to a Super Bowl, and wins a league and/or SB MVP in the process, he gets in. I personally don't think that happens, but it's definitely in the realm of possibility.

 

[Spin Doctor]

I don't necessarily disagree, which is why I said that he was going to need a league MVP or SB MVP to get in on the first ballot prior to the trade. However, there's been some very shaky players gain admittance. Kenny Stabler, for example, has some horrific career numbers, ranked 65th for passing yards, tied for 56th in TD passes, and has just the one ring. I also didn't think that Drew Pearson's resume rose to HOF level, but he's wearing a gold jacket.

This season was obviously a huge setback for him, but it's not the end of the world, either. If he gets it turned around, takes the Broncos to a Super Bowl, and wins a league and/or SB MVP in the process, he gets in. I personally don't think that happens, but it's definitely in the realm of possibility.

Another thing we also need to consider is that Wilson plays in a league which passers numbers are inflated due to their compatriots. People talk a lot about efficiency numbers around Wilson when arguing that he is an HOF QB. We also need to understand that in this era, passing is easier than ever before.

Sure, their numbers aren't great compared to modern passers/receivers but for that era, they were actually pretty good. We also have to consider that narrative plays a huge part in the HOF.

Wilson has never been considered an elite passers by the media at large. I'd argue that many people saw through his deficits as a passer. There always seemed to be a "he's good but..." asterisk placed on him.

In addition to all of this, the Seahawks had a huge drop off when the LOB disbanded and became more Wilson centric. Wilson also never had great bulk stats and played in an extremely rudimentary offense.

Even his Super Bowl win, Wilson is looked at as an afterthought. Lynch was considered the leader of the offense, Wilson was seen as just being around for the ride. This was only amplified after that fateful interception at the goalline.

Then we have to think about the Denver trade. Wilson became a laughing stock as his play soley lead the Broncos into the cellars despite having a great team around him.

Wilson's legacy is that of a player that was overshadowed by all of his compatriots. He was never seen as being an equal to Brady, Manning, and Brees, never talked about in the same breath. Then came Mahomes and Allen, once again Wilson was nothing but an afterthought.

Wilson is going to have to put together a hell of a run in Denver if he wants to get into a HOF and I don't think that's going to happen.

 

[RiverDog]

Another thing we also need to consider is that Wilson plays in a league which passers numbers are inflated due to their compatriots. People talk a lot about efficiency numbers around Wilson when arguing that he is an HOF QB. We also need to understand that in this era, passing is easier than ever before.

Sure, their numbers aren't great compared to modern passers/receivers but for that era, they were actually pretty good. We also have to consider that narrative plays a huge part in the HOF.

Wilson has never been considered an elite passers by the media at large. I'd argue that many people saw through his deficits as a passer. There always seemed to be a "he's good but..." asterisk placed on him.

In addition to all of this, the Seahawks had a huge drop off when the LOB disbanded and became more Wilson centric. Wilson also never had great bulk stats and played in an extremely rudimentary offense.

Even his Super Bowl win, Wilson is looked at as an afterthought. Lynch was considered the leader of the offense, Wilson was seen as just being around for the ride. This was only amplified after that fateful interception at the goalline.

Then we have to think about the Denver trade. Wilson became a laughing stock as his play soley lead the Broncos into the cellars despite having a great team around him.

Wilson's legacy is that of a player that was overshadowed by all of his compatriots. He was never seen as being an equal to Brady, Manning, and Brees, never talked about in the same breath. Then came Mahomes and Allen, once again Wilson was nothing but an afterthought.

Wilson is going to have to put together a hell of a run in Denver if he wants to get into a HOF and I don't think that's going to happen.

Good post, and I mostly agree. The game has changed dramatically, making statistical comparisons very difficult. IMO candidates need to be judged against their contemporaries, not players like Montana and Marino who played in a different era. Russell's contemporaries are players like Brady, Brees, Rothlisberger, and Rodgers.

I'm also of the opinion that a true HOF'er has to be considered as the top one or two players at their position at some point in their careers, and there's always been someone ahead of Russell that earned that designation. That's why he hasn't received even a single vote for league MVP during his entire career.

I'm fully aware that there's some raw human emotion revolving around Russell with us 12's that influences our opinion of things like his HOF candidacy. But for me, I feel like the HOF bar has been set too low anyway and would object to any QB being given a gold jacket with a resume as thin as Russell's.

 

[NoGain]

Good point about different eras when making statistical comparisons between QB's. For instance, the Chicago Bears defense of the 1980's (one of the all time great D's) would virtually be illegal under today's rules. They wreaked havoc on opposing QB's, and knocking QB's out of games was a fairly routine occurrence at their peak.

 

[FrodosFinger]

 

[FrodosFinger]

Has Russ done this before? ^^^^

 

[hawkfan68]

Has Russ done this before? ^^^^

Yes he has. He threw 4000+ yds and 30+ TDs in the following seasons - 2015, 2019, and 2020.

Russell Wilson Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats for Russell Wilson. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

 

[FrodosFinger]

Yes he has. He threw 4000+ yds and 30+ TDs in the following seasons - 2015, 2019, and 2020.

Russell Wilson Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats for Russell Wilson. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

But he’s never thrown for as many yards as Geno unfortunately lmao

 

[FrodosFinger]

Yes he has. He threw 4000+ yds and 30+ TDs in the following seasons - 2015, 2019, and 2020.

Russell Wilson Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats for Russell Wilson. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

That’s not a hall of fame resume’ guy not even close