Did they or did the not run the RO entire game?

Maybe someone more knowledgeable than I can help us out here. There's people like me, who say the RO wasn't really ran until crunch time. Then there's others who say it was ran plenty and it didn't work until crunch time.

IMO, the RO with a TRUE Russ keep option is done from a spread look. The WR's are about as wide as you can get them, and there's at least 3 on the field. IMO, unless it's in that type of formation, it aint a true RO. And, at least if I recall correctly, the 4th quarter is when we saw it from a spread/3WR look.

Thoughts?

In true Bevell fashion, he shat on the playbook for 3 quarters.

SonicHawk":seh0eu5z said:

In true Bevell fashion, he shat on the playbook for 3 quarters.

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Well, I seriously don't know if that's the case.

In name only. Last year they ran the look all year with no intent on having Russell keep it. No idea why they did that against an opponent begging to get burned. It frustrated me immensely.

At least you did rip Bevell Sonic, which means the thread will get some views, dumb replies, and my question may eventually get answered. Lets just sit back and enjoy the "bubble screens suck" and "how can he suck he won a Super Bowl, huh?" arguments as they manifest.

Bevell conversations are like political debates on MSNBC/Fox News, except more important.

The only other explanation I have is that GB had a spy - particularly a safety - on it, and Wilson made the right read. Won't know until someone watches the all-22.

Yeah we ran it here and there, but it really took off when Wilson kept it. I'm thinking in the Patriots game Russ should keep the first read option to set the tone that he might run, and only really run during when they really need it. It's seems like only a 2nd half thing. Might be to keep any risk of injury and also the read option keeper for Wilson is like a wild card used when only needed.

I think the way the 1st quarter played out had something to do with the plays called after that.

For some reason it just looked weird. I am going to re-watch right now and try to get a better grip.

pehawk":b5b987lr said:

SonicHawk":b5b987lr said:

In true Bevell fashion, he shat on the playbook for 3 quarters.

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Well, I seriously don't know if that's the case.

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Sure it is. Bevell should've been on the field to help out Kearse with 2 of those passes that hit him in the hands.

Bevell forced Wilson to throw a bad pass into the end zone, and a very poor decision to throw at Kearse into a double team.

You see, Kearse is Bevell's favorite, and he stood on that sideline and threatened Wilson with bodily injury if he didn't force the ball to Kearse.

Hope that clarifies things.

Pe, I'm curious why you say it needs to be run from the spread. Teams like SF and Philly often run it with double tights in a power type situation. We don't run it as a true read. Russell said that he hands it off unless there is somebody there in the hole ready to tackle Marshawn. He isn't reading the DE like is done traditionally. The defense for this play is done on an assignment basis. The LB is supposed to scrape to the outside in most schemes. A "spy" has very little to do with it.
You would have to look at the blocking to see if there are any giveaways that the plays we called are called runs to Marshawn in the huddle, or if Russell was making the decisions to hand it to him.

Sarlacc83":1q6b1jfr said:

In name only. Last year they ran the look all year with no intent on having Russell keep it. No idea why they did that against an opponent begging to get burned. It frustrated me immensely.

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It's Russell's call to keep or not.

IMO Russell can sometimes get too conservative with not keeping it more often, and he admits it. He says Lynch is a better runner so he likes to hand it off to him if it's not an obvious run for him.

Makes sense, but I'd like to see Russell be more aggressive with keeping it in the first half of these games. Frustrating to see our offense sputter so much in these first halves, and I think Russell running more aggressive would help alleviate teams packing the box to stop Marshawn.

Maybe we should all tune in after halftime?

Tical21":1fnak7z3 said:

Pe, I'm curious why you say it needs to be run from the spread. Teams like SF and Philly often run it with double tights in a power type situation. We don't run it as a true read. Russell said that he hands it off unless there is somebody there in the hole ready to tackle Marshawn. He isn't reading the DE like is done traditionally. The defense for this play is done on an assignment basis. The LB is supposed to scrape to the outside in most schemes. A "spy" has very little to do with it.
You would have to look at the blocking to see if there are any giveaways that the plays we called are called runs to Marshawn in the huddle, or if Russell was making the decisions to hand it to him.

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Technically you're right. But, most (if not all) of the RO where Russ keeps it are from a spread set. I think from tighter sets Russ is about as likely to keep it as I am to dunk.

Sgt. Largent":eppcba29 said:

Sarlacc83":eppcba29 said:

In name only. Last year they ran the look all year with no intent on having Russell keep it. No idea why they did that against an opponent begging to get burned. It frustrated me immensely.

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It's Russell's call to keep or not.

IMO Russell can sometimes get too conservative with not keeping it more often, and he admits it. He says Lynch is a better runner so he likes to hand it off to him if it's not an obvious run for him.

Makes sense, but I'd like to see Russell be more aggressive with keeping it in the first half of these games. Frustrating to see our offense sputter so much in these first halves, and I think Russell running more aggressive would help alleviate teams packing the box to stop Marshawn.

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Agreed. There are a few trends with Russ and the RO:

You'll rarely see Wilson keep it when it's a marginal read. It's why he usually gashes the defense so badly with it when he does keep it, because it's wide open. The few times I've seen something somewhat covered up are near the goal line and when he's setting up the next play.

Wilson rarely runs any keepers in the 1st half. I've seen stuff wide open and he still gives the ball to Lynch. I seriously think he's setting up the 2nd half. If you don't run any keepers in the 1st half, it won't be addressed in half time adjustments.

Hawks46":15ckx7y7 said:

Sgt. Largent":15ckx7y7 said:

Sarlacc83":15ckx7y7 said:

In name only. Last year they ran the look all year with no intent on having Russell keep it. No idea why they did that against an opponent begging to get burned. It frustrated me immensely.

Click to expand...

It's Russell's call to keep or not.

IMO Russell can sometimes get too conservative with not keeping it more often, and he admits it. He says Lynch is a better runner so he likes to hand it off to him if it's not an obvious run for him.

Makes sense, but I'd like to see Russell be more aggressive with keeping it in the first half of these games. Frustrating to see our offense sputter so much in these first halves, and I think Russell running more aggressive would help alleviate teams packing the box to stop Marshawn.

Click to expand...

Agreed. There are a few trends with Russ and the RO:

You'll rarely see Wilson keep it when it's a marginal read. It's why he usually gashes the defense so badly with it when he does keep it, because it's wide open. The few times I've seen something somewhat covered up are near the goal line and when he's setting up the next play.

Wilson rarely runs any keepers in the 1st half. I've seen stuff wide open and he still gives the ball to Lynch. I seriously think he's setting up the 2nd half. If you don't run any keepers in the 1st half, it won't be addressed in half time adjustments.

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Word...good post.

They ran a ton of read-option looks in the first half. Almost always with 3-4 WRs and Wilson carrying out the fake. The very first play of the game was such a look. There were only two series where they did not feature this look: 2nd series (they ran it twice from under center then empty on 3rd and 10), and 4th series (Wilson misjudges safety and throws INT on 1st down post route to Kearse out of I-formation).

Lynch ran for 157 on 25 carries.

DavidSeven":20st1v8h said:

They ran a ton of read-option looks in the first half. Almost always with 3-4 WRs and Wilson carrying out the fake. The very first play of the game was such a look. There were only two series where they did not feature this look: 2nd series (they ran it twice from under center then empty on 3rd and 10), and 4th series (Wilson misjudges safety and throws INT on 1st down post route to Kearse out of I-formation).

Lynch ran for 157 on 25 carries.

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Hmm, maybe my eyes deceive me then. For whatever reason the RO with a real option we're done from a spread/wide formation.

Tical21":3pwbxhii said:

Pe, I'm curious why you say it needs to be run from the spread. Teams like SF and Philly often run it with double tights in a power type situation. We don't run it as a true read. Russell said that he hands it off unless there is somebody there in the hole ready to tackle Marshawn. He isn't reading the DE like is done traditionally.

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I know the quote you're talking about, but I think Russell was kindly stroking Lynch's ego. If you watch him in an actual read he isn't looking to the line, he's watching to see how hard the DE commits to either Lynch or himself.

When we originally started running this read in 2012 you would generally see a defensive end commit hard to backside pursuit of the RB or to Wilson and the read was made simple. There was one play in particular that stood out in Wilson's reads yesterday because Perry was the free defender and instead of committing one way or the other he squared up and paused. Wilson saw how wide his angle was to run and handed the ball off. Perry then made a hard step inside and dove at Lynch's legs for a tackle despite the open hole. Great defense.

It looks like early in games Seattle tells Wilson to hand the ball off unless the free end has abandoned containment and left Wilson open for a run. Late in games, when we desperately need yards, Wilson will run if the free end has shown containment, but not committed to either player. If the defensive ends start to tire, Wilson is a nightmare. I wondered early in the game why Wilson wasn't keeping the ball, but after watching it again it seems like Green Bay was determined to not just keep him in the pocket, but make his run read as wide as possible so help could reach before he did damage.

Well, we can all agree I was way wrong in my thinking Russ was keeping only from wide formations. Emotions have skewed my reality. I mean, yesterday was the first time I ever noticed Wilson was even black. And I'm racist.

Good stuff, endzorn.