Walter Football grades the alleged Schottenheimer hire

[getnasty]

If any other team hired BS all of .net would be laughing their ass off at this grade, but because he's ours we need to hold off judgement.

 

[DJrmb]

If any other team hired BS all of .net would be laughing their ass off at this grade, but because he's ours we need to hold off judgement.

Could have said the same thing about Pete when he was hired. As a matter of fact a lot here said he was just running from the USC investigations/sanctions as did the media. I'm not telling you or anyone else what to do or think, but if you learn anything from recent history it would say not to go with the popular opinion when it comes to this team...

 

[getnasty]

If any other team hired BS all of .net would be laughing their ass off at this grade, but because he's ours we need to hold off judgement.

Could have said the same thing about Pete when he was hired. As a matter of fact a lot here said he was just running from the USC investigations/sanctions as did the media. I'm not telling you or anyone else what to do or think, but if you learn anything from recent history it would say not to go with the popular opinion when it comes to this team...

Except that Pete was successful and BS has never shown to be anything other then mediocre at best.

 

[DJrmb]

If any other team hired BS all of .net would be laughing their ass off at this grade, but because he's ours we need to hold off judgement.

Could have said the same thing about Pete when he was hired. As a matter of fact a lot here said he was just running from the USC investigations/sanctions as did the media. I'm not telling you or anyone else what to do or think, but if you learn anything from recent history it would say not to go with the popular opinion when it comes to this team...

Except that Pete was successful and BS has never shown to be anything other then mediocre at best.

Pete was not successful in the NFL. You have to remember this was not too long after Saban got laughed out of the NFL back to college and the popular opinion was that college coaches couldn't really succeed in the NFL. It was not a popular hire at all. Don't you remember that?

 

[Sox-n-Hawks]

If any other team hired BS all of .net would be laughing their ass off at this grade, but because he's ours we need to hold off judgement.

Could have said the same thing about Pete when he was hired. As a matter of fact a lot here said he was just running from the USC investigations/sanctions as did the media. I'm not telling you or anyone else what to do or think, but if you learn anything from recent history it would say not to go with the popular opinion when it comes to this team...

Except that Pete was successful and BS has never shown to be anything other then mediocre at best.

Pete was a failure at the NFL level until he came to Seattle. He was Legit at SC though, after he read The Inner Game of Tennis by Tim Gallwey

 

[getnasty]

If any other team hired BS all of .net would be laughing their ass off at this grade, but because he's ours we need to hold off judgement.

Could have said the same thing about Pete when he was hired. As a matter of fact a lot here said he was just running from the USC investigations/sanctions as did the media. I'm not telling you or anyone else what to do or think, but if you learn anything from recent history it would say not to go with the popular opinion when it comes to this team...

Except that Pete was successful and BS has never shown to be anything other then mediocre at best.

Pete was not successful in the NFL. You have to remember this was not too long after Saban got laughed out of the NFL back to college and the popular opinion was that college coaches couldn't really succeed in the NFL. It was not a popular hire at all. Don't you remember that?

I'm not saying it was popular escpically in UW country, what I'm saying is that he had a ton of success at USC and wasn't a failure in NE. BS hasn't even been mediocre he's been horrible. I'm not going to look it up but Bevells offense last year that we all hated and was his worst in Sesttle was probably ranked higher then a majority of BS lead offenses.

 

[Scorpion05]

If any other team hired BS all of .net would be laughing their ass off at this grade, but because he's ours we need to hold off judgement.

Could have said the same thing about Pete when he was hired. As a matter of fact a lot here said he was just running from the USC investigations/sanctions as did the media. I'm not telling you or anyone else what to do or think, but if you learn anything from recent history it would say not to go with the popular opinion when it comes to this team...

Except that Pete was successful and BS has never shown to be anything other then mediocre at best.

Pete was not successful in the NFL. You have to remember this was not too long after Saban got laughed out of the NFL back to college and the popular opinion was that college coaches couldn't really succeed in the NFL. It was not a popular hire at all. Don't you remember that?

This is a gross exaggeration

Pete had one really bad season to start his head coaching career. Then, he led the Patriots to a division title one year, and made the playoffs the following year. His last season with the Patriots the next year was 8-8.
Then Pete went to USC, succeeded, came back, succeeded with the Hawks. He got lucky with Russell Wilson, but without him I still believes he leads us to a few division titles. He was also revered as a really good CB coach

So at the very least, Pete showed SOME glimmer of success. I don't think it's fair to say people are being unfair to Schotty. To believe in him you need blind faith. I will say, looking back at some his games he really did call some good games. I think of the Jets-Lions overtime game, or the Jets-Chargers playoff game. Both were pretty well called by Schotty. He's had some really good wins. I think Pete is betting that not only has Schotty grown, but Russell Wilson will be the most consistent QB he's ever had

 

[jeremiah]

Could have said the same thing about Pete when he was hired. As a matter of fact a lot here said he was just running from the USC investigations/sanctions as did the media. I'm not telling you or anyone else what to do or think, but if you learn anything from recent history it would say not to go with the popular opinion when it comes to this team...

Except that Pete was successful and BS has never shown to be anything other then mediocre at best.

Pete was not successful in the NFL. You have to remember this was not too long after Saban got laughed out of the NFL back to college and the popular opinion was that college coaches couldn't really succeed in the NFL. It was not a popular hire at all. Don't you remember that?

This is a gross exaggeration

Pete had one really bad season to start his head coaching career. Then, he led the Patriots to a division title one year, and made the playoffs the following year. His last season with the Patriots the next year was 8-8.
Then Pete went to USC, succeeded, came back, succeeded with the Hawks. He got lucky with Russell Wilson, but without him I still believes he leads us to a few division titles. He was also revered as a really good CB coach

So at the very least, Pete showed SOME glimmer of success. I don't think it's fair to say people are being unfair to Schotty. To believe in him you need blind faith. I will say, looking back at some his games he really did call some good games. I think of the Jets-Lions overtime game, or the Jets-Chargers playoff game. Both were pretty well called by Schotty. He's had some really good wins. I think Pete is betting that not only has Schotty grown, but Russell Wilson will be the most consistent QB he's ever had

Most consistent QB BS has ever had, I totally agree. Give the guy a chance, I think he is just possibly the one thing the Hawks need. Someone that believes to the core of his being in ball control offense, mean motor scooters on the O line, and keep the QB clean.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Could have said the same thing about Pete when he was hired. As a matter of fact a lot here said he was just running from the USC investigations/sanctions as did the media. I'm not telling you or anyone else what to do or think, but if you learn anything from recent history it would say not to go with the popular opinion when it comes to this team...

Except that Pete was successful and BS has never shown to be anything other then mediocre at best.

Pete was not successful in the NFL. You have to remember this was not too long after Saban got laughed out of the NFL back to college and the popular opinion was that college coaches couldn't really succeed in the NFL. It was not a popular hire at all. Don't you remember that?

This is a gross exaggeration

Pete had one really bad season to start his head coaching career. Then, he led the Patriots to a division title one year, and made the playoffs the following year. His last season with the Patriots the next year was 8-8.
Then Pete went to USC, succeeded, came back, succeeded with the Hawks. He got lucky with Russell Wilson, but without him I still believes he leads us to a few division titles. He was also revered as a really good CB coach

So at the very least, Pete showed SOME glimmer of success. I don't think it's fair to say people are being unfair to Schotty. To believe in him you need blind faith. I will say, looking back at some his games he really did call some good games. I think of the Jets-Lions overtime game, or the Jets-Chargers playoff game. Both were pretty well called by Schotty. He's had some really good wins. I think Pete is betting that not only has Schotty grown, but Russell Wilson will be the most consistent QB he's ever had

Pete Carroll was also a really effective defensive coordinator in the NFL, as well as a revered DB coach. Carroll at least had a history of success in the NFL, and in the NCAA he also built one of the strongest college programs. In the NFL he was around a .500 coach before he came to the Seahawks.

My thoughts are as follows, I think Pete just wants somebody that won't question his strategy. Schottenheimer is a tow the line kind of guy. He will stick with the plan for better or for worse, and won't deviate. Unfortunately for us, Carroll is utterly bankrupt when it comes to offensive vision. His idea of an ideal offense is hilariously outdated in today's NFL. I'm not talking about the run first, smash mouth style either. The passing game part of the equation is what worries me about his views. He has said he favors a smashmouth, big play style offense, which runs contrary to the ball control values he preaches. Under Bevell, and even Bates there was too much emphasis on the deep ball, all other areas of the passing game seemed secondary. This leads to big flash plays, but also leads to inconsistent feast or famine offenses.

The hiring of Schottenheimer just reinforced the idea that Carroll doesn't have a clue about offenses. Great defensive mind, awful on offense. He see's them as garnish to his defense, if he doesn't fix this view it could be his last year here as coach. Unfortunately, he just hired a human joystick in Schottenheimer with a track record of proven failure. Even his most recent coaching stint with the UG Bulldogs was an awful, and truly dreadful stint. The offense immediately dropped like a rock in rankings for the Bulldogs. Immediately after he was fired the offense had significant improvement. I don't buy "but he had mediocre QB's!" argument one bit. In fact his offense is a hindrance to young QB's. We essentially went out and got an even worse version of Bevell. The aspects that Schottenheimer struggle with are the same exact area's Bevell did, but let me tell you they are far more pronounced in Schottenheimer than they were with Bevell.

For example, he has the tendency to attack the strengths of teams, or try to utilize players in roles, or sets they are clearly not fit for to catch teams off guard. He does this with an even greater frequency than Bevell did. He also tends to not focus on in game adjustments so much. If his initial game plan fails he will stubbornly stick with it. We criticized Bevell/Pete for not making adjustments until halftime, this guy doesn't even do that. The plan is a whole game execution. His play calling is not fluid, and is lacking in situational awareness. Walters bashing of Schottenheimer is well deserved, with plenty of instances of failure to support his claims. This is the one hiring that I was hoping, and praying we wouldn't make.

 

[SeaChat]

Is this the same site that"gave Seattle my worst draft grade ever!"?

And who says Russell Wilson was a bad pick?

You're quoting them? :34853_doh:

Yep. Walter also panned the Lynch trade because Lynch was "lazy" and "just not that good." Also thought the Pete Carroll hire was awful if memory serves.

So in summary he gave one of the best drafts in NFL history an F, one of the best trades in history an F, and one of the best coaching hires in history an F. If anything his hatred of this hire is a good omen.

Ditto that, what he said. Your post makes more sence than anything else I've read on this matter to date.