Rumor: RW to possibly play out rookie contract?

[Sac]

People clearly don't understand concept of extension vs new contract. He can signal extension with no signing bonus and spreading the money out making a zero additional cap hit next year. Not saying he will but he can. So why would he ever or the team for that matter let this risk FA.

What player has ever deferred his extension?

Joe Flacco.

Flacco didn't defer anything, he played out his rookie contract and then signed an new contract.

mikeak's comment sounds like he thinks Russell would sign an extension and then wait until 2016 to start it.

Flacco declined an extension the year before. That, in a sense, is deferring it.

 

[Russ Willstrong]

People clearly don't understand concept of extension vs new contract. He can signal extension with no signing bonus and spreading the money out making a zero additional cap hit next year. Not saying he will but he can. So why would he ever or the team for that matter let this risk FA.

What player has ever deferred his extension?

Yes. Also no other qb in history has had the start Wilson had. He is a franchise qb paid less than most kickers.
In his second year Wilson approached management about restructuring his contract and was told it can't happen.
Now he will get paid BIG money and people think he could gamble it all by playing out his contract?
There are problems with playing out his contract: 1. Franchise tag isnt a guarantee next year as Injury can undo everything he worked toward. 2. He won't ever recover the years he wasn't paid his value. 3. He won't ever achieve prolific passing stats in this system so betting on himself is a big risk especially if we miss the playoffs.

 

[Anthony!]

A lot of people seem to believe that the idea of Russ playing out his rookie contract automatically stems from unselfishness. I don't think it's realistic and I don't buy that anyone would do it given the risk he's opening himself up to (potential injury being the biggest). If he's playing out his rookie contract, it's because he and his agent want to see FA.

If he hits the open market, someone is going to pay him more than we can afford. Extend him or lose him imo.

BTW - I'm not ragging on Russ. I just think he's made it clear that he wants to have a long career and 40+ sacks per season behind a patchwork o-line doesn't lend itself well to avoiding injury and extending a career. I love the guy and I wouldn't blame him for wanting to find out how much other teams might value him.

Agreed not to mention playing on a team with some legit Wr weapons and in a real passing offense.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Flacco declined an extension the year before. That, in a sense, is deferring it.

Still apples and oranges to what I think mikeak is talking about.

Flacco made like 8M in 2012, and then immediately signed the largest contract in NFL history. So he didn't really defer anything.

I think mikeak's talking about Russell actually signing a new extension now, but still being OK with making 600k next year to help the team sign free agents. That ain't happening.

 

[Anthony!]

A lot of people seem to believe that the idea of Russ playing out his rookie contract automatically stems from unselfishness. I don't think it's realistic and I don't buy that anyone would do it given the risk he's opening himself up to (potential injury being the biggest). If he's playing out his rookie contract, it's because he and his agent want to see FA.

If he hits the open market, someone is going to pay him more than we can afford. Extend him or lose him imo.

BTW - I'm not ragging on Russ. I just think he's made it clear that he wants to have a long career and 40+ sacks per season behind a patchwork o-line doesn't lend itself well to avoiding injury and extending a career. I love the guy and I wouldn't blame him for wanting to find out how much other teams might value him.

There's this little thing called the franchise tag, so no, it's not extend him or lose him. Russell Wilson is going no where.

Sure, you could do that. The tag was last used on a kicker in 2010. I don't think they want anyone to feel like they're forced to be here and I don't think they'd use it.

The overall point that I was trying to make (and I'm sure you knew this), is that I don't think he goes without an extension this off-season due a desire to make virtually nothing so other guys can make a lot more than he does. It's ridiculous.

It was last used in 2010 because between then and now.. they have not had any players worth using the tag on.

If Wilson goes into the 2016 offseason unsigned.. there is no way he is not tagged if they can't agree to a deal.

I can guarantee you he will not be tagged because he will hold out of camp until they promise not to tag him, and he would be doing the right thing in doing so.

 

[Anthony!]

Watching this play out will be interesting. From a competitor stand point, I hope Seattle gives Wilson $20 plus million per year....but I think it would be a mistake. And I wonder about Schneider's comment that "his people know where we are at".

From most of the comments on here, it seems that Seattle is expected to fork over almost whatever Wilson wants. But that comment from Schneider seems to contradict that. I could see Carroll and Schneider saying "this is what we are willing to pay you", PERIOD.

:lol:

Carroll and Schneider would never say that first of all. Second of all, as a Rams fan you should know better than most teams fan bases.. the quarterback is an INVALUABLE asset to have. If you haven't noticed, the market for QB's is awful in free agency. And its not much better via trade. Your best bet to get a QB is much like the NBA model in that you need to completely bottom out and roll the dice in the draft. Some years you get Andrew Luck.. some years you get Sam Bradford.

The only reason Russell Wilson fell to the 3rd round to begin with is because he's 5-10/5-11. If he were even 6-2.. he'd have been a mortal lock to go in the first round. So he is what is better known as an anomaly. Franchise QB's are not going to be drafted in the 3rd round very often. We can argue if he's elite, or Top 10, or a game manager, or what have you.. but the fact is.. he's better than a great majority of quarterbacks in this league.. and these assets are irreplaceable. The final four of this years postseason had Brady, Luck, Rodgers and Wilson for a reason.

So in saying all of this.. there is absolutely no way that this FO would give Wilson a take or leave it proposition. He will be paid, because he deserves it and its what happens at that position. Do you think the Bengals and 49ers really wanted to commit a bigger salary to their QB's? Do you think the Rams are really excited about another year of Sam Bradford? I don't. But what better option do they have?

If I were a Seahawk fan, I'd probably love Russel Wilson as much as you guys do. But from my perspective, I'm taking care of Wagoner and Lynch first. Heck look what happened when Wagoner was out a few games this year....he is the most underrated player on the Seahawks IMO. And there hasn't been a running back like Lynch since Earl Campbell.

I know this is probably unthinkable, but Schneider and Carroll have been so unorthodox with how they've constructed this team....it wouldn't surprise me if this was their stance with Wilson. I think people's reactions to the play in the superbowl says it all......public expectations of Russell Wilson are hilarious. If Luck, Brady, or Manning threw that INT, it would be "wow he blew it. Can't believe he threw that INT." But with Wilson it's all the playcaller's fault??? He didn't HAVE to throw it. I think that play was indicative of this situation now - Lynch is more important than Wilson. It was proven on the field, and by the outcry of so many fans and pundits - "How do you NOT give Lynch the ball there?????"

But what you guys were actually saying is, "they shouldn't have put the ball in Wilson's hands" - but now this is the guy you want to pay $20 plus million? Please do it.

It's Wagner first of all.. I think you have your Rams on your brain as you're confusing him with Nick Wagoner .. but I think this is exactly why this rumor is being floated. Wilson doesn't have to sign an extension this year.. it's just widely assumed he will because he's been performing at a very high level on the salary of a mid-level place-kicker. But even if they sign Wilson first.. that doesn't change anything as to how they can extend Wagner or Lynch. And Wagner and Lynch combined will probably make what Wilson will average a year. So its not that big a deal really.. Lynch is not playing anywhere else but Seattle next season, he either retires or comes back. Wagner I fully expect will be extended probably near the draft. It's our FO's style to do that type of thing.

The unorthodox thing is correct, but not in this instance. If anything it will show up in how he is extended.. not IF he is extended. And as far as the last statement goes.. I don't care if our QB is Aaron Rodgers and he was throwing it to Jerry Rice.. you run the ball there with a RB like Lynch. So it was more about Lynch than it was Russell Wilson and any supposed deficiency

Fair enough. Just know that I'm pretty sure a lot of people (outside of Seahawk nation) would not have Wilson as a top 10 QB. It's a team sport, so saying he's one of the last 4 left is giving him a bit too much credit don't you think?? That team is built on defense and running the ball - I'll admit that Wilson is a huge part of running the ball. But my point about the rest of the world is....if we're right, and Wilson isn't as good as you think....it's going to show up one way or the other when he gets paid and the players around him get worse. Will he improve enough to offset that?? It's possible. But I personally would not want him to get paid like a top QB. Yes QBs are hard to find, but do you know how many NFL QBs could have QB'd Seattle to a superobowl win last year???? I'd guess half of the NFL starters. That's how ridiculous that defense and Lynch are. And you're right - as a Rams fan I watch A LOT of Seahawk games....so I do know a bit of what I'm talking about here

It's all a matter of opinion I suppose. But I'm surprised that there aren't more Seahawk fans that are hesitant to hand Wilson a $20 plus mil contract. On the flip side, I put him in the same category as Flacco...and he got a $20 mil contract...so maybe that is the market value. It's not a fact that he's better than a "great majority of QBs in this league" though....depends on how you define great majority.

And yet the players voted him #5 so you would be wrong. Most have him in the top 10. Also FTYI that Defense and Lynch were here in 2011 and we were 7-9, 2012 with Wilson 12-4 thanks for proving our point.

 

[mikeak]

Flacco didn't sign because he wanted more money

RW will do what Sherman did

You sign an extension which keeps the base salary for next year intact at the $800k or so. Then the signing bonus is spread on five years and is the only additional cap hit. IF they didn't want to hit the cap then you do zero signing bonus and increase guaranteed and it hits later.

For the record - I don't think that will happen just saying an extension won't hit us hard next year so he won't wait to sign. Lots of players do the extension it is a middle ground as technically they have less leverage now as they are under contract.

 

[hawknation2015]

I can guarantee you he will not be tagged because he will hold out of camp until they promise not to tag him, and he would be doing the right thing in doing so.

From the Illinois Business Law Journal:

The threat of a hold-out does not carry much weight. A holdout would only serve to (1) drastically reduce the player's payday, (2) portray the player as selfish, potentially alienating him from teammates, and (3) depict the player as a malcontent in the eyes of potential team suitors. The players are unhappy with the status quo, but the owners will not relinquish the franchise tag because it protects them from losing their best players. While this may seem unjust, courts have also upheld the franchise tag as a valid practice. [25] Linebacker Wilbur Marshall challenged the validity by filing memorandum in federal court, where the designation was deemed fair and reasonable - the court stated that market conditions still favored players. [26] Seeing that the franchise tag is a valid practice, the players will have to seek a forum other than the courts to address their issue with the designation.

http://www.law.illinois.edu/bljournal/p ... lemma.aspx

I don't see Russell as a "hold out" type of player.

 

[Hawkfan77]

If it's come to that, one or both sides are unhappy and negotiations have failed. Do they really go that route with Russ?

This is all hypothetical and I think he's signed to an extension this year but I don't think a player with that kind of value agrees to play out his rookie contract for a tiny fraction of what he is actually worth out of the kindness of his heart.

Worked with Walt. Russell is a true professional, he's going to give 100% on the field no matter what. Let's not act like guys half a$$ just because they are slapped with a franchise tag.

 

[Our Man in Chicago]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/DangeRussWilson/status/568533068023275520[/tweet]

I'm sure we can spin this a few different ways right?

*Affect.

= the only thing I saw in that Tweet. Films, grammar, and now what? Is dude going to come out as a Fanilow?

 

[Seahawk Sailor]

One thing I'd worry about in his situation....is his divorce final ? If not, and he can get it finalized this year, then he'd be off the hook to pay his ex a TON of money. If it's final and I didn't know it, then it's a moot point, but if it was me, and I was in the middle of a divorce, I'd put off getting that huge payday until after I didn't have to share it.

This is a very good point. If he's making $20 million this next year and splitting it in half, he's basically taking the Seahawks for half of a massive salary that he isn't even getting himself. Playing out a rookie contract could avoid having to hand over a large chunk of money to the ex-wife. And sure, he isn't getting that money himself, but his thought process could very well be "I would rather leave the Seahawks with that money to spend on offensive/defensive help for me rather than give it to her."

And that would be an incredibly wise decision for him personally, in addition to making a decision that was in the best interest of the team.

 

[Anthony!]

I can guarantee you he will not be tagged because he will hold out of camp until they promise not to tag him, and he would be doing the right thing in doing so.

From the Illinois Business Law Journal:

The threat of a hold-out does not carry much weight. A holdout would only serve to (1) drastically reduce the player's payday, (2) portray the player as selfish, potentially alienating him from teammates, and (3) depict the player as a malcontent in the eyes of potential team suitors. The players are unhappy with the status quo, but the owners will not relinquish the franchise tag because it protects them from losing their best players. While this may seem unjust, courts have also upheld the franchise tag as a valid practice. [25] Linebacker Wilbur Marshall challenged the validity by filing memorandum in federal court, where the designation was deemed fair and reasonable - the court stated that market conditions still favored players. [26] Seeing that the franchise tag is a valid practice, the players will have to seek a forum other than the courts to address their issue with the designation.

http://www.law.illinois.edu/bljournal/p ... lemma.aspx

I don't see Russell as a "hold out" type of player.

That's great but you forget what tagging a player says to the payer and other players about the team and how they view them. Yeah we have never used the Tag but we are on you because while we want you we do not want you enough to sign you to a long term deal like we did with the rest of our core players. Yeah that will make the FO look good...NOT FYI it has worked for other players before and would for Wilson.

 

[Sac]

One thing I'd worry about in his situation....is his divorce final ? If not, and he can get it finalized this year, then he'd be off the hook to pay his ex a TON of money. If it's final and I didn't know it, then it's a moot point, but if it was me, and I was in the middle of a divorce, I'd put off getting that huge payday until after I didn't have to share it.

This is a very good point. If he's making $20 million this next year and splitting it in half, he's basically taking the Seahawks for half of a massive salary that he isn't even getting himself. Playing out a rookie contract could avoid having to hand over a large chunk of money to the ex-wife. And sure, he isn't getting that money himself, but his thought process could very well be "I would rather leave the Seahawks with that money to spend on offensive/defensive help for me rather than give it to her."

And that would be an incredibly wise decision for him personally, in addition to making a decision that was in the best interest of the team.

They were married for a year...How much could Ashton possibly be entitled to?

 

[pehawk]

One thing I'd worry about in his situation....is his divorce final ? If not, and he can get it finalized this year, then he'd be off the hook to pay his ex a TON of money. If it's final and I didn't know it, then it's a moot point, but if it was me, and I was in the middle of a divorce, I'd put off getting that huge payday until after I didn't have to share it.

This is a very good point. If he's making $20 million this next year and splitting it in half, he's basically taking the Seahawks for half of a massive salary that he isn't even getting himself. Playing out a rookie contract could avoid having to hand over a large chunk of money to the ex-wife. And sure, he isn't getting that money himself, but his thought process could very well be "I would rather leave the Seahawks with that money to spend on offensive/defensive help for me rather than give it to her."

And that would be an incredibly wise decision for him personally, in addition to making a decision that was in the best interest of the team.

They were married for a year...How much could Ashton possibly be entitled to?

I know working at Microsoft made a judge assume I can fork over close to $2k a month. An NFL player? Man...it'll hurt.

 

[Anthony!]

If it's come to that, one or both sides are unhappy and negotiations have failed. Do they really go that route with Russ?

This is all hypothetical and I think he's signed to an extension this year but I don't think a player with that kind of value agrees to play out his rookie contract for a tiny fraction of what he is actually worth out of the kindness of his heart.

Worked with Walt. Russell is a true professional, he's going to give 100% on the field no matter what. Let's not act like guys half a$$ just because they are slapped with a franchise tag.

Correct he would and the FO knows it so they are taking advantage of that fact. Also Walt would wait to come to camp too, you cannot have your QB do that.

The fact is if they do not sign him to a long term deal and instead try to tag him they will have sent a bad message to Wilson and the team. They already said they want to sing all the core players and have done that. Not doing that for Wilson says he is not a core player. Since they will have made it clear he is not a core player anything Wilson does would not be viewed poorly at all.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?id=3904690

The tag is not viewed as good by the players and it is not.

Sorry if this comes down to Wilson being tagged it will not end well for the Hawks. I do not recall the last franchise QB who was tagged

 

[Hawkfan77]

If it's come to that, one or both sides are unhappy and negotiations have failed. Do they really go that route with Russ?

This is all hypothetical and I think he's signed to an extension this year but I don't think a player with that kind of value agrees to play out his rookie contract for a tiny fraction of what he is actually worth out of the kindness of his heart.

Worked with Walt. Russell is a true professional, he's going to give 100% on the field no matter what. Let's not act like guys half a$$ just because they are slapped with a franchise tag.

Correct he would and the FO knows it so they are taking advantage of that fact. Also Walt would wait to come to camp too, you cannot have your QB do that.

The fact is if they do not sign him to a long term deal and instead try to tag him they will have sent a bad message to Wilson and the team. They already said they want to sing all the core players and have done that. Not doing that for Wilson says he is not a core player. Since they will have made it clear he is not a core player anything Wilson does would not be viewed poorly at all.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?id=3904690

The tag is not viewed as good by the players and it is not.

Sorry if this comes down to Wilson being tagged it will not end well for the Hawks. I do not recall the last franchise QB who was tagged

Maybe because the FT is a last resort and you're assuming everything that can go wrong will. Just because you're not in the know you assume the worst. News flash the organization and Wilson are in communication and are speaking about the new deal.

 

[Seahawk Sailor]

One thing I'd worry about in his situation....is his divorce final ? If not, and he can get it finalized this year, then he'd be off the hook to pay his ex a TON of money. If it's final and I didn't know it, then it's a moot point, but if it was me, and I was in the middle of a divorce, I'd put off getting that huge payday until after I didn't have to share it.

This is a very good point. If he's making $20 million this next year and splitting it in half, he's basically taking the Seahawks for half of a massive salary that he isn't even getting himself. Playing out a rookie contract could avoid having to hand over a large chunk of money to the ex-wife. And sure, he isn't getting that money himself, but his thought process could very well be "I would rather leave the Seahawks with that money to spend on offensive/defensive help for me rather than give it to her."

And that would be an incredibly wise decision for him personally, in addition to making a decision that was in the best interest of the team.

They were married for a year...How much could Ashton possibly be entitled to?

Potentially? All of it.

 

[Laloosh]

If it's come to that, one or both sides are unhappy and negotiations have failed. Do they really go that route with Russ?

This is all hypothetical and I think he's signed to an extension this year but I don't think a player with that kind of value agrees to play out his rookie contract for a tiny fraction of what he is actually worth out of the kindness of his heart.

Worked with Walt. Russell is a true professional, he's going to give 100% on the field no matter what. Let's not act like guys half a$$ just because they are slapped with a franchise tag.

What are you even arguing? Who said he was going to half-ass anything and how does who you've worked with have any bearing on what I said?

If you're going to craft straw men, do it with someone else's posts.

 

[Anthony!]

If it's come to that, one or both sides are unhappy and negotiations have failed. Do they really go that route with Russ?

This is all hypothetical and I think he's signed to an extension this year but I don't think a player with that kind of value agrees to play out his rookie contract for a tiny fraction of what he is actually worth out of the kindness of his heart.

Worked with Walt. Russell is a true professional, he's going to give 100% on the field no matter what. Let's not act like guys half a$$ just because they are slapped with a franchise tag.

Correct he would and the FO knows it so they are taking advantage of that fact. Also Walt would wait to come to camp too, you cannot have your QB do that.

The fact is if they do not sign him to a long term deal and instead try to tag him they will have sent a bad message to Wilson and the team. They already said they want to sing all the core players and have done that. Not doing that for Wilson says he is not a core player. Since they will have made it clear he is not a core player anything Wilson does would not be viewed poorly at all.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?id=3904690

The tag is not viewed as good by the players and it is not.

Sorry if this comes down to Wilson being tagged it will not end well for the Hawks. I do not recall the last franchise QB who was tagged

Maybe because the FT is a last resort and you're assuming everything that can go wrong will. Just because you're not in the know you assume the worst. News flash the organization and Wilson are in communication and are speaking about the new deal.

Not assuming anything say what would happen IF

 

[Hawkfan77]

If it's come to that, one or both sides are unhappy and negotiations have failed. Do they really go that route with Russ?

This is all hypothetical and I think he's signed to an extension this year but I don't think a player with that kind of value agrees to play out his rookie contract for a tiny fraction of what he is actually worth out of the kindness of his heart.

Worked with Walt. Russell is a true professional, he's going to give 100% on the field no matter what. Let's not act like guys half a$$ just because they are slapped with a franchise tag.

What are you even arguing? Who said he was going to half-ass anything and how does who you've worked with have any bearing on what I said?

If you're going to craft straw men, do it with someone else's posts.

I can comment on anyone's posts. If you don't like your posts being quoted, I'm not sure what to say. Other than you said there would be unhappy people if Russell gets franchise, and there's no one you could possibly know that.