Our "mediocre" offense

[Erebus]

I've been lurking on the boards of the other NFC playoff teams and noticed one trend in regard to their fans' perceptions of the Seahawks: we have an "anemic" or "mediocre" offense. I think it's tacky to post on their boards (although I don't mind them posting here), so I'll leave this here for opposing fans to read.

Per Football Outsiders' DVOA, our offense is #5. For comparison, New England is 6th, Baltimore is 9th, Indy is 17th, Cincinnati is 18th, Detroit is 19th, and Carolina is 20th. Of the teams still in the playoffs, only Green Bay (1), Denver (3), and Dallas (4) are ahead of us. Dallas is only ahead by 0.3%. We're a run-first offense, and our rush offense DVOA is 1st by a mile and one of the best of all time, nearly 3 times as good as the #2 team.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamoff

If you don't like fancy advanced stats, then lets judge by yards and points. We're #9 in yards and #10 in points, ahead of other playoff teams such as Baltimore (12th in yards, 8th in points), Cincinnati (15th, 15th), Carolina (16th, 19th), Detroit (19th, 22nd), and Arizona (24th, 24th). If you look at rushing yards, we're #1 with 172 ypg, well ahead of #2 Dallas (147 ypg). Any way you look at it, we have a top ten offense, and I don't see how that can be considered anemic or mediocre. The way to beat us, I keep hearing, is to stuff Lynch and contain Wilson to the pocket. Even if that were true, its much easier said than done.

Only Detroit with their #1 ranked rush defense matches up well against our running game. The Panthers (22nd in rush defense DVOA), Cowboys (23rd), and Packers (24th) don't match up well against our rush offense.

We don't throw it a lot because, simply put, we don't have to. But when we do, we rank 10th in passing DVOA, 6th in yards per attempt (7.7), and 8th in passer rating. The NFC playoff teams with a higher ranking in pass defense DVOA than our pass offense are Detroit (8th) and Carolina (9th), although their rankings aren't much higher than our pass offense.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef

Furthermore, our offense improved when we got rid of our cancer. With Harvin, we averaged 335 yards per game, and 394 yards without him. I don't know how to find our weekly DVOA ratings (maybe that's premium content).

The bottom line is that we have a top ten offense by any metric except total passing yards, and best-in-the-league at what we try to do.

 

[SnoCoHawk]

You can list stats until you're blue in the face, but (like most of the media) all they can get their puny minds wrapped around is shiny-object, high-yard passing games with big name receivers. Preferably at least 20 yards per pass before YAC.

Unfortunately, that attitude just means that Goodell and his cronies will keep trying to take the teeth out of secondaries because they're standing in the way of giving the unwashed masses what they want. I wonder if anyone's brain-storming about how to make the run game less successful so it won't be tried as often, too.

 

[kearly]

I listen to some NFL podcasts by typical idiot east coast fans, and pretty much anytime they talk about the Seahawks you hear about how their offense and OL are terrible. It's lazy analysis, and I very much doubt that they even watch the games.

Seattle's offense IS good, damn good even. As twelves we should know our team better than lazy east coast fans.

Now, does that mean our offense is above criticism or without glaring flaws? Is it sustainable after Lynch moves on or after defenses start spying Wilson more after watching the tape and formulating their 2015 gameplans this offseason? Are we okay with not making the most of Wilson's elite passing potential? Those are valid questions. But for 2015, the offense has been championship caliber.

I think Pete is fully aware of this and wants to see his offense evolve next season, so I'm not worried about it.

 

[Seafan]

The Hawk passing game is its weakest part. That's how the mediots should phrase it. Hawks have a dominant running game, dominant run defense, dominant pass defense so the weakest part is naturally the passing game. That doesn't make it bad. Certainly it is by design and the mediots need to understand that.

 

[bigskydoc]

Furthermore, our offense improved when we got rid of our cancer. With Harvin, we averaged 335 yards per game, and 394 yards without him. I don't know how to find our weekly DVOA ratings (maybe that's premium content).
.

You are right, premium content. Just can't bring myself to pay for it.

- bsd RPA

 

[253hawk]

I remember when everyone was talking about our mediocre offense last year heading into the post-season. I think it ended alright.

 

[Pak-Man12]

We saw what happened to the best offense in NFL history last year.

 

[drdiags]

If I weren't a Seahawks fan I would look at this team like the Bud Grant Vikings. Hellacious defense with a methodical offense that in the end couldn't perform in the big game to make the 4 time Superbowl losers a winner.

I might try to rationalize the Denver loss as just Manning choking under pressure and would feel my team had a chance on a neutral field or if they could stop the running game.

As a fan I believe they are more than this and have seen them show the flexibility to play multiple styles. I would just let the fans that feel this offense is mediocre have their day. The results on the field is what matters and if the current formula gets the Seahawks into multiple Superbowls along with wins, well those other fans can have their style points.

Lions have great offensive weapons but unfortunately they are heading home and the Boys have some as well and it almost didn't save them playing at home. Don't care what the other guy thinks. On the field is what counts.

Makes for great debate though.

 

[Hawks46]

You can list stats until you're blue in the face, but (like most of the media) all they can get their puny minds wrapped around is shiny-object, high-yard passing games with big name receivers. Preferably at least 20 yards per pass before YAC.

Unfortunately, that attitude just means that Goodell and his cronies will keep trying to take the teeth out of secondaries because they're standing in the way of giving the unwashed masses what they want. I wonder if anyone's brain-storming about how to make the run game less successful so it won't be tried as often, too.

You know it's funny, I day dreamed the other day that if we won the SB again, the NFL would go out of it's way to try to derail us from getting 3 in a row. They can't do much more to the defense, so I was theorizing that they would limit rushing snaps per game, or limited consecutive rushing snaps. Or setting a minimum amount of passing attempts.

I know it sounds ludicrous, but what else can they do ? Our team plays football Old School, like they used to do. It worked then and it works now....how much more can the NFL tinker with stuff before they break the game ?

As for mediocre offense, it's amazing to look at our rushing offense. 174 ypg, really ?? That's insane. I'd say our offense can be inconsistent, but not mediocre.

 

[AROS]

Until Russell Wilson is unleashed by Carroll to throw 55 times a game and put up gaudy numbers like Manning, Luck and the like, this will be the narrative for the rest of this particular era under Pete Carroll.

It's lazy logic and dime-store analysis at best usually employed by fans who can't look past their favorite team to see what the rest of the NFL is up to.

Let 'em believe what they want, all the way to our back-to-back Lombardi's.

 

[HawKnPeppa]

You can list stats until you're blue in the face, but (like most of the media) all they can get their puny minds wrapped around is shiny-object, high-yard passing games with big name receivers. Preferably at least 20 yards per pass before YAC.

Unfortunately, that attitude just means that Goodell and his cronies will keep trying to take the teeth out of secondaries because they're standing in the way of giving the unwashed masses what they want. I wonder if anyone's brain-storming about how to make the run game less successful so it won't be tried as often, too.

You know it's funny, I day dreamed the other day that if we won the SB again, the NFL would go out of it's way to try to derail us from getting 3 in a row. They can't do much more to the defense, so I was theorizing that they would limit rushing snaps per game, or limited consecutive rushing snaps. Or setting a minimum amount of passing attempts.

I know it sounds ludicrous, but what else can they do ? Our team plays football Old School, like they used to do. It worked then and it works now....how much more can the NFL tinker with stuff before they break the game ?

As for mediocre offense, it's amazing to look at our rushing offense. 174 ypg, really ?? That's insane. I'd say our offense can be inconsistent, but not mediocre.

Make stiff arms illegal?

 

[SnoCoHawk]

You can list stats until you're blue in the face, but (like most of the media) all they can get their puny minds wrapped around is shiny-object, high-yard passing games with big name receivers. Preferably at least 20 yards per pass before YAC.

Unfortunately, that attitude just means that Goodell and his cronies will keep trying to take the teeth out of secondaries because they're standing in the way of giving the unwashed masses what they want. I wonder if anyone's brain-storming about how to make the run game less successful so it won't be tried as often, too.

You know it's funny, I day dreamed the other day that if we won the SB again, the NFL would go out of it's way to try to derail us from getting 3 in a row. They can't do much more to the defense, so I was theorizing that they would limit rushing snaps per game, or limited consecutive rushing snaps. Or setting a minimum amount of passing attempts.

I know it sounds ludicrous, but what else can they do ? Our team plays football Old School, like they used to do. It worked then and it works now....how much more can the NFL tinker with stuff before they break the game ?

As for mediocre offense, it's amazing to look at our rushing offense. 174 ypg, really ?? That's insane. I'd say our offense can be inconsistent, but not mediocre.

Make stiff arms illegal?

Well, it would have to be done under the guise of "improving player safety"...so maybe lots of unnecessary roughness calls when a defensive player gets steamrolled by a running back and/or fullback.

 

[themunn]

If I weren't a Seahawks fan I would look at this team like the Bud Grant Vikings. Hellacious defense with a methodical offense that in the end couldn't perform in the big game to make the 4 time Superbowl losers a winner.

The team couldn't run the ball though - their leading rusher had under 50 yards in all 4 superbowls, including a 12 carry 18 yard performance from their lead rusher in superbowl IX - and 12 of those yards came on a single rush. Granted, that was against the Steel Curtain, but 10 yards rushing TOTAL in a game is pathetic by any measure.

On the other hand, our passing game isn't league leading (ranked "only" 10th in DVOA"), but as mentioned by someone else in anothe rthread, our rushing game is playing at an all-time level - 29.9% DVOA, which is a higher positive DVOA than our defensive DVOA this season.
2nd place Dolphins have 10.3%. In fact, only 9 teams had a positive DVOA.

That 29.9% rushing DVOA ranks 5th all time behind only the 93 49ers (won Superbowl 49-26), 98 Broncos (won Superbowl 34-19), 2000 Rams and 2011 Panthers (NO DEFENSE).

Being able to rush limits turnovers, and with a defense that keeps the opposition from scoring (and generates turnovers of it's own), you're going to win more games than you lose. This offense is perfect for our team.