Hawks trying to trade WR Kearse

[T-Hawk]

I might be in the minority here, but I think trading j. Lane would be a huge mistake. I really don't want to be in the "have to" position of starting shaw grifins first regular season game agains Aarons rodgers. Brock is supposed to be a good nickel but I haven't been super impressed. Thorpe is not someone I want outside of special teams. I'm not banking on shead playing this year either. I think J. Lane is gonna be huge for us this year.

If it's part of getting us Richardson like Attyla and Hawkscanner have talked about, then I think the added pass rush will more than offset any drop off in coverage, and I'm all in on the move.

But, if it's just to get rid of Lane, then I agree with you, I'd rather go into the season with him than without him. Not just for defense either, he's a great special teamer as well. He was one of the gunners on that punt unit that set the record for fewest return yards in our Super Bowl season.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I might be in the minority here, but I think trading j. Lane would be a huge mistake. I really don't want to be in the "have to" position of starting shaw grifins first regular season game agains Aarons rodgers. Brock is supposed to be a good nickel but I haven't been super impressed. Thorpe is not someone I want outside of special teams. I'm not banking on shead playing this year either. I think J. Lane is gonna be huge for us this year.

Getting rid of vets like Kearse and Lane and going with unproven players is always a risk.

But if John and Pete have shown anything, it's that they completely trust their developmental process. Just as they trusted guys like Sherm, Maxwell, Kam and Lane 4-5 years ago, they now will trust the next crop of young and hungry group of DB's to develop and play hard.

Don't forget we signed Brock, and I assume Shead will be coming back sometime this year as well.

 

[Seahawkfan80]

I might be in the minority here, but I think trading j. Lane would be a huge mistake. I really don't want to be in the "have to" position of starting shaw grifins first regular season game agains Aarons rodgers. Brock is supposed to be a good nickel but I haven't been super impressed. Thorpe is not someone I want outside of special teams. I'm not banking on shead playing this year either. I think J. Lane is gonna be huge for us this year.

If it's part of getting us Richardson like Attyla and Hawkscanner have talked about, then I think the added pass rush will more than offset any drop off in coverage, and I'm all in on the move.

But, if it's just to get rid of Lane, then I agree with you, I'd rather go into the season with him than without him. Not just for defense either, he's a great special teamer as well. He was one of the gunners on that punt unit that set the record for fewest return yards in our Super Bowl season.

Ya...I still remember in my mind seeing an interception and then there was this guy that came out of no where to block so the DB or Corner could run it in for a td. Who the heck is that number 20????

 

[Seymour]

I might be in the minority here, but I think trading j. Lane would be a huge mistake. I really don't want to be in the "have to" position of starting shaw grifins first regular season game agains Aarons rodgers. Brock is supposed to be a good nickel but I haven't been super impressed. Thorpe is not someone I want outside of special teams. I'm not banking on shead playing this year either. I think J. Lane is gonna be huge for us this year.

Getting rid of vets like Kearse and Lane and going with unproven players is always a risk.

But if John and Pete have shown anything, it's that they completely trust their developmental process. Just as they trusted guys like Sherm, Maxwell, Kam and Lane 4-5 years ago, they now will trust the next crop of young and hungry group of DB's to develop and play hard.

Don't forget we signed Brock, and I assume Shead will be coming back sometime this year as well.

Pretty sure it will go better than letting Jahri Evans go to put Ifedi in his spot. That was the dumb move of the year last season. :roll:

 

[mrt144]

I might be in the minority here, but I think trading j. Lane would be a huge mistake. I really don't want to be in the "have to" position of starting shaw grifins first regular season game agains Aarons rodgers. Brock is supposed to be a good nickel but I haven't been super impressed. Thorpe is not someone I want outside of special teams. I'm not banking on shead playing this year either. I think J. Lane is gonna be huge for us this year.

Getting rid of vets like Kearse and Lane and going with unproven players is always a risk.

But if John and Pete have shown anything, it's that they completely trust their developmental process. Just as they trusted guys like Sherm, Maxwell, Kam and Lane 4-5 years ago, they now will trust the next crop of young and hungry group of DB's to develop and play hard.

Don't forget we signed Brock, and I assume Shead will be coming back sometime this year as well.

The thing that sucks too is that risk has to be undertaken at some point with salary and development curves coming to a head. It's not a question of whether you will have to take that risk, it's a matter of when.

 

[gowazzu02]

If only they had a really tall TE who could go up and get it in the Red Zone....
too soon (ahead of time?)

You joke, but this is what I'm saying.

Russell LOVES to go to Kearse in the red zone because other teams double team Jimmy and Doug and leave Kearse one on one..........cause he stinks.

So trade or cut his ass and it should be an addition by subtraction thing. Russell can't keep throwing it to Kearse (Saints game) if he's not here. Let someone else try and make plays. Both Williams and McElvoy have shown they can go up and win one on ones.

Dude some times I think your actually inside of my brain Largent. Couldn't of said it better or different myself.

Preach!

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I might be in the minority here, but I think trading j. Lane would be a huge mistake. I really don't want to be in the "have to" position of starting shaw grifins first regular season game agains Aarons rodgers. Brock is supposed to be a good nickel but I haven't been super impressed. Thorpe is not someone I want outside of special teams. I'm not banking on shead playing this year either. I think J. Lane is gonna be huge for us this year.

Getting rid of vets like Kearse and Lane and going with unproven players is always a risk.

But if John and Pete have shown anything, it's that they completely trust their developmental process. Just as they trusted guys like Sherm, Maxwell, Kam and Lane 4-5 years ago, they now will trust the next crop of young and hungry group of DB's to develop and play hard.

Don't forget we signed Brock, and I assume Shead will be coming back sometime this year as well.

Pretty sure it will go better than letting Jahri Evans go to put Ifedi in his spot. That was the dumb move of the year last season. :roll:

The hope is Ifedi develops, as opposed to letting him rot on the bench playing a 34 year old Evans.

Maybe it didn't work out LAST year, but the hope is you're developing a RT for the next 10 years, and not going with a short term fix for 1-2 years.

 

[Bobblehead]

If only they had a really tall TE who could go up and get it in the Red Zone....
too soon (ahead of time?)

You joke, but this is what I'm saying.

Russell LOVES to go to Kearse in the red zone because other teams double team Jimmy and Doug and leave Kearse one on one..........cause he stinks.

So trade or cut his ass and it should be an addition by subtraction thing. Russell can't keep throwing it to Kearse (Saints game) if he's not here. Let someone else try and make plays. Both Williams and McElvoy have shown they can go up and win one on ones.

Dude some times I think your actually inside of my brain Largent. Couldn't of said it better or different myself.

Preach!

The problem with Russell throwing to Kearse in the Redzone isn't all Kearse. Usually, if Russell is throwing to Kearse in the RZ, Russell is scrambling or throwing a unbalanced desperation flip to Kearse, who has to gyrate and contour himself just to be in the proximity of the throwing zone.

 

[Lords of Scythia]

From this it sounded like they're cutting him anyway, and just want to get anything they can--more to work with for Trader John.
http://www.seattlepi.com/sports/footbal ... 162603.php

 

[T-Hawk]

Bleacher Report app is saying Browns are interested in trade for Kearse. I'd love to get something back for him, but I can't help but feel bad for him if he does end up going to Cleveland. :|

 

[jdblack]

I love what Kearse provides, valuable part of the offense.

Unfortunately Wilson throws Kearse the ball too much, and it seems the only way to make him stop is to get rid of Kearse.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Bleacher Report app is saying Browns are interested in trade for Kearse. I'd love to get something back for him, but I can't help but feel bad for him if he does end up going to Cleveland. :|

I'm fine with getting back a bag of footballs. The value in trading Kearse as opposed to just cutting him is we free up 2.2M in cap space to add a much needed OL or DL player.

Same with Lane.

 

[T-Hawk]

I love what Kearse provides, valuable part of the offense.

Unfortunately Wilson throws Kearse the ball too much, and it seems the only way to make him stop is to get rid of Kearse.

They could also just not play him in red zone situations, but if you are actively avoiding playing a guy in the most important part of the field that's kind of a problem I guess.

 

[DJrmb]

Heard an interesting argument today about keeping Kearse (not my own, just thought it was interesting and worth posting for the sake of seeing things from a different perspective):

For all the complaining about the RB's being hurt and missing time people sure seam to have a double standard with the WR's... Everyone seems to want to ship Kearse out of here to the 1st team with a 7th round pick but besides Baldwin what healthy WR do you have without Kearse who if nothing else has proven to be durable?

Paul Richardson - Already hurt earlier this year, played through it but does anyone honestly believe he'll play 16+ games this season without getting hurt?

Tyler Lockett - There was questions with Lockett's ability to handle the punishment in the NFL even coming out of college with his size. He played 16 games his 1st year however in a bit of a limited role. Then last year he hurt his knee early on and tried to play through it but was clearly hampered. Then the broken leg later in the season. He has not gotten any playing time in this preseason and to be honest they probably should have started him on PUP. There's a lot of question if he'll be even close to 100% to begin this season.

Amara Darboh - Has barely seen any time this preseason because of multiple injuries.

Kasen Williams - Everyone knows about the terrible college injury but he's been trying to make this team for 3 years now. He's flashed play making ability in each year I believe however he always ended up getting hurt and not being able to show up consistently and therefore ended up being cut and put on the PS each year.

The only WR that seems to be constantly reliable is Tanner McEvoy. However, he has had surgery this offseason on his toe and he's yet to have been tested over a full season in more of a full time role, so really who knows on him? If they trade Kearse then I think for sure McEvoy makes it but that leaves you with him and Baldwin as your most dependable guys and McEvoy hasn't proven anything yet. Who's to say he won't be as injury prone as the rest?

As I said this isn't my opinion, I actually would still argue to go with talent/upside of the others over the durability of Kearse as I think most of the above mentioned guys offer more upside than Kearse. However, it is an interesting perspective that's not really "wrong" and should maybe give some of the people railing on the RB's pause if they are also putting all their faith and hope in the talent of all these oft injured WR's.

 

[T-Hawk]

Bleacher Report app is saying Browns are interested in trade for Kearse. I'd love to get something back for him, but I can't help but feel bad for him if he does end up going to Cleveland. :|

I'm fine with getting back a bag of footballs. The value in trading Kearse as opposed to just cutting him is we free up 2.2M in cap space to add a much needed OL or DL player.

Same with Lane.

Totally agree on Kearse, I just feel bad for him if he ends up in Cleveland. He's never played for an NFL team that hasn't won a Playoff game, to go from that to the Browns just seems cruel.

 

[Hawk-Lock]

Apparently the Cleveland Browns are interested in him.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Heard an interesting argument today about keeping Kearse (not my own, just thought it was interesting and worth posting for the sake of seeing things from a different perspective):

For all the complaining about the RB's being hurt and missing time people sure seam to have a double standard with the WR's... Everyone seems to want to ship Kearse out of here to the 1st team with a 7th round pick but besides Baldwin what healthy WR do you have without Kearse who if nothing else has proven to be durable?

Paul Richardson - Already hurt earlier this year, played through it but does anyone honestly believe he'll play 16+ games this season without getting hurt?

Tyler Lockett - There was questions with Lockett's ability to handle the punishment in the NFL even coming out of college with his size. He played 16 games his 1st year however in a bit of a limited role. Then last year he hurt his knee early on and tried to play through it but was clearly hampered. Then the broken leg later in the season. He has not gotten any playing time in this preseason and to be honest they probably should have started him on PUP. There's a lot of question if he'll be even close to 100% to begin this season.

Amara Darboh - Has barely seen any time this preseason because of multiple injuries.

Kasen Williams - Everyone knows about the terrible college injury but he's been trying to make this team for 3 years now. He's flashed play making ability in each year I believe however he always ended up getting hurt and not being able to show up consistently and therefore ended up being cut and put on the PS each year.

The only WR that seems to be constantly reliable is Tanner McEvoy. However, he has had surgery this offseason on his toe and he's yet to have been tested over a full season in more of a full time role, so really who knows on him? If they trade Kearse then I think for sure McEvoy makes it but that leaves you with him and Baldwin as your most dependable guys and McEvoy hasn't proven anything yet. Who's to say he won't be as injury prone as the rest?

As I said this isn't my opinion, I actually would still argue to go with talent/upside of the others over the durability of Kearse as I think most of the above mentioned guys offer more upside than Kearse. However, it is an interesting perspective that's not really "wrong" and should maybe give some of the people railing on the RB's pause if they are also putting all their faith and hope in the talent of all these oft injured WR's.

For sure it's a risk, like I said above..........most roster moves come with risk.

But IMO our WR group is finally deep enough to take the risk, especially if it means freeing up 2.2M to get a quality D or O-lineman. Of which there should be quite a few available come Saturday.

 

[jdemps]

I might be in the minority here, but I think trading j. Lane would be a huge mistake. I really don't want to be in the "have to" position of starting shaw grifins first regular season game agains Aarons rodgers. Brock is supposed to be a good nickel but I haven't been super impressed. Thorpe is not someone I want outside of special teams. I'm not banking on shead playing this year either. I think J. Lane is gonna be huge for us this year.

Getting rid of vets like Kearse and Lane and going with unproven players is always a risk.

But if John and Pete have shown anything, it's that they completely trust their developmental process. Just as they trusted guys like Sherm, Maxwell, Kam and Lane 4-5 years ago, they now will trust the next crop of young and hungry group of DB's to develop and play hard.

Don't forget we signed Brock, and I assume Shead will be coming back sometime this year as well.

Remember when lane came back from his ACL/ broken arm in 2015 and was awful. Shead was never a 4.4 guy and had to win on technique. He's going to be even slower until he's 100% back. Let's not forget that this injury occurred in January. Hes 7 months removed from major knee surgery. Pete said he just started running. Not cutting. Just running. I'm not expecting anything from shead this year.

 

[Seymour]

Is it a risk to think we could improve on Kearse's 1-15 in the red zone 2016 catch rate?

That is so huge it leaves me with little worry it will improve.

Addition by subtraction may sound cruel, but 100% true in this case (as you stated earlier).

If he hadn't returned pouty faced after no offers and saying goodbye, I might feel different enough to say 1 year pass, try again. But that wasn't the case, and I think losing any edge is all it takes for someone on his level of play to drop off the map.

 

[mrt144]

If only they had a really tall TE who could go up and get it in the Red Zone....
too soon (ahead of time?)

You joke, but this is what I'm saying.

Russell LOVES to go to Kearse in the red zone because other teams double team Jimmy and Doug and leave Kearse one on one..........cause he stinks.

So trade or cut his ass and it should be an addition by subtraction thing. Russell can't keep throwing it to Kearse (Saints game) if he's not here. Let someone else try and make plays. Both Williams and McElvoy have shown they can go up and win one on ones.

Dude some times I think your actually inside of my brain Largent. Couldn't of said it better or different myself.

Preach!

The problem with Russell throwing to Kearse in the Redzone isn't all Kearse. Usually, if Russell is throwing to Kearse in the RZ, Russell is scrambling or throwing a unbalanced desperation flip to Kearse, who has to gyrate and contour himself just to be in the proximity of the throwing zone.

Let's look at it another way: Are there any NFL players who could fulfill that role better than Kearse? What are the salary trade offs there? Do we have anyone on the roster that could step up into that role?

I agree, it's not all on Kearse and the dynamics of how a plays break down in the RZ could contribute greatly to the repeated missed opportunities. But this just leads me to the above question - if JK is this chaos outlet for RW in the RZ, how valuable is he in that role given the output? It's really hard for me to look at the situation in this context and believe that JK is an irreplaceable chaos outlet option EVEN IF RW believes that to be the case. RW isn't immune from cognitive biases and that's his problem to solve.

This is where Bevell needs to step up and guide RW and JK better, in my estimation. Or simply provide better chaos outlet options for RW at the exclusion of JK by putting another person on the field in his place. RW also should take stock of the outcomes and see how he can do better specifically with Kearse. I think the path of least resistance is taking snaps away from JK in the RZ and just allowing the chips to fall where they will.

Obviously that's all provided he sticks on the team and isn't traded or released.

I think if you did league wide comparisons with other teams you'd find Kearse is singularly unique in the missed opportunities - Take any team with a Top 10 QB (as you define it) and try and find a WR that has similar amount of missed opportunities both in volume and conversion. Allowing for the possibility that so many of Kearse's opportunities are harder ones than most other comparable players, is he the right player to take those harder plays on? I think the output suggests he isn't but for lack of other options on the team and schematic reluctance to adjust, he is.