Seahawk offense in the 4th quarter

[Seahawkfan80]

But the point is that when offense has the ball, the mindset has to be to score. Two years ago, PC alluded to special teams / punting and improving field position through multiple 3 and outs- leading me to believe defense was there to give offense another try at trying.

I don't mind the ground and pound and 11 minutes of boredom. But our goal isn't to score. Bevell may or may not be useless, Russell may or may not be an ineffective game manager but neither of them push until they're dragging bodies in the streets.

RW may model his game after drew brees but not the mindset. Being to many saints games, even when they suck, the saints get on the field to score. Not win the turnover battle, not complete passes, to score. I don't particularly like their brand of football. I like the Hawks but stop thinking about run run pass and punt and what it takes to score.

Aaron Rogers is a scorer, not a qb as well.

RWs interceptions show a crack in the shell. Once we get out of our get 2 yard or bust mode and punt in 4th and 5 into let's score touchdowns. Well use tools better and we won't need 5 seconds of protection from the line to line up a 10 yard pass. Moving the ball 10 yards seems to be DB and RWs second goal. They would rather move 2 yards.

You can't score with our mindset. I did like the long passes. What the hell we had the lead let's take a shot. Cardinals and Rams have to study films too and they're always stacking the box.

If Kearse would have kept sprinting or RW throw a timing pass rather than a visual pass we could have added 7.

THis is something that other teams now have to plan for. It is now in our arsenal. It has been done so it is there and could be used as necessary. Schemes are now gonna be different. oops...um uh nevermind. :twisted:

 

[vin.couve12]

The offense in the 4th quarter is directly related to the defense in the 4th quarter. We've been losing TOP in the 4th by a large margin and the D has been on the field almost the entire 4th in every game and also the last half of the 3rd.

We got away with it this time, but the offenses lack of holding any drive together late in games has exacerbate any and all defensive struggles we've had.

49ers had the ball for less than 4 minutes of the 4th quarter. What's the transition point between "getting away with it" and successfully keeping the other team off the field with a lead?

The context of getting away with it this time is that we had as many 3 and outs as they did in the 4th quarter. Let's see....

4th Quarter
Seattle Seahawks continues ...
1-16-SEA 31
(15:00) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short right to 88-J.Graham to SEA 39 for 8 yards (57-M.Wilhoite; 25-J.Ward) [92-Q.Dial]. Caught at SEA 37. 2-yds YAC
2-8-SEA 39
(14:21) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short right to 22-F.Jackson to SF 43 for 18 yards (26-T.Brock, 29-J.Tartt). Caught at SEA 40. 17-yds YAC
1-10-SF 43
(13:34) 24-M.Lynch up the middle to SF 40 for 3 yards (53-N.Bowman, 57-M.Wilhoite).
2-7-SF 40
(12:55) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short right to 16-T.Lockett pushed ob at SF 34 for 6 yards (29-J.Tartt). Caught at SF 34. 0-yds YAC
3-1-SF 34
(12:16) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson left end to SF 26 for 8 yards (29-J.Tartt).
1-10-SF 26
(11:36) (Shotgun) 24-M.Lynch left guard to SF 24 for 2 yards (57-M.Wilhoite, 55-A.Brooks).
2-8-SF 24
(10:52) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson sacked at SF 29 for -5 yards (59-A.Lynch).
3-13-SF 29
(10:10) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short left to 22-F.Jackson to SF 28 for 1 yard (35-E.Reid). Caught at SF 31. 3-yds YAC
4-12-SF 28
(9:29) 4-S.Hauschka 46 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-49-C.Gresham, Holder-9-J.Ryan.
San Francisco 49ers at 09:23
4-S.Hauschka kicks 67 yards from SEA 35 to SF -2. 10-B.Ellington to SF 23 for 25 yards (11-B.Daniels).
1-10-SF 23
(9:14) 7-C.Kaepernick sacked at SF 16 for -7 yards (72-M.Bennett).
2-17-SF 16
(8:32) 7-C.Kaepernick sacked at SF 7 for -9 yards (sack split by 93-D.King and 92-B.Mebane).
3-26-SF 7
(7:52) (Shotgun) 23-R.Bush up the middle to SF 13 for 6 yards (31-K.Chancellor).
4-20-SF 13
(7:14) 5-B.Pinion punts 42 yards to SEA 45, Center-86-K.Nelson, fair catch by 16-T.Lockett.
Seattle Seahawks at 07:06
1-10-SEA 45
(7:06) 24-M.Lynch right tackle to SEA 41 for -4 yards (29-J.Tartt).
2-14-SEA 41
(6:24) 24-M.Lynch up the middle to SEA 45 for 4 yards (63-T.Jerod-Eddie).
3-10-SEA 45
(5:44) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson sacked at SEA 36 for -9 yards (55-A.Brooks).
4-19-SEA 36
(5:00) 9-J.Ryan punts 44 yards to SF 20, Center-49-C.Gresham, fair catch by 23-R.Bush. PENALTY on SF-11-Q.Patton, Unsportsmanlike Conduct, 10 yards, enforced at SF 20.
San Francisco 49ers at 04:52
1-10-SF 10
(4:52) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass short left to 81-A.Boldin to SF 16 for 6 yards (35-D.Shead). Caught at SF 15. 1-yd YAC
2-4-SF 16
(4:26) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass incomplete short middle to 82-T.Smith.
3-4-SF 16
(4:22) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass incomplete deep left to 11-Q.Patton. Penalty on SF-75-A.Boone, Offensive Holding, declined.
4-4-SF 16
(4:16) 5-B.Pinion punts 43 yards to SEA 41, Center-86-K.Nelson. 16-T.Lockett to SEA 43 for 2 yards (31-L.McCray).
Seattle Seahawks at 04:08
1-10-SEA 43
(4:08) 24-M.Lynch right guard to SEA 45 for 2 yards (93-I.Williams, 90-G.Dorsey).
Timeout #1 by SF at 04:00.
2-8-SEA 45
(4:00) 24-M.Lynch left guard to SEA 47 for 2 yards (57-M.Wilhoite).
Timeout #2 by SF at 03:56.
3-6-SEA 47
(3:56) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass incomplete short left to 88-J.Graham. SF-29-J.Tartt was injured during the play. His return is Probable.
4-6-SEA 47
(3:53) 9-J.Ryan punts 53 yards to end zone, Center-49-C.Gresham, Touchback.
San Francisco 49ers at 03:42
1-10-SF 20
(3:42) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass short right to 85-V.Davis to SF 27 for 7 yards (31-K.Chancellor). Caught at SF 26. 1-yd YAC
2-3-SF 27
(3:19) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass incomplete short right to 11-Q.Patton.
3-3-SF 27
(3:16) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass incomplete short left to 81-A.Boldin (54-B.Wagner).
4-3-SF 27
(3:13) 5-B.Pinion punts 48 yards to SEA 25, Center-86-K.Nelson, out of bounds.
Seattle Seahawks at 03:05
1-10-SEA 25
(3:05) 24-M.Lynch left tackle to SEA 36 for 11 yards (57-M.Wilhoite).
1-10-SEA 36
(2:20) 24-M.Lynch up the middle to SEA 39 for 3 yards (95-C.Carradine).
Timeout #3 by SF at 02:12.
2-7-SEA 39
(2:12) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short left to 16-T.Lockett to SEA 41 for 2 yards (51-G.Hodges). Caught at SEA 36. 5-yds YAC
3-5-SEA 41
(2:06) (Shotgun) 24-M.Lynch left guard to SEA 47 for 6 yards (27-K.Reaser).
Two-Minute Warning
1-10-SEA 47
(2:00) 3-R.Wilson kneels to SEA 46 for -1 yards.
2-11-SEA 46
(1:19) 3-R.Wilson kneels to SEA 45 for -1 yards.
3-12-SEA 45
39) 3-R.Wilson kneels to SEA 44 for -1 yards.
END GAME

OK, so we had one less 3 and out. We did a good job in taking that first drive down for a FG that actually started in the 3rd quarter, where we were previously already shutting down for the day/night and then losing, but then we go into 3 and out mode ourselves when the 9ers get the ball down 17 with over 9 minutes left.

That way things were going, being up 17 at that time didn't really seem like much. Thankfully, the defense held the 9ers to 3 strait 3 and outs themselves so it was fine. We got away with it this time...because the defense held perfectly.

I'm not necessarily of the mind that they should absolutely have to continue to carry the team as one of the best defenses ever though. I think that's the expectation because of what CAN be given what HAS BEEN, but I also know that 3 and outs and very short drives pay a toll on a defense constantly having to go back out. They won't be as sharp....there'll be communication breakdowns, etc. We've been a lot better previously as a running team and that obviously eats the clock, particularly late in games. It hasn't been that way this year and I very much don't think that has anything to do with whichever RB is in. That OL is just damn near 50/50 hit and miss and that's just too much miss.

Speaking of which, even though it's not part of the discussion, will say that RW has missed a lot of open WRs this year and yes he is running into sacks, but dude is gunshy right now. Even when the OL has good pass pro he just doesn't trust it and mentally bails. I guess we'll just see if we can get any development there....

 

[Siouxhawk]

The offense in the 4th quarter is directly related to the defense in the 4th quarter. We've been losing TOP in the 4th by a large margin and the D has been on the field almost the entire 4th in every game and also the last half of the 3rd.

We got away with it this time, but the offenses lack of holding any drive together late in games has exacerbate any and all defensive struggles we've had.

49ers had the ball for less than 4 minutes of the 4th quarter. What's the transition point between "getting away with it" and successfully keeping the other team off the field with a lead?

The context of getting away with it this time is that we had as many 3 and outs as they did in the 4th quarter. Let's see....

4th Quarter
Seattle Seahawks continues ...
1-16-SEA 31
(15:00) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short right to 88-J.Graham to SEA 39 for 8 yards (57-M.Wilhoite; 25-J.Ward) [92-Q.Dial]. Caught at SEA 37. 2-yds YAC
2-8-SEA 39
(14:21) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short right to 22-F.Jackson to SF 43 for 18 yards (26-T.Brock, 29-J.Tartt). Caught at SEA 40. 17-yds YAC
1-10-SF 43
(13:34) 24-M.Lynch up the middle to SF 40 for 3 yards (53-N.Bowman, 57-M.Wilhoite).
2-7-SF 40
(12:55) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short right to 16-T.Lockett pushed ob at SF 34 for 6 yards (29-J.Tartt). Caught at SF 34. 0-yds YAC
3-1-SF 34
(12:16) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson left end to SF 26 for 8 yards (29-J.Tartt).
1-10-SF 26
(11:36) (Shotgun) 24-M.Lynch left guard to SF 24 for 2 yards (57-M.Wilhoite, 55-A.Brooks).
2-8-SF 24
(10:52) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson sacked at SF 29 for -5 yards (59-A.Lynch).
3-13-SF 29
(10:10) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short left to 22-F.Jackson to SF 28 for 1 yard (35-E.Reid). Caught at SF 31. 3-yds YAC
4-12-SF 28
(9:29) 4-S.Hauschka 46 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-49-C.Gresham, Holder-9-J.Ryan.
San Francisco 49ers at 09:23
4-S.Hauschka kicks 67 yards from SEA 35 to SF -2. 10-B.Ellington to SF 23 for 25 yards (11-B.Daniels).
1-10-SF 23
(9:14) 7-C.Kaepernick sacked at SF 16 for -7 yards (72-M.Bennett).
2-17-SF 16
(8:32) 7-C.Kaepernick sacked at SF 7 for -9 yards (sack split by 93-D.King and 92-B.Mebane).
3-26-SF 7
(7:52) (Shotgun) 23-R.Bush up the middle to SF 13 for 6 yards (31-K.Chancellor).
4-20-SF 13
(7:14) 5-B.Pinion punts 42 yards to SEA 45, Center-86-K.Nelson, fair catch by 16-T.Lockett.
Seattle Seahawks at 07:06
1-10-SEA 45
(7:06) 24-M.Lynch right tackle to SEA 41 for -4 yards (29-J.Tartt).
2-14-SEA 41
(6:24) 24-M.Lynch up the middle to SEA 45 for 4 yards (63-T.Jerod-Eddie).
3-10-SEA 45
(5:44) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson sacked at SEA 36 for -9 yards (55-A.Brooks).
4-19-SEA 36
(5:00) 9-J.Ryan punts 44 yards to SF 20, Center-49-C.Gresham, fair catch by 23-R.Bush. PENALTY on SF-11-Q.Patton, Unsportsmanlike Conduct, 10 yards, enforced at SF 20.
San Francisco 49ers at 04:52
1-10-SF 10
(4:52) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass short left to 81-A.Boldin to SF 16 for 6 yards (35-D.Shead). Caught at SF 15. 1-yd YAC
2-4-SF 16
(4:26) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass incomplete short middle to 82-T.Smith.
3-4-SF 16
(4:22) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass incomplete deep left to 11-Q.Patton. Penalty on SF-75-A.Boone, Offensive Holding, declined.
4-4-SF 16
(4:16) 5-B.Pinion punts 43 yards to SEA 41, Center-86-K.Nelson. 16-T.Lockett to SEA 43 for 2 yards (31-L.McCray).
Seattle Seahawks at 04:08
1-10-SEA 43
(4:08) 24-M.Lynch right guard to SEA 45 for 2 yards (93-I.Williams, 90-G.Dorsey).
Timeout #1 by SF at 04:00.
2-8-SEA 45
(4:00) 24-M.Lynch left guard to SEA 47 for 2 yards (57-M.Wilhoite).
Timeout #2 by SF at 03:56.
3-6-SEA 47
(3:56) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass incomplete short left to 88-J.Graham. SF-29-J.Tartt was injured during the play. His return is Probable.
4-6-SEA 47
(3:53) 9-J.Ryan punts 53 yards to end zone, Center-49-C.Gresham, Touchback.
San Francisco 49ers at 03:42
1-10-SF 20
(3:42) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass short right to 85-V.Davis to SF 27 for 7 yards (31-K.Chancellor). Caught at SF 26. 1-yd YAC
2-3-SF 27
(3:19) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass incomplete short right to 11-Q.Patton.
3-3-SF 27
(3:16) (Shotgun) 7-C.Kaepernick pass incomplete short left to 81-A.Boldin (54-B.Wagner).
4-3-SF 27
(3:13) 5-B.Pinion punts 48 yards to SEA 25, Center-86-K.Nelson, out of bounds.
Seattle Seahawks at 03:05
1-10-SEA 25
(3:05) 24-M.Lynch left tackle to SEA 36 for 11 yards (57-M.Wilhoite).
1-10-SEA 36
(2:20) 24-M.Lynch up the middle to SEA 39 for 3 yards (95-C.Carradine).
Timeout #3 by SF at 02:12.
2-7-SEA 39
(2:12) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short left to 16-T.Lockett to SEA 41 for 2 yards (51-G.Hodges). Caught at SEA 36. 5-yds YAC
3-5-SEA 41
(2:06) (Shotgun) 24-M.Lynch left guard to SEA 47 for 6 yards (27-K.Reaser).
Two-Minute Warning
1-10-SEA 47
(2:00) 3-R.Wilson kneels to SEA 46 for -1 yards.
2-11-SEA 46
(1:19) 3-R.Wilson kneels to SEA 45 for -1 yards.
3-12-SEA 45
39) 3-R.Wilson kneels to SEA 44 for -1 yards.
END GAME

OK, so we had one less 3 and out. We did a good job in taking that first drive down for a FG that actually started in the 3rd quarter, where we were previously already shutting down for the day/night and then losing, but then we go into 3 and out mode ourselves when the 9ers get the ball down 17 with over 9 minutes left.

That way things were going, being up 17 at that time didn't really seem like much. Thankfully, the defense held the 9ers to 3 strait 3 and outs themselves so it was fine. We got away with it this time...because the defense held perfectly.

I'm not necessarily of the mind that they should absolutely have to continue to carry the team as one of the best defenses ever though. I think that's the expectation because of what CAN be given what HAS BEEN, but I also know that 3 and outs and very short drives pay a toll on a defense constantly having to go back out. They won't be as sharp....there'll be communication breakdowns, etc. We've been a lot better previously as a running team and that obviously eats the clock, particularly late in games. It hasn't been that way this year and I very much don't think that has anything to do with whichever RB is in. That OL is just damn near 50/50 hit and miss and that's just too much miss.

Speaking of which, even though it's not part of the discussion, will say that RW has missed a lot of open WRs this year and yes he is running into sacks, but dude is gunshy right now. Even when the OL has good pass pro he just doesn't trust it and mentally bails. I guess we'll just see if we can get any development there....

So just two 3-and-outs and then the victory formation drive. Plus a sack in there. Field position also in play.

 

[RichNhansom]

I am curious why no one is criticizing Wilson? The argument now is we only scored 3 points in the second half and every explanation I see trying to support that argument wants to blame play calling (or Bevell). I love Wilson and all but come on, if he doesn't throw those picks (one in the end zone the other close to it) we likely put up 10 or 14 more points.

I'm not in love with Bevell but it really seems this conversation is way to agenda motivated.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Come on, Wilson gets plenty of criticism on here. :lol:

 

[hawknation2015]

I am curious why no one is criticizing Wilson? The argument now is we only scored 3 points in the second half and every explanation I see trying to support that argument wants to blame play calling (or Bevell). I love Wilson and all but come on, if he doesn't throw those picks (one in the end zone the other close to it) we likely put up 10 or 14 more points.

I'm not in love with Bevell but it really seems this conversation is way to agenda motivated.

It was a combination of things. On the 2nd drive of the 2nd half, Wilson did have that really bad throw into double coverage that was picked off. He also forced the ball to Graham on 3rd down of the 5th drive of the 2nd half. Drives one, three, four, and five were hindered by protection issues.

The first drive was killed by a couple mistakes: the penalty on Sweezy for unnecessarily whipping his leg and this play by Alvin Bailey:

That led to a 3rd and long and the decision to play it safe with a draw play.

The 3rd drive of the 2nd half ended in similar fashion: another whiffed block by Alvin Bailey (below) followed by another conservative call on 3rd and long:


4th drive ended with this 3rd down (everyone except Nowak was beaten):


Ugly!

5th drive you could perhaps place some blame on Wilson. Sweezy allowed a pressure, and Wilson threw the ball low to Graham, who was being double covered. Play design was also an issue here:


During the 6th and final drive we simply ran out the clock.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Nobody blocks for Russ = Russ' fault.
ok......
He can play better, but he's not playing nearly as bad as some people make act like he is.

 

[hawknation2015]

Nobody blocks for Russ = Russ' fault.
ok......
He can play better, but he's not playing nearly as bad as some people make act like he is.

Yeah, he had some great plays in that game too. Like that beautiful throw to Tyler Lockett and the perfectly-placed ball over the middle to Graham.

 

[chawx]

...
5th drive you could perhaps place some blame on Wilson. Sweezy allowed a pressure, and Wilson threw the ball low to Graham, who was being double covered. Play design was also an issue here:


During the 6th and final drive we simply ran out the clock.

I don't know the play, but this one looks like Graham was supposed to keep running out towards the sideline... Wilson threw it right to where Graham should have gone.

 

[hawknation2015]

...
5th drive you could perhaps place some blame on Wilson. Sweezy allowed a pressure, and Wilson threw the ball low to Graham, who was being double covered. Play design was also an issue here:


During the 6th and final drive we simply ran out the clock.

I don't know the play, but this one looks like Graham was supposed to keep running out towards the sideline... Wilson threw it right to where Graham should have gone.

Either way, it was thrown low (as a result of the pressure) and into double coverage. Could have easily been picked off for his 3rd INT of the game on throws into double coverage.

Now, if he throws that ball higher where only Graham could catch it, it has a chance to be a first down.

 

[Hawks46]

Still did not improve.
3 plays -9 yards punt.
3 plays 4 yards punt.
7 plays 49ers are beyond done, game over.

This was against a 49er team that had already given up. I am happy the D found some swag but our offense is still stuck in ground hogs day in the 4th quater.

Are you willfully ignoring the drive that started in the 3rd quarter and ate up over five minutes of the 4th quarter, the one that ended in a field goal? They had the ball over 11 out of 15 minutes of the 4th quarter and got a field goal.

More points would have been better, but the clock destroying boring action was quite effective.

Good point, I missed that one because it was half in the 3rd quater in the box score. Still doesn't instill much confidence against good teams in the future. With all the 3 and outs our own D forced, the 49ers should have been gassed at that point.

I hear what you're saying. I'd like to see some more points scored as well, especially in the 4th quarter. Say the Niners did score in the 4th; now you're trying to hit the gas again as an offense when all you've been doing is riding the brake. It's hard to shift gears like that sometimes.

Going run heavy and conservative sucks to watch, but when you possessed the ball as much as we did in the 4th quarter, it's effective. There's 2 games where if we'd gotten one first down (2 at the most), the game would've been over and we win.

 

[joeshaney]

Agree with the OP. Garbage offense in the 2nd half.

I get that it's good to be optimistic because we at least seemingly looked better and, more importantly, got a road win.

Regardless. Putting up only 3 second half points against the garbage pail kids from Santa Clara is continued embarrassment from our passing game.

At least it isn't our entire offense that is terrible. But from a passing game standpoint it barely gets worse. Particularly in the red zone. Pure suck.

 

[hawknation2015]

Agree with the OP. Garbage offense in the 2nd half.

I get that it's good to be optimistic because we at least seemingly looked better and, more importantly, got a road win.

Regardless. Putting up only 3 second half points against the garbage pail kids from Santa Clara is continued embarrassment from our passing game.

At least it isn't our entire offense that is terrible. But from a passing game standpoint it barely gets worse. Particularly in the red zone. Pure suck.

I think we put up a few more points if someone other than Alvin Bailey had been in at RT. He pretty much single-handedly ended two drives in the 2nd half and allowed three total sacks.

Other than Bailey's advantage in experience, I am perplexed as to why they are not giving Mark Glowinski an opportunity to play the utility role.

 

[joeshaney]

Yep.Between Bevell, Wilson, probably most obviously a flawed OLINE, plenty of blame to go around.

To your point, showing now willingness to bring in our young olineman is a little bit concerning. The current unit is lousy and if none of are young guys are any better than we have surely invested a lot of draft and trade capital into essentially a steaming pile.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

I am curious why no one is criticizing Wilson? The argument now is we only scored 3 points in the second half and every explanation I see trying to support that argument wants to blame play calling (or Bevell). I love Wilson and all but come on, if he doesn't throw those picks (one in the end zone the other close to it) we likely put up 10 or 14 more points.

I'm not in love with Bevell but it really seems this conversation is way to agenda motivated.

*too

What I wanna know is why no one has mentioned the leg whip personal foul on the opening drive of the second half that cost the Hawks at least three. And if that drives goes for seven most of these discussions aren't even happening.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Yep.Between Bevell, Wilson, probably most obviously a flawed OLINE, plenty of blame to go around.

To your point, showing now willingness to bring in our young olineman is a little bit concerning. The current unit is lousy and if none of are young guys are any better than we have surely invested a lot of draft and trade capital into essentially a steaming pile.

But that's the thing, we haven't really invested hardly any draft or trade capital in the O-line.

Pete's just relied on Cable to make chicken salad out of chicken #$%@...........and it's taking a LONG time for this line to come together.

If we don't make the playoffs, or barely squeak in and lose? We better some the first four picks be O-lineman. Cause I'm sure as hell tired of this unit being the Achilles heal of this team.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

Yep.Between Bevell, Wilson, probably most obviously a flawed OLINE, plenty of blame to go around.

To your point, showing now willingness to bring in our young olineman is a little bit concerning. The current unit is lousy and if none of are young guys are any better than we have surely invested a lot of draft and trade capital into essentially a steaming pile.

But that's the thing, we haven't really invested hardly any draft or trade capital in the O-line.

Pete's just relied on Cable to make chicken salad out of chicken #$%@...........and it's taking a LONG time for this line to come together.

If we don't make the playoffs, or barely squeak in and lose? We better some the first four picks be O-lineman. Cause I'm sure as hell tired of this unit being the Achilles heal of this team.

Drafting of Carp, Moffit, Britt, et. al. disagrees with people's premise that there has been no draft capital spent on the o-line. My conention as it concerns draft capital on o-line is that it's been "spent" poorly. IMO the o-line is John's Achilles heel in identifying college talent.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Yep.Between Bevell, Wilson, probably most obviously a flawed OLINE, plenty of blame to go around.

To your point, showing now willingness to bring in our young olineman is a little bit concerning. The current unit is lousy and if none of are young guys are any better than we have surely invested a lot of draft and trade capital into essentially a steaming pile.

But that's the thing, we haven't really invested hardly any draft or trade capital in the O-line.

Pete's just relied on Cable to make chicken salad out of chicken #$%@...........and it's taking a LONG time for this line to come together.

If we don't make the playoffs, or barely squeak in and lose? We better some the first four picks be O-lineman. Cause I'm sure as hell tired of this unit being the Achilles heal of this team.

Drafting of Carp, Moffit, Britt, et. al. disagrees with people's premise that there has been no draft capital spent on the o-line. My conention as it concerns draft capital on o-line is that it's been "spent" poorly. IMO the o-line is John's Achilles heel in identifying college talent.

Why did you conveniently leave out Unger and Okung? Isn't it fair to say those were successful O-line draft picks? Same goes for Sweezy, he's arguably our most consistent lineman right now other than Okung.

btw, Carp is kicking ass for the Jets, same for Breno. So maybe those guys aren't as big of a disappointments as you're making them out to be. Sure as hell would rather they still be here than the guys we have now.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

Yep.Between Bevell, Wilson, probably most obviously a flawed OLINE, plenty of blame to go around.

To your point, showing now willingness to bring in our young olineman is a little bit concerning. The current unit is lousy and if none of are young guys are any better than we have surely invested a lot of draft and trade capital into essentially a steaming pile.

But that's the thing, we haven't really invested hardly any draft or trade capital in the O-line.

Pete's just relied on Cable to make chicken salad out of chicken #$%@...........and it's taking a LONG time for this line to come together.

If we don't make the playoffs, or barely squeak in and lose? We better some the first four picks be O-lineman. Cause I'm sure as hell tired of this unit being the Achilles heal of this team.

Drafting of Carp, Moffit, Britt, et. al. disagrees with people's premise that there has been no draft capital spent on the o-line. My conention as it concerns draft capital on o-line is that it's been "spent" poorly. IMO the o-line is John's Achilles heel in identifying college talent.

Why did you conveniently leave out Unger and Okung? Isn't it fair to say those were successful O-line draft picks? Same goes for Sweezy, he's arguably our most consistent lineman right now other than Okung.

btw, Carp is kicking ass for the Jets, same for Breno. So maybe those guys aren't as big of a disappointments as you're making them out to be. Sure as hell would rather they still be here than the guys we have now.

Unger wasn't John's draft pick.

Yes, Okung was a decent pick though it could be argued that based on his position in the draft not quite as much. Certainly no bust though.

By all accounts Carp is much better in the Jets system than the Hawks therefore the argument can be made he was a poor draft choice for Seattle.

Sweezy is what he is, a converted d-lineman that's pretty good in run blocking and below average in pass pro.

I wish they'd kept Breno, but that had nothing to do with draft capital which was the point of my post. If you want to discuss lack of monetary investment in that area of the team, he'd be at the forefront of the discussion.