Risers and Fallers from Preseason Game #1

[MontanaHawk05]

Risers

Pete Carroll and John Schneider - the admittedly early results thus far show that Pete and John may have succeeded in packing the roster with depth. Depth, depth, depth. That's what's been missing from the last couple seasons, and that's what's sorely needed for a Super Bowl run.

The 53-man rosters of every other team in the league - RB, WR, and defense. We've got plentiful talent to choose from. That means some hard decisions will have to be made, some genuine talent will have to be cut, and the other 31 teams in the league will be carefully waiting to snatch up Seattle's roster cuts. It's a good year for the NFL to have the Seahawks.

Trevone Boykin (QB) - Maybe the structured environment of practices doesn't suit him, but in games, Boykin reminds us how much his legs help keep games open. Most of his big plays came due to an anemic Chargers reserve pass rush giving him enough time to grill a hamburger and then throw, but his scrambles were his real value. Those red-line tosses to Kasen Williams are quick passes, though, and were placed with immensely impressive touch; we saw his chemistry with Lawler last preseason. Even more interesting were his quick-window throws to Kenny Lawler. That, not those 50/50 throws, is what Seattle needs to see. My prediction.

Nazair Jones (DT) - Jones' length and scrappiness got him four tackles, one for a loss; one QB hit; and one deflection for a pick. Seattle's media characters were quick to point out that he's been doing that stuff all practice. With Malik McDowell out and Seattle's line either aging or not aged enough, Jones' development will be badly needed.

Chris Carson (RB) - YPC, ShmyPC. Carson entered this game ahead of Alex Collins in their little duel and did nothing to relinquish that position. He had two goal-line touchdowns, a nice ten-yard cut-and-go, and a longer run called back on a penalty by Jordan Roos. In such a crowded field, that's probably enough to keep him ahead.

Kasen Williams (WR) - Every WR on the roster is going to have some marvelous catch against seventh-string preseason scrubs, but give Kasen credit for balling out with the opportunities he's got. He does need more in his repertoire in the NFL to win a receiver spot Wait, not on this team you don't. Those redline throws are, like, 60% of Seattle's passing offense. Shoot, maybe he will get a roster spot. Who knows.

My sanity - Because FOOTBALL!!!

Our free agent linebackers - I've been pretty down on Michael Wilhoite. I tend to put a lot of stock in what fans of free agents' prior teams saying about him, and nobody in Santa Clara was sad to see him leave. But Wilhoite had a nicely timed hit on a Chargers pass that knocked the ball right into the hands of Terence Garvin, who returned it for a TD. With Seattle having felt the need to bring team guy Mike Morgan back, this was the kind of play those two needed to pull off.

J.D. McKissick (RB) - Though he didn't get a carry and only three mediocre punt returns, his nice thumping tackle on special teams will keep him in the team's considerations.

TE4 candidates - Seattle could keep four tight ends on the roster (they've done it before), and the battle between Tyrone Swoopes and Marcus Lucas might tempt them to. In addition to a nice hustle catch-and-run from a madly improvising Austin Davis on a blitz, Swoopes had a nice block on one of Carson's TD runs (I think) and almost had another TD on a badly thrown ball. Some people, however, think Lucas outplayed Swoopes that night. Something to watch.

Blair Walsh (K) - Nobody's rooting for him, so it was nice to see him hold his own.

Joey Hunt (C) - his presence at center indicates that Seattle is still high on him, even with Ethan Pocic (who started there in the second half) in the mix.

Kris Richard - Guy gets a mention here for calling up a corner blitz when San Diego called a timeout with twelve seconds left in a preseason game. One punk move deserves another. I absolutely love it.




Fallers

The NFL's preseason road scoring record - Smashed by the Seahawks last night.

Paul Richardson (WR) - Paul further cements his reputation as injury-prone. I kinda figure this is gonna keep happening as long as Seattle keeps drafting speedy, undersized receivers, but it's still brutal to see given Paul's clutch gene. Fortunately, he could be back on the field in a couple weeks.

The backup Legion of Boom - Falling by just a hair. Each of the four defensive backs drafted to replace or supplement our current LOB players gave up a big play in this game. It happens. They'll learn. It's not like they're in any danger. Shaquill Griffin gave up a TD to Antonio Gates, and Mike Tyson and Tedric Thompson were way out of position on some big plays. Delano Hill also lost a ball in the air, though he showed some scrap in run defense. I learned from Twitter that Hill is the favorite target of some of our armchair analysts, for being too slow. But if you're gonna label a guy by his very first competitive work on the field...

Alex Collins (RB) - Dropping a fourth-down pass is not the thing to do in such a crowded competition. He did make up for it with a short touchdown. I think he probably makes some other team's roster - just as casualty of the depth on this one.

Germain Ifedi (RT) - True, it was Joey Bosa and Melvin Ingram that beat him, but it's another chip in his stock after a tough couple weeks. He's one of Cable's guys, so I'm sure he'll keep getting put out there.

Jordan Simone (S) - Brutal summer for this guy. Picked on by Jimmy Graham in camp, released, re-signed, picked on by Graham AGAIN, and now an injury.

Amara Darboh (WR) - It's hard to imagine he won't get a strong roster push just by virtue of where he was drafted, but the sternum ding was a bummer.

Tre Madden (FB) - Dude. Don't fumble when you're trying to unseat Marcel Reece.

The credibility of anyone who makes real judgments off this game - That includes me. Stay chill, y'all.

 

[falcongoggles]

Nicely done Montana. This is better analysis than anything I've read out of the local or national media outlets, including .com

 

[StoneCold]

I know there are fans and detractors of AC, but when he dropped that pass I said he was done with this team. I know ACFan has some stats, but the eye test on him says he doesn't run hard with power. Carson is the 4th back. RB in order:

Rawls
Lacy
Prosise
Carson.

Hey, If I want to make rash and dubious declarations after one pre season game I damn well will.

 

[falcongoggles]

I would add Davis to the risers group. His shovel pass was nifty as well as his scrambling. Had his on the run bullet pass been caught with both feet down, it would have been the most impressive pass-catch of the game.

Boykins was electric at backup QB and his play is the only reason why we aren't gushing over Davis. If Boykin wasn't on the team or hadn't played well, all we would be doing is talking about Davis' play in these threads. Thus, it would be a shame to not mention his contributions as well.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

I would add Davis to the risers group. His shovel pass was nifty as well as his scrambling. Had his on the run bullet pass been caught with both feet down, it would have been the most impressive pass-catch of the game.

Boykins was electric at backup QB and his play is the only reason why we aren't gushing over Davis. If Boykin wasn't on the team or hadn't played well, all we would be doing is talking about Davis' play in these threads. Thus, it would be a shame to not mention his contributions as well.

Well, I couldn't mention everyone. I doubt there's room for him on the roster, honestly - I'm guessing QB is not a place the Seahawks will be wanting to stash three guys this year, given the depth they have elsewhere. But then again, I'm dumb.

 

[mikeak]

I like it great - especially showing the self awareness and that it is Pre-season game 1 with the last bullet.

I guess I kind of only disagree with one - Darboh

After a really good training camp I just don't think he falls because of an injury. It is a very violent sport and everyone knows it. I think he stays pretty put with the note that if others really step up (yep Kasen did) or fall flat on their faces he will move up / down slightly based on their performance while out injured.

Think he stayed where he was at yesterday - if Grayson makes the catch then maybe down

 

[Attyla the Hawk]

I know there are fans and detractors of AC, but when he dropped that pass I said he was done with this team. I know ACFan has some stats, but the eye test on him says he doesn't run hard with power. Carson is the 4th back. RB in order:

Rawls
Lacy
Prosise
Carson.

That's a likely stable of RBs for the 53. I think Carson just has far too much momentum at this early point to project him being cut. He won't make the PS.

As far as the 4th down pass, that was all Davis. That was just an inaccurate throw. That wasn't on AC in the slightest. Any QB (and Davis appeared to concede it coming off the field) would take responsibility for that play. Clearly in week one, you saw two very different backs in Carson and Collins. And Carson played early against the better SD depth such as it was. Collins can make the PS and unless Seattle feels comfortable jettisoning Lacy, I think the spot is Carson's to lose after week one.

Still plenty of football to go. But Carson gave a strong glimpse as to why Pete was so enamored with him and why he can barely maintain a very bad poker face trying to hide his excitement for him throughout camp.

It'll be tough for AC. Especially if we end up having to keep McKissic on the active for return duties. Some quality depth is going to be put out on the market somewhere. And it looks like it'll be the RB group that takes the hit.

 

[StoneCold]

I know there are fans and detractors of AC, but when he dropped that pass I said he was done with this team. I know ACFan has some stats, but the eye test on him says he doesn't run hard with power. Carson is the 4th back. RB in order:

Rawls
Lacy
Prosise
Carson.

That's a likely stable of RBs for the 53. I think Carson just has far too much momentum at this early point to project him being cut. He won't make the PS.

As far as the 4th down pass, that was all Davis. That was just an inaccurate throw. That wasn't on AC in the slightest. Any QB (and Davis appeared to concede it coming off the field) would take responsibility for that play. Clearly in week one, you saw two very different backs in Carson and Collins. And Carson played early against the better SD depth such as it was. Collins can make the PS and unless Seattle feels comfortable jettisoning Lacy, I think the spot is Carson's to lose after week one.

Still plenty of football to go. But Carson gave a strong glimpse as to why Pete was so enamored with him and why he can barely maintain a very bad poker face trying to hide his excitement for him throughout camp.

It'll be tough for AC. Especially if we end up having to keep McKissic on the active for return duties. Some quality depth is going to be put out on the market somewhere. And it looks like it'll be the RB group that takes the hit.

It's possible I missed that the pass sucked as I was busy making fresh pasta when that was happening and only used half an eye to make that rash assessment.

 

[Sports Hernia]

Risers

Pete Carroll and John Schneider - the admittedly early results thus far show that Pete and John may have succeeded in packing the roster with depth. Depth, depth, depth. That's what's been missing from the last couple seasons, and that's what's sorely needed for a Super Bowl run.

The 53-man rosters of every other team in the league - RB, WR, and defense. We've got plentiful talent to choose from. That means some hard decisions will have to be made, some genuine talent will have to be cut, and the other 31 teams in the league will be carefully waiting to snatch up Seattle's roster cuts. It's a good year for the NFL to have the Seahawks.

Trevone Boykin (QB) - Maybe the structured environment of practices doesn't suit him, but in games, Boykin reminds us how much his legs help keep games open. Most of his big plays came due to an anemic Chargers reserve pass rush giving him enough time to grill a hamburger and then throw, but his scrambles were his real value. Those red-line tosses to Kasen Williams are quick passes, though, and were placed with immensely impressive touch; we saw his chemistry with Lawler last preseason. Even more interesting were his quick-window throws to Kenny Lawler. That, not those 50/50 throws, is what Seattle needs to see. My prediction.

Nazair Jones (DT) - Jones' length and scrappiness got him four tackles, one for a loss; one QB hit; and one deflection for a pick. Seattle's media characters were quick to point out that he's been doing that stuff all practice. With Malik McDowell out and Seattle's line either aging or not aged enough, Jones' development will be badly needed.

Chris Carson (RB) - YPC, ShmyPC. Carson entered this game ahead of Alex Collins in their little duel and did nothing to relinquish that position. He had two goal-line touchdowns, a nice ten-yard cut-and-go, and a longer run called back on a penalty by Jordan Roos. In such a crowded field, that's probably enough to keep him ahead.

Kasen Williams (WR) - Every WR on the roster is going to have some marvelous catch against seventh-string preseason scrubs, but give Kasen credit for balling out with the opportunities he's got. He does need more in his repertoire in the NFL to win a receiver spot Wait, not on this team you don't. Those redline throws are, like, 60% of Seattle's passing offense. Shoot, maybe he will get a roster spot. Who knows.

My sanity - Because FOOTBALL!!!

Our free agent linebackers - I've been pretty down on Michael Wilhoite. I tend to put a lot of stock in what fans of free agents' prior teams saying about him, and nobody in Santa Clara was sad to see him leave. But Wilhoite had a nicely timed hit on a Chargers pass that knocked the ball right into the hands of Terence Garvin, who returned it for a TD. With Seattle having felt the need to bring team guy Mike Morgan back, this was the kind of play those two needed to pull off.

J.D. McKissick (RB) - Though he didn't get a carry and only three mediocre punt returns, his nice thumping tackle on special teams will keep him in the team's considerations.

TE4 candidates - Seattle could keep four tight ends on the roster (they've done it before), and the battle between Tyrone Swoopes and Marcus Lucas might tempt them to. In addition to a nice hustle catch-and-run from a madly improvising Austin Davis on a blitz, Swoopes had a nice block on one of Carson's TD runs (I think) and almost had another TD on a badly thrown ball. Some people, however, think Lucas outplayed Swoopes that night. Something to watch.

Blair Walsh (K) - Nobody's rooting for him, so it was nice to see him hold his own.

Joey Hunt (C) - his presence at center indicates that Seattle is still high on him, even with Ethan Pocic (who started there in the second half) in the mix.

Kris Richard - Guy gets a mention here for calling up a corner blitz when San Diego called a timeout with twelve seconds left in a preseason game. One punk move deserves another. I absolutely love it.




Fallers

The NFL's preseason road scoring record - Smashed by the Seahawks last night.

Paul Richardson (WR) - Paul further cements his reputation as injury-prone. I kinda figure this is gonna keep happening as long as Seattle keeps drafting speedy, undersized receivers, but it's still brutal to see given Paul's clutch gene. Fortunately, he could be back on the field in a couple weeks.

The backup Legion of Boom - Falling by just a hair. Each of the four defensive backs drafted to replace or supplement our current LOB players gave up a big play in this game. It happens. They'll learn. It's not like they're in any danger. Shaquill Griffin gave up a TD to Antonio Gates, and Mike Tyson and Tedric Thompson were way out of position on some big plays. Delano Hill also lost a ball in the air, though he showed some scrap in run defense. I learned from Twitter that Hill is the favorite target of some of our armchair analysts, for being too slow. But if you're gonna label a guy by his very first competitive work on the field...

Alex Collins (RB) - Dropping a fourth-down pass is not the thing to do in such a crowded competition. He did make up for it with a short touchdown. I think he probably makes some other team's roster - just as casualty of the depth on this one.

Germain Ifedi (RT) - True, it was Joey Bosa and Melvin Ingram that beat him, but it's another chip in his stock after a tough couple weeks. He's one of Cable's guys, so I'm sure he'll keep getting put out there.

Jordan Simone (S) - Brutal summer for this guy. Picked on by Jimmy Graham in camp, released, re-signed, picked on by Graham AGAIN, and now an injury.

Amara Darboh (WR) - It's hard to imagine he won't get a strong roster push just by virtue of where he was drafted, but the sternum ding was a bummer.

Tre Madden (FB) - Dude. Don't fumble when you're trying to unseat Marcel Reece.

The credibility of anyone who makes real judgments off this game - That includes me. Stay chill, y'all.

Nice break down, thanks!

 

[Jazzhawk]

Shaquill Griffin gave up a TD to Antonio Gates

As have pretty much every DB covering Gates. C'mon man.

Other than that I enjoyed your analysis. Well done.

 

[DJrmb]

I know there are fans and detractors of AC, but when he dropped that pass I said he was done with this team. I know ACFan has some stats, but the eye test on him says he doesn't run hard with power. Carson is the 4th back. RB in order:

Rawls
Lacy
Prosise
Carson.

That's a likely stable of RBs for the 53. I think Carson just has far too much momentum at this early point to project him being cut. He won't make the PS.

As far as the 4th down pass, that was all Davis. That was just an inaccurate throw. That wasn't on AC in the slightest. Any QB (and Davis appeared to concede it coming off the field) would take responsibility for that play. Clearly in week one, you saw two very different backs in Carson and Collins. And Carson played early against the better SD depth such as it was. Collins can make the PS and unless Seattle feels comfortable jettisoning Lacy, I think the spot is Carson's to lose after week one.

Still plenty of football to go. But Carson gave a strong glimpse as to why Pete was so enamored with him and why he can barely maintain a very bad poker face trying to hide his excitement for him throughout camp.

It'll be tough for AC. Especially if we end up having to keep McKissic on the active for return duties. Some quality depth is going to be put out on the market somewhere. And it looks like it'll be the RB group that takes the hit.

It's possible I missed that the pass sucked as I was busy making fresh pasta when that was happening and only used half an eye to make that rash assessment.

The pass was not good, but in my opinion it was definitely catch-able. On a 4th down I would like to see a guy sell out to just catch the ball for a 1st down. Maybe I'm wrong but at the time it felt like AC tried to keep his feet and catch the ball so he could run after the catch rather than selling out to secure a 1st down. That is one play I want to go back and watch to make sure I didn't see it wrong though.

 

[vin.couve12]

Collins only got a couple fingertips on that ball, but it seemed like he sort of tripped over himself just before that. His feet went all wonky either way.

That's kind of neither here nore there though. The most you're ever going to get out of Collins is that of a 4th string RB in the NFL. MAYBE 3rd. He's in the best shape of his life and still lacks burst and real lateral agility. His "happy feet" (Kam said that's what they call him) give the illusion that he's got movement ability, but it's still just an illusion. Dude always seems to get hit harder than hell too, but that's due to his stand straight up running style that robs him of what little power he has.

He might make the practice squad at this point. He won't get claimed. Per Brock, Pete said that Davis would have started for us last year if we had him so that's also tellinh as to where Collins is at. He's got no shoy at beating out Carson and is behind Davis as well. Hopefully we can put this topic to rest in a few weeks because it's like talking a out how water is wet.

 

[Hawkscanner]

Nice overall breakdown Montana,

Your takeaways from the game were pretty much the same as mine (I noted mine in the positives / negatives thread).

I too really think that (outside of that last deep throw that was intercepted -- a throw that he admitted was a mistake) Trevone Boykin had a pretty darn good game. He moved around well in the pocket, was accurate, showed excellent touch on his passes, and scrambled well when he had to. I was fairly underwhelmed by Austin Davis, so IMO I would say that (barring a roster move) that Boykin will be the back-up QB.

Chris Carson -- I LOVED what I saw from this guy. You saw right there on the field why Pete Carroll fell in love with him as well. He ran with authority, was shifty and elusive and yet hit the hole with authority. That 10 yard run he had was real nice. I think one of the biggest things that stood out to me ... was the Yards After Contact. He was consistently getting positive yards even after contact. I have to agree with Atylla in saying that I think he's got far too much momentum at this point to NOT make the 53 man roster. AND -- if he had to start for some reason ... I would have very little anxiety about that.

Nazir Jones -- I really liked what I saw from Naz Jones as well. Very scrappy, good quickness, got good penetration, and sure tackling skills. Lots of positives with him in this game.

Ethan Pocic -- Going to be real hard to keep this "dirtbag" off the field IMO. I loved his overall aggression and how he was consistently getting to the 2nd level, pushing his guy back ... and in a lot of cases putting him on the ground. This is the kind of attitude this O-Line has been missing. He'll start somewhere on the line sooner than later.

Alex Collins -- Yeah, not all that impressed with him either. From what I saw, he was often running too high and didn't show me nearly the physicality nor the level of shiftiness or decision making that Carson showed. Dropping that 4th down pass didn't endear me to him. You haven't heard a whole ton about him this camp so far and I can see why.

Paul Richardson -- I feel bad for this guy, I really do. I wonder if health concerns are just going to end up being his undoing. He's got all the talent in the word, but sometimes your greatest asset is your availability. I'm pulling for him, but I kind of wonder if this might not be it for him.

The defense as a whole (the 2nd and 3rd units) looked very good to me -- overall fairly dominant. The Hawks Front 7 was consistently getting in the backfield, getting pressure on the QB, and shutting down the running lanes. But after a great defensive play, I kept finding myself saying, "WHO THE HECK IS THAT GUY?!?" Guys who would seem to have very little to no shot at making this club seemed to keep making plays. I found myself asking myself, "Is this more of a function of the depth of talent on this Seahawks roster ... OR is this more of function of the lack of talent depth on this Chargers roster?" The answer is undoubtedly a combination of both.

 

[KiwiHawk]

I hate to add him as a faller because he's my adopt-a-rookie and eventual Kearse replacement, but Darreus Rogers didn't even get a target. He did some nice run-blocking, but otherwise was completely invisible.

He's a bit of misfit, being a guy with a huge catch radius for contested balls on a team where turnovers are so discouraged that QBs want to see separation before they throw.

I'm hoping he gets more looks, but the field is already so crowded I just don't see him making the roster, and he'd be a long shot to make the practice squad unless some of the guys ahead of him get pinched by other teams.

 

[Seahawker86]

If Kasen Williams keeps ballin put like this he HAS to make the starting top 3WRs on the depth chart. I understand it's preseason and the first game but if he keeps producing like this you can't ignore talent.

 

[IndyHawk]

Sorry ACFAN,,
Alex Colline time here is done.
Carson just looks better period.

 

[Seymour]

If Kasen Williams keeps ballin put like this he HAS to make the starting top 3WRs on the depth chart. I understand it's preseason and the first game but if he keeps producing like this you can't ignore talent.

I somewhat discounted him since he was pretty slow for a wide receiver. Around a 4.6 40 IIRC.

Then I remind myself of this famous quote....

``I might not be a great athlete,`` he once said, ``but I think I`m a real good football player.``

Who was that you ask??

Steve Largent 8)

 

[DangerousDoug]

Like another Montana, that write-up is as cool as the other side of the pillow. Thanks and keep 'em coming!

 

[Seahawker86]

If Kasen Williams keeps ballin put like this he HAS to make the starting top 3WRs on the depth chart. I understand it's preseason and the first game but if he keeps producing like this you can't ignore talent.

I somewhat discounted him since he was pretty slow for a wide receiver. Around a 4.6 40 IIRC.

Then I remind myself of this famous quote....

``I might not be a great athlete,`` he once said, ``but I think I`m a real good football player.``

Who was that you ask??

Steve Largent 8)

Exactly. You dont have to have lighting speed to be a good WR.

 

[vin.couve12]

Williams ran that while still not 100% on the crazy injury he had. He was previously a 4.4 guy as a soph. That was before putting on some muscle as well and it wasn't a real combine clock, but either way, dude is plenty fast enough and could probably still win a high jump competition.