Randy Arozarena...trade bait?

[Blazenhawks]

Look man. I'm just posting my opinions just like everyone else. In my opinion, people criticize Randy far more harshly than he actually deserves because they don't him. That's pretty much it. I don't "love" Randy. I don't have a Randy jersey and I very much doubt I ever will.

Randy has been our best hitter this season, period. Those of you that want him off the team are letting your emotions and feelings cloud your judgement, in my opinion. I just want the best players playing because I believe that gives us the best chance to win.

Do you sincerely believe that getting rid of our best hitter will make this team better? Personally, I don't.

I do think you trade a player at the deadline, even if he's your best hitter, if the return is right. Yes, the player coming back may only be average, but I'm not throwing any shade at you. I'm just trying to understand your thoughts, that's all.

I believe that trading away someone who doesn't want to be here can make the clubhouse much better and help everyone relax. I also believe that chemistry matters just as much as hitting. A team that is united and committed to each other can sometimes be more successful than a team with great talent but poor chemistry.

I don't think it will happen, though. Instead, all the blame will end up being placed on Cal for not being productive, or on JP because his defense has been so bad, or on Naylor, who seems to have stopped producing after getting paid. Those are all factors, and I'm not saying Randy is the sole reason for everything.

I just believe what I believe. As this team currently stands, I don't think it's a playoff team with or without him.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Oh, they're not making the playoffs. I've long since accepted that.

 

[Chapow]

I do think you trade a player at the deadline, even if he's your best hitter, if the return is right. Yes, the player coming back may only be average, but I'm not throwing any shade at you. I'm just trying to understand your thoughts, that's all.

I believe that trading away someone who doesn't want to be here can make the clubhouse much better and help everyone relax. I also believe that chemistry matters just as much as hitting. A team that is united and committed to each other can sometimes be more successful than a team with great talent but poor chemistry.

I don't think it will happen, though. Instead, all the blame will end up being placed on Cal for not being productive, or on JP because his defense has been so bad, or on Naylor, who seems to have stopped producing after getting paid. Those are all factors, and I'm not saying Randy is the sole reason for everything.

I just believe what I believe. As this team currently stands, I don't think it's a playoff team with or without him.

I don't really have time to respond properly to this right now, but I appreciate the civil discussion despite the fact that we clearly disagree about some things. There's far too little of this around here now a days.

 

[Chapow]

Oh, they're not making the playoffs. I've long since accepted that.

I'm not so sure about that. If Julio comes back tomorrow and is once again 2nd half Julio (like every season in his career so far), Randy keeps doing what he's doing at the plate, Cal and Naylor step it up a bit, Donovan comes back and hits like he did in the 25 games he's played so far, Canzone and Young keep doing what they're doing, etc.

Yeah, I know. That's a lot of ifs. But the AL, and especially the AL West, are very weak this season. If the M's can improve their hitting from bottom 5 to middle of the pack, they probably have a good chance at the playoffs. They do still have a top 5 pitching staff after all, statistically speaking.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Here's to hoping you're right. I want them to make the WS so effin bad.

 

[Blazenhawks]

That's how it is for me. I don't care what happens or how we get there, all i want is to get there. I really thought we had it last year.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Dan

 

[sutz]

Dan

Got us farther than any manager in team history.

 

[Azvacar]

Got us farther than any manager in team history.

Im sorry.. that had NOTHING to do with Dan Wilson... at all

 

[Ozzy]

Look man. I'm just posting my opinions just like everyone else. In my opinion, people criticize Randy far more harshly than he actually deserves because they don't him. That's pretty much it. I don't "love" Randy. I don't have a Randy jersey and I very much doubt I ever will.

Randy has been our best hitter this season, period. Those of you that want him off the team are letting your emotions and feelings cloud your judgement, in my opinion. I just want the best players playing because I believe that gives us the best chance to win.

Do you sincerely believe that getting rid of our best hitter will make this team better? Personally, I don't.

You're entitiled to that and that's what makes sports great. I really think Randy is a cancer in the dugout as the Castillo situation to me exposed it. You can't quit on a play for your teammates, act like you don't give a sh#% and watch that same batter hit a homer in that at bat and expect your teammates to be cool with it. It's just one of many plays like that, far too many. The whole Cal thing (and Cal deserves some blame too) during the WBC was goofy and too. I think the criticism is more than fair and you can be your teams best hitter and still be a massive net negative because of your attitude, defensive liabilities, baserunning liabilities, using up both challenges in a first inning at bat etc. He's not so good of a hitter that it outweighs everything else, that doesn't give us the best chance to win imo. I don't think that's emotion I think its completely justifiable.

 

[Ozzy]

Im sorry.. that had NOTHING to do with Dan Wilson... at all

Wilson has obviously no power in that clubhouse. Players quit on plays and he stands there and does nothing. I'm so glad the Seahawks are a serious organization and have a culture where that is impossible. Can you see Macdonald allowing that? Woolen was bounced and he was a borderline great player at times.

 

[Sperrydogg]

Other than his bat, what does he bring? His defense is awful. He doesn't seem to want to do anything with his teammates. He's a crap bass runner. And as far as I can see, he seems like he just doesn't want to be here.
And I've heard SEVERAL times he cares more about his hamstring and getting to free agency than he does playing hard.

He has some real trade value, get it done. This team needs a REAL left fielder who wants to be here.

They'll miss his bat for sure. I think he'll play out the season, they'll give him an "offer" that won't take. Get the draft picks and move on. Dude just doesn't come off as a team player at all, and several sources have said he's a lazy player.
Also, it's VERY clear that he pisses off his teammates. He is in the outfield. And his lack of effort. There is NO excuse for him loafing it out there.

Crap bass player? I never seen anybody run and play bass…. That would be impressive

 

[Sperrydogg]

Somebody said Randy is like DK. No… DK never MEANT to hurt his team, Randy seams to say FU to his OWN team. Another comment, I think it was Soul, said something like trading him even if you don’t really get better on paper cause the team chemistry can improve and actually raise the value of the sum over the parts. I agree with this and my example is look at the hawks. We trade gehellNo! and DK at the same time and went on to win the Super Bowl. I wonder what gehellmfnNo!’s WAr number was back then?

 

[sutz]

Crap bass player? I never seen anybody run and play bass…. That would be impressive

You know, I almost jumped on that one. Tee ball, for sure.

 

[Blazenhawks]

Somebody said Randy is like DK. No… DK never MEANT to hurt his team, Randy seams to say FU to his OWN team. Another comment, I think it was Soul, said something like trading him even if you don’t really get better on paper cause the team chemistry can improve and actually raise the value of the sum over the parts. I agree with this and my example is look at the hawks. We trade gehellNo! and DK at the same time and went on to win the Super Bowl. I wonder what gehellmfnNo!’s WAr number was back then?

I was the one who used the DK analogy. I think we all know he wasn't hurting the team on purpose, but the fact is that he was hurting the team a lot. If it happened once, I'd understand, but when it happens repeatedly, it becomes a pattern.
I want players who both perform and put in the effort. If a player is trying and still failing, that's different. Sometimes the talent just isn't there anymore, like with JP. I know JP is trying hard to avoid mistakes, but the errors keep happening. At least he's making an effort to fix them.
To be fair, I've been just as critical of players in the past. Last year, for example, I was hard on Garver because I felt like he didn't care much about hitting. With Randy, I got the impression from the moment he was traded here that he didn't want to be in Seattle. That's just my personal interpretation of the situation, of course.

 

[Chapow]

You're entitiled to that and that's what makes sports great. I really think Randy is a cancer in the dugout as the Castillo situation to me exposed it. You can't quit on a play for your teammates, act like you don't give a sh#% and watch that same batter hit a homer in that at bat and expect your teammates to be cool with it. It's just one of many plays like that, far too many. The whole Cal thing (and Cal deserves some blame too) during the WBC was goofy and too. I think the criticism is more than fair and you can be your teams best hitter and still be a massive net negative because of your attitude, defensive liabilities, baserunning liabilities, using up both challenges in a first inning at bat etc. He's not so good of a hitter that it outweighs everything else, that doesn't give us the best chance to win imo. I don't think that's emotion I think its completely justifiable.

Again, my main point is that I think a lot of you guys criticize him more harshly than he really deserves because you don't like him. You have said, right in this very thread, that Randy is one of your least favorite players ever.

It's just human nature. People generally treat people they don't like different than they treat people they do like. I'm not saying that there are no valid reasons to criticize Randy. Of course there are. I've criticized Randy plenty this year too. I just think that people that don't like him tend to exaggerate the bad and down play the good.

Randy has a 3.1 WAR this season. Cal has a -0.2 WAR, and Naylor also has a -0.2 WAR. Despite all his many flaws, Randy has the highest WAR on the team. In other words, he's been the biggest net positive in regards to contributing to wins on the team. He's helping the team win more than any other player on the team. Yet he's criticized far more harshly, and far more regularly than guys that aren't helping us win, and have in fact been liabilities.

So, yes. I do believe that people that think we'd be better without him are letting their personal feelings about him cloud their judgement, and I stand by that. If you're still trying to win this season, you don't get rid of the guy that has contributed more to the wins that they do have than any other player on the team.

 

[Chapow]

And FYI. I get as pissed as anyone when players do dumb shit. When Randy lost his damn mind and used both challenges in the 1st inning of the game, I came on here and blasted him for it and called him an idiot.

And then the very next day he went 3 for 4 with a grand slam.