Potential Sam Howell trade?

[Rat]

Lock has had some horrific relief appearances. In his first one after losing his starting job, he went 12/21 for 113 yards and an INT in a 23-7 loss. I'm not sure why he gets a pass for all his terrible outings, while Howell is completely written off for his one, coming off the bench in a nationally televised visiting fan takeover when we were already down two TDs.

Lock had multiple games last year where he barely averaged four yards per attempt. He has won two of his last ten games.

 

[Natethegreat]

Lock has had some horrific relief appearances. In his first one after losing his starting job, he went 12/21 for 113 yards and an INT in a 23-7 loss. I'm not sure why he gets a pass for all his terrible outings, while Howell is completely written off for his one, coming off the bench in a nationally televised visiting fan takeover when we were already down two TDs.

Lock had multiple games last year where he barely averaged four yards per attempt. He has won two of his last ten games.

Lock is a back up quality player that's for sure.

 

[SuperSonic67]

Teams tend to panic on draft day if they lose out on picks…putting word out that we’re willing to listen is smart, and good business. Especially at QB…we might just end up with another pick in round 5, 6 or 7 of this years draft.

 

[warden]

Again this is an outright lie. JS SPECIFICALLY SAID HOWELL WAS BROUGHT IN AS A BACK UP! Lock was signed to the Giants and we needed a back up QB and had zero cap space. JS went out and got a back up QB on a cheap deal for a move down in the draft. The whining about this move is silly. We will almost certainly get something back as well. Painting the Howell trade as unneeded or costly is over the top hyperventilating about a nothing burger.

Don’t confuse them with facts

 

[onanygivensunday]

Teams tend to panic on draft day if they lose out on picks…putting word out that we’re willing to listen is smart, and good business. Especially at QB…we might just end up with another pick in round 5, 6 or 7 of this years draft.

Anything back in return would be a bonus.

 

[Maulbert]

Lock has had some horrific relief appearances. In his first one after losing his starting job, he went 12/21 for 113 yards and an INT in a 23-7 loss. I'm not sure why he gets a pass for all his terrible outings, while Howell is completely written off for his one, coming off the bench in a nationally televised visiting fan takeover when we were already down two TDs.

Lock had multiple games last year where he barely averaged four yards per attempt. He has won two of his last ten games.

Everyone loves bringing up the Philly game as proof Lock is great, completely ignoring the fact that James Bradberry, Jr. was LITERALLY the worst starting corner in 2023, and Lock had a perfect passer rating against him in that game, 6/6, 112 yards, 1 TD, 158.3 rating. Bradberry was the primary defender on every completion during that final drive, 5 for 5. Against everyone else, Lock was 16/27, 96 yards, 0 TD, 66.3 rating, including 5 incompletions on that final drive interspersed with Bradberry getting dunked on by Metcalf and Lockett.

 

[keasley45]

JS's wet dream is for Lock to be the qbotf in Seattle. He wanted that (hoped it coukd be the case) when he got him and i am sure he wants it now. If Darnold stumbles, he cant have Howell in the wings waiting to replace him.

Have you heard how he talks about Drew? I mean talk about a woody...

 

[toffee]

BUT, if we have received "multiple inquiries" maybe we could benefit from an unexpected bidding war?

Multiple inquiries, a subtle way of a bidding war.

 

[toffee]

Everyone loves bringing up the Philly game as proof Lock is great, completely ignoring the fact that James Bradberry, Jr. was LITERALLY the worst starting corner in 2023, and Lock had a perfect passer rating against him in that game, 6/6, 112 yards, 1 TD, 158.3 rating. Bradberry was the primary defender on every completion during that final drive, 5 for 5. Against everyone else, Lock was 16/27, 96 yards, 0 TD, 66.3 rating, including 5 incompletions on that final drive interspersed with Bradberry getting dunked on by Metcalf and Lockett.

From my untrained eyes, our WRs won that game, as most of the ball placement wasn't ideal. Football is a game of inches, a fully stretched JSN's fingertips caught the back tip of the ball for our winning TD. I became a JSN fanboy after that catch. The ball placement wasn't ideal, a lesser WR couldn't catch it. That said, it could also be the lack of working together, as Lock was the backup and Geno took most first-team practice reps.

 

[toffee]

JS's wet dream is for Lock to be the qbotf in Seattle. He wanted that (hoped it coukd be the case) when he got him and i am sure he wants it now. If Darnold stumbles, he cant have Howell in the wings waiting to replace him.

Have you heard how he talks about Drew? I mean talk about a woody...

Certainly wasn't the "He is the starter until he isn't".

 

[Rat]

Also, if Schneider feels like he HAS to keep Lock because he'd be embarrassed to cut a guy he's paying $2.25m to this season, that would speak very lowly of his ability to reign in his ego. $2.25m is nothing. There's a good chance it doesn't even fall in the top 50 of QB cap hits this season. He's currently tied with Nick Mullins for 49th, and he'll fall behind any QB drafted in the top 50 next week, and potentially Brock Purdy if they reach a new deal this offseason. Hell $2.25m is less than half of what the Giants paid him to be their third-stringer last year. Many players costing more will be cut this season.

I do worry that Howell might be too damaged mentally from football terrorist Eric Bieniemy letting defenses tee off on him repeatedly for a season. That being said, if Darnold were to go down with a serious injury before the season, I think 5-12 would be the absolute best-case scenario with Lock under center. I'm not confident in saying that I think Howell 100% WOULD do better than Lock and be able to salvage our season, but I think it's at least somewhat conceivable that he COULD. For how little we'd actually get in a trade, I'd rather just have them battle it out for the backup job, and maybe the competition brings out something better in one or the other.

 

[Kamcussionator]

Another ridiculously dumb trade by Schneider. Somebody is not doing their homework because you don’t trade a guy a year after you traded for him unless something extraordinary takes place or you realize he just plain sucks. Hey John, that’s what the tape is for. Amateur hour.

Does getting a new OC with a different vision for the offense constitute "something extraordinary"?

Also, when is getting an experienced backup QB for a swap of day 3 picks "ridiculously dumb"?

Apparently some other "Amateur hour" GMs don't know what the tape is for either since they are trying to trade for him now.

Kinda just sounds like you're hating for no good reason. I'd more inclined to be like, "Wow! We're going to get something for Howell. With four QBs on the roster I figured people would just wait and try to snag him for free from the waiver wire."

 

[Rat]

Does getting a new OC with a different vision for the offense constitute "something extraordinary"?

Also, when is getting an experienced backup QB for a swap of day 3 picks "ridiculously dumb"?

Apparently some other "Amateur hour" GMs don't know what the tape is for either since they are trying to trade for him now.

Kinda just sounds like you're hating for no good reason. I'd more inclined to be like, "Wow! We're going to get something for Howell. With four QBs on the roster I figured people would just wait and try to snag him for free from the waiver wire."

We traded out of Day 2 with one pick (24 spots) and then traded out of another round with a different Day 3 pick (27 spots).

I thought the trade made plenty of sense at the time, and I still think Howell has real ability if he's not too far gone mentally to ever realize it, but isn't the fact that he's reportedly available Schneider tacitly admitting the trade was a mistake? It's not like we just lucked into a great QB situation and he's just a victim of the numbers game; Lock apparently drew no interest whatsoever in free agency (you're arguing that other teams wanting Howell is a sign that he's good), and ended up signing a month in for the same money as Nick Mullens and Case Keenum, which was less than half of what he got last year when the cap was lower. And this is to back up a 27-year-old on his fifth team, who had a "breakout year" where he absolutely collapsed over the two-game stretch where his team needed him most.

There's some potential with Howell, there's some potential with Darnold, the league doesn't seem to value Lock, but some like him. It's also entirely possible that none of these guys are all that great and we're just spinning our wheels.

 

[Cyrus12]

Horrible trade..some decent guys went between that 3rd and 4th pick...hated the trade the moment it happened.

 

[Scout]

Horrible trade..some decent guys went between that 3rd and 4th pick...hated the trade the moment it happened.

Not that bad to have a cheap backup QB and worth a deeper look. Truthfully with a new OC you expect turnover with what they are looking for at the QB position and other positions on offense But the flipside is I have no clue what is going on with the offense because:

• Who is a core player on offense signed long term?
• There is no murmurs of even trying to re-sign many of the players on offense as their rookie contracts wind down.
• The lack of spending on the OL is alarming because if they are going to be dead last in spending it has to show up somewhere else (eg defense).
• Interior OL and TE need upgrades to run this new offense and so far there are a lot of stop gaps or just average options.

 

[Streamhawk]

We'll know that in about 8-9 days from now. Or at least have a better idea and it all depends on what fish are biting on what bait.

Regarding fishing. If they stock a lake, does that mean we can fish it now or do we have to wait till the 26th?

 

[Streamhawk]

Not that bad to have a cheap backup QB and worth a deeper look. Truthfully with a new OC you expect turnover with what they are looking for at the QB position and other positions on offense But the flipside is I have no clue what is going on with the offense because:

• Who is a core player on offense signed long term?
• There is no murmurs of even trying to re-sign many of the players on offense as their rookie contracts wind down.
• The lack of spending on the OL is alarming because if they are going to be dead last in spending it has to show up somewhere else (eg defense).
• Interior OL and TE need upgrades to run this new offense and so far there are a lot of stop gaps or just average options.

Yes, the Offensive plan remains concerning after FA. However I have been trying to be patient waiting for the draft. So if they don’t draft any legit IOL *early then let the bitching continue. There’s a chance we land Warren/Loveland both blue chip TE potential at 18.

 

[Rat]

Horrible trade..some decent guys went between that 3rd and 4th pick...hated the trade the moment it happened.

I was surprised I hadn't actually looked at this, and was scared to. There were a few decent guys taken in that range.

It looks like the best player selected between picks 78 and 102 was - and of course it's this because why the hell would it be anything else - is an offensive guard selected by the Niners (Dominick Puni). Bucs WR Jalen McMillan, Steelers LB Payton Wilson, and Rams S Kamren Kinchens all look promising too. Wilson was actually who I was calling for when we took Haynes, although I was content with Haynes.

Granted, we probably would have just taken Haynes at 78 anyway, and I doubt we would have doubled up and taken Puni at 81. The pick eventually ended up being Knight (traded down from 102 also), so the result is fine in that regard, it's just annoying to see a bitter division rival hit on a steal at our biggest position of need.

 

[Natethegreat]

We traded out of Day 2 with one pick (24 spots) and then traded out of another round with a different Day 3 pick (27 spots).

I thought the trade made plenty of sense at the time, and I still think Howell has real ability if he's not too far gone mentally to ever realize it, but isn't the fact that he's reportedly available Schneider tacitly admitting the trade was a mistake? It's not like we just lucked into a great QB situation and he's just a victim of the numbers game; Lock apparently drew no interest whatsoever in free agency (you're arguing that other teams wanting Howell is a sign that he's good), and ended up signing a month in for the same money as Nick Mullens and Case Keenum, which was less than half of what he got last year when the cap was lower. And this is to back up a 27-year-old on his fifth team, who had a "breakout year" where he absolutely collapsed over the two-game stretch where his team needed him most.

There's some potential with Howell, there's some potential with Darnold, the league doesn't seem to value Lock, but some like him. It's also entirely possible that none of these guys are all that great and we're just spinning our wheels.

No it's not a mistake. You can't go into the year with no back up. We also had a cap crunch so JS did what he needed to do, to go into last year with a competent back up on a cheap rookie deal.
It's not that complicated and the price was hardly prohibitive.
Now with all the changeover and Lock on a cheap deal himself Howell is on the trade block. Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill. Good gravy.

 

[Rat]

No it's not a mistake. You can't go into the year with no back up. We also had a cap crunch so JS did what he needed to do, to go into last year with a competent back up on a cheap rookie deal.
It's not that complicated and the price was hardly prohibitive.
Now with all the changeover and Lock on a cheap deal himself Howell is on the trade block. Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill. Good gravy.

So, moves are never mistakes as long as they made sense at the time? Do you think we make the trade a second time if we could go back? Feels like it could just as easily be considered right idea, wrong player.

I still have some hope for Howell, but I think if Schneider does move him, I don't see how that's not him admitting the trade didn't work out.