PFF Player Rankings for Hawks Players Thru Week 14

RiverDog

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This took some time to put together, so hopefully a few of you will find this interesting.

The first number after the position indicates the number of players in the league who received enough snaps to qualify for a ranking followed by the players on our team who received rankings and the highest ranked player in the league at that position.

QB-40 Geno Smith 9th (T-9th) Highest Ranked: Joe Burrow, Bengals.

WR-128. JSN #16, DK Metcalf #37 (#32), Tyler Locket #62 (52), Jake Bobo #115 (114). Top Ranked: Nico Collins, Texans.

RB-59 Kenneth Walker #4 (5), Zach Charbonnet #23 (34). Top Ranked: Derrick Henry, Ravens.

TE-79 Noah Fant, #36 (39), AJ Bsarner #42 (T-45), Pharoah Brown, #68 (68). Top Ranked: George Kittle, Niners.

Center-41 Conner Williams #20 (17), Olu Oluwatimi #27, (NR) Top Ranked: Creed Humphrey, Chiefs.

OG-75 Laken Tomlinson #38 (42), Anthony Bradford #72 (70). Top Ranked: Chris Lindstrom, Falcons.

OT-80 Charles Cross #11 (11), Abe Lucas #68 (NR), Stone Forsythe #78 (73). Top Ranked: Jordan Mailata, Eagles.

CB-118 Devon Witherspoon #19 (T-24), Tariq Wollen #33 (?), Tre Brown #105 (#99) Josh Jobe #111 (#110). Top Ranked: Pat Surtain, Broncos.

Safety-92 Julian Love #6 (7), Coby Bryant #14 (T-17), Rayshawn Jenkins #72 (78). Top Ranked: Kirby Joseph, Lions.

LB-84 Tyrice Knight #25 (31), Ernest Jones #48 (41). Top Ranked: Zach Baun, Eagles.

DT-124 Leonard Williams #4 (4), Jarran Reed #25 (35), Byron Murphy #53 (64), Roy Robertson-Harris #80 (81). Top Ranked: Cameron Heyward, Steelers.

Edge-116 Boye Mafe T-#33 (T-30), Derrick Hall #62 (T-60). Top Ranked: Adian Hutchinson, Lions.

Players of interest. Offensive guard Sataoa Laumea received an overall grade of 38.8, an improvement over the 29.2 grade he had as of Week 13. Russell Wilson is the 11th ranked QB, a slight improvement over the #13 spot he was ranked at in Week 13.

I'm not claiming this to be some sort of holy grail and there are some things that do not meet the eye test. For example, despite the fact that Saquan Barkley, playing for the 11-2 Eagles, is on track to win the rushing title with over 2,000 yard yet he is just the 9th ranked running back below players like Bucky Irving and Tyler Allgeier (I had to correct the spelling on his last name 3 times). I also don't feel that they are putting enough weight on a team's W/L record for the quarterback position, that the success of eighth ranked Patrick Mahomes' 12-1 Chiefs should give him a little more stink vs. #1 Joe Burrow's 5-8 Bengals.
 

Ostatehawk

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LB, S, DT - damn - those numbers look fantastic - thanks for the hard work River!
 

Ostatehawk

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Also - I REALLY like AJ Barner - I think he will be a force in a year or two.

He has decent speed with power like a fullback and dishes out pain on DB's. He has lowered the boom on a few of them this year.
 

Ozzy

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Tomlinson at 38? So he’s an average starter if you assume two starting guards? PPF is crazy for that one lol. Jones at 41? @keasley45 this is why I call out PFF’s grade of Femo when it’s vastly different than every other advanced metric site. I need more than a PFF grade

But again props to river for doing this for us, it’s super cool to see
 
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RiverDog

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LB, S, DT - damn - those numbers look fantastic - thanks for the hard work River!
No sweat. So long as one or two of you guys think it's worth it, I'll keep posting them.

I also feel that our corners are solid, although Wollen is starting to slide a bit. I'm glad that his teammates jumped on him for loafing on a tackle. Nothing like some peer pressure to get a guy's attitude straightened out, more effective than the coach's calling him out.
 
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RiverDog

RiverDog

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Tomlinson at 38? So he’s an average starter if you assume two starting guards? PPF is crazy for that one lol. Jones at 41? @keasley45 this is why I call out PFF’s grade of Femo when it’s vastly different than every other advanced metric site. I need more than a PFF grade

But again props to river for doing this for us, it’s super cool to see
There're 32 starting guards, so if everything else is equal, average for a starter would be 16th.

However, there's likely some players that shouldn't be ranked. For example, the 3rd ranked offensive guard is the Colt's Will Fries, but he has just 268 snaps vs. #1 ranked Chris Lindstrom with 836 snaps. So, you're probably closer to being right in your assessment of Tomlinson being considered average at #38, especially when you take into consideration that there's 75 guards that met the minimum snap requirement, making 38 the midpoint.

That's why I included the number of players meeting the minimum snap count, so we can keep the rankings in perspective.
 

Kamcussionator

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Wow knight our highest LB
Yeah, I noticed that too.

Tyrice Knight #25 (31), Ernest Jones #48 (41).

There is are a bunch of threads about PFF already, so I won't go into how good or bad their system is, however I would like to air a couple things I don't like about ratings in general.

1) There is no rating for plays you didn't make because you weren't there. e.g. Luke Kuechly was often touted as an elite LB, but to watch him play he was always meeting ball carriers 5 yards deep rather than at the line. e.g. (2) If you stay in your gap, even when the play goes somewhere else, you don't get dinged -- but if you do leave it and then can't make the play you do. (This is what I suspect accounts for the Knight/Jones discrepancy.)
2) To quote Mina Kimes, "Wins are not a QB stat." Joe Burrow can attest to that this season for sure (33TD, 6 INT, 68% COMP.). Also, I would suggest, that sacks are a QB stat. You can't be sacked if you don't have the ball, yet it's real common to say it's the OL's fault. e.g. Did Tom Brady have an elite line everywhere he went? According to the statisticians he did, but he also got rid of the ball 0.5 seconds faster than the average so his lines had a much easier job than the rest of the league.
 

Kamcussionator

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There're 32 starting guards, so if everything else is equal, average for a starter would be 16th.

However, there's likely some players that shouldn't be ranked. For example, the 3rd ranked offensive guard is the Colt's Will Fries, but he has just 268 snaps vs. #1 ranked Chris Lindstrom with 836 snaps. So, you're probably closer to being right in your assessment of Tomlinson being considered average at #38, especially when you take into consideration that there's 75 guards that met the minimum snap requirement, making 38 the midpoint.

That's why I included the number of players meeting the minimum snap count, so we can keep the rankings in perspective.
Two guards per OL per team, so 64 starting guards...
 

Ozzy

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There're 32 starting guards, so if everything else is equal, average for a starter would be 16th.

However, there's likely some players that shouldn't be ranked. For example, the 3rd ranked offensive guard is the Colt's Will Fries, but he has just 268 snaps vs. #1 ranked Chris Lindstrom with 836 snaps. So, you're probably closer to being right in your assessment of Tomlinson being considered average at #38, especially when you take into consideration that there's 75 guards that met the minimum snap requirement, making 38 the midpoint.

That's why I included the number of players meeting the minimum snap count, so we can keep the rankings in perspective.
There are two guards per team or 64 starting guards unless they split left and right and I missed it?
 

Ozzy

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Yes, you are correct. My bad.
No worries!

I thought Jones would be higher too but maybe his pre Seahawks stuff is lower? He’s been incredible since coming here to my untrained eyes
 
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RiverDog

RiverDog

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It's my opinion
No worries!

I thought Jones would be higher too but maybe his pre Seahawks stuff is lower? He’s been incredible since coming here to my untrained eyes
That's a possibility. I'm not familiar enough with PFF's website to know how to glean that kind of information.

It's my opinion that most of their gradings and rankings meet the eye test. For example, this week Zach Charbonnet was ranked 23rd. Last week, he was ranked 34th. That's a heck of a jump, very appropriate for the way he played last Sunday.

Another example of meeting the eye test is the top ranked edge players. From first to sixth it's Adian Hutchinson, TJ Watt, Myles Garrett, Khalil Mack, Nick Bosa, and Micha Parsons.
 

Rat

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No worries!

I thought Jones would be higher too but maybe his pre Seahawks stuff is lower? He’s been incredible since coming here to my untrained eyes
He was graded surprisingly poorly against the Cards last week. His 51.8 overall grade was 16th among 17 defenders, with only Dre'Mont Jones grading worse.

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nanomoz

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Thanks for sharing.

Earnest Jones's ranking alone highlights how (I'm trying to be diplomatic, here) are not a complete picture.

PFF's advanced stats are awesome. Teams use them. Their rankings are, in many cases, questionable. In some cases, they are utter horseshit.

Jones has been central to the transformation of this defense in every way. He's making tackles in the run game 2-3 yards ahead of where Baker and Dodson were. And he's been suprisingly solid in coverage.
 
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RiverDog

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Thanks for sharing.

Earnest Jones's ranking alone highlights how (I'm trying to be diplomatic, here) are not a complete picture.

PFF's advanced stats are awesome. Teams use them. Their rankings are, in many cases, questionable. In some cases, they are utter horseshit.

Jones has been central to the transformation of this defense in every way. He's making tackles in the run game 2-3 yards ahead of where Baker and Dodson were. And he's been suprisingly solid in coverage.
I agree 100%. Just like statistics, PFF's grades and rankings don't always tell the full story. What PFF attempts to do is a very difficult, highly subjective task and they can often times be wrong.
 

Rat

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Earnest Jones's ranking alone highlights how (I'm trying to be diplomatic, here) are not a complete picture.

PFF's advanced stats are awesome. Teams use them. Their rankings are, in many cases, questionable. In some cases, they are utter horseshit.

Jones has been central to the transformation of this defense in every way. He's making tackles in the run game 2-3 yards ahead of where Baker and Dodson were. And he's been suprisingly solid in coverage.
I agree on his impact, but those things would still be true even if he did have a bad game against the Cards. I don't know enough for sure to say he didn't. We all remember the splash plays, so it's hard to reconcile the thought of him having that big INT and still say he played poorly overall. Maybe he did. I can't say I was really focused on him, and I'm not one of those guys who can watch a play and tell you what everyone on the field is doing. PFF is trying to isolate what they see on the field, so they'd probably see it as hurtful to their integrity to judge solo plays and games off reputation and be like "well, this wasn't good, but he has been great this year, and the team is really rallying around him, so let's bump his score up 20 points for today."
 

projectorfreak

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This took some time to put together, so hopefully a few of you will find this interesting.

The first number after the position indicates the number of players in the league who received enough snaps to qualify for a ranking followed by the players on our team who received rankings and the highest ranked player in the league at that position.

QB-40 Geno Smith 9th (T-9th) Highest Ranked: Joe Burrow, Bengals.

WR-128. JSN #16, DK Metcalf #37 (#32), Tyler Locket #62 (52), Jake Bobo #115 (114). Top Ranked: Nico Collins, Texans.

RB-59 Kenneth Walker #4 (5), Zach Charbonnet #23 (34). Top Ranked: Derrick Henry, Ravens.

TE-79 Noah Fant, #36 (39), AJ Bsarner #42 (T-45), Pharoah Brown, #68 (68). Top Ranked: George Kittle, Niners.

Center-41 Conner Williams #20 (17), Olu Oluwatimi #27, (NR) Top Ranked: Creed Humphrey, Chiefs.

OG-75 Laken Tomlinson #38 (42), Anthony Bradford #72 (70). Top Ranked: Chris Lindstrom, Falcons.

OT-80 Charles Cross #11 (11), Abe Lucas #68 (NR), Stone Forsythe #78 (73). Top Ranked: Jordan Mailata, Eagles.

CB-118 Devon Witherspoon #19 (T-24), Tariq Wollen #33 (?), Tre Brown #105 (#99) Josh Jobe #111 (#110). Top Ranked: Pat Surtain, Broncos.

Safety-92 Julian Love #6 (7), Coby Bryant #14 (T-17), Rayshawn Jenkins #72 (78). Top Ranked: Kirby Joseph, Lions.

LB-84 Tyrice Knight #25 (31), Ernest Jones #48 (41). Top Ranked: Zach Baun, Eagles.

DT-124 Leonard Williams #4 (4), Jarran Reed #25 (35), Byron Murphy #53 (64), Roy Robertson-Harris #80 (81). Top Ranked: Cameron Heyward, Steelers.

Edge-116 Boye Mafe T-#33 (T-30), Derrick Hall #62 (T-60). Top Ranked: Adian Hutchinson, Lions.

Players of interest. Offensive guard Sataoa Laumea received an overall grade of 38.8, an improvement over the 29.2 grade he had as of Week 13. Russell Wilson is the 11th ranked QB, a slight improvement over the #13 spot he was ranked at in Week 13.

I'm not claiming this to be some sort of holy grail and there are some things that do not meet the eye test. For example, despite the fact that Saquan Barkley, playing for the 11-2 Eagles, is on track to win the rushing title with over 2,000 yard yet he is just the 9th ranked running back below players like Bucky Irving and Tyler Allgeier (I had to correct the spelling on his last name 3 times). I also don't feel that they are putting enough weight on a team's W/L record for the quarterback position, that the success of eighth ranked Patrick Mahomes' 12-1 Chiefs should give him a little more stink vs. #1 Joe Burrow's 5-8 Bengals.
It's always appreciated by many that don't even post im sure
 

Jville

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This took some time to put together, so hopefully a few of you will find this interesting.

The first number after the position indicates the number of players in the league who received enough snaps to qualify for a ranking followed by the players on our team who received rankings and the highest ranked player in the league at that position.

QB-40 Geno Smith 9th (T-9th) Highest Ranked: Joe Burrow, Bengals.

WR-128. JSN #16, DK Metcalf #37 (#32), Tyler Locket #62 (52), Jake Bobo #115 (114). Top Ranked: Nico Collins, Texans.

RB-59 Kenneth Walker #4 (5), Zach Charbonnet #23 (34). Top Ranked: Derrick Henry, Ravens.

TE-79 Noah Fant, #36 (39), AJ Bsarner #42 (T-45), Pharoah Brown, #68 (68). Top Ranked: George Kittle, Niners.

Center-41 Conner Williams #20 (17), Olu Oluwatimi #27, (NR) Top Ranked: Creed Humphrey, Chiefs.

OG-75 Laken Tomlinson #38 (42), Anthony Bradford #72 (70). Top Ranked: Chris Lindstrom, Falcons.

OT-80 Charles Cross #11 (11), Abe Lucas #68 (NR), Stone Forsythe #78 (73). Top Ranked: Jordan Mailata, Eagles.

CB-118 Devon Witherspoon #19 (T-24), Tariq Wollen #33 (?), Tre Brown #105 (#99) Josh Jobe #111 (#110). Top Ranked: Pat Surtain, Broncos.

Safety-92 Julian Love #6 (7), Coby Bryant #14 (T-17), Rayshawn Jenkins #72 (78). Top Ranked: Kirby Joseph, Lions.

LB-84 Tyrice Knight #25 (31), Ernest Jones #48 (41). Top Ranked: Zach Baun, Eagles.

DT-124 Leonard Williams #4 (4), Jarran Reed #25 (35), Byron Murphy #53 (64), Roy Robertson-Harris #80 (81). Top Ranked: Cameron Heyward, Steelers.

Edge-116 Boye Mafe T-#33 (T-30), Derrick Hall #62 (T-60). Top Ranked: Adian Hutchinson, Lions.

Players of interest. Offensive guard Sataoa Laumea received an overall grade of 38.8, an improvement over the 29.2 grade he had as of Week 13. Russell Wilson is the 11th ranked QB, a slight improvement over the #13 spot he was ranked at in Week 13.

I'm not claiming this to be some sort of holy grail and there are some things that do not meet the eye test. For example, despite the fact that Saquan Barkley, playing for the 11-2 Eagles, is on track to win the rushing title with over 2,000 yard yet he is just the 9th ranked running back below players like Bucky Irving and Tyler Allgeier (I had to correct the spelling on his last name 3 times). I also don't feel that they are putting enough weight on a team's W/L record for the quarterback position, that the success of eighth ranked Patrick Mahomes' 12-1 Chiefs should give him a little more stink vs. #1 Joe Burrow's 5-8 Bengals.

Thanks for volunteering to put this together. It can only help to give PFF it's own dedicated weekly thread. Hopefully it will help direct posts better and reduce the incidents of hijacking other threads.

Very thoughtful. Of course, there is now the expectation for a follow up week 16 PFF thread.

Again, thanks for volunteering! (y)(y) Two thumbs up!
 
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