Pete is an elite coach and this proves it

[pittpnthrs]

I appreciate all of the hard work to continue to put in to prove my point. Every time you put fingers to the keyboard, the ignorance just pours out...
Do love ya tho...

You still cant see the big picture for what it is, but thats ok. Love you too bro.

 

[Hawkamaniac]

I think the OP is misinterpreting the chart. The Twitter analyst isn't trying to show or plot great coaches; he's trying to prove that the "market" does a pretty decent job of predicting outcomes.

FWIW: I think Pete is probably a Hall of Fame coach. Said opinion is centered on two SBs appearance, 150+ wins (and counting), a decade of winning seasons, etc. I'm sure there are plenty who'll disagree, but how he performs against spreads doesn't have a whole lot of significance in this debate IMO.

 

[Mix]

In the world that is NFL parity any win % above 60 should be considered elite.

 

[chrispy]

"Elite" is very subjective.

The fact he's included in the pool puts him in a fairly high-brow crowd. If a person is an average member of Mensa, they're not going to be the dumbest person in very many rooms.

Statistically speaking, an average NFL team should win the SB once every 32 years. An average NFL team should go to the SB once every 16 years. An average NFL team should go to the playoffs 14/32nds of the time. Winning a SB, going to two and being a perennial playoff team easily puts PC somewhere well above average.

All the recent RCW news has demonstrated the added difficulty of coaching the Seahawks the past 13 years. Anyone attesting that RCW was being held back and PC was riding his coattails should now thoroughly embrace the contrary. However, aside from RCW drama, the probability of hiring a new above average HC is just as likely as hiring a below average HC. The reason to hire a new Head Coach is because they're underperforming, not outperforming. Calling for the replacement of PC may be appropriate at some point, but saying that's a goal because he goes to the playoffs too much is absurd.

 

[Torc]

And then there is Andy Reid. Success with multiple QBs and teams.

What if Reid is the GOAT, or at least of this generation, and Belichick's greatness is attributable to having Brady for so long.

And Shula, and Landry.

That's kind of where I was headed - Belichick, by the evidence, was the beneficiary of having a generational QB talent, arguably the greatest QB ever. The fact that Brady switched teams and got another ring just adds fuel to that fire.

On the other hand, Pete's primary QB went to another team and that team got worse, while Pete's team improved over the previous year. Only one year of results thus far but it suggests where the Seahawk's success over the past decade has been based.

 

[FrodosFinger]

I think the OP is misinterpreting the chart. The Twitter analyst isn't trying to show or plot great coaches; he's trying to prove that the "market" does a pretty decent job of predicting outcomes.

FWIW: I think Pete is probably a Hall of Fame coach. Said opinion is centered on two SBs appearance, 150+ wins (and counting), a decade of winning seasons, etc. I'm sure there are plenty who'll disagree, but how he performs against spreads doesn't have a whole lot of significance in this debate IMO.

Upper right quadrant buddy

 

[Lagartixa]

The best way to interpret it is to leave your hate for Pete at the front door pal. We don’t tolerate it here

There are a bunch of things I think Carroll does really well, and I frequently find myself disagreeing with his detractors here on .NET, but I don't think this graph shows, well, really anything about how good Carroll is as a coach. The way I interpret that graph is that pretty much all NFL head coaches with a lot of games win about as many of those games as you'd expect them to win given the closing odds on the games their teams played. It looks pretty linear, and it's amazing how few coaches end up in the upper-left and lower right areas of the graph, where the coaches of teams that consistently overperform or underperform the betting odds would fall.

Even if a given coach is slightly above or below the best-fit line, I don't think that really says much about the coach one way or the other. Like @Hawkamaniac, I think the main takeaway from the graph is that the betting markets do a pretty good job of predicting outcomes in the long run.

 

[Ozzy]

Carroll is an all time great coach I don't think many disagree.

 

[FrodosFinger]

There are a bunch of things I think Carroll does really well, and I frequently find myself disagreeing with his detractors here on .NET, but I don't think this graph shows, well, really anything about how good Carroll is as a coach. The way I interpret that graph is that pretty much all NFL head coaches with a lot of games win about as many of those games as you'd expect them to win given the closing odds on the games their teams played. It looks pretty linear, and it's amazing how few coaches end up in the upper-left and lower right areas of the graph, where the coaches of teams that consistently overperform or underperform the betting odds would fall.

Even if a given coach is slightly above or below the best-fit line, I don't think that really says much about the coach one way or the other. Like @Hawkamaniac, I think the main takeaway from the graph is that the betting markets do a pretty good job of predicting outcomes in the long run.

Elite? Yes. I mean is he a legend like Shula, Walsh, Chuck Nolan, Landry? No
He’s more in line with Jimmy Johnson and Holmgren . Let’s face it Russ threw that interception at the 1 not Pete. He should have 2 Lombardi’s

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Great coach, not sure if he's an all-time great. But I can see why many would considering him an all time great, and that's fine.

 

[Maelstrom787]

Lol. When the team cant get past the first or second round of the post season, whats the point? The team made the playoffs last season due to a decimated Rams and Cardinals season, but did anybody truly feel they had a snowballs chance of doing anything once they got there? Sadly some of you probably did. Yes Pete built a Super Bowl team once early on, but he squandered it even quicker. I have no aspirations he could ever do it again.

What's the point?

Do you watch the sport at all? Your expectations are not in line with reality.

31 teams go home with diddly squat every year. Some have never won it all period. In any given year, most teams simply don't make the playoffs. This level of sustained success is not seen often. If you expect contention year in and year out, then enjoy some heavy disappointment no matter which fanbase you end up defecting to.

Even if they make it to a championship game, you'll be right here calling it a fluke. Hell, you'd probably try to asterisk a championship.

 

[pittpnthrs]

What's the point?

Do you watch the sport at all? Your expectations are not in line with reality.

31 teams go home with diddly squat every year. Some have never won it all period. In any given year, most teams simply don't make the playoffs. This level of sustained success is not seen often. If you expect contention year in and year out, then enjoy some heavy disappointment no matter which fanbase you end up defecting to.

Even if they make it to a championship game, you'll be right here calling it a fluke. Hell, you'd probably try to asterisk a championship.

How many years of never moving past the second round are you and others going to be content with? After a decade of the same pattern and cycle one would think the fanbase would grow tired and want change, but not this teams. Its baffling. Just making the playoffs seems good enough. Never progressing doesnt matter. The pattern has been set for all to see. Other coaches just decimate Carroll in the post season. How many more tries does the guy get before people realize its not going to happen? He needs optimum talent to move forward, succeed and overcome his deficiencies and he's never going to have that again. Carroll is a waste of time at this point unless all you care about is a Wild Card win once in awhile. Once the post season rolls around, he's just outclassed in the X and O's department.

 

[hox]

Once the post season rolls around, he's just outclassed in the X and O's department.

Yes and no. We lost to the 9ers in the playoffs mainly due to talent. They outclassed us in talent level. If Pete and John can hit again this upcoming draft, we can restock the team with talent.

Yes 9ers have better Xs and Os too, but that's mostly on the coordinators.

Pete needs smart people around him. Where Pete falls short is hiring the correct coordinators... Waldron improved over his first season, but I'm not confident in Hurtt's abilities at all. And KNJ was given too much rope.

At least Desai has a masters and a doctorate, but doesn't look like he'll be with the team for long. I'm surprised he's not already hired by another team. Pete should have made Desai the coordinator.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Well, while I think Pete is a hell a coach.........he DOES get outcoached a LOT.

 

[Lagartixa]

Yes 9ers have better Xs and Os too, but that's mostly on the coordinators.

Do they? Why do their QBs keep getting injured so much? Could that have something to do with the offensive scheming focusing completely on getting players open to receive passes, and not on protecting the QB? That would be an X-and-O failure.

 

[94Smith]

I agree he is a great coach but it is a dumb chart. It should be just win percentage or win percentage on one axis and a measure of talent on the other axis. Maybe aggregate PFF grade? But PFF hasnt been around long.

 

[hox]

Do they? Why do their QBs keep getting injured so much? Could that have something to do with the offensive scheming focusing completely on getting players open to receive passes, and not on protecting the QB? That would be an X-and-O failure.

Shanny called the same crossing route 3 or 4 times that game. A couple of times to Samuel and a couple times to Kittle but it was basically the same route. Hurtt on the other hand, wasn't too quick to make adjustments.

That they're able to run their offense with a rookie QB and still succeed demonstrates the creativity in their offense. They are multiple in their scheme.

Injuries, that's just bad luck.

 

[scutterhawk]

Agreed. Ignorance is believing an antiquated coach who hasent done anything in the post season in almost a decade is an elite coach who is suddenly going to turn things around.

LOLOL Y'all can Snivel, P*ss, & Moan BETTER than my ex ever did and that's saying something.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Irony ^^^

 

[FrodosFinger]

Well, while I think Pete is a hell a coach.........he DOES get outcoached a LOT.

Yeah but his style usually has us in games. Top 10 scoring offense and dead last against the run but top a top 5 secondary. Tells you where we need to draft. DT/NT Edge and ILB. Another center would be nice or guard I mean we have the draft capital to make some nice moves. We just need more on defensive side of the ball front 7