New CB Cook suggests changes in store for #49ers defense....

[hawknation2014]

With the 49ers will get slaughtered in man coverage.

 

[loafoftatupu]

LOL.

Lets be real tho....NOBODY thought Sherman would be this good when he was drafted, and that includes Seattle. If they did think he'd be this good there is no way in hell they'd have waited that long to take him.

When Thurmond was injured, Sherman made it clear that he wouldn't disappoint as the starter. It took one game and the guy was getting serious love. Someone knew something, but not as much as Sherman did.

 

[-The Glove-]

LOL.

Lets be real tho....NOBODY thought Sherman would be this good when he was drafted, and that includes Seattle. If they did think he'd be this good there is no way in hell they'd have waited that long to take him.

When Thurmond was injured, Sherman made it clear that he wouldn't disappoint as the starter. It took one game and the guy was getting serious love. Someone knew something, but not as much as Sherman did.

yup. I remember worrying when Thurmond went down and thinking "wow. This guy is good" when Sherman played a few

 

[NINEster]

I'm surprised the 49er secondary wasn't blown up after the super bowl loss. That was the worst secondary outing I've seen by the 49ers in quite some time in a big game.

I don't think a scheme change to mimic Seattle is necessary. It's about personnel which the 49ers do not have yet, in the secondary.

The secondary needs to get better but they do not need to be as good as Seattle to be effective.

2011 might have been a nice perfect storm for the 49er defense surprising the hell out of the league, but it also illustrated IMO how scary the defense can be if the secondary can be effective.

 

[Uncle Si]

I'm surprised the 49er secondary wasn't blown up after the super bowl loss. That was the worst secondary outing I've seen by the 49ers in quite some time in a big game.

I don't think a scheme change to mimic Seattle is necessary. It's about personnel which the 49ers do not have yet, in the secondary.

The secondary needs to get better but they do not need to be as good as Seattle to be effective.

2011 might have been a nice perfect storm for the 49er defense surprising the hell out of the league, but it also illustrated IMO how scary the defense can be if the secondary can be effective.

and for your personnal change you brought in Chris Cook? bless you

 

[Marvin49]

I'm surprised the 49er secondary wasn't blown up after the super bowl loss. That was the worst secondary outing I've seen by the 49ers in quite some time in a big game.

I don't think a scheme change to mimic Seattle is necessary. It's about personnel which the 49ers do not have yet, in the secondary.

The secondary needs to get better but they do not need to be as good as Seattle to be effective.

2011 might have been a nice perfect storm for the 49er defense surprising the hell out of the league, but it also illustrated IMO how scary the defense can be if the secondary can be effective.

and for your personnal change you brought in Chris Cook? bless you

Oh relax. LOL. Minimum contract. Possible camp fodder. Not every signing is meant to be a starter. LOL.

All his signing signifies is that the guys the Niners have been bringing in lately are tall, lanky CBs.

 

[loafoftatupu]

Well, they needed to do something.

Who knows what the SF secondary will look like when the season starts. Whatever it is, they can't just stand still and continue to expect different results. The Niners are strong in the middle, which bolsters both the back and front of their defense.

Whatever it is they do in the secondary, it is going to be an adjustment period for them at least in the early part of the season.

 

[Marvin49]

Well, they needed to do something.

Who knows what the SF secondary will look like when the season starts. Whatever it is, they can't just stand still and continue to expect different results. The Niners are strong in the middle, which bolsters both the back and front of their defense.

Whatever it is they do in the secondary, it is going to be an adjustment period for them at least in the early part of the season.

That I agree with. Better, not as good, who knows. All we know for sure is that it will be different and there will be a period of adjustment. Brock and Reid started last year, but whomever the other corner will be and Bethea will have to adjust to the new D.

 

[Popeyejones]

^^^^ Not sure I agree with the "needed to do something" meme. The secondary definitely under-performed toward the end of last year, but the majority of the league would be envious of the unit we're talking about.

The 9ers were 11th in opp comp %, 6th in y/att, 11th in ints, 4th in opp QB rating, and 7th in pass yards allowed per game.

If people want to credit the dline and lbs for that, they were tied for 18th in sacks.

To be honest, if Kap didn't have three turnovers in the fourth quarter of the nfcc NOBODY would be talking about problems in the 9ers secondary. This is about a guy having 25% of his total turnovers on the year in the 4th quarter of the NFC Championship game. That's a combination of random chance and going up against the best defense in the league, but it's REALLY not a secondary related thing. Not to take a SINGLE THING away from the Hawks who flat out won that game and absolutely deserved to do so, but we're talking about a game in which over 40% of the opponents' offensive production and all of their touchdowns came off three big plays. The hawks did a good job of creating them and capitalizing off of them, but as anyone who has watched football for more than a few weeks knows, that's largely flukey.

Long story short I think the 9ers will have a rebuilt secondary this year because the salary cap demands it, not because there was something fundamentally wrong with the unit. The numbers simply don't bear that out.

 

[Sports Hernia]

^^^^You call it flukey, other call it "choking". 8)

 

[ImTheScientist]

The only difference is Cook is certainly no Earl Thomas.

Is Cook a safety or Earl a CB? Nope. Not sure why you would compare the two.

 

[Marvin49]

^^^^ Not sure I agree with the "needed to do something" meme. The secondary definitely under-performed toward the end of last year, but the majority of the league would be envious of the unit we're talking about.

The 9ers were 11th in opp comp %, 6th in y/att, 11th in ints, 4th in opp QB rating, and 7th in pass yards allowed per game.

If people want to credit the dline and lbs for that, they were tied for 18th in sacks.

To be honest, if Kap didn't have three turnovers in the fourth quarter of the nfcc NOBODY would be talking about problems in the 9ers secondary. This is about a guy having 25% of his total turnovers on the year in the 4th quarter of the NFC Championship game. That's a combination of random chance and going up against the best defense in the league, but it's REALLY not a secondary related thing. Not to take a SINGLE THING away from the Hawks who flat out won that game and absolutely deserved to do so, but we're talking about a game in which over 40% of the opponents' offensive production and all of their touchdowns came off three big plays. The hawks did a good job of creating them and capitalizing off of them, but as anyone who has watched football for more than a few weeks knows, that's largely flukey.

Long story short I think the 9ers will have a rebuilt secondary this year because the salary cap demands it, not because there was something fundamentally wrong with the unit. The numbers simply don't bear that out.

They needed to do something because....

1) They weren't going to pay Whitner.
2) Rogers was declining.
3) Brown was always solid but unspectacular.
4) Late in 2012 when both Aldon and Justin were hurt, that pass D was exposed.

Yes....they had a good year in Pass Coverage last year, but a lot of that is playing teams that weren't all that great passing teams to begin with (in particular that stretch that Aldon missed) and because of that front 7.

The front 7 isn't just about creating pressure (and they did that a lot...particularly when Aldon was out there). They were also able to stop the run without an 8th defender which helped the pass D by allowing both safeties to defend against the pass.

 

[loafoftatupu]

^^^^ Not sure I agree with the "needed to do something" meme. The secondary definitely under-performed toward the end of last year, but the majority of the league would be envious of the unit we're talking about.

The 9ers were 11th in opp comp %, 6th in y/att, 11th in ints, 4th in opp QB rating, and 7th in pass yards allowed per game.

If people want to credit the dline and lbs for that, they were tied for 18th in sacks.

To be honest, if Kap didn't have three turnovers in the fourth quarter of the nfcc NOBODY would be talking about problems in the 9ers secondary. This is about a guy having 25% of his total turnovers on the year in the 4th quarter of the NFC Championship game. That's a combination of random chance and going up against the best defense in the league, but it's REALLY not a secondary related thing. Not to take a SINGLE THING away from the Hawks who flat out won that game and absolutely deserved to do so, but we're talking about a game in which over 40% of the opponents' offensive production and all of their touchdowns came off three big plays. The hawks did a good job of creating them and capitalizing off of them, but as anyone who has watched football for more than a few weeks knows, that's largely flukey.

Long story short I think the 9ers will have a rebuilt secondary this year because the salary cap demands it, not because there was something fundamentally wrong with the unit. The numbers simply don't bear that out.

Popeye,

I think that if the Niners secondary wanted to improve that they would need to make changes. Is it money motivated? Sure it is, but how many times does Harbaugh want to see that "I got burned again" look on the face of Carlos Rogers (gone) or watch Whitner chasing down a ball carrier from behind? (Also gone)

I honestly don't think that there is much to the Niners secondary, nor has their been. Teams can pass on SF, beyond the LBer level. When things are going good up front (which is typical for SF) the secondary isn't getting exposed. They are getting credit statistically for the efforts of an elite front.

As a unit, I saw them as average, with potential for being much better if some young players are provided the opportunity. They may very well be improved by the time the season starts, but there wasn't any point in paying that much money (as you pointed out) for something they can get for less. If SF gets a really solid secondary that defense becomes far more effective.

 

[Popeyejones]

^^^ Wouldn't disagree with that assessment. I just think that in a conversation between fans of the two best teams in the NFL over the past couple years (and one of which has the best secondary in the league), it's easy to lose site of the fact that we're talking about what was a top 10 unit in the league as if it was trash. It's just that IMO Rogers' age, Brown's demands, and not being able to retain two pro-bowl safeties due to the salary cap is the story here, not the unit being fundamentally poor and in need of implosion.

Basically, what I'm saying is that this is MUCH more similar to the Hawks' defensive line situation than it is to the Browns' quarterback situation.

 

[Marvin49]

^^^ Wouldn't disagree with that assessment. I just think that in a conversation between fans of the two best teams in the NFL over the past couple years (and one of which has the best secondary in the league), it's easy to lose site of the fact that we're talking about what was a top 10 unit in the league as if it was trash. It's just that IMO Rogers' age, Brown's demands, and not being able to retain two pro-bowl safeties due to the salary cap is the story here, not the unit being fundamentally poor and in need of implosion.

Basically, what I'm saying is that this is MUCH more similar to the Hawks' defensive line situation than it is to the Browns' quarterback situation.

Partially true IMO, but I think the 49ers have wanted to revamp the secondary for awhile now. They knew Goldson and Whitner were going to be up and never had any intension to pay what they wanted.

I can only speak for myself though and I've been looking for an upgrade there for awhile. I wasn't a fan of either safety in particular. Actually liked Brown though but kinda always knew he wasn't a great player, just a very solid one. I guess what I'm saying is that they weren't terrible, but behind that front 7 they could probably do a lot better.

The one thing they will miss tho is the way those 2 safeties would play downhill. I hope Reid and Bethea can do that a bit, but they aren't Goldson and Whitner in that regard.

 

[Lords of Scythia]

Well thats a hell of a compliment, our biggest rival copieing our scheme now. Guess if you can't beat them join them. Pete has left a impact for the rest of the league that will be used for a while now. Still have to get all the pieces but we didn't have them all working year one either.

PC is the mastermind to the rest of the NFL at this point. The Seahawks lost their DC and the D GOT BETTER.

 

[RolandDeschain]

I can't wait for the 49ers to run with a single high safety against us most of the time.