Is Russ giving us a discount?

[hgwellz12]

Let that boy cook!

 

[NFSeahawks]

Won't give a discount but I would put it past him to structure a deal with more guaranteed up front money that makes the cap hits easier. He's smart and if we give him a chunk of cash up front he can invest, hell make more money in the long run.

maybe that's just not realistic but nothing would surprise me.

Well put, it's very realistic.

 

[Popeyejones]

The NFLPA allows a little "home town discount," but it ain't much.......usually about 10%.

The NFLPA has no involvement in how much or how little people sign for. There are tons of regulations of what contracts may and may not include which are pre-negotiated by the NFLPA, but a player could choose to play for a dollar a year and the NFLPA couldn't say anything about it.

Other Topics Mentioned:

1) As for if they've already worked out the rough parameters of the deal, this IS a violation of the agreed upon contract with the NFLPA, and isn't worth the risk. In Wilson's case in particular he also just changed agents, meaning the likelihood of this is about as close to a statistical zero as one could get.

2) As for taking a hometown discount, the frequency with which they happen (almost never) really doesn't match the frequency with which the possiblity of them happening is talked about (almost always). Hometown discounts, when they do occur, aren't even really "discounts" they're team friendly deals in terms of HOW the money is allocated rather than HOW MUCH money is allocated (e.g. Brady, Kaepernick).

3) Personally, I get most annoyed when fans say that players will take less because they're "good people" or "aren't greedy."

For a guy like Wilson, he's been getting paid about 2.25% of his market rate for three years now ( (500K/22million)100 ). Given this reality, IMO him wanting what he's worth doesn't make him a "bad person" or "greedy", it makes the fan claiming he should take less than he's worth to "help out the team" (and their own fandom) a bad person and greedy. Nobody EVER suggests that their favorite team should pay their players more than their worth just to prove that the team is made up of "good people" and aren't "greedy." The same needs to work in reverse.

 

[ManBunts]

If he doesn't take a discount it just proves he doesn't care about winning. He only cares about money, endorsements and getting guys cut when he doesn't like them. Selfish prick.

You forgot this... :sarcasm_on: :sarcasm_off: ....

Soooooo...endzorn...bitter much?

I don't think we get a discount, but I think we get a team friendly deal a la the Kapaernick deal where we can drop him whenever. Probably more guaranteed money, maybe starting slightly higher and with less escalation, but really that's probably the best he can do for us. As has been mentioned, the NFLPA won't let player's give discounts. It would make the other kids look greedy.

BUT...BUUUUUUTTTT Cutler, Flacco and Dalton basically doing ho-hum at best (horrible at worst) has probably helped deflate the idea that QBs should ALL garner big gash.

BUT...BUUUUUUTTT...Russell has the hardware to prove he's worth it. Pay the man. He's taken the lumps, works his butt off, and you can't deny the impact he's had on the community also.

 

[volsunghawk]

I don't think he'll take a discount, per se, but I just don't see him pushing to get biggest-contract-ever type megadeal. Like $20 mil/year vs. $25 mil/year. Maybe with a lot of guaranteed money. Dying to see the deets on this one when it gets done. .NET will take a week to digest it.

By the nature of player contracts, each new one is "biggest ever. "

I expect that the absolute floor for Wilson's deal is going to be whatever the last real franchise QB got. No less.

You mean Kaepernick... :stirthepot: :les: :34853_doh: :179422: :0190l: :177692: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :roll:[/quote]

Actually, I mean it's possible that Wilson holds out on contract negotiations until Newton or Luck have signed new deals. That's not necessarily likely, as both were 1st round picks and their teams can exercise the fifth-year option on their deals, but if one of those teams decided to proactively give their franchise QB a new long-term deal, Wilson would use that as a baseline and add a nice markup to it.

News from this recent offseason indicate that while Newton is under Panthers control through 2015, both sides would like to have a deal done by March 2015, and the belief is that Newton's agent will use Cutler's deal as a starting point.

I think that looking at the deals given out the last couple of years, we shouldn't expect Wilson's deal to come in under $20M APY or under $60M guaranteed.

 

[NFSeahawks]

The NFLPA allows a little "home town discount," but it ain't much.......usually about 10%.

The NFLPA has no involvement in how much or how little people sign for. There are tons of regulations of what contracts may and may not include which are pre-negotiated by the NFLPA, but a player could choose to play for a dollar a year and the NFLPA couldn't say anything about it.

Other Topics Mentioned:

1) As for if they've already worked out the rough parameters of the deal, this IS a violation of the agreed upon contract with the NFLPA, and isn't worth the risk. In Wilson's case in particular he also just changed agents, meaning the likelihood of this is about as close to a statistical zero as one could get.

2) As for taking a hometown discount, the frequency with which they happen (almost never) really doesn't match the frequency with which the possiblity of them happening is talked about (almost always). Hometown discounts, when they do occur, aren't even really "discounts" they're team friendly deals in terms of HOW the money is allocated rather than HOW MUCH money is allocated (e.g. Brady, Kaepernick).

3) Personally, I get most annoyed when fans say that players will take less because they're "good people" or "aren't greedy."

For a guy like Wilson, he's been getting paid about 2.25% of his market rate for three years now ( (500K/22million)100 ). Given this reality, IMO him wanting what he's worth doesn't make him a "bad person" or "greedy", it makes the fan claiming he should take less than he's worth to "help out the team" (and their own fandom) a bad person and greedy. Nobody EVER suggests that their favorite team should pay their players more than their worth just to prove that the team is made up of "good people" and aren't "greedy." The same needs to work in reverse.

No one claimed taking more would make him a bad person, I don't know why people keep suggesting that.

It's topic for discussion, and has little to do with something being right or wrong.

 

[NFSeahawks]

I don't think he'll take a discount, per se, but I just don't see him pushing to get biggest-contract-ever type megadeal. Like $20 mil/year vs. $25 mil/year. Maybe with a lot of guaranteed money. Dying to see the deets on this one when it gets done. .NET will take a week to digest it.

By the nature of player contracts, each new one is "biggest ever. "

I expect that the absolute floor for Wilson's deal is going to be whatever the last real franchise QB got. No less.

You mean Kaepernick... :stirthepot: :les: :34853_doh: :179422: :0190l: :177692: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :roll:

Actually, I mean it's possible that Wilson holds out on contract negotiations until Newton or Luck have signed new deals. That's not necessarily likely, as both were 1st round picks and their teams can exercise the fifth-year option on their deals, but if one of those teams decided to proactively give their franchise QB a new long-term deal, Wilson would use that as a baseline and add a nice markup to it.

News from this recent offseason indicate that while Newton is under Panthers control through 2015, both sides would like to have a deal done by March 2015, and the belief is that Newton's agent will use Cutler's deal as a starting point.

I think that looking at the deals given out the last couple of years, we shouldn't expect Wilson's deal to come in under $20M APY or under $60M guaranteed.

I agree with the bold, I see 20 million a year, and I'd even venture to say thats a discount.

Volsung, we will be the first to venture the Luck vs. Wilson contract thread when they are both paid. :lol:

I see Luck getting more based on his passing stats, I feel like they will place more value in that. Not to say I agree, just what I think will happen.

 

[Cyrus12]

Nope why would he? this is a business...he will be getting huge cash! All these signings make me think Lynch is gone in the off season

 

[volsunghawk]

By the nature of player contracts, each new one is "biggest ever. "

I expect that the absolute floor for Wilson's deal is going to be whatever the last real franchise QB got. No less.

You mean Kaepernick... :stirthepot: :les: :34853_doh: :179422: :0190l: :177692: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :roll:

Actually, I mean it's possible that Wilson holds out on contract negotiations until Newton or Luck have signed new deals. That's not necessarily likely, as both were 1st round picks and their teams can exercise the fifth-year option on their deals, but if one of those teams decided to proactively give their franchise QB a new long-term deal, Wilson would use that as a baseline and add a nice markup to it.

News from this recent offseason indicate that while Newton is under Panthers control through 2015, both sides would like to have a deal done by March 2015, and the belief is that Newton's agent will use Cutler's deal as a starting point.

I think that looking at the deals given out the last couple of years, we shouldn't expect Wilson's deal to come in under $20M APY or under $60M guaranteed.

I agree with the bold, I see 20 million a year, and I'd even venture to say thats a discount.

Volsung, we will be the first to venture the Luck vs. Wilson contract thread when they are both paid. :lol:

I see Luck getting more based on his passing stats, I feel like they will place more value in that. Not to say I agree, just what I think will happen.

I think Luck will get more, but not based on his passing stats. I think he will get more because the Colts will exercise the 5th year option on his deal and keep him under contract through 2015 and work out a deal after Wilson has already signed his new deal. Then Luck and the Colts will use the Wilson/Newton deals as the starting point for their negotiations.

 

[StoneCold]

I think it's more likely we don't sign him than he gives us a discount.

SC

 

[Sgt. Largent]

The NFLPA allows a little "home town discount," but it ain't much.......usually about 10%.

The NFLPA has no involvement in how much or how little people sign for. There are tons of regulations of what contracts may and may not include which are pre-negotiated by the NFLPA, but a player could choose to play for a dollar a year and the NFLPA couldn't say anything about it. .

I don't mean legally allow, as in they could stop a cheap contract.

But they can put a lot of pressure on a player if he decides to accept a lowball offer, because of as I said, it has a direct impact on other players trying to negotiate.

IMO this conversation is silly anyway, no player in the history of the league that I know of has accepted a deep discount to play anywhere. They all know their time in the league is extremely finite and they need to cash in when they have the leverage to do so.

 

[Russ Willstrong]

Let that boy cook!

More like...that boy let Cook go. The OP is likely on to something here. We appear to be signing key players after RW announced he changed agents. The question is WHY did he drop a top agent Bus Cook who has been leveraging big contracts for some of the most notable names in sports so he can sign with a lesser team? Is he more willing to consider a team friendly deal than Cook was? Is Cook's cut too much? Does RW not want a max deal as it would blemish his image and not align with his team - first message as a LEADER.

 

[Russ Willstrong]

The funny thing is that all the while RW was playing lights out he was being severely underpaid and nobody protested except for a brief moment Russell himself. Now that he will be handsomely rewarded with a top deal many fans find it troublesome...But imagine Russell surprises us as he always does with a sacrificial move that improves his team...Doesn't that smack of leadership and consistency?

 

[Bprez3]

I can see it, sort of. Let's just say his Microsoft endorsement deal might jump up a bit too.

No doubt this will help in negotiations. Paul Allen may or may not have anything to do with Microsoft anymore. Seeing that Wilson is their spokesperson I am sure Mr. Allen still has some pull

 

[jdemps]

This is life an NFL arms race. All three teams are going to try to lock their guy up early so they don't have to shell out the biggest megacontract. Honestly, I'm not sure if Cam's really in this discussion. His winning percentage is low enough that I see him get paid more Kaep-like than A-Rod like.

 

[irocdave]

This topic has been kicked around so many times, surprised the MODs haven't punted this thread. RW will be the highest paid QB in NFL history to the joy of a lot of posters on this site. Is he worth it? Is he worth the forfeiture of future drafted players, re signs of good drafted players, free agents etc because that is the reality if RW gets top shelf money? Is RW the real deal when the money he makes becomes an obstacle to having a great D AND having top shelf receivers and or an O line to protect him. THAT is the reality of paying RW top shelf money. RW has been under paid since drafted but he has not proven he should be paid like a top shelf QB. Aaron Rodgers and Tom Brady are true difference makers at QB and are paid appropriately, RW is not in the same boat and should not be paid like them.

 

[2_0_6]

This topic has been kicked around so many times, surprised the MODs haven't punted this thread. RW will be the highest paid QB in NFL history to the joy of a lot of posters on this site. Is he worth it? Is he worth the forfeiture of future drafted players, re signs of good drafted players, free agents etc because that is the reality if RW gets top shelf money? Is RW the real deal when the money he makes becomes an obstacle to having a great D AND having top shelf receivers and or an O line to protect him. THAT is the reality of paying RW top shelf money. RW has been under paid since drafted but he has not proven he should be paid like a top shelf QB. Aaron Rodgers and Tom Brady are true difference makers at QB and are paid appropriately, RW is not in the same boat and should not be paid like them.

I bet you have a Wilson jersey in every color don't you? :sarcasm_off:

 

[HawkWow]

The cap increase is not an assumption. The cap is based on revenues, which are contractually due to increase, thus increasing the cap. The exact number isn't known or released until the off season, but it's going to go up quite a bit. This is a fact of mathematics.

I still think he can take less than what the typical "overpay" is for players in the NFL. He has at least 10 endorsement deals that pay him plenty. I'm not saying that justifies taking a home team discount, but I do think it's the type of player Russell is. If he wants to win multiple super bowls he will realize taking a lower amount will help the team in the long run, financially. He is a safe QB, he doesn't take unnecessary hits, I think this will allow him to take less.

I think whatever discount he would have originally taken will be adjusted with the cap.

Just a thought, no proof to this just an observation.

I like it.

The camp that says Russ should go for the throat may not be wrong but they may not be right. Let's say Russ adds a ring this year. 2 SBs in 3 years. What's that worth in endorsements deals?

Now, say he gives us a bit of a discount that allows us to grab another huge contributor (or keep 1 or 2). With our nucleus intact and still young, yet big time experienced, what would 3 SBs be worth to Russ Wilson?

The money would be ridiculous...no matter where it comes from. We're in Tiger Woods territory now and people are comparing Wilson to his idol, Derek Jeter. It also paves the road straight to Canton for a guy that was too short.

Wilson would have great difficulty doing all that elsewhere, imo, so the question is how badly does Wilson want to win? I think he is positioned where he can have his cake and it too. Take 17 per, Russ. Just do it.

 

[Smellyman]

no

 

[theascension]

Russell has stated he wants to own a sports team some day.. tough to do that if he isn't getting some large contracts.