Americas Game on NFLN.

[SalishHawkFan]

Man, I just got teary eyed thinking about all the years here on dot net when we'd bicker and worry and the whole roller coaster ride when the fan boys got all hyped only to crash and burn when the team lost.

This is wonderful. this is magic. This is the best year ever.

 

[NINEster]

The '85 Bears along with the '86 Giants had suffocating defenses that you couldn't really equate to modern teams given the states of the game back then versus now.

When you consider the difficulties Joe Montana had against those defenses, it probably forces you to tip the hat that those Ds are in a league of their own. Remember unlike Peyton Manning, Montana was a big game QB. You were never blowing the guy out if he was still able to play, and he wasn't a choker. And because there were no rules to protect QBs back then and he was somewhat fragile, often times he did not finish some big games.

Those teams ensured that the Niners didn't run away with 6-7 SBs in the '80s.

The Ryan 46 D went to Philly, created havoc in the NFC from '88-'92. In one particular game in '89, the Eagles sacked Montana 8 times in a game before he turned on his magic to throw 4 TDs in the 4th quarter and win. But before that happened, he struggled. Then Ryan went to the Oilers in '93 and created a ton of problems there right away. That season I remember that D holding the 49ers to 7 points in the Astrodome and was one of the toughest defenses I've ever seen Steve Young play against. Montana struggled against the Oilers in the playoffs with KC but was still able to get the W.

The Giants D was equally tough but in a different setup. They too were front 7 based, but more LB than DL. Against the 49ers they ran a ton of disciplined zone, and relied on the pursuit of their LBs to make plays. Compared to the 46, they didn't blitz nearly as much. Collectively the Bears D was maybe a bit better, but Lawrence Taylor was enough in a league of his own as a defensive player in those days to warrant respect. And there were times that Carl Banks was just as good if not better. And then there's Belichick running the show as well, who might have to get as much credit for the D performance as the talent on the field. SOB was an elite DC.

The peak Bears D might have been more effective against the 49ers than the Giants D, but it was essentially a problem only for the '85 season, whereas the Giants were tough for the 49ers from '85-'91.

Back then because of the rules allowing physical contact in coverage, and the pass/run ratios being more balanced than today, you didn't need the typical shutdown secondaries as you do now (interestingly enough the NFC team with the best secondary often was the 49ers). Also, there weren't many great receivers/passing attacks back then for it to matter. Even a team like SF didn't throw it as much as most teams do now. Montana never had a 4000 yard season, and the one time he came close it wasn't their best offensive team of that era.

The Seahawks D is worthy of being considered special, when you put all of these factors together and the "inflation" of offensive stats due to the modern rules. That the D is equally tough against power football teams like the 49ers and not just the aerial assault teams is impressive.

However, not sure any team post mid '90s can compare to the juggernauts of old, pre-free agency, pre-salary cap.

 

[pmedic920]

9ster, you make some good points.
And I would use them to highlight the fact, 2013 Seattle Seahawks shut down, what many are calling the best offensive team EVER,in the 2013 Denver team. This was in spite of the rule changes that protect both the QBs and WRs.

 

[rideaducati]

It's funny how people forget the division the Bears were in at the time. All the other teams in their division were AWFUL. I'm not saying the Bears weren't good, but woof, that division was horrible to watch. Green Bay won 8 games that year...6 of them came from beating division teams.

I felt the same way watching the Bears play as I did watching the Rapistberger stealers. Both those teams won the same way Seattle is winning now. I enjoy the thought of all fans of other teams thinking what I thought about those teams.

 

[Scottemojo]

A lot of good historical perspective

I loved your post, though I would argue that a couple of Niner defenses were damned impressive and would be the talk of the league still if they hadn't operated in the shadow of the offense.

Seattle's D is unique historically in a couple of respects. Building a defense from the secondary forward confounds traditionalists. The focus on 2013's SB winning effort kind of hides the fact that this secondary was becoming one of the best in NFL history without consistent pressure on QBs up front in 2012.

I would also add this nugget:http://www.footballperspective.com/putting-the-2013-seahawks-pass-defense-in-perspective/

That piece came out before the SB, or any of our playoff wins vs guys like Brees.

The "juggernaut" defenses of the past are gone for good. That is a fact. They arrived in an era where a QB who threw as many TDs as INTs was doing damn good, in an era where the commish was more concerned with games being played in less than 3 hours than high scores. The SB winning Bucs were the last of those teams, but they are forgotten because they couldn't keep the band together. The Patriots grabbed and hand checked their way to a couple of titles, but the outrage over the way they played got the rules redefined again, and it felt like defense was more about slowing passers down than actually stopping them. When Pete got hired I was mystified by his defensive plan when it was so clear to me that the modern NFL is about racking passing yards on offense and getting great pass rushers on defense. Stupid as it sounds now, there are still a bunch of NFLteams that are going to stubbornly do just that, the Lions seem like a prime example.

Nothing Seattle is doing now is new, which is why it becomes so difficult to explain why it is historical. The amalgamation feels new, though. building, then paying, 3 stars in the secondary while running a DL rotation where no one guy gets more than 600 snaps is not commonplace. Doing so in an era where the rules are stacked against those secondary players felt like it could not work, yet it did. Running cover 3 as a base defense when you think the other team is going to pass is supposed to be suicide. It wasn't.

Going forward, I suspect the same faux outrage that made Bill Belichek into a bad guy for teaching his secondary to play physical all over the field back in 2003 and 2004 is going to become a problem for Seattle. Teams that have a lot of capital and future contracts invested in the passing game are going to bitching the loudest about Seattle being a bunch of holding cheaters, and Roger and his rules comittee will act on that outrage as the National Fantasy League does not want 35 point ass whippings ending football seasons. We saw a bunch of it last year as the season wound down, we will see more of it this year.

 

[Threedee]

On KJR recently, Holmgren mentioned that the Hutchinson debacle wrecked the working relationship between himself and Ruskell. Carroll and Schneider are still going strong in their relationship, as Schneider clearly drafted another class tailored to Pete's system, and he didn't lose any players to free agency that Pete didn't also anticipate leaving.

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

What I loved most about this past Superbowl was that Mother Nature calmed herself down long enough for the Seahawks to deliver the 43-8 ass-whooping. So the Bronco and ALL of their supporters whether fan or media pundit could not use that as the excuse.

 

[loafoftatupu]

Speaking of the 85 bears... does anyone recall watching them? I was too young... Can we really be as good as them this year or come close?

I remember it like it was yesterday. They were the elite unit of the season and were very good in the surrounding years, but the most consistent defenses for that decade were both the Giants and believe it or not the Niners.

The stats might not show it, but from 81-90, those Niner teams had a defense that could really step it up when they had to. They might not have shown it in the regular season, because the Walsh machine of perfection overshadowed it. Those years they won the Super Bowls the 49er defense played exceptional football in the playoffs. They would have to contend with the Giants, Bears and the then offensive output of the Rams, then they would get matched up with an AFC team that was seriously outclassed. The 88 Bengals were known for scoring and ball control, yet a struggling offense was able to come alive after the Niners defense held the Cinci point total down.

They had a few weird upsets at home, the Giants just thrashed them one year and the Vikes stole one too, but when they lost, it was to the SB winners in several cases. For some reason the Giants used to give them fits, but in those years they won? The Niner defense played lights out in the post season. I know the Eagles were the elite unit at the end of the 80s, but they just could not handle the post season. The Giants and Niners maintained a high level that entire time.

How do the Seahawks measure up? Well I think if this unit could play by that era's standards allowed the same physical level of the 85 Bears that they would step up and take care of business. If the Giants and Bears of the 80s played today, there would be fines and ejections. The 80s Niners were part of that too. Romofreak, Burt, Haley, Lott, Fagan and bunch did not trifle with other players.

I was going through some video I captured of the introduction of the defense during the NFCC. It made me shiver. I remember a time when the crowd would get loud for guys like Easley, Kennedy, Robinson, Nash and Jacob Green. But as the 2013 Hawks were introduced I realized that every name they called was one of an exceptional player. That there was no lull in the crowd like it was when Darrin Comeaux, Jeff Bryant and Nesby Glasgow ran onto the field. The crazy part was that behind those players were another layer of talent.

Statistically, the Hawks have been ranked high on defense for 3 straight years, if they can hold on for just a few more, maybe get another Lombardi or dare I say 2, they will be recognized in history as one of the top defenses of all time. I have a suspicion that as long as PC and JS run this show, that the defense is going to be well known.

 

[pmedic920]

^^^^good stuff right there

 

[halfrack]

I remember that defense. Awesome, smothering pass rush. Worked with Otis Wilson's brother at the time. Wilson was their starting LLB for several seasons. All I heard about was Bears this and Bears that. If we improve our line, our defense will be even better that Bear team. We already have the best secondary ever assembled.

 

[Hasselbeck]

When will our Americas game be roughly aired ?

They air the new champs episode the Tuesday of kickoff week. So I believe September 2nd is when ours will air.