Minn QB Kirk Cousins: Leader of Men or Just Another Stiff?

[olyfan63]

I had forgotten you live in MN... clearly you'd be getting a media earful about Kirk Cousins' every bowel movement, never mind his QB play. Whatever else can be said, there certainly seems to be no lack of effort and preparation on Cousins' part to earn that $80M guaranteed contract. Can we agree on that aspect, as say, compared to a JaMarcus Russell? (I know that's setting the bar very, very low) And I don't care if he's a good dude, good character, and that rubbish. I hear Andy Dalton is a high-character guy. Win or the rest of that package means squat.

I would say Cousins "did IT" in the Denver game, played up to his contract. Bringing his team back from 0-20 deficit or whatever it was, not a bad day's work. Agreed, just one data point, but a positive one. OK, Cousins, if you want any hope of ever winning Uncle Si over, then dammit win Sunday, and then win the week after over Rogers and the Packers, or you're stuck in stiff-land.

I'll text Kirk some motivational crap to help fire him up and see what he says. I've been out of touch so I'll ask him about the Hawks game too and why the freak didn't he pull off the comeback when he had the ball and the chance. And no, Kirk, being intimidated by the greatness that is Akeem King covering your target receiver on 4th down is not a valid excuse.

 

[Uncle Si]

I think cousins is a good QB...

I just don't think he's taken the next step to be considered great.

 

[olyfan63]

I see I'm a week off. It's not this week, but the week after for the Vikings-Packers game, ON MONDAY NIGHT, in the Homer Dome. Now THIS is a big game, PROVIDED that the Vikings beat the Chargers in LA, not at all a guaranteed thing. After all, the Chargers beat up the Packers a few weeks back.

So it looks like Cousins has 2 big games in the next 2 weeks:
1) Beat the Chargers in LA this week
2) Beat the Packers at home the week after

But, even if Vikings win both, if Minnesota then loses the season finale to Chicago, the other games won't matter, and he won't get credit for them, and might even miss the playoffs, depending on Rams record. So 3 big games for Cousins and the Vikings. OK, Kirk, gotta win all 3 to move out of stiff-land. Division title or (you're a) bust.

 

[olyfan63]

Cousins and the Vikes beat up on the Chargers, on the road. Setting up the GB game nicely.
Cousins seemed to play well and lead his team to a road victory.
As a Hawk fan, I'd love to see Cousins show some leadership and beat the Pack, to knock them down a bit in the seeding and out of a #1 seed possibility. Can we agree this is a "big game" for him to show his progress in?

 

[Maulbert]

Cousins and the Vikes beat up on the Chargers, on the road. Setting up the GB game nicely.
Cousins seemed to play well and lead his team to a road victory.
As a Hawk fan, I'd love to see Cousins show some leadership and beat the Pack, to knock them down a bit in the seeding and out of a #1 seed possibility. Can we agree this is a "big game" for him to show his progress in?

The Seahawks benefit more from a Packers win, as a 3-way tie between us, GB, and NO would give Seattle the #1 seed, whereas a tie with just the Saints puts us at #2.

 

[Uncle Si]

I see I'm a week off. It's not this week, but the week after for the Vikings-Packers game, ON MONDAY NIGHT, in the Homer Dome. Now THIS is a big game, PROVIDED that the Vikings beat the Chargers in LA, not at all a guaranteed thing. After all, the Chargers beat up the Packers a few weeks back.

So it looks like Cousins has 2 big games in the next 2 weeks:
1) Beat the Chargers in LA this week
2) Beat the Packers at home the week after

But, even if Vikings win both, if Minnesota then loses the season finale to Chicago, the other games won't matter, and he won't get credit for them, and might even miss the playoffs, depending on Rams record. So 3 big games for Cousins and the Vikings. OK, Kirk, gotta win all 3 to move out of stiff-land. Division title or (you're a) bust.

I don't think Kirk reads these boards... unless you are actually him, which would make sense for this thread to even exist

 

[Largent80]

He is a Leader of Stiffs.

 

[knownone]

Cousins and the Vikes beat up on the Chargers, on the road. Setting up the GB game nicely.
Cousins seemed to play well and lead his team to a road victory.
As a Hawk fan, I'd love to see Cousins show some leadership and beat the Pack, to knock them down a bit in the seeding and out of a #1 seed possibility. Can we agree this is a "big game" for him to show his progress in?

The Seahawks benefit more from a Packers win, as a 3-way tie between us, GB, and NO would give Seattle the #1 seed, whereas a tie with just the Saints puts us at #2.

The Vikings beating the Packers is pretty much the only way we can lose to the 49ers and still win the division. So it’s hard to say one outcome is more beneficial than the other at this point.

 

[SanDiego49er]

You didn't really think Cousins was going to win that game vs Green Bay did you? I knew he wouldn't. I have never seen him win a big game in my life. NEVER. I mean he may have some out there that I didn't see but they are few and far between. 0 - 9 on MNF is incredible. It's stunning to be that bad. You would think you would win one by just getting lucky. He is like 0 - 100 in big games, prime time games, SNF, MNF, playoff atmosphere, really important match ups. I mean I NEVER see him win anything big. I can't believe people think this is a "good QB" based on stats. If you can't win big games EVER you are NOT GOOD period.

:34853_doh:

 

[olyfan63]

You didn't really think Cousins was going to win that game vs Green Bay did you? I knew he wouldn't. I have never seen him win a big game in my life. NEVER. I mean he may have some out there that I didn't see but they are few and far between. 0 - 9 on MNF is incredible. It's stunning to be that bad. You would think you would win one by just getting lucky. He is like 0 - 100 in big games, prime time games, SNF, MNF, playoff atmosphere, really important match ups. I mean I NEVER see him win anything big. I can't believe people think this is a "good QB" based on stats. If you can't win big games EVER you are NOT GOOD period.

:34853_doh:

I was cautiously optimistic, especially if Dalvin Cook was playing . Kirk, give us some kind of sign that things are different now! So, without Cook, Kirk buddy, it's all you! This is your chance! Elite QBs can win games anyway even when their team is missing a weapon or two.

Even the early game returns were positive. Minny gets a turnover giving them the ball 10 yards from paydirt. Then they settle for a FG??!!! WTF is this schit?? Another turnover, and Cousins gets a TD pass and now it's 10-3. Then another GB turnover. No points from that, Vikings offense fails to cash in. OK, so 3 gift wrapped turnovers, for a total of 10 Minnesota points?

Minny's leading rusher had 28 yards on 10 carries. So clearly Minnesota is *screwed* without their Dalvin Cook running game. Cousins is not able to carry the team without a running game.

Minnesota's O-Line had trouble with the Packers' D-Line, 5 sacks on Cousins. Cousins repeatedly took drive-killing sacks, while looking deep downfield, including some dumb sacks he ran himself into. Marginal pocket awareness. What we Seahawks fans call "Hero Ball" when Russell Wilson does this.

MY Verdict: Kirk Cousins is a better than average STIFF. He could not elevate his team to a W at home, even when spotted 3 turnovers.

Alternate view: With Dalvin Cook and a running game, Cousins and the Vikes score at least 24 points in this game, and the Vikings probably win. The Vikings held Cook out for the playoffs, to try to get him healthy. Cousins and the Vikings could be dangerous in the playoffs with a healthy Dalvin Cook.

Looking forward: Next week's game is pretty much meaningless for the Vikes. Playoffs. If Cousins can lead his team to a playoff win, it will be time to revisit this.

 

[IndyHawk]

He is a Leader of Stiffs.

:lol: :lol: :lol: ..

 

[Uncle Si]

You didn't really think Cousins was going to win that game vs Green Bay did you? I knew he wouldn't. I have never seen him win a big game in my life. NEVER. I mean he may have some out there that I didn't see but they are few and far between. 0 - 9 on MNF is incredible. It's stunning to be that bad. You would think you would win one by just getting lucky. He is like 0 - 100 in big games, prime time games, SNF, MNF, playoff atmosphere, really important match ups. I mean I NEVER see him win anything big. I can't believe people think this is a "good QB" based on stats. If you can't win big games EVER you are NOT GOOD period.

:34853_doh:

I was cautiously optimistic, especially if Dalvin Cook was playing . Kirk, give us some kind of sign that things are different now! So, without Cook, Kirk buddy, it's all you! This is your chance! Elite QBs can win games anyway even when their team is missing a weapon or two.

Even the early game returns were positive. Minny gets a turnover giving them the ball 10 yards from paydirt. Then they settle for a FG??!!! WTF is this schit?? Another turnover, and Cousins gets a TD pass and now it's 10-3. Then another GB turnover. No points from that, Vikings offense fails to cash in. OK, so 3 gift wrapped turnovers, for a total of 10 Minnesota points?

Minny's leading rusher had 28 yards on 10 carries. So clearly Minnesota is *screwed* without their Dalvin Cook running game. Cousins is not able to carry the team without a running game.

Minnesota's O-Line had trouble with the Packers' D-Line, 5 sacks on Cousins. Cousins repeatedly took drive-killing sacks, while looking deep downfield, including some dumb sacks he ran himself into. Marginal pocket awareness. What we Seahawks fans call "Hero Ball" when Russell Wilson does this.

MY Verdict: Kirk Cousins is a better than average STIFF. He could not elevate his team to a W at home, even when spotted 3 turnovers.

Alternate view: With Dalvin Cook and a running game, Cousins and the Vikes score at least 24 points in this game, and the Vikings probably win. The Vikings held Cook out for the playoffs, to try to get him healthy. Cousins and the Vikings could be dangerous in the playoffs with a healthy Dalvin Cook.

Looking forward: Next week's game is pretty much meaningless for the Vikes. Playoffs. If Cousins can lead his team to a playoff win, it will be time to revisit this.

Nah man.. it's not something you look at game to game.

If Cousins is playing in the super bowl, you could start to trend the narrative to something else.

But last night was the cousins we have all watched for years. And cook wasn't changing that. The packers dropped that game at his feet in the first half and he came away with a 1 point lead.. then tanked the 2nd half.

I like Cousins. But I think it's clear he needs a lot of help to be elite... Which kind of makes him not

 

[ivotuk]

Cousin's is a good QB that needs talent around him. Not a lot. Dalvin, Diggs in good health (he looked hobbled), and a decent TE. With that and Thielen, I think he would have beat GB. But he had nothing, and I'm guessing, but it looked like really poor play calling.

Kirk is limited by being "unathletic" but he's a cerebral QB and can do well with a good team. He cannot however, elevate a team.

 

[5_Golden_Rings]

The guy's married. It's probably not appropriate to talk about him being stiff. ukeface:

 

[olyfan63]

Nah man.. it's not something you look at game to game.

If Cousins is playing in the super bowl, you could start to trend the narrative to something else.

But last night was the cousins we have all watched for years. And cook wasn't changing that. The packers dropped that game at his feet in the first half and he came away with a 1 point lead.. then tanked the 2nd half.

I like Cousins. But I think it's clear he needs a lot of help to be elite... Which kind of makes him not

WAIT JUST A MINUTE THERE UNCLE...
Did I ever use the "ELITE" word? I started this asking more about his LEADERSHIP, his effect on the players around him, getting them to elevate their game.

Tell you what, the Minnesota DEFENSE definitely ELEVATED their game--for a little over one half of play.
Debatable whether Cousins had *anything* at all to do with that, but he certainly didn't hold them back.
Now, when Cousins and the offense turned those 3 primo turnovers into 10 points, not 17 or more, now that was a LETDOWN for the defense.

I also did not realize the #2 RB was out for this game. So Cousins had basically NO running game to work with. So of course he was going to suck and get sacked a lot.

Russell Wilson didn't exactly light the Cards on fire with his top 3 running backs out. After several weeks of subpar play, Rams and Cardinals games, now we've got people posting threads on how Russell is a pretender, NOT ELITE.

Is Nick Foles ELITE? No, but he does have a Super Bowl ring as a starting QB.
Was Trent Dilfer ELITE (stop that laughing!) No, but even HE has a SB ring as a starting QB.

Cousins timing does suck though, for making any case for his leadership. I think the GB game is more of a throw-away under the circumstances. Yes, an ELITE QB would have "found a way" to elevate his team despite the obstacles. Heck, even Dave Krieg elevated his team in the '83 playoff win at Miami. Threw to Largent for 40+ yards, and Curt Warner ran it in for the TD. But then, Largent and Warner. Top, top players in their prime.

 

[olyfan63]

The guy's married. It's probably not appropriate to talk about him being stiff. ukeface:

I think Cousins gave a limp and weak performance in that game. He held onto the balls too long and couldn't get them off on those plays so he did bottom duty, underneath the pile.

 

[5_Golden_Rings]

The guy's married. It's probably not appropriate to talk about him being stiff. ukeface:

I think Cousins gave a limp and weak performance in that game. He held onto the balls too long and couldn't get them off on those plays so he did bottom duty, underneath the pile.

:lol: :mrgreen:

He certainly came for the sacks.

 

[olyfan63]

Here I was just thinking how inappropriate--or not quite clever enough my comment was; either 1 too many or 1 too few eggnogs, and you chime in with that. Oh well. It's in Mod's hands now. May Mods strike that post dead if it's their will.

 

[Uncle Si]

Nah man.. it's not something you look at game to game.

If Cousins is playing in the super bowl, you could start to trend the narrative to something else.

But last night was the cousins we have all watched for years. And cook wasn't changing that. The packers dropped that game at his feet in the first half and he came away with a 1 point lead.. then tanked the 2nd half.

I like Cousins. But I think it's clear he needs a lot of help to be elite... Which kind of makes him not

WAIT JUST A MINUTE THERE UNCLE...
Did I ever use the "ELITE" word? I started this asking more about his LEADERSHIP, his effect on the players around him, getting them to elevate their game.

Tell you what, the Minnesota DEFENSE definitely ELEVATED their game--for a little over one half of play.
Debatable whether Cousins had *anything* at all to do with that, but he certainly didn't hold them back.
Now, when Cousins and the offense turned those 3 primo turnovers into 10 points, not 17 or more, now that was a LETDOWN for the defense.

I also did not realize the #2 RB was out for this game. So Cousins had basically NO running game to work with. So of course he was going to suck and get sacked a lot.

Russell Wilson didn't exactly light the Cards on fire with his top 3 running backs out. After several weeks of subpar play, Rams and Cardinals games, now we've got people posting threads on how Russell is a pretender, NOT ELITE.

Is Nick Foles ELITE? No, but he does have a Super Bowl ring as a starting QB.
Was Trent Dilfer ELITE (stop that laughing!) No, but even HE has a SB ring as a starting QB.

Cousins timing does suck though, for making any case for his leadership. I think the GB game is more of a throw-away under the circumstances. Yes, an ELITE QB would have "found a way" to elevate his team despite the obstacles. Heck, even Dave Krieg elevated his team in the '83 playoff win at Miami. Threw to Largent for 40+ yards, and Curt Warner ran it in for the TD. But then, Largent and Warner. Top, top players in their prime.

He's not a coach, he's a QB.

Either he's elite, and leads his teams to wins. Not just a big win here and there (which cousins doesnt have) but a constant, consistent history of bog results. Or he's not. Stop moving the goalposts.

And it's not a throw away game, even if you wish it away, because it's just more of the same from him.

Cousins and Wilson aren't in the same class, so comparing them is ridiculous. One has some good games, the other has been in the elite class of and for years.

 

[5_Golden_Rings]

Welp, he finally won a big game.