Golden State Warriors

[Hasselbeck]

Well I definitely underestimated the presence of Draymond Green in the Dubs lineup, the paint was more wide open for LeBron than a WR Cary Williams was covering.

Also helped Kyrie Irving had the night of his life, Harrison Barnes couldn't hit water if he fell out a boat, and the Warriors as a whole missed 13 of their last 14 shots from 3 - most of which were uncontested shots.

Wouldn't surprise me now if this series somehow gets to 7 games, but I still think at full strength the Warriors are just a much better team than the Cavs.. and short of another Kyrie/LeBron God Mode game.. I think the Dubs end the series on Thursday.

P.S. Kevin Love really does suck. I don't know how Tyronn Lue continues to trot him out there over Channing Frye, I really don't.

 

[Hasselbeck]

On a good note, niners fans are crying tonight.

On a bad note, I had CLE/GS OVER 209. They were at 205 total points with 5 minutes and 33 seconds left in the game. They managed to score 4 points in the last 5:33, and only 1 point in the last 3 and a half minutes.

You need help :lol: Go Cavs! It's going 7..Anything can happen,I hope the loss of Bogut hurts more than they make it seem.I hope Green blows blows another gasket so he's out for game 7

Bogut is a warrior (figurative term, not literal :lol: ) .. but honestly the Warriors best lineup is their death lineup where Green is at the 5 and Iguodala plays the 4. Ezeli is pretty underrated so he can fill the void IMO.

Losing Green for a game was a far bigger blow to the Warriors lineup than losing Bogut will be.

 

[Hasselbeck]

Bottom line, if you TRY to hit a guy in his nuts, it's going to be a flagrant. Green is a dummy for doing so. He was well aware that he was one flagrant away from being suspended. He put himself in a vulnerable position for the league to call a flagrant on him. Whether it was actually flagrant or not, he put himself in a bad position.

And I'm tired of hearing the Warrior fans whining about how the NBA suspended him to extend the series. First of all, if Green didn't already have so many flagrants and tech's in the playoffs, he would still be playing. Second of all, last year all I heard from Warrior fans was that it wouldn't have mattered if Love and Kyrie played in the finals. Suck it up, your team played without their 3rd best player for one game. The Cavs had to play without their 2nd and 3rd best player for basically the entire Finals last year.

The NBA is rigged talk is pretty funny. Pretty much every radio show was talking about it today.

Agreed - its similar to a personal foul in the NFL in that they rarely flag the instigator but they always get the guy that reacts. LeBron knew what he was doing by trying to get under his skin by stepping over him (an unwritten rule in basketball, similar to staring at a long home run in baseball). Draymond has to recognize the situation there and realize he's used up all his good faith from previous actions. Have to swallow some pride and just let him have that one then come back in Game 5 and take his championship away from him.

 

[knownone]

Well looks like the NBA got what they wanted when they suspended Green. I honestly don't know what was worse, Golden State or the officiating.

The officiating was fine. Near the end of the game the announcers even mentioned how well the game was officiated. As for the Green suspension, that is on him. He knew that he was one flagrant foul away from being suspended and he put himself in a vulnerable position. It's not like the league came out and suspended him, they gave him a flagrant foul which resulted in a suspension. Everyone is crying about LeBron, but the real story should be about how Green let him team down.

I want Cleveland to win the series, I don't believe they are the better team, and I'm not blind to that fact. I don't think there is any way that's a flagrant on Green, plain and simple, it's hard for me to stand here and see anything but the NBA trying to extend the series. Especially when it's not obvious if there is intent, If they gave him a flagrant during the game I'd disagree, but I'd be fine with it. However, using slo-mo replay is not the best way to determine intent on f***ing basketball court, did the refs think it was a foul when it happened? no? ok, then let it go. Instead they retroactively give a flagrant for what is at the very worst a fringe flagrant foul, based solely on some nameless refs perception of another mans intent... it's stupid.

Intent isn't necessary to get a flagrant 2, let alone a flagrant 1. Whether the striking player is deemed "reckless" is typically more important than whether or not he was doing it intentionally.

The fact that the refs on the court didn't call it a flagrant is irrelevant. As you yourself stated, the officiating was awful. I think they probably just missed the hit to the groin, since there was so much more attention on what LeBron was doing before that. I didn't even notice it at the time, but I think the video I posted above makes it clear why the league felt compelled to call a flagrant.

You are wrong, the refs missed a lot of calls in the game yes, but the ref in this case is 5 feet away from the entire incident, he saw what happened. He talked to the other refs, they determined it wasn't a flagrant, the league after the fact using slo-mo says it is flagrant. The video you posted looks to me like Lebron taunts Green by stepping over him and Green tries to get up as soon as possible and accidently hits Lebron's groin. Is it a basketball play? Yes, Green is trying to stand up. Did he wind up and follow through? No. Did Lebron get injured? No. Did Green's actions start the altercation? No, Lebron did when he stepped over him. The only way you can call a flagrant on Green is if you think he intentionally swung for Lebron's groin. That's my issue with this, the Ref who was there on the court watching it in real time from 5 feet away doesn't think it's a flagrant, it's not a flagrant.

 

[Throwdown]

Stepping over someone is a taunt, but you can't get physical in response which is exactly what happened. His reputation after the Steve Adams incident preceded him, it was the right thing.

 

[Alexander]

Intent isn't necessary to get a flagrant 2, let alone a flagrant 1. Whether the striking player is deemed "reckless" is typically more important than whether or not he was doing it intentionally.

The fact that the refs on the court didn't call it a flagrant is irrelevant. As you yourself stated, the officiating was awful. I think they probably just missed the hit to the groin, since there was so much more attention on what LeBron was doing before that. I didn't even notice it at the time, but I think the video I posted above makes it clear why the league felt compelled to call a flagrant.

You are wrong, the refs missed a lot of calls in the game yes, but the ref in this case is 5 feet away from the entire incident, he saw what happened. He talked to the other refs, they determined it wasn't a flagrant, the league after the fact using slo-mo says it is flagrant. The video you posted looks to me like Lebron taunts Green by stepping over him and Green tries to get up as soon as possible and accidently hits Lebron's groin. Is it a basketball play? Yes, Green is trying to stand up. Did he wind up and follow through? No. Did Lebron get injured? No. Did Green's actions start the altercation? No, Lebron did when he stepped over him. The only way you can call a flagrant on Green is if you think he intentionally swung for Lebron's groin. That's my issue with this, the Ref who was there on the court watching it in real time from 5 feet away doesn't think it's a flagrant, it's not a flagrant.

I may be wrong about what the ref did or did not see, but it's not relevant. The refs get it wrong sometimes. Even when the play is right in front of them. The question is whether, by rule, it's a flagrant. It clearly is. You keep emphasizing the "intent", but the rule makes it clear that intent is only one of many considerations. On the Steven Adams hit, Draymond got a flagrant 2 for what was pretty clearly an unintentional hit. His lack of intent didn't matter because of the severity of the hit and the recklessness that led to it. This incident is definitely not as bad as that one (hence why it's only a flagrant 1), but he still unnecessarily swings his right arm in LeBron's direction, twice, with the first swing making clear (if unintentional) contact. Him swinging that arm has nothing to do with him getting off the floor. If you look carefully, he's already on his feet (and LeBron is no longer over him) by the time that right arm comes out. Also, I don't know about anyone else, but my "get off the floor" motion doesn't involve swinging one of my arms wildly. I would imagine it's actually counterproductive to the goal of getting on your feet. I might have been inclined to give Green the benefit of the doubt, except that he immediately repeats the exact same motion, only without making contact.

Also, what LeBron did is irrelevant. You can argue that LeBron should've gotten a technical (I'm surprised he didn't), that he was the instigator, or that he's a douche or whatever. But that doesn't change the fact that it was Draymond who swung his arm at LeBron and, intentional or not, made contact with him. You don't get a free flagrant foul just because the other guy is being a jerk. The question is whether the swinging right arm is a necessary motion. I don't think it is.

 

[Hawk-Lock]

^^^Agreed with everything Alexander said. It doesn't matter if Draymond even hit his nuts or not, it was intent.

Warrior fans can cry all they want, but last year all I heard from them was that it wouldn't have mattered if Kyrie and Love played. Draymond more than deserved this. He should have been suspended in the OKC series, so this was long overdue.

But enough of the past, game 6 is tonight and it should be great. I'd be pretty shocked if LeBron let the Warriors hoist the trophy on their own floor two years in a row. This should go 7.

 

[Alexander]

^^^Agreed with everything Alexander said. It doesn't matter if Draymond even hit his nuts or not, it was intent.

Warrior fans can cry all they want, but last year all I heard from them was that it wouldn't have mattered if Kyrie and Love played. Draymond more than deserved this. He should have been suspended in the OKC series, so this was long overdue.

But enough of the past, game 6 is tonight and it should be great. I'd be pretty shocked if LeBron let the Warriors hoist the trophy on their own floor two years in a row. This should go 7.

I'd like to see a game 7, but I really think the Warriors finish the job tonight. I think Cleveland will put up a worthy fight, but I couldn't help but notice how much more effective LeBron was in the paint with Green not playing. He won't have that advantage tonight. He'll need his jump shot to fall tonight, and the cast around him will need to show up, ala Kyrie in the last game. Might be a good time for Kevin Love to do something.

 

[hawknation2016]

The reflexive swiping of his arm was not "unnecessary" under the circumstances. Green had been knocked to the ground, stepped over while he was getting off the ground, and was being straddled by the head. Those were not hits or punches; it was mild reflexive swiping that Lebron did not appear to notice at the time.

I would say calling that reflexive swiping a "flagrant" is emblematic of the current pussification of the NBA, but reflexive swiping would never be called a flagrant in just about any other situation. Hundreds of such plays occur every year without being levied a "flagrant" foul. Anyone who says otherwise is kidding themselves.

This was about Lebron's whining, the viewing public's delusion, and the profit motive.

 

[hawknation2016]

I'd like to see a game 7, but I really think the Warriors finish the job tonight.

But only I am the one with the bias.

:snack:

 

[Hawk-Lock]

The reflexive swiping of his arm was not "unnecessary" under the circumstances. Green had been knocked to the ground, stepped over while he was getting off the ground, and was being straddled by the head. Those were not hits or punches; it was mild reflexive swiping that Lebron did not appear to notice at the time.

I would say calling that reflexive swiping a "flagrant" is emblematic of the current pussification of the NBA, but reflexive swiping would never be called a flagrant in just about any other situation. Hundreds of such plays occur every year without being levied a "flagrant" foul. Anyone who says otherwise is kidding themselves.

This was about Lebron's whining, the viewing public's delusion, and the profit motive.

People get knocked over all the time in the NBA, that wasn't anything. I still don't make all that much of LeBron stepping over Green, but from a refs perspective they can't penalize a guy for trying to get up and walk over a guy. It's no different than a bat flip after a home run in baseball. You can't penalize it, but it is one of those unwritten rules that players know of. But a shot to the nuts, that is something the refs can penalize, and they did so. At some point Draymond has to learn, you can't just keep hitting guys in that area.

And I stand firm by my belief that the decision to suspend Green had nothing to do with the NBA trying to extend the series and make more money. If that were the case, then I can bring up a ton of other examples where it didn't happen.

 

[Hasselbeck]

Fun fact: The Warriors beat the Cavs in Game 6 to win the title exactly a year ago today.

The way Cleveland is tortured..... my money is on Golden State :lol:

 

[Alexander]

I'd like to see a game 7, but I really think the Warriors finish the job tonight.

But only I am the one with the bias.

:snack:

I never claimed I didn't have a bias, but even if you don't think the incident warranted a flagrant, the claim that the league only assessed it because (a) LeBron whined about it and (b) they wanted to manufacture a seven-game series is the sort of thing you'd expect to read in the comments section of fan blog after a tough loss, when everyone's trying to blow off steam. If you're really that cynical, why bother watching the sport at all? You'll be continually disappointed when things don't go your way.

I also don't recall LeBron lobbying the league for a flagrant foul after the game, just saying that he didn't like what Green said to him during the incident. So I don't even know how anyone can seriously claim that the flagrant was in any way meant to appease him. That's just ludicrous. Why would they feel the need to do that? If you're going to make extraordinary claims, you better have more than just the usual fanboy talking points to back it up.

We can agree to disagree about whether Green's swinging arm was unnecessary or merely reflexive. I simply don't buy the argument that this wouldn't be called in any other context. If you swing your arms around, you're going to get called for it if you end up hitting someone, especially if it's in a sensitive area.

 

[Hawk-Lock]

Fun fact: The Warriors beat the Cavs in Game 6 to win the title exactly a year ago today.

The way Cleveland is tortured..... my money is on Golden State :lol:

Knowing the Cavs, they will probably fumble on the goal line in the bottom of the 9th inning. :lol:

 

[Krieg's list]

And I stand firm by my belief that the decision to suspend Green had nothing to do with the NBA trying to extend the series and make more money. If that were the case, then I can bring up a ton of other examples where it didn't happen.

You're right. I've got a better conspiracy theory :lol:

They intentionally waited to suspend Green until after it was too late in a feeble attempt to convince non-GSW fans that Golden Boy Steph Curry's team wasn't being nudged along all playoffs. Clearly they weren't willing to suspend him against OKC with the Thunder up 2-1 and threatening to take a commanding (yes, I know...) 3-1 lead in the series, even though the Adams' groin kick was unquestionably suspension-worthy in and of itself, let alone with the Beasley takedown and repeated nut-shots factoring in as well.

I can understand Warriors fans' shock and disbelief that the incident with LeBron was the straw that broke the camel's back after everything else that happened [read: everything else that he'd gotten away with], but waiting until GS took a 3-1 lead with 2 home games left to suspend Green-- when the bulk of his suspendable offences had occurred with his team in a much more tenuous position-- reeks of favoritism and, to the cynical eye, a fairly transparent attempt to subsequently hide it. It's like catching someone with their hand in the cookie jar and then waiting for them to eat the cookie before giving them a big, ostentatious slap on the wrist. Draymond knows he won't be suspended in the most important situations, so how is this even a deterrent?

We really need "Conspiracy ON!" and "Conspiracy OFF!" signs to go along with these guys :sarcasm_on: :sarcasm_off:
:lol:

 

[Hawk-Lock]

Looks like game three all over again.

 

[CPHawk]

Fun fact: The Warriors beat the Cavs in Game 6 to win the title exactly a year ago today.

The way Cleveland is tortured..... my money is on Golden State :lol:

So far, it's looking like you would lose that bet.

 

[Throwdown]

Cleveland is mopping these dudes right now

 

[IndyHawk]

I say the Cavs have a good chance to finally do it,not saying they will but GS has to shoot a bunch of 3's to win.GS is not going to win the inside battles or outrebound the Cavs,Bogut was a big loss in that respect because Thompson owns the paint.

 

[hawknation2016]

As expected after the NBA suspended Green for Game 5, this is going to a Game 7. Bring it on.

:snack: